MIRecovery

You have not failed. Your heart was in the right place but you have unrealistic expectations. You are attempting something that has zero chance of success and are destroying yourself in the process.

You did create the problem

You can not control it

You can not cure it

Ariesagain

I think if you go back and read your first post from an outside perspective you might see how some of us were confused by it? You talked a lot about him, mentioned you hadn't dealt with these feelings before and you feel love for him, his phone call to you from his new girlfriend's house as recounted sounded very much like a boyfriend, and your husband's involvement with this guy wasn't mentioned at all...

So you can maybe see why some of us leaped to conclusions, especially since lots of people only read the original post and skim the responses?

I hope you're feeling better and stronger today...

healthyagain

Sorry, but you have not "failed." He is the only person who can help himself. That is the only proper way. You wanted to help, and that is a good thing, but you picked a wrong person to help to.

I personally think you are being very manipulated by this guy. One of the reasons why I believe my ex might be borderline is that he just lies, and manipulates, and loves to feed on people's emotions. He will make up a lie (for example say he is to move to another town, or just quit his job and leave) and then feed on my reaction. Normal people do not do this. People who love you and respect you do not do this. And another thing: How can you know that this guy's stories are true? Because tell you what, addicts do lie A LOT!

People on here may sound harsh, but they all have good intentions. So sorry you feel that way about this forum.

Bekindalways

Thinking about you Cerulean. Although you were trapped by a master manipulator, you seem to have learned super fast.

Who I really feel sorry for is the woman he moved in with. Poor lady. She is in for a ride. I'm not suggesting you try to help her as we Codependents are as bad as the addicts in many ways. She may show up in this forum someday.

hopeful4

Oh goodness. Your heart was in the right place. This man has mental illness mixed with addiction issues. This will be a cycle he goes through for the rest of his life. I encourage you to read some books, educate about Bipolar and addiction. It's quite a ride, that is for sure.

You reached out. You cared for him, and he knew that. You did not fail. You did not do anything wrong. You tried.

It's quite toxic to be close to someone who has mental illness on this level and not taking care of themselves the way they should.

I'm sorry. I think you deserve peace and kindness. There is a saying here on this board, take what you want, and leave the rest. With this many people on a forum, and the difficulty that comes with trying to type out your feelings, sometimes that may come across as harsh. It's a lot of opinions. However, ultimately, it's a support forum. So I hope you come for the support, and are able to leave the rest.

I hope you have a peaceful weekend.

dandylion

Cerulean.....I have just now read through this thread.

I can see that you are in a lot of pain. I can see that this experience represents a significant loss for you. You invested human compassion and caring and wanted to be an agent to relieve his suffering.....Basic human caring and kindness......

You speak of another loved person in your life that suffered and passed, tragically, from their own overwhelming situation.....

I find myself wondering if you were ever to completely grieve that ear lier loss...
Whenever we suffer a loss that we don't/can't completely grieve....the loss will bubble up and compound any future losses....
All of this compounded loss can be excrutiating and feel overwhelming....It can trigger all of the symptoms that you have shared.....especially, too, the physical symptoms..... fears of abandonment can be triggered, also.....and, that is one of the powerfully frightening of human emotions...(all humans have the capacity for this..nature has wired us this way)......

I send you my compassion for your deep disappointment and pain.....

I think that a grief support group might help to bring you comfort and support as you attempt to process all of this.....

sincerely,
dandylion

ceruleanblue

The feelings I was referring to were the sense of responsibility I felt. The sense of responsibility came from knowing I advised him on purchasing a car and he impulsively left town 3 days after purchasing it. The woman he is involved with was someone he reconnected with after 25+ years and moved in with after only 2-3 weeks of communication with her! 😳 Sound familiar? I only learned about his friendship with her AFTER he made the decision to leave rehab and stay there. I have the unfortunate knowledge of his behaviors outside of a treatment facility and it's been chaos, pure chaos. I felt bad (responsible)for HER!

I felt responsible for my part in the car bit. If he didn't have a car, he would have probably stayed and received the treatment he needed. If he didn't have a car, he wouldn't have left the only support he has left (barely), which are his adult children. If he didn't have a car, I would not feel so anxious about him drinking and driving and hurting SOMEONE ELSE.
*When you know someone that's been killed by a drunk driver, this hits home!!

I do feel a sense of love and empathy for him. Even if none of what he said was true, he obviously was at an in-patient facility for a reason. They don't just allow you to stay and hang out there without good reason. He was NOT loud, angry, mean spirited, or hurtful when he was sober or drinking. He was sad, regretful, ashamed, and hopeless. That vulnerable behavior resonated with the caregiver in me, I guess ?? If he had been abusive or inappropriate towards me, it would not have been the same. I do not have people like that in my life.

My husband was not mentioned because it was about my feelings.
He had already reassured me, but I just kept renumerating about all the things that could go wrong again outside of treatment. He had only been there for a month.

His Dx is consistent with childhood sexual abuse. I DO believe that part. None of it matters at this point. Why he does what does? I was trying to understand my part in this. What I should or shouldn't feel "responsible" for. I know plain and clear he manipulated me. I am not a doormat and didn't recognize why I felt so bad. I felt bad because I AM A RESPONSIBLE PERSON with a conscious, he is operating under a different set of rules and boundaries for himself.

None of it matters. The negative comments were helpful in their own way, but were hurtful because I thought I WAS detached, and for most of the time I was. Being so far away, I could hang up and go about my day with my family and it didn't effect me---until this last episode and because I feel I may have assisted all of it to happen with the STUPID CAR!

I see my feelings in this are irrelevant to his choices. I hope I never encounter anyone like this again, and if I do, I have the wisdom to know better, know the importance of boundaries, know the importance of not trying to help. I will leave it to the professionals.....which is something I'm prepared to say if for some awful reason we speak again.

I am still disappointed in myself.
I will be OK.
I was scared and anxious when I was writing that post. I read it again and I feel it again....ugh.

I will read the online literature from Al-Anon just to know what it's all about.

I really just want to complete the walk, and walk away from all of this...
I intend on doing just that.

Hawkeye13

Be at peace--we choose our paths and he has chosen his for whatever reason.

He may decide recovery is the most important thing soon, later, or never but
his life is his own to lead, and hopefully he too will find peace and healing
before it's too late.

dandylion

ceruleanblue....your intentions were of the highest....you weren't clairvoyant....you didn't know what role a car might or might not play....

Don't beat yourself up for what you did not KNOW! That is not fair to your self...don't be mean to yourself.....

Truthfully, it will take you some time to process yourself through this and come to a kind of "peace" with it......
This is hard stuff....and, life can feel so hard....
The expression,"Let go and let God (the Universe) ", comes to mind.....

dandylion

ceruleanblue

Thank you for this response! It meant so much to me. You are 100% correct. I am reading it and crying. I did not grieve properly, but how does that happen now, years later? I will explore that. I need to.

I didn't even know about his death until years later..... I called his family and we cried together. We had just lost touch. My life, young family, traveling abroad for years, jobs. I never really grieved, but it haunts me. It really haunts me. I loved him so much and my youthful memories are all happy and joyful. Addiction is awful. He should not have died. And yes, I also feel a sense of "what if" responsibility about his death. He was like a brother.

I acknowledge my own hurt/pain/loss/hope in the present situation.

I just hope he gets help and chooses to live. I hope he doesn't give up.
I feel like he's scrambling in the world, trying to find his place. Its just sad.

Thank you for reading between the lines and writing this. I think it's time I work on me too.

Everything happens for a reason--even the bad.💔
Everyone comes into our life for a reason.

Txjeepguy

Unless your name is on that car with him, you're not responsible.

the simple act of advising him how to purchase one does not make you responsible for what he did or didn't do.

ceruleanblue

Thank you for your response.

No, my name is not on that car. It was just advice, nothing else.

I just want to crawl away and hide in a hole for a few days.
Process all of this, process ME, not him.

I want to cry and not keep it together for the sake of anyone else.

I have my own stuff to work through and I'm prepared to explore it.

The brakes are on (for my life) and I need to hit pause now.....

wanttobehealthy

Until I started to look at why I was so deeply enmeshed and attached to NEEDING, almost like I needed oxygen to breathe, to helping fix and convince my xAH to get help/get sober etc... I did not realize how many of my own issues I had.

Maybe, for as bad as this experience has been with this fb acquaintance/friend, it's an opportunity to look at what it is in your own experience and inner self that makes you so invested in helping and advising and what makes you so tied to whether a person heeds that advise or not?

I hear a lot of my own very co-dependent thinking in your writing and I feel for you.

It's a process I am still trying to sort out for myself actually. But I know that when I find myself consumed with trying to solve others problems and feeling intense emotions as you describe feeling, when others don't heed my well intentioned advice, that's a good sign to me that there are issues in ME I am avoiding and that my energy is better spent on me.

dandylion

ceruleanblue.....I completely understand the need to hit pause....and, be with yourself...and, to cry!

Crying serves an important function for us humans. It is a built-in way for use to rid our bodies of excess stress and emotional pain....to externalize the negative energy that is just too much to bear.....
I read about a study that said that all tears are not the same....that when we are under stress and pain....the hormones that are associated with this are found, in larger amounts, in our tears! tears from sadness are not the same of as tears from an environmental allergen, for example.....

May the loving arms of the Universe wrap loving arms around you and give you comfort in your pain....

dandylion

ceruleanblue

I agree completely with you.

His issues are sad and painful to him and to me. Yes, he's a master manipulator, but gosh he tried hard to forge through life alone. Completing military tours, surviving sexual abuse (the shame that goes with that especially for men), having a mental health condition, and addiction. Pretty awful stuff. Through emails, he sent me many pictures of his time in the military and the places he went to. I know he's not lying about that.

My awareness of my own issues because of this situation are sad and painful. I have unresolved feelings about a few things too. None of the issues have to do with him. None!
I see that now.

We all get on our life treadmill and just keep going. Keep doing. Keep helping. Keep working. Keep caregiving.

I just want to cry and cry and cry some more....

I miss my childhood friend, very very much. I'm nostalgic for a time when I didn't know about these kinds of things in the world. I think of our own children....as a parent. I'm suddenly a mother of child lost--like my friend.
Awful!

The world seems dark and sad today to me....sad indeed.


The cure for anything is salt water: sweat, tears, or the sea.
~ Isak Dinesen

Bekindalways

C, I love that Isak Dinesen quote.

Also I second what Txjeepguy said about the car. It is likely that without your support, he still would have managed to get one.

We codependents are hyper-responsible while the addicts/alcoholics are zero-responsible; it is why we find each other. It has taken me awhile to realize that quite a bit of my caregiving, helping personality is a kind of pride as if I'm some how better than others. This may not be true for other codependents but it has become painfully apparent in myself.

Good on ya, for doing the hard work of grieving. You will be a better, wiser person on the other side of this.

ceruleanblue

. It has taken me awhile to realize that quite a bit of my caregiving, helping personality is a kind of pride as if I'm some how better than others.

Yes, this is exactly what I felt. I felt pride in the small ways I did help him. I saw some positive results from some advice I gave him. I know he was grateful for it and it came from an honest place on his part.

There is something about his thinking process that is arrested or stunted.... Thought patterns that seemed straight forward to me were like "aha moments" for him. He commented on it himself. It was like I had shortcuts to conclusions and he was often taken aback by how quicky I came to them. It was "normal" stuff to me.

Our talks were not all doom and gloom about the past. He is creative and is gifted in designing and building things. He sent me photos of things he designed and built. He is funny, witty, and has a different angle on life. He is a patriot. We talked about outdoor adventures, trips, personal fitness challenges. He did not just call me to dump and dump.

His lying usually coexisted with his alcohol use. I recognized the pattern AFTER he lied and after the binge. I believe his history because during the time he shared it with me he was sober (for almost a year) and really working his program. He was healthy and "happy". The grief and sadness comes from those happy talks. He shared his future hopes and plans for his life. Starting a garden. Participating in a vet program that goes on outdoor expeditions as part of healing.

You see, he wasn't just this depressed man calling to moan. He was alive. He was often hopeful and happy. Those hopes are what echo in my mind and make me grieve for HIS LOSS, his hopes, his dreams.

Does this make sense?

That's what hurts.... For lack of a better way to say this, he wanted to be "good". He wanted to be free of his past. The childhood stuff he couldn't control and felt deep shame over.

I hope he makes it.

amy55

cerulean, I am currently helping out an addict. Would like to say ex-addict, but can't. He has been off of heroin for over 21 years, but was on the Meth Maintenance Program for about 20 years which he quit cold turkey in 11/2014.

Well, he let everything go, and hit his rock bottom. He had no transportation, cannot get a car license, because his license was suspended back about 25 years ago for driving without a license, no registration, no insurance, no inspection, and he never took care of that.

He also had no internet, no cable, no hot water, no transportation, a cell phone with almost no minutes left on it, no bank account, no credit cards. He lives 25 miles to the nearest town, and he couldn't even go to the food pantry anymore, because he was just stopped again for no registration, and no insurance. The cops know know his truck and he will be stopped if he drives it.

He said that he worked recently and had cash at home, but couldn't pay for anything without a checking acct or a credit card, and couldn't get into town to open up the bank account.

I helped him out with a scooter, and a cheap cell phone so that he could call me and not keep putting minutes on his tracfone. I also did this with the knowledge that even if he says he has the money had home to repay me for this, that I don't expect repayment, and that I could afford it if he doesn't repay me.

That's where my feeling of responsibility end. He can use these things to help himself out now, or not. He has transportation now to get to a job, he has a phone for any job interviews, he can also get food. If he decided to be irresponsible with the help that I gave him, then that is his choice.

I gave him the opportunity to help himself.

My concern ends there. I will still support him though, but that is with phone contact. I'll congratulate him, and be happy for him when he gets a job. I'll encourage him, but as of now, the rest is on him.

And I agree with everyone else here with the car. He would have bought one anyway, no need for you to feel guilt.

(((((hugs)))))
amy

theuncertainty

It's not bad, at all, to say that. That's taking care of yourself. It's lovely to want to help friends. That's what friends do, but it's important to realize where the limitations are to the help we can provide and to respect those. For ourselves. It sounds like you know that additional help for your friend is beyond what you can do, but maybe you're having a hard time with the feeling that you can't do more, or thinking you should do more?

It's important, I think, to give ourselves permission to step back, to acknowledge that *this* is beyond the scope of our abilities. You've done what you can. His choice to repeat these types of behaviors is not something you can change. It's sad. It hurts when our friends and loved ones keep repeating destructive behaviors, but for our own well-being, we need to be able to see when we've done what we can and give them space to figure out what they can do for themselves.

The following quotes help me when issues with my now AXH come up, maybe they'll help for you:

ceruleanblue

Thank you, Amy.

Again, another very helpful post and insightful for someone like me.

Warm regards.