When you just can't get through to them
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Join Date: Jan 2012
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They can think there is a huge conspiracy against them and no matter what you say, they can come up with some type of logical (in their mind) evidence proving them right. It really is fascinating.
When I left XABF, he removed his motorcycle from the garage. Not because i threatened to harm it, not because I have harmed anything of his in the past, not because I've shown him I was capable of harming his things....but because I could harm the engine on it....and I suspect because he thought of doing something to my things.
It was like leaving a middle schooler. I've read that emotional development stops when someone starts problem drinking. That came into my mind during a lot of our arguments in the last couple years of the relationship. After a barrage of insults and not getting a word in edgewise, I would stop and think "Hmm...yep, you started drinking around 15....seems about right."
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Join Date: Jan 2015
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My AH would say similar things too...stress when coming home...wouldn't drink so much if I was more okay with it...blah, blah, blah...
I am SO glad you did not go on that trip with him. Sounds like he is already planning to drink...and that would not be a vacation for you...no all inclusive resort could be worth the stress of being with him...being at home with your kids sounds like a vacation to me! LOL...
I am SO glad you did not go on that trip with him. Sounds like he is already planning to drink...and that would not be a vacation for you...no all inclusive resort could be worth the stress of being with him...being at home with your kids sounds like a vacation to me! LOL...
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Firebolt-been there sister. My then husband got so drunk one night and moved all the money in our joint savings into another account in his own name-like thousands of dollars. Next morning I confront him and of course it's my fault-somehow. Then shortly thereafter I created my own savings account to protect my money bc of what he had done. I got railed for that one too bc how dare I assume he would take money (um, ehat?!) and that I was doing the same thing he had done. Let me just tell you-trying to speak logic to a person with the emotional iq of a five year old, it just doesn't work. I do feel badly for calling my ex a five year old or teenager hundreds of times during the last few years of our marriage-but it was true and Firebolt, I did the same thing. Hmm, he's still 15 years old-that explains every single thing. Every damn thing. Immaturity, arrogance, emotionally stunted, manipulative, just interested in getting screwed and not having a relationship, crude-in love with mommy-like he was at 15 I'm sure! It is true they stop developing at a certain point. Stunted.
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Originally Posted by jada1981 
I couldn't wait to post today. AH left for Mexico today (a trip I was supposed to be on.) I'm actually a little annoyed that I have to miss out since his company is paying for it and it's at an awesome all-inclusive resort. However, I also know it would have been a challenge for him to abstain from drinking so it probably would have been stressful.
So, you are 100% right that it would have been stressful for you to be with him on that trip-- he will not be sober and you would have been trapped having to deal with him drunk.
Anyways, last night we had another discussion. He had posted here in the other side of the board asking whether it's possible to be in recovery from alcohol while still smoking marijuana. I saw what he wrote and he didn't give the whole story, such as he has tried to be "sober" and since July has only been able to make it 1.5 months at a time.
Anyways, the overwhelming advice was no, you need to give it up, although someone mentioned maybe giving it up for 90 days to see if it's really a "problem." (I know I shouldn't even be checking what he writes....forgive my codependent ways.) Anyways, so last night he tells me he may consider giving it up for 90 days.
I will say that I 'may consider' advice I am being given to get her to leave me be for a bit. I have no intention of taking others' advice. My situation is unique and special and smoking pot is not an issue. But I am sick of discussing this with the wife so if I say "Im working on it, Ill think about it or I may consider it" that buys me more time. And when she follows up and asks me about it in a few days I will tell her she nags too much and because of that it justifies my not giving it up just as I never planned to to begin with
I told him regardless, I still want to live separately.
It then seems he got really offended and then got into another discussion.
I told him my final goal would be for us all to be able to be a happy family (even though I know in my heart that the chances of that are close to zero.)
Wow. Well, then he goes on to say how years ago, when I first started trying to "regulate" his drinking, he should have just told me this is who he is and left
Im so sorry-- I could see this going this way as you wrote-- he gets told there are limits for your own well being and he starts to insult and hurt you. So so so familiar. Im so so sorry.
He then told me, in his own words, "Honestly, I really don't even know if I have drinking problem. I think if you had never had to try to control it, it wouldn't be an issue." He told me a lot of times he just drinks to spite me.
If I had never given him the ultimatum that he had to stop drinking in order for our marriage to work, then he wouldn't be drinking so much.
He said everyday, when he drives home from work and gets closer and closer to the house, his anxiety goes through the roof because of having to deal with me.
Going back again to him drinking in the car with the kids in the backseat, again he says if he didn't have to hide it from me, that wouldn't be happening.
He then says, while he will miss me and we are best friends, we just never could seem to connect. I told him it's hard to connect with someone when they have an addiction problem.
He said the main reason he wanted to try to make it work was for the kids. Then he tells me that throughout our relationship, he noticed that I was negative, such as saying negative things about his sister-in-law when she would post on Facebook (we have BOTH continuously said she is a negative nancy) and would point out the negative things she would post all the time.
And then he tells me I have a problem because I got plastic surgery (yes, I had a couple of cosmetic procedures that I paid for with my own money). He told me I should look into getting help regarding that. He was also wanted to be clear that the only reason he's been going to more AA meetings lately is because HE wants to, not because I have been telling him to do so.
I then asked him if he intends to try to remain sober, since he just said he didn't really believe he ever had a drinking problem. He said he wasn't sure. This obviously worries me about him seeing the kids now once we're separated.
Really guys...how can he say these things? Doesn't have a problem, even though he got a DUI a month ago.
What comes next? Do you have a next step?
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Originally Posted by SadInTX
I am SO glad you did not go on that trip with him. Sounds like he is already planning to drink...and that would not be a vacation for you...no all inclusive resort could be worth the stress of being with him...being at home with your kids sounds like a vacation to me! LOL...
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Originally Posted by wanttobehealthy
What comes next? Do you have a next step?
I also had a phone call with my lawyer. He's actually a friend of mine who does family law. Because I am a lawyer myself (although I don't do that area), he told me that I can do the initial steps myself and he will work with me behind the scenes to make sure everything is good. I'm thankful for this because we can save the legal fees. He's sending me the forms and my plan is to work on the initial pleadings tonight after the kids go to bed. The only reason I would file for Legal Separation vs. Divorce is if I would still be able to be covered under his employer's health insurance as a legally separated spouse (some employers will allows this.)
I plan to provide for visitation of the kids at our residence (I will reside in the house with the kids.) I am also going to require Sober Link and that he blow throughout intervals during the visitation.
He hasn't officially been charged with DUI yet. If he actually gets convicted, it will be a slam dunk for me. However, he was arrested for it and I do have the police report. If he wants to try to contest what I want in the temporary orders, then I'm prepared to get declarations from friends/family and others (including the therapists that we have seen together), as well as other evidence, such as his own posts here on this board and several chat messages we have between us. Additionally, in the past, he has also visited "massage parlors" (aka prostitutes) and I will be happy to include all of that in the evidence, which will become public record. I have specific messages he has written on chatboards regarding his actions and I will subpoena his phone records, which will show calls he made to various massage parlors, etc, plus get declarations from therapists and friends whom I confided in after these events occurred. Things could get bad for him and since I'm doing the work myself, I won't be worrying about legal fees.
One of the best feelings is that for the first time forever, I honestly DO NOT CARE if he drinks on his trip. I guess this is what freedom feels like?
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Jada-I know how you feel re vacations and honeymoons. Let me share this with you-my husband got so drunk after our rehearsal dinner that he threw up the night before our wedding and slept through his golf, etc with all his groomsmen. I begged him not to get drunk after our wedding (or before). He got so smashed (he went to take shots with a buddy and left me at the bar for over 30 minutes).... That he passed out on me in bed as he was trying to "consummate the marriage". I had to literally lift his drunk body off of me-in my wedding dress...and then I flipped out and yelled at him, he woke up and was pissed I was pissed and he drubkenly took his wedding ring off and left the hotel room-staggering his way down the hall. Yep!! And the next morning I got an apology and it'll never happen again! Yep!!! Reading what I just wrote - we would have been married ten years this coming Friday, the 4th. I'm a fu**ing idiot. This was our wedding!!! Lovely "man" eh?! Don't let me fool you though-I drank a ton too before I found sobriety-and acted like a tool and pretty foolish. I don't even remember a lot of nights on my honeymoon bc I was so drunk. How sad is that. :/
The last time we went away together was a couple of years ago-we went to the coast with out girls. He did ok during the day, bc he knew I hated him drinking, and during dinner but he wanted to go fishing so I stayed home with the girls while he fished by himself-came home deunker than drunk. It was so sad. I did sit outside and talk with him bc I truly loved and liked him-he was my best friend.
The other "vacation" we took was for my birthday a couple of years ago. We went to a cabin in the hill country-it was beyond beautiful and there was no alcohol for thirty miles. I know he searched it out and tried to run errands to find alcohol-but we did have a good time as he hung out instead of sitting getting drunk by himself. Sad thing was in the morning, he couldn't leave quick enough do he could get home and start drinking.
Anyway, tangents and stories. But I wanted to let you know that you will be okay and much healthier and peaceful without an addict in your life.
The last time we went away together was a couple of years ago-we went to the coast with out girls. He did ok during the day, bc he knew I hated him drinking, and during dinner but he wanted to go fishing so I stayed home with the girls while he fished by himself-came home deunker than drunk. It was so sad. I did sit outside and talk with him bc I truly loved and liked him-he was my best friend.
The other "vacation" we took was for my birthday a couple of years ago. We went to a cabin in the hill country-it was beyond beautiful and there was no alcohol for thirty miles. I know he searched it out and tried to run errands to find alcohol-but we did have a good time as he hung out instead of sitting getting drunk by himself. Sad thing was in the morning, he couldn't leave quick enough do he could get home and start drinking.
Anyway, tangents and stories. But I wanted to let you know that you will be okay and much healthier and peaceful without an addict in your life.
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Originally Posted by Forourgirls
Jada-I know how you feel re vacations and honeymoons. Let me share this with you-my husband got so drunk after our rehearsal dinner that he threw up the night before our wedding and slept through his golf, etc with all his groomsmen. I begged him not to get drunk after our wedding (or before). He got so smashed (he went to take shots with a buddy and left me at the bar for over 30 minutes).... That he passed out on me in bed as he was trying to "consummate the marriage". I had to literally lift his drunk body off of me-in my wedding dress...and then I flipped out and yelled at him, he woke up and was pissed I was pissed and he drubkenly took his wedding ring off and left the hotel room-staggering his way down the hall. Yep!! And the next morning I got an apology and it'll never happen again! Yep!!! Reading what I just wrote - we would have been married ten years this coming Friday, the 4th. I'm a fu**ing idiot. This was our wedding!!! Lovely "man" eh?! Don't let me fool you though-I drank a ton too before I found sobriety-and acted like a tool and pretty foolish. I don't even remember a lot of nights on my honeymoon bc I was so drunk. How sad is that. :/
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Originally Posted by Forourgirls
The only thing I would be hesitant on is doing visitation with you-at your house. If he goes off the deep end , that could potentially not be safe for you. Just my thoughts...
But I was thinking about what could happen if he gets drunk sometime and decides to just come over to the house and do god knows what. That's a bit scary. He's never been violent, but who knows what could happen after the separation. I need to think about that.
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"Really guys...how can he say these things? "
being one of them recovering alcoholics id say with insane denial.
it didnt matter who said what to me to get me to see how jacked up i was, it wasnt gonna do anything but waste breathe that could have been used elsewhere.......
until i honesty wanted help, which required me getting out of denial and seeing how insanely bonkers i was.
being one of them recovering alcoholics id say with insane denial.
it didnt matter who said what to me to get me to see how jacked up i was, it wasnt gonna do anything but waste breathe that could have been used elsewhere.......
until i honesty wanted help, which required me getting out of denial and seeing how insanely bonkers i was.
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Originally Posted by tomsteve
"Really guys...how can he say these things? "
being one of them recovering alcoholics id say with insane denial.
it didnt matter who said what to me to get me to see how jacked up i was, it wasnt gonna do anything but waste breathe that could have been used elsewhere.......
until i honesty wanted help, which required me getting out of denial and seeing how insanely bonkers i was.
being one of them recovering alcoholics id say with insane denial.
it didnt matter who said what to me to get me to see how jacked up i was, it wasnt gonna do anything but waste breathe that could have been used elsewhere.......
until i honesty wanted help, which required me getting out of denial and seeing how insanely bonkers i was.
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everyones bottom is defferent- its where we quit digging. some are able to get the hint, get help, and stop before losing things. others like myself had to lose relationships- the day after my last drunk my (by then ex. i just wasnt informed yet) fiance told me some of the things i said and did- which i dont think i could have picked a worse time- then threw me out.
that was my bottom. i dont think i possibly could have hated myself more.
but thats what it took for me to stop digging.
and,imo, best move she (or any other women i had ever been in a relationship with)ever made was to toss me out.
then theres those that take alcoholism to the gates of insanity and even death.
looks like yer takin care of you and are quite receptive of what these folks are sayin. good on ya!
that was my bottom. i dont think i possibly could have hated myself more.
but thats what it took for me to stop digging.
and,imo, best move she (or any other women i had ever been in a relationship with)ever made was to toss me out.
then theres those that take alcoholism to the gates of insanity and even death.
looks like yer takin care of you and are quite receptive of what these folks are sayin. good on ya!
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Originally Posted by jada1981
You know, I was kind of thinking about that last night. My main thinking is that we both work and the kids go to daycare. AH is planning to get a place close to the house and our thinking was that he could pick them up from school a couple days a week, take them home, hang out, give them dinner, bed, etc. We want to keep them at home as much as possible for now. The days he picks them up, I will go to the gym and maybe al-anon after.
But I was thinking about what could happen if he gets drunk sometime and decides to just come over to the house and do god knows what. That's a bit scary. He's never been violent, but who knows what could happen after the separation. I need to think about that.
But I was thinking about what could happen if he gets drunk sometime and decides to just come over to the house and do god knows what. That's a bit scary. He's never been violent, but who knows what could happen after the separation. I need to think about that.
It was HELL. He assaulted me twice that year, in my home, in front of my kids.
Finally the judge (a new one) at one of many contempt hearings asked why on earth his visits were occuring or had been occuring at the home and that judge was HORRIFIED that another judge had ordered it. That was the end of that, finally.
Anyway, I totally understand the dillema of wanting to know what he's doing and protect the kids and the home seems a logical place to have visits, but it could bring problems too.
Perhaps setting visitation to occur at a public place instead of your home might be safer for all?
Sounds like your lawyer friend is a great resource and the behind the scenes plan to save you money is great!
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Originally Posted by jada1981
Since he's out of town and I am alone with the kids, I decided to go to an al anon meeting this morning. It was a new meeting, but I shared about everything that's going on and some wonderful women who have been through the same thing came up to me after to show support.
I also had a phone call with my lawyer. He's actually a friend of mine who does family law. Because I am a lawyer myself (although I don't do that area), he told me that I can do the initial steps myself and he will work with me behind the scenes to make sure everything is good. I'm thankful for this because we can save the legal fees. He's sending me the forms and my plan is to work on the initial pleadings tonight after the kids go to bed. The only reason I would file for Legal Separation vs. Divorce is if I would still be able to be covered under his employer's health insurance as a legally separated spouse (some employers will allows this.)
I plan to provide for visitation of the kids at our residence (I will reside in the house with the kids.) I am also going to require Sober Link and that he blow throughout intervals during the visitation.
He hasn't officially been charged with DUI yet. If he actually gets convicted, it will be a slam dunk for me. However, he was arrested for it and I do have the police report. If he wants to try to contest what I want in the temporary orders, then I'm prepared to get declarations from friends/family and others (including the therapists that we have seen together), as well as other evidence, such as his own posts here on this board and several chat messages we have between us. Additionally, in the past, he has also visited "massage parlors" (aka prostitutes) and I will be happy to include all of that in the evidence, which will become public record. I have specific messages he has written on chatboards regarding his actions and I will subpoena his phone records, which will show calls he made to various massage parlors, etc, plus get declarations from therapists and friends whom I confided in after these events occurred. Things could get bad for him and since I'm doing the work myself, I won't be worrying about legal fees.
One of the best feelings is that for the first time forever, I honestly DO NOT CARE if he drinks on his trip. I guess this is what freedom feels like?
I also had a phone call with my lawyer. He's actually a friend of mine who does family law. Because I am a lawyer myself (although I don't do that area), he told me that I can do the initial steps myself and he will work with me behind the scenes to make sure everything is good. I'm thankful for this because we can save the legal fees. He's sending me the forms and my plan is to work on the initial pleadings tonight after the kids go to bed. The only reason I would file for Legal Separation vs. Divorce is if I would still be able to be covered under his employer's health insurance as a legally separated spouse (some employers will allows this.)
I plan to provide for visitation of the kids at our residence (I will reside in the house with the kids.) I am also going to require Sober Link and that he blow throughout intervals during the visitation.
He hasn't officially been charged with DUI yet. If he actually gets convicted, it will be a slam dunk for me. However, he was arrested for it and I do have the police report. If he wants to try to contest what I want in the temporary orders, then I'm prepared to get declarations from friends/family and others (including the therapists that we have seen together), as well as other evidence, such as his own posts here on this board and several chat messages we have between us. Additionally, in the past, he has also visited "massage parlors" (aka prostitutes) and I will be happy to include all of that in the evidence, which will become public record. I have specific messages he has written on chatboards regarding his actions and I will subpoena his phone records, which will show calls he made to various massage parlors, etc, plus get declarations from therapists and friends whom I confided in after these events occurred. Things could get bad for him and since I'm doing the work myself, I won't be worrying about legal fees.
One of the best feelings is that for the first time forever, I honestly DO NOT CARE if he drinks on his trip. I guess this is what freedom feels like?
As hard as this is, it does sound like you are clear on what you need to do.
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Have not talked to AH at all today or tonight. Before he left for Mexico, he told the kids they were going to facetime each night. Last night he texted and we ended up talking/facetiming around dinnertime and he appeared to be sober.
Tonight he didn't text me to set up a time to talk to the kids, only texting me once about something someone posted on Facebook. Just now, DS (5 years) wanted to try calling him, so we did and I could tell the call was ignored, so DS left a voicemail. I can only assume AH is drunk. (It's about 11PM where he is.)
I thought last night was going to be hard being alone, but I was so exhausted, I finally got some rest. And when I woke today, I felt an amazing sense of peace because I wasn't worried about AH and his drinking. I also had a great session with my therapist.
Tonight he didn't text me to set up a time to talk to the kids, only texting me once about something someone posted on Facebook. Just now, DS (5 years) wanted to try calling him, so we did and I could tell the call was ignored, so DS left a voicemail. I can only assume AH is drunk. (It's about 11PM where he is.)
I thought last night was going to be hard being alone, but I was so exhausted, I finally got some rest. And when I woke today, I felt an amazing sense of peace because I wasn't worried about AH and his drinking. I also had a great session with my therapist.
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Originally Posted by jada1981
He hasn't officially been charged with DUI yet. If he actually gets convicted, it will be a slam dunk for me. However, he was arrested for it and I do have the police report. If he wants to try to contest what I want in the temporary orders, then I'm prepared to get declarations from friends/family and others (including the therapists that we have seen together), as well as other evidence, such as his own posts here on this board and several chat messages we have between us. Additionally, in the past, he has also visited "massage parlors" (aka prostitutes) and I will be happy to include all of that in the evidence, which will become public record. I have specific messages he has written on chatboards regarding his actions and I will subpoena his phone records, which will show calls he made to various massage parlors, etc, plus get declarations from therapists and friends whom I confided in after these events occurred. Things could get bad for him and since I'm doing the work myself, I won't be worrying about legal fees.
One of the best feelings is that for the first time forever, I honestly DO NOT CARE if he drinks on his trip. I guess this is what freedom feels like?
One of the best feelings is that for the first time forever, I honestly DO NOT CARE if he drinks on his trip. I guess this is what freedom feels like?
Great plan, well-thought out, and it sounds like you're already in motion.
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I am not kidding when I say I feel like I wrote this just over 2 years ago. My ex was the same alcoholic, also smoked marijuana daily. I struggled with leaving or separating for a long time, my choice was to leave, and I am glad I made it. However I am not telling you what to do, I just know exactly how you feel and send you prayers.
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