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Please help talk me off this ledge

Old 03-01-2016, 11:35 AM
  # 41 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by FireSprite View Post
I know that I can't spin in circles in my mind, thinking about the other person's anger/problems/
POV/whatever. I can't control it & all that, you know the drill.

So I've learned to flip the script like this as a method of self-preservation. If I can't get anywhere focusing on them, where can I find room for growth on my side of this situation? How did I trigger? When did I feel myself getting emotionally carried away? What are my expectations - then & now? I always find something I could've done or said or timed differently, even just slightly. Even just internally.

It's also hard because the healthier I become, the easier it is to see the problems all around me differently.... and I wonder, was it always this easy for others to see? Were people as frustrated & furious at *my* denial of my situation? It's true when they say that "when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change".

I hope you are feeling better today!
I definitely can see that I ought to have done a lot differently in my interactions with her...

If I could do it over again I would have simply said I can't spend time together right now-- I wish you well-- and then notified the appropriate organizations quietly.

I can see that my reaction to her and to my concern for her kids was far more "reactive" than it needed to be and in the end all I did, by being honest with her about the fact I would be sharing my concerns, was create drama for me.

She sent the police to my HOUSE to question ME for "harassment".

When I gave them my phone and was cooperative, they quickly changed their tune, told me to notify her to stop contacting me and took photos of her texts admitting to her boyfriend driving drunk and being alone with her kids drunk and the police initiated a child protective services investigation.

I feel like I never knew this woman. She attempted to retaliate against me for my obligation to ensure her kids are safe, and it blew up in her face and she's now under investigation by child services...

Insane...

Im glad I stood up for her kids because someone had to... I was SO triggered by her rationalizing and attempts to convince me she had it all under control when the only way things were under "control" was bc she was lying repeatedly to everyone... She even admitted in a text to me, which the police saw only bc of her false allegations that I was harassing her (more like the other way around) that she had told her kids dad this ELABORATE lie to excuse the boyfriends DWI...

I have blocked her from having all contact with me altogether and several mutual friends have "unfriended" me on social media so she's undoubtedly playing victim and that is fine...

I actually feel relieved to not have to silently listen to her excuses anymore-- I found myself stressed and resentful lately whenever she reached out to me and the friendship has been over for a while but I wasn't willing to admit it...

I didn't expect to feel relief over the end of my contact with her but I do. Her insanity of making false claims about me certainly shed light on how addicted she is to her addict (and she drinks a lot too and perhaps has an issue of her own)...

Anyway, I do have a lot of growth to do, a lot of changes to make and need to learn to react a whole lot differently to things than I do...

I wish I could have done this differently with her but at the end of the day I acted in line with my conscience and looked out for kids and for my own well being and so Im going to have to live with people disliking me for it....
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Old 03-01-2016, 12:21 PM
  # 42 (permalink)  
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((((((SO MANY HUGS)))))) I know this has been so hard on you & you probably feel like you've been on an emotional roller coaster these last days.

Maybe it had to be this way for her? Maybe she needed something this dramatic to understand that her kids ARE greatly affected by her denial. I know she's not there yet, but she's not done going through this inquiry yet either. More will be revealed, right?

And if not, you still learned a lot about yourself in all of this. Progress, not perfection Friend!!
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Old 03-01-2016, 03:42 PM
  # 43 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by FireSprite View Post
((((((SO MANY HUGS)))))) I know this has been so hard on you & you probably feel like you've been on an emotional roller coaster these last days.

Maybe it had to be this way for her? Maybe she needed something this dramatic to understand that her kids ARE greatly affected by her denial. I know she's not there yet, but she's not done going through this inquiry yet either. More will be revealed, right?

And if not, you still learned a lot about yourself in all of this. Progress, not perfection Friend!!
In many ways dealing with her and the retaliatory BS these last days has been so reminiscent of dealing with my abusive xAH that I think THAT more than anything else has stunned me to no end.

I actually feel very alarmed for my own well being seeing the lengths she will go to to defend herself and project blame onto others.

And its been nothing short of PTSD like reaction for me since having the police show up on my doorstep. Having HER be the cause of that, no matter how twisted it all became and how bad for her it is now because of her own retaliatory efforts (ironically enough), is unforgivable.

What is most hurtful or shocking I guess, is that she knew me through ALL the hell my xAH put me through-- she knew the horrid details of all of it... She is the person I told EVERYTHING to and that means she surely had to know how devastating it would be to send the police on a fools errand to my house. And she did it anyway.

It's beyond cruel that she did that and it just highlights for me that she is as sick as her addict bf. No sane person acts as she is.
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Old 03-01-2016, 03:51 PM
  # 44 (permalink)  
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WTBH, what she did was wrong, but I doubt it is grounded in the calculated malice you're attributing to her. You can say, "She had to have known" how it would affect you, but I doubt she is thinking clearly.

I'm not suggesting for a second that you should welcome her back into your life after this, but for your own sake I think you need to consider what's real, here, and what is a product of you own (perfectly understandable) reaction. What's real is what she DID, what might NOT be real is what you think her motives and thought processes were. She felt attacked (wrongly) and she tried to retaliate (also wrongly). I doubt she was thinking, "Now, how can I retaliate in the very MOST hurtful way possible?" It sounds like a knee-jerk reaction. That doesn't make it right but I doubt that you misjudged her all those years and befriended a monster.
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Old 03-01-2016, 04:40 PM
  # 45 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by LexieCat View Post
WTBH, what she did was wrong, but I doubt it is grounded in the calculated malice you're attributing to her. You can say, "She had to have known" how it would affect you, but I doubt she is thinking clearly.

I'm not suggesting for a second that you should welcome her back into your life after this, but for your own sake I think you need to consider what's real, here, and what is a product of you own (perfectly understandable) reaction. What's real is what she DID, what might NOT be real is what you think her motives and thought processes were. She felt attacked (wrongly) and she tried to retaliate (also wrongly). I doubt she was thinking, "Now, how can I retaliate in the very MOST hurtful way possible?" It sounds like a knee-jerk reaction. That doesn't make it right but I doubt that you misjudged her all those years and befriended a monster.
Yeah, I don't think she was a monster all those years we were friends-- sorry if I made it sound as such. I do think she reacted (very much in a way that my xAH would when he "felt" wronged-- retaliatory minded and desperate to put the attention elsewhere) but I don't think she is a bad person deep down. Or at least I hope not...

I do think that she's been a friend who enjoyed being there when I had times that were hard but who never wanted to admit when she had times that were hard... She liked to dispense advice but never needed any advice from anyone else and anyone who tried to offer advice she disliked, was removed from her life... I suppose I should have realized that my turn would be sooner or later...

As upset and disappointed in her as I am, I can see a lot of my older self -- my addicted to the addict self-- in her and it's sad but also eye opening. In some ways I reacted like her too to those who tried to give me kind and sage advice back when I was hell bent on staying with xAH. I certainly never involved the police or accused others of hurting me in anyway but I FELT entitled to feel like a victim of well meaning friends and family who told me things I did not want to hear and in reality they were never off base at all, but of course I didn't see it that way at the time...

It's so devastating to see someone going down the same rabbit hole I fell into and stayed stuck in (by choice) for so long and to realize there is absolutely NOTHING I can do to help...

This friendship has been difficult and unhealthy for me for the last year and I've stuck it out to try and be supportive and gentle and patient with her. And all that it left me with was anger and frustration and it was inevitable I suppose that this point was going to come.

I still can't wrap my head around the fact she's placing her loyalty to an addict she's dated for 1 year, above her protection of her kids-- that's one Im having a hard time letting go of since I've known her kids since they were toddlers and love them as if they're my nephews...

It's just sad all around...
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Old 03-01-2016, 05:14 PM
  # 46 (permalink)  
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WTBH-I wanted to share a story with you. A couple of years ago my husband and I were hanging out with his cousin and wife and their neighbors on a weekend evening. Drinking - lots of drinking. (Recall this is the cousin that has two DUIs and still loves getting drunk-but is not an alcoholic according to my ex). I was close to them-I loved them. The neighbor had been talking about how when he got divirced from his first wife al he did was get drunk every day. Right after that I watched him let his less than two year old take his beer can off the table and drink it. I figured he would grab it and tell him no. Nope-not this crowd. The dad let him do it multiple times and laughed about it. Joked that his wife would be pissed. Little boy in diapers wondering around with a beer to his lips. Dad joked that he was a little alcoholic. Yep. I was appalled. I prayed bout it and sent the mother a text the next day telling her I was concerned and that was something that was so inappropriate that CPS could be called. Needless to say that text ended multiple friendships and I was told and chastised by my exs cousins wife, that I was close to, that she no longer wanted to hang out with me bc she worried that I would judge her too. She was more concerned with the discord it would create with her neighbors than the obvious issue at hand. But that is my ex husbands family. Sigh. I was trying to do the right thing for the kid-bc dad was oblivious. Alcoholics creating another generation of alcoholics and endangering their kids-and the wives that enable it. And trust me, I used to be one!! I was in that sick denial land when I was drinking, too. It's sad...very sad.
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Old 03-01-2016, 05:17 PM
  # 47 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Forourgirls View Post
WTBH-I wanted to share a story with you. A couple of years ago my husband and I were hanging out with his cousin and wife and their neighbors on a weekend evening. Drinking - lots of drinking. (Recall this is the cousin that has two DUIs and still loves getting drunk-but is not an alcoholic according to my ex). I was close to them-I loved them. The neighbor had been talking about how when he got divirced from his first wife al he did was get drunk every day. Right after that I watched him let his less than two year old take his beer can off the table and drink it. I figured he would grab it and tell him no. Nope-not this crowd. The dad let him do it multiple times and laughed about it. Joked that his wife would be pissed. Little boy in diapers wondering around with a beer to his lips. Dad joked that he was a little alcoholic. Yep. I was appalled. I prayed bout it and sent the mother a text the next day telling her I was concerned and that was something that was so inappropriate that CPS could be called. Needless to say that text ended multiple friendships and I was told and chastised by my exs cousins wife, that I was close to, that she no longer wanted to hang out with me bc she worried that I oils judge her too. Sigh. I was trying to do the right thing for the kid-bc dad was oblivious. Alcoholics creating another generation of alcoholics and endangering their kids-and the wives that enable it. And trust me, I used to be one! It's sad...very sad.
It's hard to be the one in the situation who does the right thing and gets chastised, (or visits from the police) for it...

Im so sorry you had to experience this too... and yet knowing that others have been in the same boat and made it through ok, despite it being sad and hurting, does help...

I truly do feel like we are living the same life with some of these posts forourgirls!
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Old 03-01-2016, 07:10 PM
  # 48 (permalink)  
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^ me too, sista!
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Old 03-01-2016, 07:35 PM
  # 49 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by seek View Post
What is actually being reported to CPS? That the mom lives with an alcoholic in rehab? If there is abuse you are aware of, you failed to mention it. I think that's an important piece. Lots of kids have to live in dysfunctional families. If they are not being abused, there is nothing to report. Am I missing something?
Abuse has many forms. The abuse these children are suffering in this particular household are equivalent to physical abuse. Neglect and emotional trama is what is happening. That's what WTBH needs to report.
To CPS: "I'm reporting the knowledge of two children who are being neglected by their mother and potentially being harmed emotionally and physically by her drunk live-in boyfriend. A stop by the home one evening may save those kids from enduring any more of it."

No one made that call for me and my brother.

Call CPS

Also, what is xAH??
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Old 03-01-2016, 07:56 PM
  # 50 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post
Abuse has many forms. The abuse these children are suffering in this particular household are equivalent to physical abuse. Neglect and emotional trama is what is happening. That's what WTBH needs to report.
To CPS: "I'm reporting the knowledge of two children who are being neglected by their mother and potentially being harmed emotionally and physically by her drunk live-in boyfriend. A stop by the home one evening may save those kids from enduring any more of it."

No one made that call for me and my brother.

Call CPS

Also, what is xAH??
xAH is Ex Alcoholic Husband

The police made a report to CPS, WAY better than it coming from me and the Officer who made it told me to not make one myself since she's alleging "harassment" on my part so he took all the texts from me with proof of her admitting to the crap she is subjecting her kids to and the cop included that in his report and CPS and I said ok to using my name as a witness willing to speak to them if need be but he said that it would remove her ability to continue to allege I was harassing her (which the cop recognized I was NOT) if he made the report vs me...

And CPS will obviously take the report from a cop over a citizen much more seriously.

And I too was a kid who lived in chaos, abuse even and my family put on a good act in public (but people KNEW there was bad stuff happening) and no one wanted to get involved...

Ive spent my professional life advocating for kids in need and these kids of my one time friends are like my own kids in terms of how I love them so I had no choice but to speak up for them...
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Old 03-01-2016, 08:11 PM
  # 51 (permalink)  
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xAH, I'm glad this stood for what I thought it stood for. Lol
I read the whole thing thinking, "if this doesn't stand for ex alcoholic husband then I will have sorely missed the point WTBH was making.."

Also, thank goodness your friend sent the police to your door. I know that sounds crazy but a report from the cops is a million times more likely to get CPS into that home.

Imagine the strength you have. You faced a fear, a trigger, that may save two kids, their mom, and a whole family. And you made it through.

Thank you for your strength. Those kids may not have to live like my little brother and I did. My mom died when I was 13 and then, finally, I knew freedom. It's a sad thing when a child loses their parent and it's a great day. I felt like a monster for a long time. Never told anyone I felt elated when she died until I was an adult.

For all those who will call CPS-- thank you!!
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Old 03-01-2016, 08:28 PM
  # 52 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post
xAH, I'm glad this stood for what I thought it stood for. Lol
I read the whole thing thinking, "if this doesn't stand for ex alcoholic husband then I will have sorely missed the point WTBH was making.."

Also, thank goodness your friend sent the police to your door. I know that sounds crazy but a report from the cops is a million times more likely to get CPS into that home.

Imagine the strength you have. You faced a fear, a trigger, that may save two kids, their mom, and a whole family. And you made it through.

Thank you for your strength. Those kids may not have to live like my little brother and I did. My mom died when I was 13 and then, finally, I knew freedom. It's a sad thing when a child loses their parent and it's a great day. I felt like a monster for a long time. Never told anyone I felt elated when she died until I was an adult.

For all those who will call CPS-- thank you!!
I remember wishing when I was a kid and got to be friends with a girl in foster care, that I wished I was her-- I thought she was so lucky that something bad enough had happened to get her out of her home... I don't think I have ever told anyone that actually... When my own mother learned that I was hanging out with this girl (and probably feared I might let slip to her foster mom what life was like for me at my own home), I was banned from spending time with her ever again...
Friendships were not allowed bc I might spill the family "secrets" so I guess it makes it an even bigger deal for me and more deeply rooted in trigger emotional stuff that my one time best friend has reacted as she has because of my spilling her secret... I guess no matter what my age, Im expected by those close to me to keep their secrets...

I share that tale about foster care and my mom to say that I totally relate to why you'd have felt relieved that your mom died... I do get it... I am so sorry no one ever stood up for you or called to help keep you safe...

As for being brave and helping the kids of my friend, Im not so sure I accomplished anything in the long run... I think that I did do what was right and what I felt I had to, but I am jumping at every sound I hear, convinced the police are back and I will be in trouble despite doing nothing wrong. My "friend" is a well respected professional and puts on a good mom act and I am sure nothing will come of the CPS call other than that my former friend will hide things a lot more...

But I will hope and cross my fingers that she makes better choices for her kids... Sadly, I think that her call the police to lie and hope to throw me under the bus, to protect her loser abuser boyfriend, sort of shows the way she will proceed...

All I can think is "what if I did not have all those texts saved?" .... It's scary to have someone I trusted try and get me into legal trouble to cover up her own poor choices.... I guess Im still in scared and panicky mode and I realize it is irrational, but it's what it is....
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Old 03-01-2016, 08:41 PM
  # 53 (permalink)  
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The thing I've learned through all this is to trust God as He will show you who people truly are-whether they are trustworthy or not. He's got your back on this. Remember that the right thing and the easy thing are seldom the same thing.
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Old 03-01-2016, 09:07 PM
  # 54 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Forourgirls View Post
The thing I've learned through all this is to trust God as He will show you who people truly are-whether they are trustworthy or not. He's got your back on this. Remember that the right thing and the easy thing are seldom the same thing.
That bolded part particularly Ive been reminding myself of for the last week as Ive waffled about what to do and then finally did what needed to be done...

Sad that she doesn't realize it would have, in many ways, been far easier for me to turn a blind eye and not be involved in this drama...

But I have to be able to sleep at night and live with myself so...
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Old 03-01-2016, 09:13 PM
  # 55 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by wanttobehealthy View Post
I remember wishing when I was a kid and got to be friends with a girl in foster care, that I wished I was her-- I thought she was so lucky that something bad enough had happened to get her out of her home... I don't think I have ever told anyone that actually... When my own mother learned that I was hanging out with this girl (and probably feared I might let slip to her foster mom what life was like for me at my own home), I was banned from spending time with her ever again...
Friendships were not allowed bc I might spill the family "secrets" so I guess it makes it an even bigger deal for me and more deeply rooted in trigger emotional stuff that my one time best friend has reacted as she has because of my spilling her secret... I guess no matter what my age, Im expected by those close to me to keep their secrets...

I share that tale about foster care and my mom to say that I totally relate to why you'd have felt relieved that your mom died... I do get it... I am so sorry no one ever stood up for you or called to help keep you safe...

As for being brave and helping the kids of my friend, Im not so sure I accomplished anything in the long run... I think that I did do what was right and what I felt I had to, but I am jumping at every sound I hear, convinced the police are back and I will be in trouble despite doing nothing wrong. My "friend" is a well respected professional and puts on a good mom act and I am sure nothing will come of the CPS call other than that my former friend will hide things a lot more...

But I will hope and cross my fingers that she makes better choices for her kids... Sadly, I think that her call the police to lie and hope to throw me under the bus, to protect her loser abuser boyfriend, sort of shows the way she will proceed...

All I can think is "what if I did not have all those texts saved?" .... It's scary to have someone I trusted try and get me into legal trouble to cover up her own poor choices.... I guess Im still in scared and panicky mode and I realize it is irrational, but it's what it is....
I just wrote a big long reply to this and the site logged me off at some point before posting it.. Sigh..

Well, instead of trying to recreate all the anecdotal evidence and support for what I'm about to say, I'm just going to say it.

Those kids will stay in that household because of the exact reason you stated. She is a professional. And obviously a good liar. CPS, the courts, their father--next to nothing will get them a secure environment in or out of that house.

So you have a choice. Walk away or get that woman an intervention and an education on what is means to be a victim of domestic violence and a co-dependant alcoholic. And get that damn boyfriend out of the house. Pay him if you have to. :p

That's the only way to help those kids now.
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Old 03-01-2016, 09:24 PM
  # 56 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post
I just wrote a big long reply to this and the site logged me off at some point before posting it.. Sigh..

Well, instead of trying to recreate all the anecdotal evidence and support for what I'm about to say, I'm just going to say it.

Those kids will stay in that household because of the exact reason you stated. She is a professional. And obviously a good liar. CPS, the courts, their father--next to nothing will get them a secure environment in or out of that house.

So you have a choice. Walk away or get that woman an intervention and an education on what is means to be a victim of domestic violence and a co-dependant alcoholic. And get that damn boyfriend out of the house. Pay him if you have to. :p

That's the only way to help those kids now.
Given her attempts to allege harassment to the police and their advice to me to not contact her AT ALL (not bc Ive done anything wrong but to save me from HER further harassment and allegations), I can not contact her (for my own sake) at this point.

I can't risk my job, my freedom, my ability to provide and care for my own kids trying to help a woman who is bound and determined to cover for her loser addict...

But the loser addict is criminally involved now and will undoubtedly screw up and CPS will do their investigation and presumably THEY will contact me for input as I supplied evidence of her texts about the abuse that occurs, so I will do all I can in my discussions with them, to advocate for those kids...

But fortunately or unfortunately, my communication with her directly is over because she's gone off the deep end since sending the police to my home and Im not risking a rookie cop getting a call from her saying she didn't want contact with me and I contacted her and me running the risk of trouble for me...

Maybe Im being irrational but my experiences with the police in my town are that they are capricious at times, not altogether objective and it's a luck of the draw in terms of who shows us. My xAH is also drinking buddies with several of the local cops and there is no love lost between those few and me so I feel VERY fortunate a sane one showed up the other night, saw that the allegations were lies (since I gave him my phone and he read her harassing texts vs the other way around) and made the report to CPS...

I do not think it would be wise for MY own kids and their well being for me to risk being in touch with her again directly given what she's shown to be capable of.

But I assure you that when CPS or the police contact me about the child safety matter involving her kids, I will be 110% involved and do whatever I can to help them.
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Old 03-01-2016, 10:10 PM
  # 57 (permalink)  
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It's always easier to turn a blind eye....we are not called to do that!!
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Old 03-02-2016, 05:52 AM
  # 58 (permalink)  
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I think cooperating with CPS and not putting yourself in line for a harassment
charge is the wisest course of action at this time,
especially in light of the PTSD I think you are still feeling after crazy Xah's BS.
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Old 03-02-2016, 06:29 AM
  # 59 (permalink)  
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WTBH, I know how upsetting you found the visit from the police, but they weren't there to slap the cuffs on you, they were investigating an allegation--as you would want them to do if you called to report something.

Sammy is right, the visit from the police is documentation. If she alleges anything else, that police report is gold. Her credibility as far as allegations against you is pretty well shot (unfortunately she probably damaged her credibility as far as any allegations against her b/f, too, should she decide to report anything involving him).

So I don't think you have anything to fear in terms of someone in authority believing lies against you. You're going to cooperate with any investigation involving CPS. And, incidentally, just because you don't hear from them directly or you don't see/hear of anything being done, doesn't mean they aren't doing anything. It's most common as a first step to investigate and offer any services that may help the home situation, unless the kids are in immediate danger. Their dad knows, too, so assume he is monitoring the situation.
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Old 03-02-2016, 08:56 AM
  # 60 (permalink)  
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its been nothing short of PTSD like reaction for me since having the police show up on my doorstep.
I'm no expert, but I wouldn't call it a PTSD-like reaction, it IS a PTSD reaction. I'll bet you don't even notice minimizing yourself in ways like this? It is incredibly powerful to Own your Story & call it by the right label. Your past with your Ex involves a lot of bad interactions with your local PD. That's real.

Maybe I'm being irrational but my experiences with the police in my town are that they are capricious at times, not altogether objective and it's a luck of the draw in terms of who shows us. My XAH is also drinking buddies with several of the local cops and there is no love lost between those few and me so I feel VERY fortunate a sane one showed up the other night, saw that the allegations were lies (since I gave him my phone and he read her harassing texts vs the other way around) and made the report to CPS...
You're not irrational, you're in a PTSD-mindset. This incident showed you the exact opposite of your "normal" experience with your local cops, right? But that's just one incident, like a drop of water compared to a river..... it's going to take time to get to a "new normal" with all of this. Think of this like a baby step in that direction.

Hasn't your Ex also gotten into more issues outside of you since your split? Wasn't it sort of public too? Maybe his alliances at the Dept aren't so loyal any longer, maybe they don't want to get dragged into his spiral. Maybe this new complaint on file (in your favor) shows them that hey, maybe it's been him this whole time after all? Maybe they simply aren't willing to risk their pensions to protect his eroding reputation. Don't hold those assumptions as fact forever, things CAN change.


It's so devastating to see someone going down the same rabbit hole I fell into and stayed stuck in (by choice) for so long and to realize there is absolutely NOTHING I can do to help...
I agree. I have to visualize myself hula-hooping allllll the time.

You've done what you can, and found ways you could do it better if the situation came up again. The correct authorities are involved & no matter what, this incident created waves impossible to ignore.

You've got lots to process on your side though - the ending of this friendship & acceptance that it hasn't been working for some time, the projection of your own situation, the residual emotions & revelations.

So, time for my favorite question: What are you doing FOR YOU during all of this?
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