HoldOnLoosely

Hi everyone. I could sure use your support and advice. My husband recently had a couple of slips after 9 months of sobriety. I know that's not uncommon. To be honest, alcoholism is only a symptom of other issues in our marriage. Alcoholism crept into his life almost two years ago (went from moderate drinker to binge drinker on weekends with a only a handful of blackouts). I was clueless of the extent of his alcoholism until he admitted to it a year ago.

We had two strikes (stressors) against us in our marriage prior to the alcoholism: workaholism and a special needs child. Both put a strain of the relationship despite our best efforts. There were other issues too. His fear of abandonment (which I was unaware of until recently). That came out in ways in the relationship that were not constructive.

So, we kind of limped into the alcoholism journey (two individuals with the best of intentions and struggling to keep it all together). I soon discovered pornography (back in February) two months after his alcoholism admission. Mostly, websites, but I will admit I'll never know the full extent. I let it go. I set boundaries for alcoholism and pornography back in the winter and moved on.

The last ten months have been challenging. We are both in individual therapy and marriage counseling (for 8 months). I have stood up for myself, but I have found myself coming up against rationalizations, blame shifting and so forth. I think it was a combination of him whiteknuckling it and his attention focused more on saving the marriage instead of truly working on himself.

A month ago, he admitted to the two alcohol slips and also to looking at pornography three times. I followed through with "I think we should put the marriage temporarily on hold and work on ourselves individually". I finally got tired of "fighting" him, and I told him I needed a break. I am exhausted. I want a chance to work on myself. I find I don't have the bandwidth to work on the marriage and myself. I also have three children (one teenager and one tween), and I homeschool one of them due to his learning challenges. The tween and teenager stage presents its own set of challenges at times. So, it's a lot on my plate.

I suggested a separation of sorts (stay together in the house, but live separate lives) so I might have more breathing room. It was also an attempt to cut down on the tension and arguments that arose when we talked about anything related to the marriage. It's not been well received by husband. He wants to continue to work on the marriage and thinks I have put the marriage in "grave peril" with my decision. That I have abandoned him and left the marriage. That it's only been eleven months, and I have given up on him. So NOT true. According to him, the consequences of my choice rests solely with me. He understands my need to "regroup", but finds the way I am going about it all wrong.

I only want time to work on myself and not get caught up in the arguments anymore. I have been telling him that for months. I thought by stepping aside and out of the line of fire I would have a little room to breathe and have a chance to look within myself more.

I am trying to stand my ground and be true to myself, but it's difficult at times. I know I should detach, but it's still challenging not to "hear" his words.

Am I going about this correctly? I am struggling. Thank you so much for your help.

FireSprite

I absolutely wished for/needed solo time, yes. In the very earliest days of my recovery I didn't see it that way & did the opposite - cling tighter to what wasn't working. But after about 6 months I really saw how I could benefit from it.

We had been separated for 2 yrs & only just living together again for a few months.... going back to that situation wasn't in the cards financially or I would have done it without hesitation.

ladyscribbler

I think you're doing the right thing for you. It sounds like his objections are more about him wanting to avoid his own issues and that "working on the marriage" is the chimera that allows him to do that. So you wanting to detach and sort out your side of the street means he will be left in the position of doing the same thing himself. I think he is terrified of facing himself right now and is looking for any "out" he can find.
You're not abandoning him. You're putting on your own oxygen mask. The best thing you can do for your whole family is to take care of yourself.

LexieCat

From what I've read in here those "in-house" separations don't seem to work out for most people. REAL separations sometimes do, but it seems like when two people who are married constantly bump into each other it's very hard not to have guilt and resentment permeating the atmosphere. I did an in-house separation for a few months before I moved out on the way to a divorce but I had an unusually friendly divorce, compelling reasons for staying a few extra months in the house, and a spouse who didn't make things unreasonably difficult. If he had, I would have been out of there.

FireSprite

Missed the in-house part - sorry. That would not have worked for me at all. I needed REAL distance to not judge him or feel judged by him - living in the same home it is not the same thing to me at all. I'd be distracted just being aware of his comings & goings.

Mango blast

Absolutely!!

My husband and I are living apart and are married. I don't view it as separated. Although in a large sense we are, I am wanting and/or willing (this can vary at times! ) to have time with him and family time. I am not spiritually fit enough to live full time with alcoholism, even in early recovery. I have no time line on this.

We are going on dates on the weekend -- an open AA meeting together, and/or he goes to AA and I go to Alanon, then we do something together -- talking, walking, shopping, eating together. Little things we haven't been good at in a long time. On the weekend, we are together as a family with our 8 year old son, so far - usually while visiting elsewhere -- at a relative's or friend's house. Sunday's have been especially hard for my husband as he knows we're leaving and the tension filters to me and I'm not dealing well with it either. My knee-jerk reaction was to not want to spend any time together, but that's my history and wanting to put up walls and barriers around me. I'm learning other tools that are helping in many ways. We're going to change things up this Sunday. Not sure how it's going to look, but probably a plan a, b and c.... with input from myself, my husband and our son.

One day at a time. Baby steps.

I'm in Alanon and needing to spend extra time on my program. I'm going to 3-4 meetings a week. The closest one is an AA meeting 30 minutes away from home. The other ones are much further away and yet are very important to me and somehow it's all working out and falling together. Checking in with my sponsor more often. Calling others in the program. Asking to get together with others to chat in person and also to hear how they work their program and what's made a difference to them.

This time around with sobriety, my husband is showing different behaviors than any other attempt. Going to AA meetings, calling members, has a sponsor, etc. He hasn't been drinking, yet my brain keeps wanting to check, ask, wonder.... that's my "dis-ease" within myself and why I need to work my program harder to keep the focus on what I can control: me. My thoughts, my behaviors, my actions. It really is crazy-making in my own mind when I smell his deodorant and wonder if he's been drinking. Most of the time I'm able to mind my own business and keep on my side of the street. Then life flows beautifully and I can let go of the wondering. I'm going to be okay no matter what is going on with my husband.

I was using phrases like "I need to take care of myself" and my sponsor has helped me balance that and sometimes replace that with phrases like, "I want to be curious." "I want to be supportive." "I want to be loving." That doesn't mean I am those things at any given moment, yet I truly do want to be those things and some days I am. Usually when I'm buckling down on taking care of myself first -- I just don't always say it that way.

HoldOnLoosely

Thank you so much for your responses and support. I appreciate it SO much.

pndm07

Hi. Time away from the situation, and just so you can savor some real peace, is really healing, I think. I have been separated from my h for 4 years, (after his first bout of drinking landed him in rehab) although we had since gotten close again and spent a lot of time on weekends, with our son. This was only because he was practicing what I thought was a rigorous AA program. Unfortunately he just relapsed badly, and all bets may be off now, but I am thankful that he at least is not living with me. It's draining to have to deal with this type of thing all the time. I don't think you're abandoning the marriage, it sounds like you are really being kind to him. Be gentle with yourself and do what you need to gain some peace in your life.

Lilro

Good Morning H

"I suggested a separation of sorts (stay together in the house, but live separate lives) so I might have more breathing room. It was also an attempt to cut down on the tension and arguments that arose when we talked about anything related to the marriage."

^^^^ this did not work for me when my exh and I were having problems ^^^^

It is hard to live separate lives when you are under the same roof. Everything is questioned and the problems are literally still staring you in the face. If you truly need time to yourself to work on your marriage please think of a plan B.

HoldOnLoosely

So true. It is difficult. It's been one month, and I'm finding it's not working like I had hoped. Plan B? I don't know of many alternatives other than a physical separation. That won't go over well.

Thanks so much everyone for your advice and support.

Lilro

That won't go over well with who? Your husband?

What do YOU want?

I will tell you from experience that the tension in the air during our " live in " separation could have been cut with a knife. That's not a good environment for either yourself or your children.
Who has brought on this situation? You? Believe me I know, it's all easier said than done. At the time of my separation I was a stay at home mom. It wasn't so easy for me to just pick up and go with my son. Of course, my ex was adamant that it was HIS HOUSE TOO AND HE WAS NOT LEAVING. Ugh!! Please... ( he may as well have stood there beating his chest) whatever...
It wasn't until the tension and arguments got so bad that I had to call the police one evening.. They made him leave.
I wish you all the luck with this... It's a hard situation to be in. Think about yourself and your children and let your husband figure his end out.
Hugs
Ro

firebolt

Whoa - my codie alarm went off on that...that I something I would say....you know, because I know what's best for everyone to do for their lives

You have to do what is right for you, and it doesn't have to go over well with him. Your hubs might be shocked to find that if a real separation were to happen, BOTH of your growths could speed up by leaps and bounds.

sauerkraut

Hi Hold on Loosely,
When you wrote, "I have found myself coming up against rationalizations, blame shifting and so forth. I think it was a combination of him whiteknuckling it and his attention focused more on saving the marriage instead of truly working on himself," it sounds like you already are experiencing his attempts to keep the focus on "the marriage" (and, I'm projecting from my own experience, from how "unfair" you are to him) rather than really trying to deal with what is driving him to unhealthy behaviors. I would guess the more distance you can achieve from him, the more he will have to look in the mirror . . . although likely not before trying desperately to keep you in the room to blame.

My AH and I had a therapy session the day after his last drinking episode. The therapist asked how everything was going; I said, not well. H was drunk last night, so I have nothing to say. H knows the drinking is non-negotiable for me.

The therapist that he doesn't usually take sides, but in this case he thought I was right, that I should leave.

Oh my goodness did my H try to get me to stay! He, the emotionally available, in-tune to his feelings, etc. did not want to sit alone in the room and discuss with the therapist why he got smashed the night before. He wanted to keep me there, so he could keep the focus on 'our marriage,' regardless of the fact that he knew our marriage didn't exist anymore if he continued choosing to drink.

It felt so liberating to walk out of the therapist's office. And it feels even more amazing to be living on my own, finally off a roller coaster that I can't control and cannot stand.

BTW I didn't even remember that porn was also an issue with my husband (although he denied the evidence) until you mentioned it with yours.

Good luck finding your space; I agree with the others in saying that yes, you (we) all need it.

HoldOnLoosely

Thank you everyone for your advice and support.

So, the latest... Yesterday afternoon and evening, he begged and pleaded to please stay together and continue to work on the marriage. It's a "one time ask" according to him. I assume that means he won't ask again. He did say we either work on the marriage or he'll probably move out since he can't live like this (staying together in the house, but living separate lives).

He feels he's made inroads with his individual therapy, it will be different this time, I should give him one more chance and there will be no more "fighting" him.

I am indecisive. I either: (1) continue to choose "to put the marriage temporarily on hold and work on ourselves individually". That will crush him. It's difficult to look at the pain in his eyes, and I don't want to hurt him; or (2) choose to work on the marriage and give it one more chance. Then, I somewhat invalidate myself and what I wanted.

Any suggestions? We have a marriage counseling session this afternoon, and it will be discussed there.

FireSprite

IDK - none of us do, really. What do you WANT to do?

Your post reads to me that you would prefer Option #1 but are more concerned about hurting his feelings than doing what you ultimately feel is right for you.

I guess I don't get why it HAS to be either/or - Either you are working on the marriage & staying together OR splitting & separating. Why is it so unacceptable to be physically separated & continue to work on yourselves and have your marriage benefit as a result?

If it were a new relationship no one would question the need to move slowly & carefully, no one would suggest rushing to live together..... to me a recovering marriage is very much like a new relationship because we have new labels, boundaries, understandings, etc. What is the difference?

HoldOnLoosely

That's a very good question. It's my husband that finds it unacceptable, and I don't exactly have the answer. Perhaps, I'll have a better understanding this afternoon at the marriage counseling session. And, you make an excellent point regarding recovering marriages. So true.

I also want to apologize for asking the question "Any suggestions?". I had a chance to reread my thread, and all of you have already thoughtfully given me your suggestions and advice. Sorry about that.

I truly appreciate your responses. Thank you so much.

firebolt

Yeah, I agree with FS - it sounds like you are leaning to option one, and your only hangups are all about how he feels - rather than about how you feel.

Shes right - separating doesn't have to be a marriage ender - in fact, it may be your only real shot at healing the marriage. Best of luck to you today - sending good vibes, strength, courage, and clarity.

redatlanta

I guess I would ask what has changed to merit continuing things the way it is now....because the offer as I see it is no different. Well, one difference. He says no more fighting. Why is there fighting now? Why hasn't he stopped before now? If you stop the so called in house separation, he will stop arguing with you? Whatever.

What you are asking for is not unreasonable. In fact, it might be the only thing that saves the marriage. You may decide to agree to continue on the marriage, put your needs to the side, give in to his request (manipulation), avoid "hurting" him, he wins the battle, you all lose the war.

IMO a physical separation is probably the best idea.

HoldOnLoosely

It's been a while since I posted. There were twists and turns with the living arrangements. For a couple of weeks, my husband temporarily backed off his "he moves back in the bedroom or we physically separate" and so we plodded along with the in house separation. Until a week before Christmas. Then, it came up again - the bedroom or physical separation. He finally had reached his limit (after only six weeks). Whatever. In hindsight, I probably should have called his bluff. Instead, I caved. There's no other way to put it. It might have been due to the holidays, the seriousness of a physical separation, fears of the unknown. I don't know. I haven't had the time to delve into it. Anyway, he ended up back in the bedroom until yesterday...

My husband finally confessed the rest of his secrets a day ago. During a dark 5-6 month period (a year and half ago) of binge drinking, he went five times to massage parlors for FULL body massages...when drunk of course. I didn't know there's a phrase for it - massages with happy endings. I am SO disappointed. I don't know what else to write. SO disappointed.

I don't know if I can put this behind me. I don't know if this is the end of my marriage. I just don't know.

ladyscribbler

I didn't know there's a phrase for it - massages with happy endings.

That's a pretty euphemism for cheating on your wife with a prostitute. Having lived in many military towns, I'm familiar with those types of establishments. Gross.
I'm really sorry. I know how you agonized over the decision of whether or not to separate.
One thing, as much as it's tempting to blame the alcohol for his behavior, his drinking didn't cause this. Being drunk might have lowered his inhibitions, but it wasn't the reason for his cheating. Just like not all alcoholics are abusive or violent, not all of them are cheaters either.