Shake909

Firstly I must say what a brilliant forum this is - very informative & full of wise words!

My situation: have been with the girlfriend for 8 months now. I noticed her problem with alcohol VERY early on. Now I'm quite fond of a drink myself and much of my social life is based in and around pubs and the odd social night out but this is a completely different level.
It's the usual signs which I'm sure many of you are familiar with: personality changes very quickly; cannot stop at just 1 or 2 drinks; says outrageous and often insulting things; extreme anger; often leads to substance abuse which means she is able to carry on drinking; endless lies and drama all based on her reaction to alcohol...
I have discreetly spoken to a member of her family and one of her friends and I am not alone in my thoughts and people have raised it with her in the past but she ends up shutting them out of her life.

I have thrown quite a few ultimatums at her to get help - she eventually agreed 6 weeks ago. She initially had an assessment (at a local addiction support place, they also deal with mental health/behavior issues etc) and has since had 4 hour long meetings. I have been taking her there so know she has been attending but she changed her mind at the last minute about wanting me to be there at the sessions.
She came out from 2 of the sessions VERY upset - I think she has had to discuss losing her mother 9 years ago which has obviously had a devastating impact on her.

BUT she continues to drink... and says that the lady who is counseling her thinks that the problem isn't alcohol.

Now I'm not qualified to diagnose people but I'm 100% sure that the problem is alcohol - it ends badly every single time. My niece has exactly the same bad reaction but she was able to admit it and get help because she wanted to .

My question to others is this: have any of your loved ones gone into meetings/counseling like this, have still been in denial half way through (whilst continuing to drink) but come out the other side after 10/20 sessions?

I am at the end of my tether. I don't want to abandon her if she can get through this but can't carry on living this lifestyle either - it's so draining : (

Pia

Shake909- Please run... do not feel obligated to help her. Please dont think you will say or do the 1 thing that will get her to See The Light and Change Her Ways.

You have been with her for 8 months and feeling at the end of your rope now, it will continue to get worse. If we could love someone enough or care about someone enough for them to change we all would not be here.

Please Stop Abandoning You!!!!!!

Ally89

I will echo the comment already made- leave this relationship now.

I know it seems harsh and that it is easy for poeple to say when we do not undrstand your feelings- but we do. We have lived this.

I was with my XABF for 5 years- this year headmitted he had a problem and started counselling. I thought this was great, he also started coming back very upset and offered support. He was very cagey about the sessions and I respected that as his private space.

Fast forward 5 months and he was drinking the whole way through, just hid it from me but I found something each time. Oh yes I remember the lies: "my counselor said I am not 'that type' of alcoholic, it is just about me getting better control over my drinking, I just have to cut down for a while, oh yes my counselor told me this holiday you will not be attending with me is a great opportunity to test out my control."

He actually told me once he even lied to his counselor about how much he was drinking (and god knows whatever else). Although you are doing the right thing and coming from a place of love, trying to help if they are not reading only gives them a reason to resent and blame you. If you threaten the addiction then you become the problem and yes you can be cut out. Very brutally. I would cut your losses and take the control I never did. She already has a history of cutting people out, please do not delude yourself into thinking you will be treated differently. Believe me it hurts much more after 5 years that 7 months.

atalose

It’s kind of like this……….you clearly see she has a problem with alcohol= that’s like seeing a big hole she’s fallen into.

Then you attempt to manipulate her into seeking help = trying to pull her up from the hole.

You have a slight understanding of a tragic lose earlier in her life = you beginning to climb down into that hole with her making excuses why she might be down there.

She is making up excuses such as the counselor told her she doesn’t have a problem with alcohol = her wanting to stay down in that hole.

Right now you are not all the way down in the hole. You have a good chance of getting yourself out.

Nothing says that somewhere down the road if she fully address’s her issues and has quality time sober and is working a program and you want to explore a relationship with her then, that you can do that. But right now 8 months into this dating and so many big issues with her. Whether you stay or whether you go will have no bearing on her drinking. Your support or you ending things will have no bearing on her drinking.

marie1960

BUT she continues to drink... and says that the lady who is counseling her thinks that the problem isn't alcohol.


There is a very high probability that she is lying.

If she stays in denial, she will not have to address the actual life issue that is currently controlling her life.

Only 8 months into the relationship and this is what you are dealing with?

You are not abandoning her, she abandons herself everytime she chooses to drink and drug.

You cannot help/save her, but you certainly can save yourself.

What you allow is what will continue.

tomsteve

"BUT she continues to drink... and says that the lady who is counseling her thinks that the problem isn't alcohol."

more than likely, from what i read, is alcohol is only a symptom of deeper problems. there was probably quite a bit you werent told, like possibly this counselor telling her alcohol isnt going to make anything better, stuffing it wont work, and continueing to drink everything will get worse.
probably told to stop drinking,too.

if ya want to go down further stay. she will drag ya down as long as ya allow her to.read around here and learn of the depths a person can get dragged down to.

step away and take care of you.
youre putting quite a bit of effort into an 8 month relationsip.
im thinkin ya got issues of your own ya may want to consider working on.

tomsteve

this isnt peanuts were dealing with.

its not the question.... yet....

SparkleKitty

Hi Shake and welcome to the forum. We're very glad you're here but very sorry you found reason to come looking.

At this point your GF sounds like she is in denial. There's no time frame any one can give you for her understanding the depth of her problem, or when or if she will decide to deal with it.

I find it is best to accept people as they are, today, not how I hope or wish they will be, and make my decisions accordingly. You may be willing to hang in there for awhile longer, and there's nothing wrong with that and of course there is always a chance things will improve, but if you do I highly recommend attending some Al-Anon meetings. Right now your eyes are the only ones that are open to what is going on. You cannot open her eyes for her. You can in no way manage her addiction. But you can take care of yourself as you figure out what it is that you want to do moving forward.

Ally89

No I would not tell someone to leave a relationship if their partner had an allergy to peanuts.................peanuts do not change brain chemistry and causes someone who professes to love you to constantly lie, manipulate and cause you hurt, distress and question your own sanity.

The fact that you even state this as a viable comparison leads me to believe you do not have much experience of dealing with the effects of someone else's drinking? Perhaps you should read around and see where some of us are coming from.

I am not so deluded to think for one moment that an opinion on a forum will make someone make a decision on their relationship they do not want to make. We are sharing experience and opinion. Take what you like........

cynical one

Keep in mind that you can abandon puppies, kittens, and minor children. But, leaving a relationship with a capable adult is not abandoning them, her survival is not dependent on you.

And, while I think she's twisting the counselor saying "alcohol is not the problem" to mean she doesn't have a problem with alcohol. Perhaps what the counselor said or meant was "the use of alcohol is a symptom of the problem" meaning there is a deeper underlying issue or "root cause". But, that is just semantics.

Take the use of alcohol out of it, is her behavior acceptable or not?

Also, look at the reality of it, not who you thought she was, or who you think she can be, but who she is right now. Is the person she is today who you want to invest more time into?

dandylion

Hercules.....while I do hear your point....I don't think you need to worry too much.

Something that I have observed is that nobody leaves a relationship until they are ready---until they want to. Especially, when they are in the early biological attraction phase of a relationship. Or, if they are clinging to a dysfunctional relationship for reasons like co-dependency or even trauma bonding (in some cases), etc.
This particular forum is a sort of select group---in that virtually everyone has already been down the road and suffered just about everything that an alcoholic can do to inflict pain and destruction into a relationship. There is a strong feeling of obligation to share the (harsh) reality with the new person___when they are preparing to walk straight into the jaws of the Dragon.

The other thing that I have noticed is that there is only one good chance to share this with the new freshly "in love" person. They almost always leave the forum after they have been given the advice to save themselves....as that is not what most have come to hear.
But---I do feel that it plants a idea in their brain that they may be able to use later. And, they do get to hear that leaving a toxic relationship is an option, and that it is valid to look after their own welfare, first.

Don't worry.....they won't leave the relationship just because we said so......

dandylion

cynical one

When seeing replies like this, my first thoughts are either they are still active in their addiction, have less than a couple months sober, haven't yet acknowledged the wreckage of their past, or haven't worked a program from the loved ones side.

And, in some cases...all of the above.

redatlanta

I see you are a newcomer to recovery Hercules. Wishing you well on your journey to sobriety.

The posters have answered the question - in their experience the answer was no, given the circumstances that the OP's girlfriend is still in denial, and is still drinking there is no indication that things will change. With little time invested in the relationship their opinion is best to exit. This is based on their own experience and while you may not like to hear this side of things (what life is like living with an alcoholic), its reality for many.

You peanut analogy is not accurate and in no way represents life with addiction.

To the OP - I am sorry for what you are going through. Yes you will have to decide what you can live with. At this time there your girlfriend is not showing ANYTHING indicative of trying to change. My guess also is that she is lying to the therapist about her consumption and outrageous behavior. This is very, very common alcoholism is a disease of denial. I suggest you put some space between yourself and her for the time being. It would be best not to go anywhwere with her where drinking is involved. I also recommend you get to Al Anon to work on your situation.

Shake909

Firstly - many thanks for all of your replies. I fully appreciate most of you will have been through far more than I have & it means a lot to get a response from those who have (unfortunately) got in-depth experience with this grim matter.

Perfectly acceptable - hence the frustration. It's like going out with 2 different people. We have gone away on trips recently where I've implemented a 'ban' on alcohol and you wouldn't know there was anything wrong. But we get back home, she's left to her own devices and it all goes belly-up BADLY. And then there's almost a 24 hour period where I know I won't get any sense out of her and I have to ignore pretty much any contact in that time-frame.

To be honest, most of you have echoed what my close friends have been saying to me. But because it is genuinely so good when alcohol isn't brought into the equation, I've felt it had to be worth fighting for.

I predict I will just have to walk away from it in the next few weeks which will be extremely hard. I've thought about Al-Anon, but I do not want to be living with this for the rest of my life if the other person can't face up to it properly.

Thanks again folks...

honeypig

Hi, Shake--glad you found us here, and glad you weren't put off by some of the replies to your original post. While it may make the most sense to tell someone who has only 8 months invested in a relationship to "run away", it's also necessary for the person being told to run (you, in this case) to understand WHY that may be the best.

If you were dealing w/someone who had a problem other than addiction, it would seem pretty crappy to "abandon" them when a problem arose or they came upon tough times. However, addiction/alcoholism is a total game-changer. All bets are off, all the rules have gone out the window. Reading other folks' stories and experiences here will show you what I'm talking about.

What will be most helpful to you in making this decision for yourself will be educating yourself about alcoholism. Reading around this forum and especially checking out the stickies at the top of the page will help a lot towards that end. So will Alanon.

I don't quite understand the portion of your post that I quoted above. Alanon has no lifetime membership requirement; you can attend as many or as few meetings as you like, for as long or short of a time as you feel is helpful. Some folks do continue to go for years and years even if the A is no longer in their life b/c they get so much help w/simply living life, and that is really what Alanon is about--about you and how you live your own life, NOT about the A and whatever they may or may not be doing. Many of us here have found it helpful; some have not. The best way to decide is to try it for yourself, I think. Let me emphasize again that Alanon is about YOU, not the A.

Anyway, welcome to SR, and I hope you find the support and education that you're looking for. Keep coming back as long as you feel the need.

Shake909

I have to confess I was being a bit small-minded with regards to Al-Anon, I had it in my mind that it was mainly for people who had decided to put up with their other halves and their drinking problems. Am reading up on it now. I know they hold meetings not far from me so I might actually go down that path.

Thanks for opening my eyes and for your other wise words :-)

healthyagain

Hello Shake and welcome,
Whatever decision you make, make sure you are well-informed before making it (and I am also one of those who would tell you to run for your life, but . . . ehm). Just like alcoholics have to hit their bottom before they stop drinking, we also have to hit our own bottom with alcoholics before we leave for good. Took me 10 years, after almost 9 years of marriage.

The fact is, if she does not choose recovery herself, there is nothing you can do. In the meantime, the disease is going to progress. If she is this bad after 8 months only, is it really really really worth it?

So, find out as much as you can about the disease, especially the social aspects of it, the roles spouse, family, friends play in it, and how you can truly help without being sucked into codependency.

Liveitwell

Hercules-I'm just going to say it...unless you have experience, strength or hope to share on living with an addict and the trauma that can come along with that, please stay on your side of the street - congratulations on your sobriety.

OP-if AlAnon doesn't gel with you, please also check out Celebrate Recovery....good alternative to AlAnon. Peace to you!!

honeypig

You'll certainly find folks who have made this choice; you'll find others who've made different ones, and perhaps most important, you'll find a lot who are in the process of learning enough (about themselves, their options, alcoholism, and what they want out of life) to make their own highly personal decision, the same place that you yourself are in.

Each meeting, depending on the particular folks who attend, can have a very different flavor. You may be able to find a men's meeting, if that would be more comfortable. You may want to look into a beginner's meeting, altho this is certainly not necessary or even always available. Just bear in mind that meetings will differ from other meetings to some extent, and even the same meeting may be very different from week to week depending on who attends. It can take a few tries sometimes to find the right fit.

I'm glad you're considering this. I found it very useful to have both SR for online support as well as Alanon for face-to-face help. Each had its own strengths, and boy oh boy, I needed all the help I could get! Things are much calmer now, but I still rely on SR and Alanon to help keep my feet on the ground and my mind centered. Hope you find the same help.

JustAnotherDay

If you know how she is now... Please leave this relationship. I invested four years to someone, like most, has underlying issues that are exasperated by alcohol. It's easy to cover up excessive drinking if you're going out socially all the time. You will find that if you want to enjoy things or family functions that alcohol will still be involved. She will get worse. Let her fail on her own and hopefully she will get the help she needs!!!

Please don't waste another minute. I have let letters that I gave AB years ago, it's still exactly the same now. I'm in my twenties and I've spent more time worrying about his mental health than my own wellbeing when that should never be the case.

Please feel free to message me, I'm not completely out of the woods yet but I've been there and I can relate.