I'm so foolish
Sober since 10th April 2012
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Location: Perth, Western Australia
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Hi Butterfly, I'm with Maybear in that navigating through the world of dating isn't easy, but it's not super serious either. Both of you are equivocal about a relationship, and a kiss is just a kiss. It didn't go further.
If you're both ok about friendship, I don't see any reason why you couldn't meet up for a drink or a coffee.
If you're both ok about friendship, I don't see any reason why you couldn't meet up for a drink or a coffee.
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Join Date: Nov 2013
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Originally Posted by Butterfly 
Thanks everyone. Although I have probably blown the friends thing now with my response I get it and I haven't heard from him since.
Probably best.
Probably best.
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I thought a little bit more about this last night because it kept tugging at my brain. Initially I was happy you had the experience and good feeling of someone being attracted to you. Something feels familiar about the situation to me...
He didn't want to get hurt or for me to get hurt didn't want to not be friends.
THIS ^^^^^. In my quests for the most f*ucked up man on the planet I have heard this a myriad of times. What this means is this person wants a free ride so to speak. When someone says "I don't want to get hurt or hurt you" in my experience it means they will. They are unavailable - yet soften it by stating your friendship is important. So what they really want is whatever they need at the moment. Need a girlfriend for a day - you are it. Need a roll in the hay - you are it. Need someone to talk to - you are it. Need a friend - raise your hand. What they DON"T need is anything more - no strings, no obligation, they owe you nothing, BECAUSE they told you from the get go their intent.
You want to see a man look at you bug eyed have a "relationship" with him under these rules and then tell him you thought things were more serious. You'll hear stuttering and watch him dance around like a mexican jumping bean. "I TOLD YOU I DIDN"T WANT YOU TO GET HURT"!!! LOL whatever.
I do think you need to wrap things up before you endeavor on dating. That's just my opinion of course you proceed how you wish. In the future should you run into this "type" again just move along. They are WAY more trouble than they are worth.
I've been off the market for a long time. In my single, codie, enabler days I would have been all over this. I would have already plotted how the whole thing was going to work out (and it would because His words say one thing but his actions another). No matter what he may have said or done I would have put a lot of energy and time into "fixing" him, and all his many problems stemming from childhood LOL (awwww poor him),
Today I wouldn't give this kind the time of day. Healthy relationships - whether casual or serious, don't begin by discussing potentially hurting each other. That's a RED FLAG.
He didn't want to get hurt or for me to get hurt didn't want to not be friends.
THIS ^^^^^. In my quests for the most f*ucked up man on the planet I have heard this a myriad of times. What this means is this person wants a free ride so to speak. When someone says "I don't want to get hurt or hurt you" in my experience it means they will. They are unavailable - yet soften it by stating your friendship is important. So what they really want is whatever they need at the moment. Need a girlfriend for a day - you are it. Need a roll in the hay - you are it. Need someone to talk to - you are it. Need a friend - raise your hand. What they DON"T need is anything more - no strings, no obligation, they owe you nothing, BECAUSE they told you from the get go their intent.
You want to see a man look at you bug eyed have a "relationship" with him under these rules and then tell him you thought things were more serious. You'll hear stuttering and watch him dance around like a mexican jumping bean. "I TOLD YOU I DIDN"T WANT YOU TO GET HURT"!!! LOL whatever.
I do think you need to wrap things up before you endeavor on dating. That's just my opinion of course you proceed how you wish. In the future should you run into this "type" again just move along. They are WAY more trouble than they are worth.
I've been off the market for a long time. In my single, codie, enabler days I would have been all over this. I would have already plotted how the whole thing was going to work out (and it would because His words say one thing but his actions another). No matter what he may have said or done I would have put a lot of energy and time into "fixing" him, and all his many problems stemming from childhood LOL (awwww poor him),
Today I wouldn't give this kind the time of day. Healthy relationships - whether casual or serious, don't begin by discussing potentially hurting each other. That's a RED FLAG.
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Although I have probably blown the friends thing now with my response I get it and I haven't heard from him since.
you spoke to him YESTERDAY.
try not to "catastrophize" everything.
it doesn't serve you well.
you spoke to him YESTERDAY.
try not to "catastrophize" everything.
it doesn't serve you well.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
This...100%. Honey, you are so hard on yourself. You have been through so much. I know you want to leave that hurt behind, and you will. It takes time, and it takes just being OK on your own first. Love you lots, this is just a bump in the road!
XXX
XXX
Originally Posted by maybear
Deep breath Butterfly! Big hugs. You are so hard on yourself. Give yourself a break, you are human and so is he remember.
Dating is hard for everyone. We have all been rejected and will reject. There are many reasons.
You are putting your entire self worth in this guy's hands. Take it back and keep it where it belongs. With you.
I agree that you need to establish some boundaries when it comes to dating and stick with them. Make sure you are accountable and 'check in' with yourself and your feelings when you start dating to make sure you are not feeling uncomfortable and overstepping your boundaries at any time.
Hugs!! You are doing great, please show yourself some compassion.
Dating is hard for everyone. We have all been rejected and will reject. There are many reasons.
You are putting your entire self worth in this guy's hands. Take it back and keep it where it belongs. With you.
I agree that you need to establish some boundaries when it comes to dating and stick with them. Make sure you are accountable and 'check in' with yourself and your feelings when you start dating to make sure you are not feeling uncomfortable and overstepping your boundaries at any time.
Hugs!! You are doing great, please show yourself some compassion.
Baby Steps
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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Thank you everyone. I spoke to some friends today one said oh he's so sweet knowing your not ready and backing off another said he's messing with your head walk away!!
Red I've thought about what you've said aswell and yes I was planning how it would all work out!!
It has left me feeling that had I had sex with him he wouldn't have been too worried about what I was going through. When I first asked him why he kissed me and said all those things his reply was your not ready for that!
I can't help but feel that he was only after one thing. It's funny that despite him knowing I had a lot of healing to do and recovery from my marriage he kissed me yet when we spoke about it again he then said he didn't want things to be complicated and what I had said made a lot of sense!!
Let's face it the we can still be firends is the brush off!!
I know I jumped in both feet I hate feeling lonely, unattractive and not wanted. I am scared of spending my life alone. I think this was why I put up with stbxah behaviour for so many years at least I wasn't alone. And if he was at home/came back then I was wanted and worthy. I know unhealthy thinking!!
Red I've thought about what you've said aswell and yes I was planning how it would all work out!!
It has left me feeling that had I had sex with him he wouldn't have been too worried about what I was going through. When I first asked him why he kissed me and said all those things his reply was your not ready for that!
I can't help but feel that he was only after one thing. It's funny that despite him knowing I had a lot of healing to do and recovery from my marriage he kissed me yet when we spoke about it again he then said he didn't want things to be complicated and what I had said made a lot of sense!!
Let's face it the we can still be firends is the brush off!!
I know I jumped in both feet I hate feeling lonely, unattractive and not wanted. I am scared of spending my life alone. I think this was why I put up with stbxah behaviour for so many years at least I wasn't alone. And if he was at home/came back then I was wanted and worthy. I know unhealthy thinking!!
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((((hugs)))) Butterfly.
I stand by my original opinion about all of this. SLOOOOOOOW DOOOOOOOWN.
You are not the casual sex type of person right now, you are not yet divorced completely & as of just a couple weeks ago (maybe less?) you were still holding out hope that your marriage wasn't actually over. You aren't ready to date, IMO; it's just too early.
I read that you are more concerned about not being alone than you are about being happy & that makes me so sad, Butterfly. I wish you could see that you could have BOTH if you would stop obsessing about everyone else & put ALL of that mental energy into yourself instead. After all of these years of putting up with your Ex's crap, is a few months dedicated to yourself too much to ask? Aren't YOU worth it?
If you recognize the unhealthy thinking you are doing, you have to also realize that as long as you continue that same pattern, you're going to keep producing the same results, right? If you desire different results, you HAVE to change the thinking first!
I stand by my original opinion about all of this. SLOOOOOOOW DOOOOOOOWN.
You are not the casual sex type of person right now, you are not yet divorced completely & as of just a couple weeks ago (maybe less?) you were still holding out hope that your marriage wasn't actually over. You aren't ready to date, IMO; it's just too early.
I read that you are more concerned about not being alone than you are about being happy & that makes me so sad, Butterfly. I wish you could see that you could have BOTH if you would stop obsessing about everyone else & put ALL of that mental energy into yourself instead. After all of these years of putting up with your Ex's crap, is a few months dedicated to yourself too much to ask? Aren't YOU worth it?
I know I jumped in both feet I hate feeling lonely, unattractive and not wanted. I am scared of spending my life alone. I think this was why I put up with stbxah behaviour for so many years at least I wasn't alone. And if he was at home/came back then I was wanted and worthy. I know unhealthy thinking!!
Baby Steps
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Thank you firesprite ^^^^^^^^^ everything you said was spot on!! I'm not the casual sex type, never was and never will be. Sex is very personal to me and based on love, trust and mutual respect, may sound boring to some but for me it's not it's who I am and I'm ok with that.
I know it was too early and I'm not ready I'm not over ex but it was nice to feel wanted but then I want to rush into things. I probably scared him off!! I want to be happy I really do and I probably looked to this guy thinking he could make me happy and I won't be alone yes I know seriously unhealthy. I am starting to recognise that my thinking is very unhealthy and will try harder to work on that.
I know it was too early and I'm not ready I'm not over ex but it was nice to feel wanted but then I want to rush into things. I probably scared him off!! I want to be happy I really do and I probably looked to this guy thinking he could make me happy and I won't be alone yes I know seriously unhealthy. I am starting to recognise that my thinking is very unhealthy and will try harder to work on that.
Baby Steps
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Originally Posted by LexieCat
Yup, what Anvil said. Think of it from his perspective, he's trying to let you know he's attracted to you but willing to go at your pace. I know it's hard to navigate when you're feeling attracted (and attractive--yay!) yourself, but aren't sure how far you want to take it.
So it sounds to me as if YOU are the one who's ambivalent. He isn't, but he's trying to walk that delicate line between showing interest and being pushy.
Maybe keep it casual for now, get to know each other a little better--he's sort of from the past, right? So things change with time. Maybe plan some activity you'd both enjoy and see if you really have fun together. In the vertical sense of the word.
So it sounds to me as if YOU are the one who's ambivalent. He isn't, but he's trying to walk that delicate line between showing interest and being pushy.
Maybe keep it casual for now, get to know each other a little better--he's sort of from the past, right? So things change with time. Maybe plan some activity you'd both enjoy and see if you really have fun together. In the vertical sense of the word.
Yes I probably am ambivalent I want to start living and enjoying life but not ready to date!!
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Of course it was great to feel desired! I don't blame you AT ALL for wanting that validation about yourself. Every woman reading this thread has felt that way at one time or another, we can all relate.
I think it was a good experiment Butterfly, I really do. You tested the waters & found out a bit more about yourself in the process. If you scared him off THAT easily then good riddance! Buh-Bye! Better to find that out now vs. later.
There's NOTHING boring about this attitude:
It's not just about sex or others for that matter - can you think about YOURSELF that way? Can you see that YOU deserve your own love, trust & respect too? That's what you want to focus on friend, rebuilding love & trust with yourself. This go-around you assumed your gut instincts were wrong only to find that they were accurate - next time the trick will be to trust those gut tugs without waiting for "proof". It is an AMAZING feeling to trust yourself like that!
I think it was a good experiment Butterfly, I really do. You tested the waters & found out a bit more about yourself in the process. If you scared him off THAT easily then good riddance! Buh-Bye! Better to find that out now vs. later.
There's NOTHING boring about this attitude:
Sex is very personal to me and based on love, trust and mutual respect, may sound boring to some but for me it's not it's who I am and I'm ok with that.
Baby Steps
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Originally Posted by FireSprite
I think it was a good experiment Butterfly, I really do. You tested the waters & found out a bit more about yourself in the process. If you scared him off THAT easily then good riddance! Buh-Bye! Better to find that out now vs. later.
There's NOTHING boring about this attitude:
It's not just about sex or others for that matter - can you think about YOURSELF that way? Can you see that YOU deserve your own love, trust & respect too? That's what you want to focus on friend, rebuilding love & trust with yourself. This go-around you assumed your gut instincts were wrong only to find that they were accurate - next time the trick will be to trust those gut tugs without waiting for "proof". It is an AMAZING feeling to trust yourself like that!
I'm more than happy with my attitude towards sex. When I was younger I would have given into pressure and never really had sex for enjoyment. Suppose the same with ex a it was always when he wanted it and if I tried to initiate he would say no, I don't really know where my believe came from suppose maybe it's how I want it to be and feeling forced.
I will try to adopt the same thinking to myself and show myself a bit more love and respect.
Thank you firesprite.
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I think what jjj111 said has a lot of truth! I do something something similar...
For years I tried to give my real dad second chances even though he had been mean, verbally/emotionally abusive, and alcoholic, and he never changed. I then grew up to date men that would not a d could not live up to what I deserve; it was inevitable that these men would "let me down". They repeated the pain I felt as a child.
What's interesting though, is that not only do we repeat patterns to continue to victimize ourselves, but we can also tweak reality into our delusions by assuming that others are doing to us what has been done to us before. Welcome to codie brain! Ugh!
I'm still working on this one. I think it has to do with communication, allowing myself to express my emotions, listening to myself about what I really want (that guts voice), and allowing others to show me who they are over a period of time... and then taking what they've shown me at face value. Part of that too is learning to live in the moment instead of future trippin and allowing my past to dictate my current situation.
For years I tried to give my real dad second chances even though he had been mean, verbally/emotionally abusive, and alcoholic, and he never changed. I then grew up to date men that would not a d could not live up to what I deserve; it was inevitable that these men would "let me down". They repeated the pain I felt as a child.
What's interesting though, is that not only do we repeat patterns to continue to victimize ourselves, but we can also tweak reality into our delusions by assuming that others are doing to us what has been done to us before. Welcome to codie brain! Ugh!
I'm still working on this one. I think it has to do with communication, allowing myself to express my emotions, listening to myself about what I really want (that guts voice), and allowing others to show me who they are over a period of time... and then taking what they've shown me at face value. Part of that too is learning to live in the moment instead of future trippin and allowing my past to dictate my current situation.
Baby Steps
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Originally Posted by LemonGirl
I think what jjj111 said has a lot of truth! I do something something similar...
For years I tried to give my real dad second chances even though he had been mean, verbally/emotionally abusive, and alcoholic, and he never changed. I then grew up to date men that would not a d could not live up to what I deserve; it was inevitable that these men would "let me down". They repeated the pain I felt as a child.
What's interesting though, is that not only do we repeat patterns to continue to victimize ourselves, but we can also tweak reality into our delusions by assuming that others are doing to us what has been done to us before. Welcome to codie brain! Ugh!
I'm still working on this one. I think it has to do with communication, allowing myself to express my emotions, listening to myself about what I really want (that guts voice), and allowing others to show me who they are over a period of time... and then taking what they've shown me at face value. Part of that too is learning to live in the moment instead of future trippin and allowing my past to dictate my current situation.
For years I tried to give my real dad second chances even though he had been mean, verbally/emotionally abusive, and alcoholic, and he never changed. I then grew up to date men that would not a d could not live up to what I deserve; it was inevitable that these men would "let me down". They repeated the pain I felt as a child.
What's interesting though, is that not only do we repeat patterns to continue to victimize ourselves, but we can also tweak reality into our delusions by assuming that others are doing to us what has been done to us before. Welcome to codie brain! Ugh!
I'm still working on this one. I think it has to do with communication, allowing myself to express my emotions, listening to myself about what I really want (that guts voice), and allowing others to show me who they are over a period of time... and then taking what they've shown me at face value. Part of that too is learning to live in the moment instead of future trippin and allowing my past to dictate my current situation.
I think I understand what you mean by tweaking reality to match our delusions. It's that thinking that everyone will behave the same towards us, treat us the same, if someone is having an off day, as many do, I know for me I believe it's to do with me and my fault. This guy may actually be trying to look out for me and may want to go at my pace or he may just have wanted one thing and when he realised he wasn't getting it he backed off!! My unhealthy thinking of course takes over!! Time will tell I suppose!!
Future tripping is such an easy thing to do and I always do it I need to learn to live in the moment.
Thank you
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Originally Posted by Butterfly
It's that thinking that everyone will behave the same towards us, treat us the same, if someone is having an off day, as many do, I know for me I believe it's to do with me and my fault.
Right! On the one hand, my codie brain can jump to conclusions and go on and on thinking about how someone did me wrong or that what they did or said actually meant something else that usually pits me in some victim role or frames me as being unliked or unloved or uncared for, or used or what have you.... Many times that is AAAAALLL me! I have now learned that that is not just because I find people who repeat my trauma for me, but because I anticipate it and I fail to actually express my feelings, needs, wants, desires, etc... I fail to communicate. I can quell my needs because I think they are somehow undeserving of being met, for so many various unrealistic reasons, and of course, I fear the responses and possible rejections of others. But without the communication, my brain goes crazy! Lol....
And then on the other hand, I can be totally wronged, and part of WHY I don't express myself or communicate properly is becuase I am disconnected from what I actually feel. I constantly feel like I need time to digest what someone has said to me, done to me, or asked of me, or else I end up just agreeing and saying "yes" even though I have no clue if I am really up for it, or again, I fear saying "no" because of possible conflict. I can be totally wronged by another person and I won't do anything about it (at first) because of my disconnect. And THAT adds to all the incessant thinking I do! I think, "am I wrong? am I being realistic? is it really that bad? what are their motives? am I overreacting? am I just making assumptions?
What a funny bunch us codependents are!!!!! I am actively practicing saying NO when I want to or feel I need to..... and without feeling guilty. I am also working on expressing myself when I feel I need to. Hard to do with active drinkers... in that sense, it's best to just put distance I think.
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You know I am so scared to tell people what I want or to express my feelings to them and I still find myself doing things I don't really want to do or I'm not ready for. Not so much with my good friends but I did with this guy. Said things I didn't mean, kissed him even though I wasn't ready. Why? Because I wanted to feel wanted. I actually convinced myself that he liked me and now I haven't heard from him since I guess he didn't and didn't want a friendship. Gone from speaking everyday for the last 3 weeks to nothing!!
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Butterfly remember to validate yourself first ...you dont need anyone else to validate your worth! You must feel good about you in order to have the healthy relationship you want. Take it slow with your new friend and see where it leads but as long as you know you can be happy with him or just as happy without him because you are amazing all by yourself! 
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Originally Posted by Butterfly
You know I am so scared to tell people what I want or to express my feelings to them and I still find myself doing things I don't really want to do or I'm not ready for. Not so much with my good friends but I did with this guy. Said things I didn't mean, kissed him even though I wasn't ready. Why? Because I wanted to feel wanted.
^^^This is why I say it isn't a failed experiment. You found out something REALLY IMPORTANT about yourself here. But instead of focusing on all this above - you're concerned with this:
Originally Posted by Butterfly
I actually convinced myself that he liked me and now I haven't heard from him since I guess he didn't and didn't want a friendship. Gone from speaking everyday for the last 3 weeks to nothing!!
If you're not able to be sincere & honest with others that you want to develop more intimate relationships with, are they ever really able to know the REAL you? Nope, they can't, because neither can you until you figure it out for yourself.
Changing who you are to fit in with who they are will never bring you happiness & you DESERVE to be happy Butterfly! ((((hugs))))
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