Blanket333

I am the wife of a recovering alcoholic. He is 15 years sober. We have been together for 30 years. When he was drinking, I stood by him and told him always that I know there is a good person inside there. He has done really well over the years and am amazed and proud of him.

I am looking for folks in this forum who understand the same solid years of sobriety under their belt to help me with identifying changing traits or characteristics that could be typical in the years of recovery. i.e., he is very impatient with me and others.

I feel that if I express an opinion about ANYTHING it is challenged, so I end up just not expressing much. I believe it would be wise for me to get to an Al-Anon meeting as well. I love him and I know he loves me. We will never part. He is extremely anxious and I always try to let him know to chill and identify how minor a situation is - it doesn't always work.

I am looking for affirmation that this is typical behavior and some new tools for my toolbox. Thanks out there for wisdom.

LemonGirl

Sorry, I can't help, but I wanted to post to give your post a bump up on the list!

maia1234

Sorry, I can't help also. But is he working a program, sober? Kind of sounds like a dry drunk, actions.... just wondering??

CodeJob

My RAH is like this. I thought it was alcohol, but clearly it's not. I try to respect his need for space, but I find ways to totally irritate him just because it is so easy to push him off the edge. I get it either way, so I might as well pick the topic. Oh, things like making 2 marriage counseling appointments, hugging him, stating the truth, the cost of groceries, the dog having muddy feet, the fact it did not snow... It gets tiresome.

Some say depression and hormonal imbalances are most visible in irritability in males.

But if your H is like mine, why oh why would you go to a MD?!

Oh and welcome!! Sorry I don't have any serious tools other than wisecracking him right back.

totfit

This is typical "human" behavior. If he is 15 years sober alcohol had nothing to do with it. It is just part of his makeup. This is not to say that some of his makeup did not originally contribute to his addiction. Working a program, dry drunk is merely "program speak" nothing more.

Blanket333

Thanks for the posts. To fill in the missing pieces of information. He just recently has been going back to his weekly meetings - didn't have a sponsor, but hopefully back on track. We have no financial, illness or other worries - we are so incredibly grateful. He is anxious, worries over everything (no need), doesn't get regular sleep, quit taking a mild depression medication and very willing to get medical help. In progress.....

Blanket333

I realize alcohol has nothing to do with his behavior. That is the cart before the horse, part of which transcended to alcohol to make those behaviors vanish. I am getting myself to Al-Anon because I can feel the "victim" emerging again. I am just trying not to incite.

Blanket333

That is spot on.....I would send you a PM but I am new. Can you tell me some coping skills you use. I think you could relate to this.....

A normal day and you start talking about something, you make a statement (could be a question or just an observation) and all of sudden you know its coming. He remarks with a tone of aggravation and questions the remark. I'm responding with don't get worked up, I am just making a comment. Down the road we go and ultimately I can't even remember what I said.

cookiesncream

Once alcohol has entered the picture it is very easy to blame all behaviors one dislikes about the lack of alcohol, recovery lacking, etc. I wish I had answers for you but sadly I don't. There are many people in my life that behave like your hubbie and have never been alcoholics it is simply who they ARE. Having read about half of the book "Co-dependent No More" to try and understand the psychology of that perspective I myself am inclined to go searching for a bunch of books, literature on how to survive and deal with these folks. Sorry this isn't a great answer but wanted to say I relate very much.

Peace,

Cookies

CodeJob

Hello Blanket,

I was very concerned for a while about his irritability as it is a sign of relapse. But it has remained fairly stable. My RAH only 21 mo sober, so we do not have the time in that you and your H have.

Sometimes I cajole. Sometimes I ignore it. Sometimes I am heartfelt about how hurtful it gets. I really am not sure he really realizes how much he dishes out. Does yours?

Having my own friends, activities and plans has helped me not be around and focused on him.

The toughest thing is our son is in some ways more mature than my H. He calls his dad on his behavior! Yikes. I can't rebuke honesty. I know I can't come between them in their relationship. Are your kids grown?

Last year I tried The 5 Love Languages. That didn't go over very well but I thought it was simple intervention.

This fall we did some marriage counseling. It has not been very revealing.

Another thing I sent him the Gottman four horses of apocalypse.

Gottman's Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse - Couples Therapy Inc ~ Worldwide

I hope these help you!

Blanket333

No I really believe he doesn't know how he dishes it out. Lately I just don't respond. It is the lesser of two evils. I just know I won't get a snarky remark, insult or patronizing remark if I just clench it. That is a shame, because we could be having some great conversations. Any response from me that starts out as "I think" does not fly. It better be dead on balls accurate or forget it.

Its just me and my H. Four Horseman.....Excellent - I'm on it. My husband really likes to me around me ALL the time. Great ! Sometimes I need a break....

Seren

Hi Blanket, and Welcome!

I don't really know that any of us can tell you exactly what's going on with your husband, bit it sounds like a trip to his doctor might be in order. Don't hesitate to come here anytime and vent and talk as you need! Maybe you could take a spa day (something most men can't stand) for a bit of alone time?

redatlanta

I deal with this behavior with my RAH in spurts and right now is one of them. He never established coping skills for stress - at least that is my observation I wasn't around him for the first 10 years sober. The only thing I would attribute to actual alcoholism/personality is that it is very self absorbed. As you describe there is no realization that the worry, anxiety, and petulance is affecting others. Its as if they are the sun and we are the planets just floating around expected to listen, soothe, and "fix" (no thanks). It goes way beyond someone having a bad day a needing a little extra attention. My RAH obsesses as well and it drives me bat sh!t.

One thing that I have noticed about RA's and A's is an inability to cope with the uncontrollable. That is how it is in my house. We all have things that happen that are beyond our control and RAH is having to deal with one of those right now. How he is dealing with it is to try and control it - its not working. Its not really something IMO that the average bear would freak out about beyond mild irritation. Now the behavior has morphed well beyond the actual issue, and I think he spends more time being worried about being worried, and pissed off about being worried, rather than working towards a resolution. I can see how back in the day the answer would be alcohol. I'm not sensing that he is heading toward relapse but who knows.

Anyways, how to deal with it is hard. You are correct, the snappy stuff is very tiresome and sometimes its easier just to say nothing. Picking and choosing your battles is necessary in a relationship, but eating someone's sh!t sandwich daily gets real old real fast. You are just going to have to speak up and not accept the behavior. I'm glad he has returned to AA - whether or not that will solve it who knows. I know you said you have no worries, but there is something that is causing this.

He want's you around all the time, he wants you to articulate perfectly, he really doesn't want to hear your opinion about anything he questions you on he just wants you to agree with him. You say he has no idea - well how is that? I doubt that. He is so emeshed in his crap he doesn't CARE what or how this effects you because King Baby - its all about him. Egocentricity at its finest.

Put your foot down and rise above door mat status. As long as you are silent, as long as you sit there and take it, as long as you continue to "be around all the time" when you don't want to be this ain't gonna change most likely - unless he has an epiphany that he is being a jerk.

I myself have let it go on too long this time. 2 nights ago I just told him if he can't get a handle on it is go pack a bag and stay in a hotel or go to Alaska I don't care where just go away I'm done dealing with it. We have had a change of attitude since and a realization that the issue just isn't that big a deal anyway. Imagine that.

Good luck sorry you are dealing with it.

dandylion

Blanket....I can't help you from my own experience with this. My children's father was a narcissistic personality. Every day was living with criticism (he was not an alcoholic). I had to decide if I wanted to live like that forever...and, the answer was "no". so, I divorced him. I have never regretted that decision. It was like walking out of a prison.

However, I have known at least 3 friends who have husbands of many, many years of sobriety. Their marriages seem to be of the "cold war" variety. They don't seem happy with their husbands. From what I hear....they sound like grouchy, rigid and critical old trolls...LOL! But, these women never plan to separate. Just content to live with the situation.
I say nothing to them. I just listen...because they have decided what they are willing to live with.
different strokes for different folks.

I don't know if this helps...but, this is all the experience I have at a personal level.

dandylion

CodeJob

Blanket, Well, if you have a fancy smart phone, you could record him For a few 'normal' interactions. Then sit down for a heart to heart. tell him you love him dearly, but let's listen to how you talk to me bc I don't think you realize how unkind your pattern is with me.

Actually, that along with the 4 Horseman being introduced might stop it for a time....

Do you think men just think they are supposed to be grumpy? All those Grumpier Old Men movies, Archie Bunker, Married With Children...

Nah, Red my ATL gal is probably right with the theory on stress. NOT many coping skills.

This one is hilarious! So I mentioned several times our toilet seat was wiggling. The plastic bolt sheered off last Saturday morning. Of course this happened while I was in there. It is pointless to just say, 'hey the bathroom seat just broke, we need a new one.. Let's run to Home Depot.' So I just set the screw on the sink. I knew he'd find it and start up.

RAH- Who did this?
CJ- I don't know. (I am such a liar, but really things happen why must we assign blame!?)
RAH- How did this break?
CJ - i told you it was loose.
RAH- Now I have to go to Home Depot! What size is this? I can't believe this happened!
CJ - silence.

RAH proceeds to leave immediately for Home Depot. He comes back and freaks out because he bought an elongated seat... Oops. Then he left again and managed to get the right one.

All the while muttering aloud and many deep sighs, "I can't believe this happened. I'don't understand why I had to make two trips to Home Depot already this morning!" He acts like a toilet seat is a major catastrophe. I ignore all of that. I live in the burbs 3 MILES from a HD. it is not a major trip.

I peek in and say, nice job. And get a final verse of how things are always breaking around here as if I maliciously trash stuff just to set him off.

dandylion

Blanket...has he always been this irritable? or is this of recent onset?

When people are depressed they are often irritable and harrassable. Also, it is good to remember that depression can be the first presenting symptom of many other diseases. A visit to a good internist who is aware of the personality changes is a good place to start.
I would suggest that you both talk to the doctor for, at least part of the visit.
Men are notoriously bad at giving a good history to a doctor. Also, they need to be alone with the doctor for part of the visit because they may want to "confess" things that they don't want you to hear.

I just wanted to add this afterthought for you....

dandylion

ichabod

My RAH and I have been married for 22 years next week and he's been sober for 5 years. I'm going to agree with the others who think that his shortness isn't a result of his alcoholism but could be a remnant of part of what led him to drink in the first place. If people in recovery don't continuously work on it, and their overall improvement, they fall back into being the wounded, confused souls they were to start with.

My own husband has a lot of anxiety and I notice that when his life gets busy and he doesn't have much time for himself, it gets much worse. Once the anxiety takes hold, he spirals down for a while until he can get a grip on it. I honestly think this isn't the alcoholic in him, it's the anxiety sufferer. We are fortunate in that he has a good support system in AA and that his friends help him see when he needs some help or needs to step back.

He lashes out at me sometimes because we are very different people. He is emotional. I tend more towards rational and matter of fact. When he gets into the, it must be awesome to be perfect," thing, "I just roll my eyes and refuse to indulge him.

CAPTAINZING2000

I just divorced my wife last fall after we were sober over 15 years.
Our issues might not have been anything like yours.

When you say sober, if there isn't happy joyous and free to go along with it all you really have is a dry drunk.

I had other issues along with the alcohol, most of us do.
I might have over looked it in a post but, have you mentioned counseling to your hubby ?

cookiesncream

I don't mean to hijack your thread in any way merely an example of what I saw in my own life to illustrate the "is the bad behavior the booze or the person." In full disclosure I am both in recovery and an ACOA. I shared this info on another thread which you may have read so apologies in advance.

My Dad was an alcoholic for about four years during my adolescence/early to mid teen years. The families focus was completely on his drinking. The ENTIRE focus was on his drinking. To be fair as a teenager diagnosing his issues was not my fault. That said during his drinking he was short tempered, went on wild spending binges, moved us to another state, etc, etc. It was easy to blame all of this behavior on alcohol and its attending consequences. He quit drinking and we all thought life would be great. Sadly two and a half months later he also proceeded to take his own life. In retrospect some thirty years later it is clear to me and many around me that he was suffering from untreated bipolar disorder. The issue was the bi-polar disorder, the alcohol was merely the medicine. I say that merely as an example. I know that as a person in recovery that doing the long hard work of looking into "what was I trying to medicate" and working through those issues which only I alone can do is the key to my longterm mental health.

That said the Al-Anon stuff still applies in so many cases. If he is dealing with underlying issues you can't control, didn't cause, and can't fix.

Not sure these thoughts are particularly revealing or helpful but thought I'd share.

Peace,

TerpGal

Yeah the worried about everything and difficulty sleeping is troublesome and I think warrants a trip to the doctor. Men, unfortunately are many times socialized that the only acceptable emotion to display is anger. So if he really does have an anxiety/depressive disorder it will manifest as irritability. The difficulty sleeping is a hallmark of anxiety/depressive disorders but also a myriad of other medical issues. A full physical and labs are in order. fwiw I really dislike General practitioners prescribing psych drugs. They just don't have the expertise.