Soberintexas007

While we were watching the New Year's Eve party on tv, he told me that he wished he could have a glass of wine. I told him that he knows how he gets when he drinks, which is why it would not be a good idea. He told me that he knows he has no choice. I told him that he does have a choice. He said that he didn't since he knows how I feel about it. I told him that it is true that I don't want to be in a relationship with an active alcoholic, nor do I want any alcohol in the house nor be around any alcohol when in the house. So he told me that this then means that he doesn't have a choice. I tried to still tell him that he does have a choice, but he could not understand it. I told him that if so wants to be able to drink, then he is totally free to engage in that lifestyle with another partner, and I would be okay with that. He told me that I was speaking nonsense. I told him that I would rather keep our memories the way they are without having any further drama with drinking. He told me that he does not want to drink behind my back, as that would be wrong, and that he would rather get my permission. I told him that I will not give him my permission, and that this is where he has a choice.
When he persisted, I went into the bedroom.

After about 10 minutes, he came in and told me that he was having a craving, and that I need to help him work through it rather than get crazy about it. I asked him how he wants me to help him through it. I don't think he was too sure. I told him that this is what AA is for, a place he can go to when he does get cravings, but that he does not want to go, and that I cannot make him.

After a little bit later, he turned to me and told me that he has issues (THIS WAS AMAZING, HE HAS NEVER ACCEPTED ANY PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY OR ACCOUNTABILITY FOR ANYTHING!)

That aside, I know the prognosis is grim since he is not getting any treatment. And life goes on....

Seren

Hello Justbreathe, Happy New Year!

I'm sorry your husband decided to badger you...but I think you handled it well in telling him the decision to drink was his and that your boundary was that you would not be around him if he drank.

Congratulations on your continued sobriety!!!!

honeypig

JB, I'm not sure that telling you he has issues is accepting any kind of responsibility. My A knew he could push my sympathy buttons by crying and telling me how sick he was and how he needed help. This performance would always suck me in. Then I found SR and Alanon, and I learned that actions were the thing to watch. I saw how no action was ever taken towards getting that help, and I saw it for what it was--manipulation, buying time, a way to get me off his back for a while.

As I'm sure you've been told many times, he does not sound as if he has any real interest in getting sober; he is merely trying to placate you. Telling you that he has cravings and that you have to help him work thru them is pure BS. He is trying to put the blame for his eventual drinking on you, and you were smart to tell him AA and a sponsor are the place for this.

If he started a similar conversation in the future, I think I'd simply tell him it was his choice, and then refuse to engage any further. Leave the room, leave the house, change the subject if you can...there is no point whatsoever in a "discussion" like you described here, at least in my opinion. He has choices, and so do you. Take care of you.

FeelingGreat

JB I can see a little progress there. He accepts that you won't live with alcohol and has clearly made a choice to stay in the relationship on those terms. He's also agreed he has a problem; it's finding a way of dealing with it that isn't AA. I was especially heartened by him actually telling you he has a craving (after a lot of previous BS). This is what's at the basis of relapse - you are craving; it doesn't matter how you dress it up. If he admits to a craving again, see if he will do some deep breathing on the spot, eyes closed, concentrating on his body. From a recovered alcoholic, it can be very effective.

His unwillingness to go to AA could be that he doesn't want to work at staying sober, or maybe that he is uncomfortable with that support group. Many people are. Maybe there is another place he can find support? Therapy, another type of group? The problem now is that although he's going through the usual struggles for an A giving up drinking he doesn't have a tool kit to cope with them. Like you say, the prognosis isn't good unless he finds some form of support.

shil2587

Justbreathe, I just wanted to say a huge well done! You are still sober yourself, you stated your boundaries in terms of what you will do if he does drink again and left the ball in his court. That's massive progress in a short period of time.

Well done! I hope your Christmas and New Year were otherwise enjoyable.

LeeJane

Well done for staying sober yourself and also not buying into your hubs manipulation.

The first time my AH 'admitted' he had issues, I was really happy and thought it meant he was going to get help and quit booze. Not at all, it was just more lip service to keep me quiet. He knew what I wanted to hear so said it. No follow up action.

I have learnt that those discussions along the lines of AH asking me to 'help' him are a waste of time. All part of the denial and game playing in his own head to enable him to keep drinking. You did right to refer him to AA.

All best wishes to you.

maia1234

Amazing. That's how new I am in this program. I thought it was awesome of what he was saying, and all you guys called it was bs!! I learned something new today.

Happy 2015 everyone!!

redatlanta

You handled it well JB.

I too see this as simple manipulation to get you to be a co-conspirator in his return to drinking. Great for your refusal to participate. You did a really good job when he said he has no choice and you pointed out that he does.

Happy new year to you hoping for continued strength for you in this situation.

dandylion

justbreathe, I also agree that you handled this testy situation very well--especially for someone who is relatively "new" to this!

It is so easy to get sucked in to these "discussions"--like, in the bet of an eye! sometimes, it takes real skill (and knowlege) to side-step it. So--congrats.

I wish I could tell you the number of times that I would get into gut-wrenching arguments with my adult son, a few years ago!!! He was living elsewhere, but he would come over to the house to visit me and his stepfather. It may surprise that we all got along very well...there was a lot of affection between all of us.
However, I could see my son's looming problem with alcohol. (I always said "problem with alcohol" so as not to **** him off with the "A" word, at that time).
I would try (in my ignorance) to lure him in by describing the benefits of AA and the attractiveness of a life of abstainence.
Every single time--the discussion would dissolve into screaming and shouting. I would end up crying and distraught--and, he would leave--slamming the door so hard that it shook the rafters. My whole day would then be ruined....as I would wring my hands and look to the heavens and ask Why!? Why!?
SCENE 4/TAKE 5.
Boy--did I have a lot to learn!! Poor me. I can cry, thinking back to how much I spun my wheels. To absolutely no avail.....zero.....

When I compare myself to you---you deserve a friggin banner!!

dandylion

Ursula745

He sure is putting a lot of responsibility on you to tell him he can or can't have a drink. Bottom line is he still wants to drink and he isn't because of YOU. So he says....

Pathetic that he is using you as his crutch, IMO. He doesn't want to be stopped, and wants to keep engaging you in conversation to give him permission when you have already stated your boundaries. Even if he IS living with those boundaries for now, he doesn't want to. Does that matter to you?

Seems like he thinks you are holding him hostage to your rules. I guess how long you're willing to deal with that is up to you. I wouldn't be able to handle it, but more power to you...

I hope things turn around for you this year and you don't have to live in this constant battle with him. I hope he either gets it, and decides for HIMSELF not to drink without you deciding for him, or if not, you realize what's going on and decide further boundaries for yourself so you don't have to continue to engage in this. It must be very tiring to repeat yourself over and over again.

HUGS....


Edited to say the things you said to him are good things. You did state your boundaries well, my concern is simply that you HAVE TO KEEP DOING IT. I don't see how you just don't get tired of that and not even respond to his questions about it. It would wear me out! It HAS worn me out...been there. Wishing you a peaceful New Year!

Soberintexas007

Happy New Year to everyone as well.

Yes, this is my current dilemma. It is getting tiring and irritating to often have to assert these boundaries over and over. And it is frustrating that my AH is trying to act as if I am holding him hostage for my boundaries and rules around his drinking (I don't like to feel this way.) My next step may be to just not engage with him any further if he badgers me again in this way in the future, which another member suggested (because it is tiring AND depressing).

I will say this. Last night when we were in bed, my AH mentioned how he thinks alcoholics are weak and should not need something like AA. I disclosed to him many serious, life threatening consequences with alcohol that I have had in my past. In hearing my history with alcohol and all of the negative consequences, he soon became very quiet. I told him that these are the reasons why I cannot drink again, as things can come tumbling down very quickly.

Carlotta

I think that you have made a LOT of progress JB.
Congratulations on your sobriety and good going tackling your own alcoholism first and foremost. As long as you stay sober, everything else can be worked out.
Happy New Year!

shelton40

Good job on your own sobriety. I hope your husband grabs those reigns too. Happy New Year

lillamy

You know, for a person as recently sober as you are, you are pretty dang amazing. I don't think I would have been able to have that conversation without blowing my top -- but you kept your calm, you told him what you need in your life, and you refused to let him put it all on you. You told him he had a choice: If his choice is to drink, he can leave.

Of course he is going to fight that. He WANTS to not have a choice. He wants you to be the evil ogre who stands between him and what his heart desires. By refusing to do that -- by telling him that he DOES have a choice, you've started removing yourself from the position of controlling his drinking. That's big stuff right there.

(Oh, and the comment about "for a person as recently sober as you" -- all I mean is that you are working BOTH your own sobriety AND your codependency recoveries parallel -- and that, my friend, is like working two full-time jobs.)

SeriousKarma

Good going JB. It looks like you're starting the new year off strong.

Perhaps your next boundary should be about boundaries. Is that possible? A boundary that he crosses when he gets to pushy about the other boundaries? A boundary boundary?

Whatever. I just wish you peace, joy, and continued growth in the new year.

Soberintexas007

Thank you all for your feedback, I appreciate it.

hopeful4

I think you handled this very well.

Tight Hugs.

AnvilheadII

it's like a game of Hot Potato.....he keeps trying to make you take the hot potato and you keep giving it right back. good for you. you are using YOUR recovery tools - aka oven mitts in this case.

NOT MY POTATO!