Where ever you go, there you are...
For Dandylion and anyone else...
(Moderator, please let me know if this is off-topic, and we can start a new thread.)
The Rage-o-Holic was my second husband (and now ex-). He was the father of the youngest.
When I left, my youngest was sure his dad was going to kill himself. He brought it up many times with a, "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO HIM?!" At one point, however, my son had come to me a year earlier and said, "Mom, it's getting worse. You need to leave." Looking back, he had a lot of conflicted feelings, which was understandable.
The other three had been through the wringer. They all reacted negatively in a variety of ways (for another post some day). As I said, the oldest said, "I'm sorry that I made things harder for you. I know that you did your best. It was a difficult decision and I know now that if I were in the same circumstances, I would not have been as strong as you were. You always stuck up for us, even when it meant throwing yourself into the oncoming rage."
My second daughter (who is much better with writing than talking), has posted glowing things about me on Facebook for all to see. She has said that I was the best mother ever, and how I would do anything for my children to be safe and happy. (Thanks, honey, but in retrospect I wish I would have done it sooner.)
My older son has said, "I realize now that he only does just enough so that he looks like the good guy, but those of us who know him realize it's only a smokescreen. He's never proactive and as soon as the public audience is gone, he does nothing to help. It's all for show; but WE know the truth. You, Mom, on the other hand, always had/have our best interests in mind and sacrificed yourself so we be protected."
I kept reminding the youngest that his father had threatened to kill himself many times before, but had never followed through. If his dad really wanted help, he could seek it out; and that I wasn't professionally qualified to help him. My son hated that. In his mind, if his dad died, it was my fault. After six years, his father is still alive and still plays the suicide card. We are out of the loop now, and he doesn't pull that with us any more. He's found a new audience.
The youngest isn't quite to the point yet of delivering an eloquent apology, but he acknowledges that I made the hard choice that HAD to be made, and he is sorry he tried to guilt me into staying. The youngest had gotten into trouble at school, including a curfew and underaged drinking violation that landed him in court. He also had publically threatened another teen in high school who had been bullying him. That landed us back in court along with a suspension and expulsion hearing (he was allowed to stay). He told me that he had worried for a few years that he would turn into his father (angry rages), but that, if anything, he thinks he takes more after me. He then was concerned that he would become co-dependent, but he says watching me become stronger with better boundaries has helped him, too.
All of my children rebelled. All teens do! And yes, it's infinitely harder when they have a toxic family system at the same time. It seemed that it took about three to six years on their own for them to come back and say, "Wow. You were right about so much." It's not easy for them to say, so it's so appreciated when it happens. And I tell them all the time how proud I am of them, especially given the difficult circumstances they came up through!!!
Yes, they see the big picture now. They tell me that don't know that, in similar circumstances, they would have done as well. And I tell them that if I had to do it over, I'd do it differently. But as it was said here, we can't change the past.
I came from a toxic family. My parents came from toxic families. My hope is simply that each generation gets a little better until we can stop this cycle. My kids have worked very hard with their own recoveries to get there. They said watching my recovery unfold helped them. THAT is how we can make amends. Everyone here on SR is doing that and we can share our experience, strength and hope.
(((Hugs))) to formyboys and everyone else!
(Moderator, please let me know if this is off-topic, and we can start a new thread.)
The Rage-o-Holic was my second husband (and now ex-). He was the father of the youngest.
When I left, my youngest was sure his dad was going to kill himself. He brought it up many times with a, "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO HIM?!" At one point, however, my son had come to me a year earlier and said, "Mom, it's getting worse. You need to leave." Looking back, he had a lot of conflicted feelings, which was understandable.
The other three had been through the wringer. They all reacted negatively in a variety of ways (for another post some day). As I said, the oldest said, "I'm sorry that I made things harder for you. I know that you did your best. It was a difficult decision and I know now that if I were in the same circumstances, I would not have been as strong as you were. You always stuck up for us, even when it meant throwing yourself into the oncoming rage."
My second daughter (who is much better with writing than talking), has posted glowing things about me on Facebook for all to see. She has said that I was the best mother ever, and how I would do anything for my children to be safe and happy. (Thanks, honey, but in retrospect I wish I would have done it sooner.)
My older son has said, "I realize now that he only does just enough so that he looks like the good guy, but those of us who know him realize it's only a smokescreen. He's never proactive and as soon as the public audience is gone, he does nothing to help. It's all for show; but WE know the truth. You, Mom, on the other hand, always had/have our best interests in mind and sacrificed yourself so we be protected."
I kept reminding the youngest that his father had threatened to kill himself many times before, but had never followed through. If his dad really wanted help, he could seek it out; and that I wasn't professionally qualified to help him. My son hated that. In his mind, if his dad died, it was my fault. After six years, his father is still alive and still plays the suicide card. We are out of the loop now, and he doesn't pull that with us any more. He's found a new audience.
The youngest isn't quite to the point yet of delivering an eloquent apology, but he acknowledges that I made the hard choice that HAD to be made, and he is sorry he tried to guilt me into staying. The youngest had gotten into trouble at school, including a curfew and underaged drinking violation that landed him in court. He also had publically threatened another teen in high school who had been bullying him. That landed us back in court along with a suspension and expulsion hearing (he was allowed to stay). He told me that he had worried for a few years that he would turn into his father (angry rages), but that, if anything, he thinks he takes more after me. He then was concerned that he would become co-dependent, but he says watching me become stronger with better boundaries has helped him, too.
All of my children rebelled. All teens do! And yes, it's infinitely harder when they have a toxic family system at the same time. It seemed that it took about three to six years on their own for them to come back and say, "Wow. You were right about so much." It's not easy for them to say, so it's so appreciated when it happens. And I tell them all the time how proud I am of them, especially given the difficult circumstances they came up through!!!
Yes, they see the big picture now. They tell me that don't know that, in similar circumstances, they would have done as well. And I tell them that if I had to do it over, I'd do it differently. But as it was said here, we can't change the past.
I came from a toxic family. My parents came from toxic families. My hope is simply that each generation gets a little better until we can stop this cycle. My kids have worked very hard with their own recoveries to get there. They said watching my recovery unfold helped them. THAT is how we can make amends. Everyone here on SR is doing that and we can share our experience, strength and hope.
(((Hugs))) to formyboys and everyone else!
Thanks for postiing Look, I always appreciate hearing how kids have done in the long run and it gives me hope for mine.
Sometimes its hard for me to see any of this getting better when it feels like things have just gotten progressively worse. its hard to imagine it getting better when it hasn't over the last 3 years. I know that is just how I see it, and feelings aren't facts....and I REALLY need to work on looking at things in a more positive way. Im so ready to do that.
I need to work on what I want out of all of this, and understanding what my motivation is in the situation with his dad. We have a really strange relationship, his dad and I. We rarely go more then a week without contact, but it is hardly ever about our son unless I bring it up. It could be about football, or something that is going on in his family or a situation that will come up like losing our pet last month, and then I will make a jab about the fact that he hasn't bothered to ask about XYZ that is going on with our son and it deteriorates quickly into his excuses (Am I the only one who can pick up a phone?, time has got away from me and Ive been really busy..etc.) His dad is more then happy to have a chatty relationship with me when it is convienient for him. Im the one that has a problem with the betrayal and the way he handled our divorce. The fact he has nothing to do with my older sons who he raised for almost 20 years and never asks about them. the fact that he let me find out about his cheating by walking in on them and then his excuse was "well I was done"...but didn't think it was necessary to let ME know that. It hurts me that If he had been with me, the way he is with this woman, we would not have had the problems we had. He takes time off work now to spend with the people he cares about, he makes plans and does special things to let them know he cares, He is sober and being responsible as far as paying his bills and the day to day things that an adult does...but hes still not emotionally capable of having a relationship his son.
just rereading this makes me sick to my stomach....how can I even have a relationship with someone who has done the things he has and why do I even care??
I know I have a lot to work on, and this next year is going to be my year of change. I have spent the last 3 years with my life on hold and its time to get on with my life.
Sometimes its hard for me to see any of this getting better when it feels like things have just gotten progressively worse. its hard to imagine it getting better when it hasn't over the last 3 years. I know that is just how I see it, and feelings aren't facts....and I REALLY need to work on looking at things in a more positive way. Im so ready to do that.
I need to work on what I want out of all of this, and understanding what my motivation is in the situation with his dad. We have a really strange relationship, his dad and I. We rarely go more then a week without contact, but it is hardly ever about our son unless I bring it up. It could be about football, or something that is going on in his family or a situation that will come up like losing our pet last month, and then I will make a jab about the fact that he hasn't bothered to ask about XYZ that is going on with our son and it deteriorates quickly into his excuses (Am I the only one who can pick up a phone?, time has got away from me and Ive been really busy..etc.) His dad is more then happy to have a chatty relationship with me when it is convienient for him. Im the one that has a problem with the betrayal and the way he handled our divorce. The fact he has nothing to do with my older sons who he raised for almost 20 years and never asks about them. the fact that he let me find out about his cheating by walking in on them and then his excuse was "well I was done"...but didn't think it was necessary to let ME know that. It hurts me that If he had been with me, the way he is with this woman, we would not have had the problems we had. He takes time off work now to spend with the people he cares about, he makes plans and does special things to let them know he cares, He is sober and being responsible as far as paying his bills and the day to day things that an adult does...but hes still not emotionally capable of having a relationship his son.
just rereading this makes me sick to my stomach....how can I even have a relationship with someone who has done the things he has and why do I even care??
I know I have a lot to work on, and this next year is going to be my year of change. I have spent the last 3 years with my life on hold and its time to get on with my life.
LookASquirre.......I just read your post! Thank you so much for taking the time to respond!
Ir was very reassuring for me to read...and I know that it must bring comfort to other mothers (parents). I am so happy for you, by the way.....
I think your story underlines the thing that we often hear expressed, here, on this forum:
That children can make it successfully if they have one stable and loving parent in their corner.
This fact is welcome news, I think, for so many parents who are plagued by guilt and despair for their children.
dandylion
Ir was very reassuring for me to read...and I know that it must bring comfort to other mothers (parents). I am so happy for you, by the way.....
I think your story underlines the thing that we often hear expressed, here, on this forum:
That children can make it successfully if they have one stable and loving parent in their corner.
This fact is welcome news, I think, for so many parents who are plagued by guilt and despair for their children.
dandylion
I was rereading this post this morning and all the great advice I got at this time. I just want to update ya'll on my youngest.
As of now he is gone....He turned 18 at the end of Feb. For about 2 weeks before his bday and then after he got more and more out of control. Started habitually skipping school and walking out of his classes, got suspended for that and the first day back to school after that suspension, got in trouble for having a conversation with another kid about buying a gun. That involved police, detectives searching my home and him being suspended again until the decided if they were going to let him come back. Shockingly, they decided to let him. They were convinced that he was a good kid and was struggling. Still had the ability to graduate (8 weeks till graduation...6 credits short) so they wanted to give him one last chance. He took off and didn't come home the night before he was to start back to school. That was a little over a week ago...he initially said he was needed a break, then the school said he told them he moved out. then he cut off all contact with me and I have not heard from him in about 5 days.
He had been going to a therapist weekly and she had strong concerns about him being depressed and self medicating with pot. From what I hear he has been drinking excessively. He has no job, no money, no car......Im sure his "friends" will tire of him in no time. He did not return to school so Im sure he has burned that bridge.
Im worried sick about him but part of me is relieved .....it has been stressful the angrier he got. He got really hateful towards me and that was just painful to watch. This loving caring sensitive kid turn into this manipulative mean hateful person.
The therapist told me there is nothing I can do for him, he needs to figure this out for himself. His problem is not with me, it is with his dad so nothing I do is going to fix it.
*sigh* My life has not gotten better since I left his A father. It has gotten harder, and dealing with all of it alone, that has sucked the life out of me. I thought it would get better......I really did. I use to have so much hope.
As of now he is gone....He turned 18 at the end of Feb. For about 2 weeks before his bday and then after he got more and more out of control. Started habitually skipping school and walking out of his classes, got suspended for that and the first day back to school after that suspension, got in trouble for having a conversation with another kid about buying a gun. That involved police, detectives searching my home and him being suspended again until the decided if they were going to let him come back. Shockingly, they decided to let him. They were convinced that he was a good kid and was struggling. Still had the ability to graduate (8 weeks till graduation...6 credits short) so they wanted to give him one last chance. He took off and didn't come home the night before he was to start back to school. That was a little over a week ago...he initially said he was needed a break, then the school said he told them he moved out. then he cut off all contact with me and I have not heard from him in about 5 days.
He had been going to a therapist weekly and she had strong concerns about him being depressed and self medicating with pot. From what I hear he has been drinking excessively. He has no job, no money, no car......Im sure his "friends" will tire of him in no time. He did not return to school so Im sure he has burned that bridge.
Im worried sick about him but part of me is relieved .....it has been stressful the angrier he got. He got really hateful towards me and that was just painful to watch. This loving caring sensitive kid turn into this manipulative mean hateful person.
The therapist told me there is nothing I can do for him, he needs to figure this out for himself. His problem is not with me, it is with his dad so nothing I do is going to fix it.
*sigh* My life has not gotten better since I left his A father. It has gotten harder, and dealing with all of it alone, that has sucked the life out of me. I thought it would get better......I really did. I use to have so much hope.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 765
Formyboys
I'm sorry to hear about all the pain in your family.
Your son can still get a high school diploma if he decides to, later.
Alcoholism is a family illness so all parties are involved. Did you go to therapy with son? It's family problem so...
Best case scenario is all parties going to a 12-step fellowship though.
In my family I've been the only one willing to do that so I am actually currently separating from them, for the highest good of all involved.
I'm sorry to hear about all the pain in your family.
Your son can still get a high school diploma if he decides to, later.
Alcoholism is a family illness so all parties are involved. Did you go to therapy with son? It's family problem so...
Best case scenario is all parties going to a 12-step fellowship though.
In my family I've been the only one willing to do that so I am actually currently separating from them, for the highest good of all involved.
Oh sweetie, I am so sorry to hear this. Honestly, I look back at the person I was at 18 and am NOTHING like that now. Hopefully he will get through this and come back to the morals and values you have taught him.
Tight, very tight, hugs to you.
Tight, very tight, hugs to you.
I find myself having a hard time commenting on this, as you're living what I fear will happen to one of my kids. When they just get worse and don't take the life preservers tossed to them. When they just blow their chances.
I find that the detaching skills I used with AXH are way harder to use with your children. Way harder.
I am so sorry your life has become more difficult. When I feel like that, I try to remind myself that my life is just more difficult than it was -- there's nothing that says my life right now is more difficult than it would have been if I had stayed. ((((Hugs))))
I find that the detaching skills I used with AXH are way harder to use with your children. Way harder.
I am so sorry your life has become more difficult. When I feel like that, I try to remind myself that my life is just more difficult than it was -- there's nothing that says my life right now is more difficult than it would have been if I had stayed. ((((Hugs))))
I did go to therapy with him, we would alternate every other week I would go in and then the next he would go by himself. It was actually frightening to see how much pain he was in. ANY mention or discussion about his Dad would cause him to completely come undone and sob...and to watch him struggle to get it under control, like he wasn't going to let him do that to him..it was heart breaking. Then there would be times he would just fill her (the therapist) full of crap and have a horrible attitude.
And yes, I did at one point tell his Dad what was going on. No reaction, not much to say about it....and then didn't hear from him for awhile. He cannot handle any thing that has to do with emotion or feelings. That is not new..
I long ago quit informing him about anything, It causes me to have expectations and then Im always disappointed. He does know about the new situation and hasn't had much to say about that either. I think the last comment I got when I told him was "Damn kid"...........
I know he is 18, but he is so unprepared for the world. Even the therapist said he was the most immature 18 yr. old she had seen. I guess you have to let them go sometimes, I just wish he was not so damaged and was more aware of how many people love and care about him. he knows I am here if he needs me, and like a close friends father told me, He will need you long before you need him.
And yes, I did at one point tell his Dad what was going on. No reaction, not much to say about it....and then didn't hear from him for awhile. He cannot handle any thing that has to do with emotion or feelings. That is not new..
I long ago quit informing him about anything, It causes me to have expectations and then Im always disappointed. He does know about the new situation and hasn't had much to say about that either. I think the last comment I got when I told him was "Damn kid"...........
I know he is 18, but he is so unprepared for the world. Even the therapist said he was the most immature 18 yr. old she had seen. I guess you have to let them go sometimes, I just wish he was not so damaged and was more aware of how many people love and care about him. he knows I am here if he needs me, and like a close friends father told me, He will need you long before you need him.
Yes Lillamy, your right......the whole detaching thing is waaaay harder with the kids. especially since he is in so much obvious pain. I feel like I am abandoning him if I detach and that, I think, is the main problem he has....he feels abandoned already.
Even the therapist said he was the most immature 18 yr. old she had seen.
I pray he'll come back to you. He does know where his safe place is. He does know that you will help him and protect him.
My older son went through a VERY rough adolescence, from about 14 till his early 20s. Could not stick with school, got into legal trouble, suffered from depression, made poor choices in friends, etc. No substance abuse to speak of, and none in the house. It was just something about him that had extreme difficulty fitting into the world. He benefitted from therapy for a time, but then refused.
I'm happy to say that he is now in his late 20s, has a good, responsible job that he is successful at, he has nice friends, and a lovely girlfriend. He's probably underemployed (still too stubborn to get the one credit he needs for an associate's degree and he has a brilliant mind), but he is basically happy with his life. It just was a very uphill struggle for him, and about all we could do was to offer emotional support on the rare occasions he would accept it.
I've known other young guys like that, too. If they keep it together long enough to stay out of jail or hospitals (or worse) they sometimes just somehow grow out of it.
Hugs, I feel for you.
I'm happy to say that he is now in his late 20s, has a good, responsible job that he is successful at, he has nice friends, and a lovely girlfriend. He's probably underemployed (still too stubborn to get the one credit he needs for an associate's degree and he has a brilliant mind), but he is basically happy with his life. It just was a very uphill struggle for him, and about all we could do was to offer emotional support on the rare occasions he would accept it.
I've known other young guys like that, too. If they keep it together long enough to stay out of jail or hospitals (or worse) they sometimes just somehow grow out of it.
Hugs, I feel for you.
Still nothing from him.....I was so exhausted last night from not sleeping all week that I finally did get some sleep. Thanks for all the updates on your kids that went through this and have come out the other side, that definitely gives me hope. I wish I could fast forward through this and not have to watch him go through it.
As expected there is not a lot of support from "Dad"...
As expected there is not a lot of support from "Dad"...
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)