dandylion

Justwantnormal....when the children are old enough....they can be educated as to what alcoholism really is. There is also alateen. Children can come to understand (or at least, accept)if the subject is dealt with openly and honestly.

If you were to read the heartbreaking posts on the Adult Children of Alcoholics section....you will see that a much worse question to have to answer is: "Mom, why did you stay"? Children do better if they have o ne stable loving, sane parent in a home without chaos of alcoholism.

I think if you work in alanon and learn more about this disease...that these questions will not cripple you like they are now....

dandylion

legna

To the question, "How long can he moderate his drinking?" - It doesn't matter.

If you want to leave - leave.

I never did understand the ultimatum route. We are in a relationship with someone not so that we can control them, not so they can conform to our idea of right, wrong, normal, sane, etc. We just have the opportunity to walk by their side while they travel on their journey - as they have the opportunity to walk with us for a bit on our journey.

They have every right to drink or drug themselves to death if they wish. Or moderate. Or get clean and sober. If you don't enjoy sharing their journey, stop walking with them.

Justwantnormal

Prompted by Anvilheads response, I just went back and read some of my older threads. I can't believe I'm coming up to my 1 year SR anniversary and am still asking the same questions I was a year ago! What's wrong with me?! It's no wonder I feel like I'm going crazy ~ I'm all over the place! One post I'm angry, then the next I'm hopeful, then depressed, then leaving, then staying, then found serenity, then back to depressed. Thank you to all of you who continuing to respond kindly to me even though you probably want to just slap some sense into me!

legna

Well, I can only speak for myself, but I can't imagine anyone wanting to slap some sense into you. This is hard. You've been asking the same questions for a year - some ask the same questions to their death. I get the sense that you won't be one of them. Hang in there.

Kboys

My AH could do it for a couple of days, and that's it. He used to be able to go longer, but each time, the periods of "moderation" got shorter and shorter. I know he will never be able to do it.
"I almost wish it would just fall apart now so we can be done with it. "
I know how that feels, and I'm feeeling the same way now, as my AH has not been drinking four days. I KNOW it won't last, but I guess I want him to make it easier on me by starting again, so that I can have a "reason." But, I have had PLENTY of reasons, and I know I don't need another one... And I know that you have too.

Everyone is right, we can leave anytime we want. We don't need a crystal ball to see the past...

Stay strong

SparkleKitty

The problem with "wishing things would fall apart" is that they HAVE been falling apart by degrees for a very long time, but you've kept pushing the boundary of what's acceptable to accommodate them.

Justwantnormal

Wow. What a sense of relief that one sentence just gave me. Thank you, I hope you're right!

Thumper

Giving myself permission to leave. It was such a switch.

Like a previous poster I used to cry into the early hours and wish for him to cheat or hit me - so I'd give myself permission to leave. In hindsight I don't think it would have matter. So many lines in the sand had been erased why would those two be any different? I filed for divorce and he went into rehab and I wanted to die! I hated him for it because how would I have the right to leave if he was sober?

His behavior, saint or sinner, made zero difference. I only had to make the mental switch to giving myself permission to do what was right for me. Sounds simple but it was extremely complicated with all the trappings of codependency.

You have permission to leave this man based upon your truths. Your history with him. Give yourself permission to take care of yourself independent of what he does or says today.

My ex did start to drink again and he used to threaten me with what a mistake I was making and he'd be sober and successful and I'd miss out. Our dreams lost and all my fault. I got mad once and told him that was fine! A sober successful ex husband was way better than a drunk unemployed current husband!

Kids have a way of knowing eventually. You make a happy, peaceful, calm home and provide them with a happy, peaceful, calm mother and they will adjust, be better off, and as they get older they will understand more than you think.

A counselor helped me so much with all this, as did SR.

LadyinBC

Moderation never worked for me and like someone else commented it just gave me an excuse to keep drinking.

People who don't have a problem with alcohol don't need to figure out a way to "moderate" their drinking. They don't obsess over when and how much they can drink. The more I tried to moderate the more I actually drank.

The cycle is definitely a roller coaster for everyone involved. You just need to decide when you want to get off the ride.

Are you happy and at peace? This is the question to ask yourself. Everyone has the right to be happy and to feel a sense of peace and contentment. Including you. You will at some point make the decision that is right for you, we all take the journey to get there.

tiredmum

[QUOTE=lillamy;4942024]
For me, I've always been a people pleaser. I wanted to have something (I don't know what) that nobody could disagree with gave me the right to leave. I was afraid of being "the bad guy who broke up the family." I even thought "if only he had cheated on me, I could leave" or "if only he would hit me, I could leave." But the thing was -- that goalpost kept moving. By the time he did whatever it was I felt I needed to know that I was "allowed" to leave by some objective standards -- I no longer felt that it was enough.

For me, it really was the realization that his drinking -- much as I tried to protect them -- really affected the kids that made it possible for me to make the decision. QUOTE]

Wow Lillamy, you have eloquently put exactly how I was, always wishing for the worst to happen so I would be "allowed" to leave him!

torquemax777

My AH has a new version of moderation; he only wants to drink on payday. The first problem with that is the "payday" turns into a pay "weekend" and the $15 ( he insists on me limiting him to) turns into $50. I told him that's not moderating, that's binging! I gave him the analogy if he ever quit smoking ( which for some reason he wants more than alcohol sobriety) if he made it two weeks without a cigarette, would he then smoke a whole carton? Or if I went on a diet, but planned to reward myself with an entire wedding cake every two weeks, would I still be considered to be dieting? He's not really moderating. And in all actuality, I've heard that binge drinking is actually harder on their health than daily drinker's. He's tried the daily 3 or 4 way of moderating, he can't stop at that few, says it's like having none; just makes him tired. Also, he thinks it's working because he " isn't experiencing any negative consequences anymore"...... Yet! Is more like it! Plus, his version of no negative consequences is a whole different definition than mine! His version of negative consequences is if "he's not breaking things, going to jail, driving drunk, cheating, getting in fights, etc.... Who is he hurting?" That's HIS theory. I don't even know how to begin to explain to him how repulsed I am by his drinking regardless of the lack of negative consequences. He just doesnt get it! If he would have been successful at moderating years ago, I might have been hunky dory with it, but even if he could now ( which I don't believe) it's already too little too late

SoloMio

I don't have a crystal ball, but if I had to guess, I'd say they won't have to ask because they'll know.

maia1234

Wow lillamy. Thanks for sharing. I'm sad for your children that they will never know the great man he was before alcohol took him. Sad for everyone.

Bamawife

From past experience with my AH, moderation was temporary. He does not have the ability to "moderately" drink. Heck, he cannot even socially drink. My AH's idea of moderation was drinking a fifth of vodka a day instead of a half gallon.

peaceofpi

I understand that point. There are several "leaving" scenarios:
(1) You leave, and you get better, and he does not. (This is my experience and probably that of many on SR.)
(2) You leave, and you get better, and he gets better. Then you (A) reconcile and remain friendly or (B) go your separate ways.

My AXH tried at times to "moderate." But that's like saying "I am not powerless over alcohol" ... the opposite of Step 1.

Hawks

Sometimes the only thing that will bring a drinking problem to a halt is more drink.

I have heard hundreds of alcoholics say "my wife left with the kids, I was devastated and of course my drinking went through the roof. Six months later, I had smashed into my own personal hell and hit rock bottom "

Only you will know if you have any feelings left for this man.

Some alcoholics are quite nice people but alcoholism drags them down to levels of behaviour they don't exhibit sober.

Some alcoholics are just nasty nasty people drunk or sober.

But at the end of the day, hanging in there is really just trying to stop a train that is eventually going to crash.

So get out of the trains way, decide if you want to be there to help clear up the wreckage and if you do want to be, start gathering a clean up / support crew while the train is still running.

Best of luck with it all

CodeJob

Most of us cycled right along with our qualifiers for years and that is why we can point this out to you. Not acting is a choice too and many of us take that route too. Anvil is wise and such a little devious one to use your own posts like a golf course map. You are winding back and forth as you play the game. That is actually fairly normal codependent behavior.

But writing them was a very good step. Questioning yourself, you are trying to shake your old ways. Maybe it is time to get more help for you? What are you doing to get peace in your head and detach from Signor drunk cycler?

The third scene with my H I realized what was going on and used some of that time to learn detachment. When his fourth scene started, I told him straight up I was not going down the 'rabbit hole'. About 50 days into scene 4 I kicked him out of the house.

And we both know my days of not acting to protect my sanctuary and DS's are OVER. We argue over this believe it or not and each time I say the same darn thing,". The first time was hard. Now I've got the number of a 24 hour locksmith in my cell. I am confident I can act even sooner.'

Now here's the funny thing. This took me 18 years to figure out. I don't come from any drinkers in my immediate family so my knowledge of addiction was lame. My training came from dysfunctional family side of things.

So just accept what you know and see how your understanding has changed. These are important steps that truly can take years.