Now HERE'S an interesting development

Old 10-02-2014, 10:29 AM
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Now HERE'S an interesting development

AH and I will be seeing a marriage counselor on Monday evening. Because I set up the appointment (naturally), I made sure to find one who is also a certified alcohol and drug abuse counselor. I do not believe my AH knows that the therapist is also an addiction counselor.

Anyhoo...to me this whole thing smacks of my AH's last, desperate attempt to magically fix our marriage in a way that involves me admitting how wrong I am and him being able to continue to drink. My hope for the sessions is that we can learn some communication skills that will help us co-parent after I leave, and that I will have a safe place, away from the kids, to tell him of my departure when that time comes. Those are my hopes. Naturally, I have zero expectations about the whole thing.
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Old 10-02-2014, 10:31 AM
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I hope you both get some clarity and healing.
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Old 10-02-2014, 10:33 AM
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Congrats on taking a big step. It will be very interesting when the therapist remarks on the drinking which he/she will certainly do. It's best to walk in with no expectations and just see what happens. But brilliant getting a therapist who knows alcoholics.
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Old 10-02-2014, 11:09 AM
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Whose idea was it to make an appointment with a marriage counselor?

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Old 10-02-2014, 11:22 AM
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It was mine, at the suggestion of a divorce lawyer friend who deals with volatile divorces. He is concerned about the reaction if I share the news of my divorce filing in a non-neutral setting, without outside parties present.
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Old 10-02-2014, 12:47 PM
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Wisconsin .....the average counseling session is 1hour long.

If you get to the point of spilling the news....I highly suggest that you have a back-up plan for when your walk out of the counselors door.

dandylion

p.s.---I still don't understand how you are saying that it is your husbands "desperate attempt" when you also say it is your idea and you made the appointment......??

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Old 10-02-2014, 01:21 PM
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Dandylion, I am well-versed in the workings of therapy, for better or worse.

I am not financially ready to leave at this point anyway. Barring some sort of huge blowup at our first session (which is generally not the pattern he follows), I will not be surprised to attend multiple sessions. And at all times we will take separate vehicles. I never drive with him anywhere anymore anyway.

It his reaction to my suggestion, and his behavior since I scheduled the appointment that smacks of another desperate attempt. Faced with the idea that we will be talking about our relationship with an outsider (he falls squarely in the category of "you don't need to be talking about our relationship with ANYONE") he is once again pulling out all the stops to be as nice to me as possible and trying to moderate his drinking so he can walk in the door of that office and declare that this whole thing is MY problem, and that his drinking plays no part, because he has been nothing but pleasant with me and is only having a few beers every day. It is the exact same pattern he followed during our ill-advised visits with our pastor back when I had any hope that our marriage could be saved.

The whole issue came up the other evening when he was badgering me incessantly at home about the way I had answered a question he had asked. He had been drinking, and I had zero desire to engage him. I kept my answers brief and non-inflammatory, and finally came to the end of my rope because this was all happening in front of our son. I finally said "I am happy to talk about our relationship with a marriage counselor, but don't want to discuss it any more in front of [4yo son]." A hundred million years ago, when I thought this would all get better, I would ask him repeatedly to go to marriage counseling, and he would always retort with an angry refusal, usually coupled with a sexist and/or racist comment about who he was sure I would select as a therapist. This time, his answer was "ok, let's go." So, I found a counselor and made the appointment a few days later.

Like I said...I know I'm done. I am not in a financial position to leave at the moment, but if this will give me an opportunity to talk through my feelings with someone qualified, present an opportunity for AH and I to improve our communication skills as we face co-parenting together, and give me a safe place to raise the issue of divorce, then I'm happy to go for a few sessions. The sessions are free and I certainly don't have anything to lose. What my AH gets out of it, if anything, is his business.
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Old 10-02-2014, 01:52 PM
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I don't think it is necessarily a bad plan. My ex and I did some similar sessions with a few differences. For one - I had already filed for divorce so there was no disillusionment as to what was going on. We went with the goal of being able to communicate and co-parent. My ex looked at is as marriage counseling to save the marriage and admitted as much at one point but that was not because I wasn't upfront. We filled out all the forms that counselors give initially etc. After, three or four sessions she said she would no longer see us together if he didn't participate in a recovery program. He declined. She'd work with either of us individually. He had first choice since he started with her originally and brought me in but he didn't want to so I stayed with her. It was sooo good for me. It might be a better use of your time to see her on your own until you are ready to move forward with your plans and then bring him into a session. Being totally honest with the counselor is the best way to get the most out of therapy.
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Old 10-02-2014, 02:14 PM
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I went to see a counsellor with my fiance as we were having relationship problems. She made me fill out some information sheets about myself. Including questions like "do you have any issues with substances, have you been treated for addictions in the past, etc.".

I was honest. Yes - I'm an alcoholic. Yes - I'm still drinking.

She looked over our sheets and immediately told us that while she would love to help, there is nothing she can do until I address my substance abuse issues. She could continue to take our money & see us, but our relationship will not improve until I get help as an individual.

She said, if I become sober, she will see us again, and can assist with any relationship troubles.

It hit home and it made alot of sense.

However, I will say that it sounds like you're trying to control the show here. Being a little bit manipulative by arranging an "addictions counsellor" behind his back, etc.

Only your husband can get himself sober, when he is ready and willing. Nobody can do that for him. Trying to do so will probably only create more problems for yourself.

Why not see a counsellor who specializes in co-dependency/people with alcoholic spouses for yourself?
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Old 10-02-2014, 02:31 PM
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I have waited over 20 years for my stbxah to get hit with the serenity stick. Doesn't work.
He has no intention on getting better unless his life has become unmanageable and he has hit rock bottom. From my perspective, you are wasting your time. Work on you...

Where you are going to go, save some money on the side, speak to an attorney, go to alanon meetings, and get strong. You will need that when you are really ready to walk. I have wasted 26 years waiting. Learn from us, hoping and praying for him to get sober will never work, as love can not cure alcoholism.

Take care of yourself ONLY!!
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Old 10-02-2014, 03:27 PM
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I have had my fair share of tough love and straight talk here over the years, and I have always taken it with good humor and a healthy appreciation for the sentiment behind it. That said, I feel like I'm not explaining myself well here. I never said I have done anything behind my AH's back. We agreed that I would find the counselor and make the appointment, which I did. I am not hiding anything from him. It is not my job to be his mommy and give him a detailed list of information about a counselor, when he could spend five minutes looking it up himself. I am also sure that the counselor's credentials will be front and center at our appointment. I'm not trying to sneak my AH into an addiction counselor to try to make him better. In fact, my AH has given zero indication he is even remotely ready to acknowledge his disease. And that's none of my business.

As for controlling, the only thing I am trying to control is how I spend my time, and the environment I am in when I discuss divorce--I do not want to spend it with a marriage counselor who has no training on addiction, and will not be equipped to manage a potentially volatile confrontation. As someone who has been on the receiving end of plenty of emotional abuse, I consider it an act of strength that I am trying to proactively manage the situation I may be in when I bring up divorce. I have no intention of lying to the therapist, or my AH. This is not about game playing. It's about ME trying to end this relationship in as safe a way as possible, in a place that does not involve our children. I do not have friends or family here who can come and take the children while I have these potentially rage-inducing conversations with my AH. It is my opinion that this is the best way for me to get help for myself, and for me to make the break in a way that puts my children and me at the least risk.

As for counselors with experience with treating those with co-dependency, this counselor is exactly that, as are most counselors who treat both addiction and families of addicts. The only expectations I have of these sessions are for myself--what I hope to get out them by being honest with a counselor who knows about addiction AND the havoc it wreaks on loved ones AND the way co-dependency just makes the whole dynamic that much more toxic.
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Old 10-02-2014, 03:43 PM
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Wisconsin......O.K......now that you gave more explanation...I can see your logic.

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Old 10-02-2014, 03:50 PM
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Wisconsin, it sounds like you feel you're getting attacked a little bit here, and I can see your point of view.

SR is a great site, but sometimes it feels very rigid and defensive when a situation comes up that is a little bit different.

I think your plans sound good; please keep us updated on how the session goes.
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Old 10-02-2014, 04:01 PM
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I read the OPs post more as ... She has booked an appointment with a counsellor who is also an addictions specialist so that the counsellor won't be snowed by any quacking, not to force her husband into acknowledgement of his side of the issues. I believe that some counsellors who have no background in addiction may not take that into account during therapy (although I could be wrong, not an expert at all here lol)
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Old 10-02-2014, 04:10 PM
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You know what, guys. My bad. I totally admit it. It has been a stressful week at work, and I am HALTing to the max. Thank you all for your thoughtful responses and inpt. So grateful for you all!
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Old 10-02-2014, 04:13 PM
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Like I said, Wisconsin....now that you completely explained...I DO Understand.

In fact, I applaud you for having a long term plan for your exit.

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Old 10-02-2014, 06:43 PM
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I think having a marriage counselor that specializes in addiction is an excellent idea. My AH and I went to a counselor withOUT such a background about 5 years ago. I was horrified when she told us she didn't think AH's drinking was a problem if he was still able to function at work and was still participating in caring for our then toddler. Really? I know it wasn't nightly back then like it is now but we told her he was getting plastered every single Friday and Saturday night. And she saw nothing wrong with that? Huh? That experience really set us back and we stopped seeing her shortly thereafter. (AH hadn't wanted to go in the first place, was suddenly justified in his drinking and happy counseling was over.)

Fast forward 5 years and the drinking was out of control and occurring nightly. He could no longer deny he had a significant problem. As a last attempt we started seeing a new counselor WITH an addiction background. She was awesome! She didn't hold back on her assessment of AH or me. Helped me understand my enabling and most importantly gave us specific things to do. I started going to Alanon, read a lot of materials, set my boundaries and am now working on detachment. Unfortunately AH only made it to 1 AA meeting and decided about 4 sessions in that he was done with counseling. We are now in the processes of divorcing.

I continue to see our counselor though and it's really helped me in my quest to become the best version of myself.

I hope you and your AH both find it helpful! Good luck & keep us posted.
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