HikerLady

Ohhhhh be very very careful and get some professional legal advice. My brother was in a similar situation and was floored to find out that his AW was continuing to fund her addiction by taking out new credit cards, forging his name on that as well as forging his name on checks. When he finally discovered it and it was brought up in court proceedings she basically got off with a slap on the wrist and he had to cover the damage as well as see to it that all potential creditors would contact him directly to verify his knowledge of any new accounts in his name. She was almost able to refinance the house as well attempted to list it for sale w/o his knowledge as well. Frankly, you've got a lot to work out if you want to stay married and stay safe financially with her in the house. Hate to say it but you cannot expect the court system to be fair which ever way you go, but whatever you do make sure you get it in writing and do it in a way that absolves you of any legal obligation to any future debt she incurs w/o your permission or knowledge.

ResignedToWait

Because I am in the military, I am obligated to provide a certain amount of support to my military dependents (i.e. spouse). Providing the home, the utilities, and the payment on her vehicle just so happens to meet the minimum that the military requires I provide (33% of my income). If I were to pull the house from under her, she would be able to contact my command and the military would be obligated to step in and I'd face disciplinary charges for not supporting my dependent.

Once I'm retired from the military, however, I'll have no such obligation...and believe you-me, her life won't be as comfortable as it is now. (I have no desire to plant my roots in that house, we have no family in that area, and the cost of living here is far more than I'll be able to afford once I transition to civilian job and civilian pay)

MissFixit

Wait, I just read your post about her live in boyfriend. Adultry! Bingo! Could that be your get out of jail free (or with lower alimony payments)????

unsureoffuture

I would consult with an attorney because you are married. You are likely responsible for her debt even though its not in your name. If she dies, it will likely transfer to you. An attorney could give you the best advise about what is in your best interest.

ResignedToWait

I already included the 50%...14 years out of a 20 year career, is 14/20 of 50%, or about 35% total..(woops, it's 35, not 38...did math wrong previously I guess) haha

dandylion

ResignedToWait....I am not qualified enough to advise as to the financials....best left to a lawyer who works WITH a certified financial planner....would be my move on that.

As to the moral issues....it seems to me that you have given considerable thought to this.
The way I look at it is....if you come to the conclusion that staying married would be the best practical conclusion and you can live with that in your own heart....than that is what you should do.
I have seen situations where very loving and committed couples have actually DIVORCED in order to keep from financial ruin due to extreme situations (like severe illness). They still remained as a couple--just divorced, legally.
If it can work in one direction, I don't see why it couldn't in the other...LOL!

I have know of couples who separated and never bothered to get divorced......I guess they had their various reasons.....

I support you in whatever your decision is....you sound like a very sincere person, to me....

dandylion

ResignedToWait

I didn't have the strength to leave until the criminal neglect of the kids occurred, and even then, I had to have one year of separation, living in different homes, before I was allowed to file for divorce (in our state, Virginia)

amy55

Think of it this way, you are currently paying her 33% of your income now. Your pension will be less then your pay. She is entitled to 38% of your pension. Using fictitious numbers here but this is how it works. Say you are entitled to $2000 a month (gross pension) that is divided by 2. $1000. It's 38% of $1000. $380 per month for wife. That is of course if it is done the same way as the do it for csrs pension.

You can offer her your share of the house as compensation for dividing thrift savings plan, or some other assets.

Since she co-habitats with another person under circumstances tantamount to marriage, they will consider that in the alimony payment.

Alimony payment differ from state to state, but usually the longest you would have to pay them is for about half the time of your marriage unless it is special circumstances, like a disability. Also remember if she is deemed capable of working, the court will likely impute wages to her.

Lawyer up, and get the numbers.

amy55

OK, just saw this now. Obviously you already worked out this comp. Good for you.

Still with the 35% of your pension, which would revert back to you upon her death, it still looks financially better for you since you will then have a civilian job.

ResignedToWait

I cannot prove adultery, unfortunately. Yes, we all KNOW it's happening, but I have no proof that they are intimate.

Also, adultery, even if the cause for divorce, isn't "supposed" to affect spousal support..nor will it affect the % of my retirement she'd get. At best, it will help with swinging a few percentage points in asset distro to my side.

FireSprite

It was unbelievable. She would sneak around her kitchen ~in a WHEELCHAIR by that point~ when her support staff was distracted, turning up bottle after bottle of hidden vodka & swigging from it every chance she had. Her AH brought the V to the hospital in water bottles for her, bringing it in right under the staff's noses until they put a stop to it. We heard every excuse - complicated alternate health issues, mistakes made by Drs, lab techs, nurses.... it was such a large web of BS. Her youngest daughter was a freaking Dr herself & she would boldly lie to DD's face, fully knowing DD had read her medical charts with her own eyes.

I worked for her & her AH for a couple of years & had a cushy job that I could have coasted in forever & likely taken over the business eventually. I was 25 when they made me a minority partner (I earned it, don't get me wrong) but I could NOT tolerate the atmosphere of working with active A's & quit when she refused to go to rehab & he refused to accept that her disease had progressed past what they could manage. I had to go NC & it was so sad to see that play out over so many years, even with that distance.


Morally - I've seen a number of couples unaffected by addiction who remain married yet separated for many, many years because it makes financial sense to do so. (A few of our clients have that arrangement honestly) As long as you are OK with the legal/financial/custody/etc issues, what is right for you is the right answer FOR you, IMO.

amy55

I just read up a little about alimony in Virginia, it could end with a "court finding of cohabitation". Find out about this, and what kind of proof you would need.

I doubt if it would help with division of property.

Also: don't forget that she would most likely be ordered to pay child support, she will have an income. A percentage of your pension.

ResignedToWait

I will of course be doing a consult about all this...but there is no worry about that. Virginia is a state where spouses are not passed on the debt upon the other's death...and creditors are not allowed to go after the spouse for the other's debts, as long as they aren't a joint account or a co-applicant. My credit rating at the moment is a bit over 750, and hers is basement 500's due to her not paying a single payment to any of her debt in at least a year.

ResignedToWait

Thank you for that insight Fire, that sounds sickening about how many enablers she had in her life! At that point, you really do have to just throw your hands up and walk away from it all. She had no chance to ever get better, especially with all the "help" she was getting. So sad.

schnappi99

Car loan in your name, she's driving it and kills somebody- you'll be sued since she has no money and no insurance and you do & you have a nice house that can be liquidated and a nice pension to attach for damages. Doesn't matter about justice or right and wrong.. your name is attached to that car.

sorry to put it this way but wtf are you exposing yourself to all this risk for?

redatlanta

Morally I don't see an issue as she is having an affair. There are ways to prove that btw via PI and it can have an affect on alimony. Correct me if I am wrong but I think in VA you normally have to separate a year before divorce? I think if you can prove adultery you do not.

As everyone else has stated I think you need to sit down with an attorney. There are no free rides in life what may appear to be the best option in staying married may only be under certain circumstances. Maybe you have already divided assets, perhaps her car is only in her name as well as the house. My greatest concern would be liability if she were to get in an accident while driving intoxicated and the possible repercussions from that, and health related debt. Have you ever thought about that this person could go into a coma and live on life support while you are married? Yes I realize that you have VA benefits how far does this extend to her as a spouse?

Take the money part out of it - I think that long term remaining married to her will cause issues for you mentally. Today you may not feel like proceeding into a relationship, but you have no idea what you will feel like in 5 years, 10 or 15. You are not available to anyone as a married and while you may never get into another serious relationship why would you allow AW and your marital status to rule that part of your life? I realize you can date and for all intensive purposes you may as well be divorced, and I don't judge you if you do. I suppose I lean toward divorcing for this reason but that comes from how I would feel. I would just want it gone and out of my life.

You can't count on her dying in 2 years. You have no idea trust me, a human being is hard to kill. Some go quick and some defy statistics.

Hopefully Mike will chime in on this thread if he hasn't already, but I did not see a comment from him. He has remained married to his AW I believe 3 years separated now and I think also moving toward divorce. I think he would have some applicable advice for you.

ResignedToWait

Thank you everyone for your input with this. My #1 takeaway, I need a lawyer.
There are so many aspects of this that aren't able to be predicted or to know which way things will turn out, I think it will be a matter of choosing the lesser of many evils.

Red, I didn't know M1ke was in this situation with being separate but still technically married!! Thank you so much, I'll have to go do a deep-dive on his postings and get some insight.

soberjuly

Ok, divorce laws are different in every state. Plus, if you have physical custody of the children, she has no argument for the house.

If you divorce her now, in her current state, she won't get much in the way of custody and will end up owing you child support which of course she can't pay but if you have custody and she gets married and says she can't pay CS, the courts can go after her husband's salary.

See, I am kinda reading that you are waiting for her to die? I am NOT trying to be disrespectful but I have found, it's always those types that hang on for years and years.

You need to make sure you document everything. If she remarries, she can't get spousal support.

You have every right to be concerned and protect your own interests. There may be ways to protect some of your assets for the children.

Yes, I think you do need an attorney. Or can anyone advise you in the military? I mean, I assume they have some social networks.

If you divorce her, she may also view the kids as a meal-ticket and try to get custody. Bankruptcy will not dissolve any child support obligations so far as I know.

You didn't give the ages of the kids, and I am not asking you to, but hopefully you don't have years to wait for freedom.

If my ex could exploit me for every penny I have he would, he has tried but my husband is an attorney and he has never gotten as far as he has tried. He has managed to get thousands out of us because we were unable to get the children out of the foreign country they were living in, the courts failed us and we basically struck a financial deal with him and he gave the kids to me but he never got what he wanted which was basically that we would support him in the US with an apartment, car and spending money. He's pond scum but my son will age out in 4 years, my daughter in 6. It's almost over. I try to keep things civil and we actually helped him financially this year when he lost a job because it affects the kids when his life is messed up.

lillamy

Absolutely. States are so different. In MA, for example, if she has a live-in boyfriend, you would probably not be forced to pay alimony. In CA, you would probably be forced to pay alimony for life because she has a disability. Etc.

And a lawyer would also look at the liability side of things.

It's not an easy situation, for sure.

Woodman123

The only thing I'd add to the conversation is BECAUSE you are married, if she kills/injures someone under DUI, then could the suit go after YOUR assets? And from what you've described in her reckless use of a vehicle, that could be more likely than dying in the next year. This is one thing I was worried about with my AW... I want to get as legally clear from her path of self-destruction as possible, even if it means giving up some of MY hard-earned savings.

ditto the attorney consult. IMO, not a d*** move to consider staying married if it ultimately benefits you and the kids- you've certainly endured enough.