Children Find Selfie Porn on Dad's Phone
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
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With technology today carrying around your private life is common.
When we were kids our parents took polaroids that they his in their nightstands but kids being kids we found them along with my mom's vibrator that we would use for neck massages. I laugh thinking about it now. And 2 of the 4 of us kids walked in on our parents having sex. Such is life. We are not scarred from from it.
I would only consider it sexual abuse if AH said look at this picture of dad or if he handed the phone to them and said look at all my pictures. Why did they have his phone in the first place?
As with a lot of things it will come down to a he said she said. Liquor in the trunk? Don't count on that admission from him. Perhaps there is a possibility of subpoena of credit card information to see if he purchased from a liquor store while they were in his care. Could have been smart and used cash though.
So my guess is daddy was drinking and not paying attention to what was going on. A violation of his visits. Has the Court given you any latitude with this like being able to breathalyze him before or after a visit? Is your only means of determining this observation of behavior or smelling it on him?
When we were kids our parents took polaroids that they his in their nightstands but kids being kids we found them along with my mom's vibrator that we would use for neck massages. I laugh thinking about it now. And 2 of the 4 of us kids walked in on our parents having sex. Such is life. We are not scarred from from it.
I would only consider it sexual abuse if AH said look at this picture of dad or if he handed the phone to them and said look at all my pictures. Why did they have his phone in the first place?
As with a lot of things it will come down to a he said she said. Liquor in the trunk? Don't count on that admission from him. Perhaps there is a possibility of subpoena of credit card information to see if he purchased from a liquor store while they were in his care. Could have been smart and used cash though.
So my guess is daddy was drinking and not paying attention to what was going on. A violation of his visits. Has the Court given you any latitude with this like being able to breathalyze him before or after a visit? Is your only means of determining this observation of behavior or smelling it on him?
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
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Ugggghhh.
Again since the Courts have stated he cannot drink around the kids how is that supposed to be enforced? Is an affidavit by the kids enough?
By chance did the kids get a photo of the liquor bottles?
Again since the Courts have stated he cannot drink around the kids how is that supposed to be enforced? Is an affidavit by the kids enough?
By chance did the kids get a photo of the liquor bottles?
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The only enforcement would be by the kids. Leaving them in the lousy position to be spies. And me as having to take information from the kids and subjecting them to being interviewed by a clueless judge who has no children himself. Or I hear the children's stories, support them, send them to therapy and wait for whatever more severe catastrophe strikes to get the judge to protect us.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
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The next court ordered visit with their father, send them with cell phones and tell them to snap pictures of anything, including his pictures on his phone, that bothers them and send them to you.
They will have seen whatever it is anyway, so they are not spies. They are recording what happens when they are with their father that disturbs them.
I think you still need to have an impartial person such as a policeman or social worker interview them and make a report. That takes it out of the "he said/she said" "this-is-a-nasty-divorce-battle" realm and puts it where it should be: parental negligence/abuse on his part.
In other words, convert fact into evidence.
Desypete, this is the answer to the difference between this and what happened to your friend. In this case, the father actually did the bad behavior. Four children, including a 14 year old and a 17 year old saw it and experienced it. It is fact, not fiction.
Protecting innocence in childhood is a necessary part of good parenting.
Children need to grow up in an environment of trust, love, and safety. They need to be allowed to deal with the developmental milestones of growth on their own natural timetable. They need boundaries of safety and appropriateness built and maintained for them.
When they are adolescents, they start dealing with their own sexuality, and they need their parents as a resource and a model of what an appropriate sexual relationship is between two loving adults.
They don't need to be thrust into viewing their father as a sexual being.
Putting children into a sexual relationship with an adult is the definition of sexual abuse.
Pippi is right on in stopping this madness and taking every legal avenue to prevent any more exposure to a man who is rapidly descending into a hellish dysfunction without boundaries or limits.
He does not need to be allowed to take prisoners with him.
ShootingStar1
They will have seen whatever it is anyway, so they are not spies. They are recording what happens when they are with their father that disturbs them.
I think you still need to have an impartial person such as a policeman or social worker interview them and make a report. That takes it out of the "he said/she said" "this-is-a-nasty-divorce-battle" realm and puts it where it should be: parental negligence/abuse on his part.
In other words, convert fact into evidence.
Desypete, this is the answer to the difference between this and what happened to your friend. In this case, the father actually did the bad behavior. Four children, including a 14 year old and a 17 year old saw it and experienced it. It is fact, not fiction.
Protecting innocence in childhood is a necessary part of good parenting.
Children need to grow up in an environment of trust, love, and safety. They need to be allowed to deal with the developmental milestones of growth on their own natural timetable. They need boundaries of safety and appropriateness built and maintained for them.
When they are adolescents, they start dealing with their own sexuality, and they need their parents as a resource and a model of what an appropriate sexual relationship is between two loving adults.
They don't need to be thrust into viewing their father as a sexual being.
Putting children into a sexual relationship with an adult is the definition of sexual abuse.
Pippi is right on in stopping this madness and taking every legal avenue to prevent any more exposure to a man who is rapidly descending into a hellish dysfunction without boundaries or limits.
He does not need to be allowed to take prisoners with him.
ShootingStar1
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,452
The only enforcement would be by the kids. Leaving them in the lousy position to be spies. And me as having to take information from the kids and subjecting them to being interviewed by a clueless judge who has no children himself. Or I hear the children's stories, support them, send them to therapy and wait for whatever more severe catastrophe strikes to get the judge to protect us.
Pippi, I don't agree with you here.
]There is a profound book on trauma called In An Unspoken Voice: How the Body Releases Trauma and Restores Goodness written by Peter a. Levine, PhD that may be worth your reading. Dr. Levine is a life long trauma therapist and a research scientist in comparative brain research and stress.
This book talks about trauma, how the body traps emotional trauma in physical symptoms, and how to deal with and release trauma. Your children would benefit from therapy about these events. Their longer term emotional health would benefit from this information being introduced in a powerful, credentialed manner, to those uncaring judges.
You can choose the person who interviews your children. Perhaps an impartial child psychologist is the best choice. Someone who can write a professional report as an expert in the field, and someone who can testify in court.
Your children have experienced these events. They didn't go into their visit with their father trying to find evidence to discredit him. They were not and are not spies. They went with their father to have fun camping. As your DD7 expected campfires, marshmellows, hikes. Good hearted childish fun. They got what they got: a highly disturbing sexual encounter with their father. That is now part of their psyche. That information is in their brains and their bodies. They have the right to talk about and act on what happened to them. To not give that right full expression, is to trivialize what they are feeling. That is what happened to you. I suspect that is what created the pattern that you - that I - that others who have been abused - have that leads to our backing away from legitimacy of our knowing.
I think this may be the crack in your husband's facade that will break open the reality of how he is behaving.
ShootingStar1
Pippi, I don't agree with you here.
]There is a profound book on trauma called In An Unspoken Voice: How the Body Releases Trauma and Restores Goodness written by Peter a. Levine, PhD that may be worth your reading. Dr. Levine is a life long trauma therapist and a research scientist in comparative brain research and stress.
This book talks about trauma, how the body traps emotional trauma in physical symptoms, and how to deal with and release trauma. Your children would benefit from therapy about these events. Their longer term emotional health would benefit from this information being introduced in a powerful, credentialed manner, to those uncaring judges.
You can choose the person who interviews your children. Perhaps an impartial child psychologist is the best choice. Someone who can write a professional report as an expert in the field, and someone who can testify in court.
Your children have experienced these events. They didn't go into their visit with their father trying to find evidence to discredit him. They were not and are not spies. They went with their father to have fun camping. As your DD7 expected campfires, marshmellows, hikes. Good hearted childish fun. They got what they got: a highly disturbing sexual encounter with their father. That is now part of their psyche. That information is in their brains and their bodies. They have the right to talk about and act on what happened to them. To not give that right full expression, is to trivialize what they are feeling. That is what happened to you. I suspect that is what created the pattern that you - that I - that others who have been abused - have that leads to our backing away from legitimacy of our knowing.
I think this may be the crack in your husband's facade that will break open the reality of how he is behaving.
ShootingStar1
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Pippi......I have always thought that dealing with a Narcissistic Personality Disordered person----and a drunk one, at that----is like being ambushed by snipers in a jungle at any given moment.
God bless you, Pippi......
dandylion
God bless you, Pippi......
dandylion
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I agree with ShootingStar - you should be having the children photograph the things that are disturbing to them. Particularly any evidence of alcohol.
Turning them into spies would be asking them to snoop and the like and that's not this. This may make them feel better anyway cause I am sure he spends most of his time denying anybody sees anything they say they do including them.
Turning them into spies would be asking them to snoop and the like and that's not this. This may make them feel better anyway cause I am sure he spends most of his time denying anybody sees anything they say they do including them.
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Quick Friday night update:
I have spoken to my lawyers and domestic violence counsellors in the two countries, plus local police and the family therapist.
DD14 also spoke to the therapist, and then she, the therapist and I spoke together. DD14 says she is afraid of her father. She remarked on his significant mental decline, which she said was very obvious. She talked about the photo being creepy. She also noted excess use of alcohol with hidden bottles all over garage. Just like in the old days. And, he was spoking marijuana and the smell was so strong on him it made her eyes tear up. She, his greatest ally, has had enough of him. She wants to tell our pediatrician who will likely be the one to right a report to the judge.
My dv counsellor here said that more disconcerting than the photo is the context. That xah seems to be using DD14 to fill my vacant role as woman of the house. And that, she feels, is perverse. Now it is DD14 observing and being exposed to his dark side, not I.
The dv counsellor in the US and the one here agree that visitation might need to be canceled for the time being. Until xah finds himself some recovery. They feel as do I that this has crisi has go e on too long and the children are being burdened by xah's behaviors/demeanor.
Additionally, I worked on the likelihood that xah likes these crises because it is the only time he hears from me. The attention and drama nourish him and keeps him being problematic. Because that is the only time I will communicate with him.
So, no more visits with the children, no more contact with me. Then maybe he will get bored of disturbing the children and go away.
So then, I was just driving up to the supermarket when what crazy bast*rd do I see behind the wheel next to my home but xah himself. So I had the kids lock the doors and went to the police to warn them that I had just told xah no more visits with the children for now, and suddenly he is 25 meters from our home. Someone is coming to change the locks for me tonight.
Battening down the hatches. May be in for a stormy weekend.
I have spoken to my lawyers and domestic violence counsellors in the two countries, plus local police and the family therapist.
DD14 also spoke to the therapist, and then she, the therapist and I spoke together. DD14 says she is afraid of her father. She remarked on his significant mental decline, which she said was very obvious. She talked about the photo being creepy. She also noted excess use of alcohol with hidden bottles all over garage. Just like in the old days. And, he was spoking marijuana and the smell was so strong on him it made her eyes tear up. She, his greatest ally, has had enough of him. She wants to tell our pediatrician who will likely be the one to right a report to the judge.
My dv counsellor here said that more disconcerting than the photo is the context. That xah seems to be using DD14 to fill my vacant role as woman of the house. And that, she feels, is perverse. Now it is DD14 observing and being exposed to his dark side, not I.
The dv counsellor in the US and the one here agree that visitation might need to be canceled for the time being. Until xah finds himself some recovery. They feel as do I that this has crisi has go e on too long and the children are being burdened by xah's behaviors/demeanor.
Additionally, I worked on the likelihood that xah likes these crises because it is the only time he hears from me. The attention and drama nourish him and keeps him being problematic. Because that is the only time I will communicate with him.
So, no more visits with the children, no more contact with me. Then maybe he will get bored of disturbing the children and go away.
So then, I was just driving up to the supermarket when what crazy bast*rd do I see behind the wheel next to my home but xah himself. So I had the kids lock the doors and went to the police to warn them that I had just told xah no more visits with the children for now, and suddenly he is 25 meters from our home. Someone is coming to change the locks for me tonight.
Battening down the hatches. May be in for a stormy weekend.
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Btw, sorry for phone typos!
Also, don't know what judge will decide re: visitation. It is up to him obviously. My lawyer will write to him with reports from therapist/doctor. Then we'll see what he does with that information.
Also, don't know what judge will decide re: visitation. It is up to him obviously. My lawyer will write to him with reports from therapist/doctor. Then we'll see what he does with that information.
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I have a lot of scattered thoughts here.
If it was just this incident alone, I might give him the benefit of the doubt. It is not, however. Over time he has been grooming your kids to accept increasingly unacceptable things to accommodate his alcoholism and mental decline. This is BAD NEWS.
In this context, showing your pubescent daughter nude pictures of himself and his sexual interests is a step towards sexual predation.
My XAH began showing some really concerning things around his sexual behavior with my son, showing him cheesecake porn and the like, when he was at his worst and living with me. I found out that he also had an accusation against him that he molested his daughter as a teenager. This information gnaws at the corners of my brain. I am very glad that all of his visits with DD3 are supervised, but I can't think about it too hard or I will go ******* crazy.
I was sexually abused as a teenager. The legacy of this abuse on my life has been monumental. I am in my early thirties and finally feel like it doesn't touch me. My parents ignored it and did not take it seriously, even blaming me. It changed the rest of my life. Good on you for taking action.
Be careful. An unhinged narcissist is something else.
If it was just this incident alone, I might give him the benefit of the doubt. It is not, however. Over time he has been grooming your kids to accept increasingly unacceptable things to accommodate his alcoholism and mental decline. This is BAD NEWS.
In this context, showing your pubescent daughter nude pictures of himself and his sexual interests is a step towards sexual predation.
My XAH began showing some really concerning things around his sexual behavior with my son, showing him cheesecake porn and the like, when he was at his worst and living with me. I found out that he also had an accusation against him that he molested his daughter as a teenager. This information gnaws at the corners of my brain. I am very glad that all of his visits with DD3 are supervised, but I can't think about it too hard or I will go ******* crazy.
I was sexually abused as a teenager. The legacy of this abuse on my life has been monumental. I am in my early thirties and finally feel like it doesn't touch me. My parents ignored it and did not take it seriously, even blaming me. It changed the rest of my life. Good on you for taking action.
Be careful. An unhinged narcissist is something else.
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Thank you, Florence. Your perspective, as always, is very helpful.
I can't seem to settle down here. Seeing xah driving by the apartment with that maniacal look on his face pretty well freaked me out. Then having someone in here nervously changing the lock.
I wish sometimes there were someone to lean on. I think I lean on you all!
I can't seem to settle down here. Seeing xah driving by the apartment with that maniacal look on his face pretty well freaked me out. Then having someone in here nervously changing the lock.
I wish sometimes there were someone to lean on. I think I lean on you all!
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I just remembered that I left my car parked just before the building. I might get a huge ticket but it is late and I dont want to risk going outside. What if crazy xah is lurking around down there?
I mean, you don't wind up driving by that little village lane by accident. What was he doing here anyway?
I mean, you don't wind up driving by that little village lane by accident. What was he doing here anyway?
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Brw, I had a r.o. Temporaily.
The stupid American family doctor wrote to the judge here to say there that xah is in fine heAlth and can have many week long unsupervised visits with the children.
After that letter it was goid-bye restraining order and good-bye supervision.
The stupid American family doctor wrote to the judge here to say there that xah is in fine heAlth and can have many week long unsupervised visits with the children.
After that letter it was goid-bye restraining order and good-bye supervision.
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He doesn't have any friends here that I know of. Just some work colleagues.
I wrote to xah's family to notify them when Xah told me that he was in the ER here for a mental health evaluation. But his family wants nothing to do with me. I want someone to deal with him being all 'unhinged' as Florence put it so well.
right now, if something happens to xah, I am the only adult who is connected to him on this side of the Atlantic.
I wrote to xah's family to notify them when Xah told me that he was in the ER here for a mental health evaluation. But his family wants nothing to do with me. I want someone to deal with him being all 'unhinged' as Florence put it so well.
right now, if something happens to xah, I am the only adult who is connected to him on this side of the Atlantic.
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Additionally, I worked on the likelihood that xah likes these crises because it is the only time he hears from me. The attention and drama nourish him and keeps him being problematic. Because that is the only time I will communicate with him.
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