TalenCrowhaven

Okay, there's something I've noticed about chronic, doting enablers...

The strikingly beautiful female addict/alkies/narcissists, seem to have no end of male enablers as long as their looks hold out and they keep their manipulation skills well honed.

However, it doesn't seem to matter how vile, nasty, and ugly in the extreme (both inside and out) their human male counterparts are, there always seem to be an entire gallery of enabling women, just lined up as ladies in waiting for them. I honestly can't believe how many women out there are willing to repeatedly sacrifice themselves, their children, their peace of mind and sanity...to these guys.

Is puzzlement...

What is your experience? Any personal insight and observations are welcome!

dandylion

TalenCrowHaven.....there are several theories about the dynamics of partner attraction. One of them is called "exchange Theory".
You will find a discussion of this in any basic textbook of Marriage and Family. Also in some Psychology textbooks.


Take a look in Hollywood---you will find examples all over the place.

dandylion

TalenCrowhaven

Looking for personal experiences, not studies or theories.

ResignedToWait

When in doubt, follow the money trail...

ladyscribbler

I think my ex's new enabler is there for money/material comfort. She was living in a trailer with no running water or electricity, just an outhouse. So my ex's dumpy house probably looks like a palace to her. They're keeping the trailer and land as a "summer home"/drug farm, but this winter they will likely move into his house.
I posted about their relationship on christinastar's thread Lies if you want more info. The whole thing is just hideous, honestly. I do feel sorry for her daughters.

closetcodie

I have noticed this with my RAH. There has been an endless trail of women who would do anything to be with him. Most have been trashy addicts, but some were professional, well off women as well. At one point he was sleeping with one of his court ordered therapists. What I will never understand is that all of them knew about me and his kids. One went as far as calling me to brag that she had taken my husband (while I was pregnant.) It can't be for money because he doesn't work, doesn't own a home, doesn't have a license. Oh but the ******** that flows from his mouth. It definitely captivates a wide audience.

DesertEyes

Can you be a little more specific? Your original question covers a _lot_ of human beings, which only studies and theories can address. If you would break it down to something at a personal level then a person can share their personal experience.

Like for example; I recently dated a strikingly beautiful woman ( like you describe in your post ) until I found out she's married. How can I spot the "red flags" when dating people like this? Is being strikingly beautiful a "red flag"? ( hmmm.... perhaps not ) Is her not wanting me to _ever_ pick her up at her place a "red flag"? ( I'm thinking yes )

Am I making sense with my example? Not looking to hijack your thread, just trying to narrow it down and make it easier to answer.

Mike

TalenCrowhaven

Dandylion, thanks for your respose. I'm sorry I came across curt at your suggestion. Yes, studies and theories are highly valuable. I'm just looking for more personal observations from us codie types.

Mike, this is just something I've noticed going on a lot these days. I don't know quite how to narrow it down! Hmmmm...

amy55

Confused with the question. Are you male or female?

TalenCrowhaven

Amy,

I'm a 58 year old female.

kudzujean

I think one reason for this is that there's more social pressure for women to be in a relationship. Even if it's a crappy one, many women would rather be in a crappy relationship than no relationship.

Another thing, I think that IN GENERAL women are willing to put up with a lot more crap to stay in a relationship than men are. A large part of this is because in the past (and many times in the present) women have to, because USUALLY the man has more income.

desypete

the thing i have to do is to keep my long nose out of other peoples affairs unless of course i am asked
no one will ever know why or hows of it and really it doesnt matter as alcoholics do not have labels on top of there heads nor do any one else who might have problems or issues in life

we all seem normal to the outside world. have a look around you in your local shopping area see if you can pick out abnormal people lol
you might not like the way someone dresses so you will find fault or someone who smokes you will find fault or someone who looks pretty and gets a lot of attention from men or women who chase after good looking men

it really doesnt matter as its none of my business people are people and they come in all shapes and sizes with all sorts of problems or hang ups

hopeful4

Fear of being alone. The pool gets smaller as one gets older. I don't really know. I am amazed by this also.

I know this. I divorced my X and will never be with anyone again who has any tendencies towards an addictive personality at all. And likely will never marry again.

RevivingOphelia

In most societies, women are conditioned to believe their value increases through connection with a man. They have internalized the belief that they are not enough on their own. Some women accept the crappiest behaviour of a man because the idea of living without one is a worse proposition.

redatlanta

I think you could take a look at gender specific roles and answer a lot of that question. Women (generally) are more nurturing, fixers, mothering etc and will put a hell of a lot of effort into fixing someone's problems.

What you describe as the male counterpart I would deem "trophy status" - put up with it as the physical appearance of their partner is reflective of their value.

In my observation though I see this happen far less with males than with females. Certainly have known a male to take on a project then exit when the girlfriend/wife got too crazy. Women will hang in for YEARS.

Florence

Agreed, and we are also fed fairy tales about kissing frogs and the bountiful rewards of martyrdom.

lillamy

Well -- I don't know about what young hot women go through, seeing as the only thing that applies there to me is the "woman" part...

I will tell you, though, that the line of young, hot women who lined up to help my poor ex after I left him was astounding. None of them lasted very long, but they kept getting replaced by new hot bombshells who -- I guess -- believed (like I did once) that their love would save him.

atalose

There was a time when “divorce” was taboo so woman had to “endure” physical and emotional abuse rather than be ostracized by family, friends and community. Divorce kind of became a “norm”, yes it freed woman from all kinds of abuse and unhappiness but at the same time left a void – aloneness, financial struggles, child care struggles. Healthy woman found ways to cope and get by without the help of marriage/dating/relationship. Un-healthy woman go from relationship to relationship.

Magical thinking – Fairy tale endings we believed to be true rather than the reality that they were fictional stories we heard while growing up.

Codependents need “fixer uppers” where healthy minded woman can be happy alone, and pick healthier men.

I always love the expression – water seeks its own level.

Un-healthy people attract un-healthy people – they settle for less than they deserve.

Healthy people attract healthy people, period.

And I know allot of codependent men as well. Men just don't seem to express their un-happiness as much as woman do unless of course they are looking for their relationship before giving up the one they have. And woman do the same thing.

Hockeyerik

I am a man and the women I married was not the person she presented herself to be. I know there were red flags along the way but they were hidden in her saying everything I thought I wanted in a partner. It was like she read my mind and acted exactly like the person I wanted to see. She made me feel special and loved and cared for. I felt like I could trust her and since I wasn't acting couldn't imagine her to be acting. It was all a hoax now that I look back on it.
As to why anyone would keep picking these types of relationships. I don't know exactly but until I had been in one as the enabler I had no idea the dynamic existed. I know what to look for now and how subtle the red flags can be and am moving on with my life.

atalose

someone on here once said,Red flagsare not party favors. We tend to NOT listen to our inner voice warning us and instead we get so focused on soaking up all that we have longed to hear and feel, we ignore and excuse away the warnings.

We rush into "relationship" just to have one when we really don't even know the person. Everyone is fantastic in the very beginning, we can't believe it...........and we end up discovering we shouldn't have.

We need to take our time to fully get to know someone before we committe to living with them, marrying them, investing our all into them.

Healthy people do not allow someone they have only known a few short weeks or a couple of months to move in with them. That's a big old red flag.

Healthy people don't go out on a few dates then plan their future with that person, then try and do all they can to make that dream come true. That's a big old red flag.

One of the beginnings of OUR recovery is to learn from our past mistakes, learn the red flags and CONTROL our reactions and emotions when it comes to "relationship".

I've discovered I'm pretty good at fixing things, people is not one of them.