Going crazy, don't know how to let go of this marriage.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 485
Going crazy, don't know how to let go of this marriage.
Ahhhh. I'm sick of thinking/talking about all of this, but I need help.
AH and I have lived apart for almost four months now. He's been drunk probably 3-4 times since then. He's been fine on the days when he has the boys so far and has been helpful with dropping/picking them up from school. However, his mother has been visiting a lot due to his health issues and I feel that she is the one helping him "keep it together."
A few times recently we've done outings as a family and it's gone great. Then, as I posted last week, we went to the beach for 4th of July fireworks and it turned out to be my worst nightmare. He got WASTED. He was falling down drunk, literally. He also got in my face a few times to the point that strangers were giving me a "are you ok?" look. I was mortified. And the kids saw him that way. They've never seen him like that. Of course, he was full of "I hate myself" and "I'll never drink again" apologies for a few days after that.
Now, only a week later, his usual thinking is back. I told him last night that we need to limit our contact because neither of us are going to change if we stay too intertwined. He agreed, but then went on a tangent about "You're the one who left me," and went on and on about how we are toxic together. He said I am psychotic and oppressive and would never let him go out. He said "What if I said right now that a couple of my mates are coming out from England next summer? You would freak out!"
Of COURSE I would. Two years ago, his friend came to visit and my husband got arrested THREE times in a two week period. One was for a bar fight, once for drunk in public, and one for trespassing at a hotel bar. I had a 9-month-old baby at the time.
He also brought up that it's ridiculous that anytime he goes out, which is rare, I take the kids and leave. That's because he is an unpredictable drunk and I never know what he'll be like when he comes home. What kind of idiot would stay home and wait for that?
How does he not see that alcohol is the problem here?? How can he see me as a crazy oppressor?? It makes me crazy. I texted him this morning and told him all of this, and how I don't understand how he can't see that if he just gave up drinking our marriage would have worked. He responded with:
"I want a divorce. I'm going to hire a solicitor to sort it out. Leave me alone from now on. I don't want to hear you go on about sh*t any longer. Keep it about the kids from now on. Simple."
Why can't I wrap my mind around this. He is logical and smart in so many ways. He keeps telling me that I will never change. How can he not see what's in front of him? Why am I questioning my own sanity? I don't want to let go because I'm afraid he will die and our kids' hearts will be broken. It's so hard to give up! I keep trying to convince him, make him see. I have always been in denial that he is a real alcoholic because he doesn't seem addicted, just a problem drinker. But if this isn't an alcoholic talking, I don't know what is.
I want to let go with dignity. I don't want to beg him to understand. I don't even know if I love him anymore, I don't know what I'm fighting for. It's my kids really. I feel like we've failed them.
AH and I have lived apart for almost four months now. He's been drunk probably 3-4 times since then. He's been fine on the days when he has the boys so far and has been helpful with dropping/picking them up from school. However, his mother has been visiting a lot due to his health issues and I feel that she is the one helping him "keep it together."
A few times recently we've done outings as a family and it's gone great. Then, as I posted last week, we went to the beach for 4th of July fireworks and it turned out to be my worst nightmare. He got WASTED. He was falling down drunk, literally. He also got in my face a few times to the point that strangers were giving me a "are you ok?" look. I was mortified. And the kids saw him that way. They've never seen him like that. Of course, he was full of "I hate myself" and "I'll never drink again" apologies for a few days after that.
Now, only a week later, his usual thinking is back. I told him last night that we need to limit our contact because neither of us are going to change if we stay too intertwined. He agreed, but then went on a tangent about "You're the one who left me," and went on and on about how we are toxic together. He said I am psychotic and oppressive and would never let him go out. He said "What if I said right now that a couple of my mates are coming out from England next summer? You would freak out!"
Of COURSE I would. Two years ago, his friend came to visit and my husband got arrested THREE times in a two week period. One was for a bar fight, once for drunk in public, and one for trespassing at a hotel bar. I had a 9-month-old baby at the time.
He also brought up that it's ridiculous that anytime he goes out, which is rare, I take the kids and leave. That's because he is an unpredictable drunk and I never know what he'll be like when he comes home. What kind of idiot would stay home and wait for that?
How does he not see that alcohol is the problem here?? How can he see me as a crazy oppressor?? It makes me crazy. I texted him this morning and told him all of this, and how I don't understand how he can't see that if he just gave up drinking our marriage would have worked. He responded with:
"I want a divorce. I'm going to hire a solicitor to sort it out. Leave me alone from now on. I don't want to hear you go on about sh*t any longer. Keep it about the kids from now on. Simple."
Why can't I wrap my mind around this. He is logical and smart in so many ways. He keeps telling me that I will never change. How can he not see what's in front of him? Why am I questioning my own sanity? I don't want to let go because I'm afraid he will die and our kids' hearts will be broken. It's so hard to give up! I keep trying to convince him, make him see. I have always been in denial that he is a real alcoholic because he doesn't seem addicted, just a problem drinker. But if this isn't an alcoholic talking, I don't know what is.
I want to let go with dignity. I don't want to beg him to understand. I don't even know if I love him anymore, I don't know what I'm fighting for. It's my kids really. I feel like we've failed them.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,050
It was really hard for me to understand why my ex couldn't see what a huge problem he had. It took a lot for me to let go of the idea that it would dawn on him one day that he is an alcoholic who needs serious help. I've posted elsewhere about how much he has deteriorated, and yet if you asked him, he would say he was fine.
I had to realize that I was the one who had a problem with his drinking. And that it was affecting every aspect of my life, and worse, that it was affecting my sons.
It is not easy to watch an otherwise intelligent, perceptive and talented individual slide so far down. On some level, I think they know, otherwise you wouldn't have all the pushback and anger that emerges when they are feeling guilty. I am now able to see that for what it is, not an attack on me, but self loathing from the alcoholic.
It was not easy for me to leave him, because I had all the guilt and fear that kept me paralyzed.
I never regret leaving, though. Not once have I thought my life or my children's lives would be better if I had stayed. It might have prolonged the inevitable decline of my ex, but he has so many options for help and support if he wants to stop drinking that it is truly his choice to live the way he does.
You don't have to take any huge, life altering step today, but what if you took him at his word and from now on maintained limited contact with him, only dealing with "kid business." That was a huge help for me in letting go.
Hugs Emmy.
I had to realize that I was the one who had a problem with his drinking. And that it was affecting every aspect of my life, and worse, that it was affecting my sons.
It is not easy to watch an otherwise intelligent, perceptive and talented individual slide so far down. On some level, I think they know, otherwise you wouldn't have all the pushback and anger that emerges when they are feeling guilty. I am now able to see that for what it is, not an attack on me, but self loathing from the alcoholic.
It was not easy for me to leave him, because I had all the guilt and fear that kept me paralyzed.
I never regret leaving, though. Not once have I thought my life or my children's lives would be better if I had stayed. It might have prolonged the inevitable decline of my ex, but he has so many options for help and support if he wants to stop drinking that it is truly his choice to live the way he does.
You don't have to take any huge, life altering step today, but what if you took him at his word and from now on maintained limited contact with him, only dealing with "kid business." That was a huge help for me in letting go.
Hugs Emmy.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,481
Originally Posted by EmmyG 
I want to let go with dignity. I don't want to beg him to understand. I don't even know if I love him anymore, I don't know what I'm fighting for. It's my kids really. I feel like we've failed them.
And HE has failed the kids at this point. HE is the one w/the alcohol problem. As long as you do what you need to in order to see that the kids have at least ONE safe, stable, loving parent (that would be YOU), then you have not failed at all. One person alone cannot do the work needed to make a marriage, and he is certainly not holding up his end of the commitment, is he?
I'd also like to address your statement that you hesitate to call him a "real alcoholic" b/c he doesn't seem addicted. First of all, why else would someone see the consequences that he is seeing from drinking and not decide to quit, if he wasn't addicted? And second, what difference does it make what label is put on him if he is filling your life and your children's lives w/pain and chaos?
I hope that doesn't sound too harsh, Emmy, but you DO have the power to end the craziness. So many others here have done it, and you can too. Maybe this thread will help you: http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ere-there.html
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Baton Rouge, La.
Posts: 15,238
I fooled a lot of people as well and no one
ever thought I had a drinking problem and
could put it down anytime I wanted. Most
folks with an addiction are pretty smart.
Smart but sick. I was sick with an alcohol
addiction and trouble followed it.
I was the one in my 25 yr. marriage that
was working a living a recovery problem.
The only one that was sick with an addiction.
As I grew and changed in many areas of
my life, our marriage failed due to communication
and understanding as well as honesty.
I chose to exit from it and we both agreed
and it ended very peacefully.
Peacefully because I moved back to my
hometown of Baton Rouge and he remained
in Houston, so distances was a plus for a
stress free separation and then divorce.
We left out pretty much all communication
and allowed both lawyers do their jobs and
all we had to do was sign the papers. Leaving
out the verbal, emotions in the equation also
allowed everything to move along smoothly
and effectively.
That was 6 yrs ago with still no communication
and both of us have moved on and remarried.
Just keeping it simple in recovery is the way to
go and continues to work well for me.
ever thought I had a drinking problem and
could put it down anytime I wanted. Most
folks with an addiction are pretty smart.
Smart but sick. I was sick with an alcohol
addiction and trouble followed it.
I was the one in my 25 yr. marriage that
was working a living a recovery problem.
The only one that was sick with an addiction.
As I grew and changed in many areas of
my life, our marriage failed due to communication
and understanding as well as honesty.
I chose to exit from it and we both agreed
and it ended very peacefully.
Peacefully because I moved back to my
hometown of Baton Rouge and he remained
in Houston, so distances was a plus for a
stress free separation and then divorce.
We left out pretty much all communication
and allowed both lawyers do their jobs and
all we had to do was sign the papers. Leaving
out the verbal, emotions in the equation also
allowed everything to move along smoothly
and effectively.
That was 6 yrs ago with still no communication
and both of us have moved on and remarried.
Just keeping it simple in recovery is the way to
go and continues to work well for me.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
EmmyG----he does not "see" because he is an alcoholic...and thinks l ike an alcoholic. All of this makes good sense to him within his altered reality. Alcohol alters the reality of the alcoholic.
You are not going to change him by your logic and explanations. If he saw your logic (and bought it)---he would have to quit drinking!!!!!!!!!!! That is like asking him to give up oxygen, right now. He can't comprehend living without drinking.
He will manipulate to get back to the status quo (which worked for him; not for you and the kids). He can send you spinning because he "Knows" you are not convinced of his alcoholism. He "knows" that you don't want a divorce and are still clinging to that hope.
He "knows" where all of your achilles heels are and where your self-doubt lies---this makes it so easy for him to hit all of your buttons. Make no mistake...he knows what he is doing and how to take you to your knees with guilt and self-doubt.
One way to neutralize (to a great degree) his "power" over you is to go no contact--as much as humanly possible, given you have children together.
It might even come down to you two passing all your communications through a third party. I see where several others, here, have done that.
With your contacts with him, it looks, to me, like you are actually doing intermittent reinforcement of the bonds to him--and, intermittent reinforcement is the worst (strongest) kind.
These are the thoughts that I offer you for the delimma that you posed---"don't know how to let go of this marriage"
dandylion
You are not going to change him by your logic and explanations. If he saw your logic (and bought it)---he would have to quit drinking!!!!!!!!!!! That is like asking him to give up oxygen, right now. He can't comprehend living without drinking.
He will manipulate to get back to the status quo (which worked for him; not for you and the kids). He can send you spinning because he "Knows" you are not convinced of his alcoholism. He "knows" that you don't want a divorce and are still clinging to that hope.
He "knows" where all of your achilles heels are and where your self-doubt lies---this makes it so easy for him to hit all of your buttons. Make no mistake...he knows what he is doing and how to take you to your knees with guilt and self-doubt.
One way to neutralize (to a great degree) his "power" over you is to go no contact--as much as humanly possible, given you have children together.
It might even come down to you two passing all your communications through a third party. I see where several others, here, have done that.
With your contacts with him, it looks, to me, like you are actually doing intermittent reinforcement of the bonds to him--and, intermittent reinforcement is the worst (strongest) kind.
These are the thoughts that I offer you for the delimma that you posed---"don't know how to let go of this marriage"
dandylion
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NJ
Posts: 20,458
Emmy, there were 20 thoughtful responses from people to the thread you started 4 days ago, you never responded or read them? (Sad again).
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: AZ
Posts: 309
All I have to say is, wow. ^^^
Listen, Emmy, I know it is hard. And lets be honest, you are not just staying for the kids. You love him, and want him as your loving, caring, husband. You are hoping he will see it your way. And he may, but he may not. I think he is throwing the divorce card as manipulation to get you to back off and let him do what he wants. Balls now in your court. What are YOU going to do?
Listen, Emmy, I know it is hard. And lets be honest, you are not just staying for the kids. You love him, and want him as your loving, caring, husband. You are hoping he will see it your way. And he may, but he may not. I think he is throwing the divorce card as manipulation to get you to back off and let him do what he wants. Balls now in your court. What are YOU going to do?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 485
Originally Posted by Fandy
Emmy, there were 20 thoughtful responses from people to the thread you started 4 days ago, you never responded or read them? (Sad again).
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Emmy, I think the most applicable thought that comes to mind is: He keeps showing you who he really is..... when are you going to BELIEVE him? He hasn't embraced recovery & by your own admission has changed very little (& what has changed can possibly be chalked up to having mom around).... So what do you EXPECT to change when nothing has really changed?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 485
Yes that's so true. I was just saying to my sister this morning that I was so isolated for the first five years of our marriage. I was pregnant twice and working from home. So when it's just you and this unhealthy person, you can easily lose sight of what is normal and start questioning your own instincts. That's why I come here. I get that it's frustrating to see someone coming here and struggling with the same issues over and over, but it's been a SLOW process for me. It took so much for me to leave him. I am physically out, now I just need to detach emotionally, which I'm finding difficult.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Emmy---No doubt about it...letting go of this marriage is, I would guess, the hardest thing you have ever been call upon to do.
It is hard to come face=to=face with this. It it were easy, this would be a very small forum rather than the size that it is. As you read, story after story illustrates this.
Wher a person is in the process makes a difference, also. Some people come out of the denial and grieve the loss of their "dream" while they are still living with the alcoholic partner. For them, they often report relief as their major feeling when the separateion comes.
Emmy, for you, I honestly don't think you have allowed yourself to really grieve very much, so far........I think keeping up a lot of the former family structure has kept your connection pretty close to him.
But, I think your current sadness is the beginning of the process. Grief is composed of several emotions--sometimes all mixed together! And it DOES hurt...it hurts like HEL*!!
Unfortunately, there is no way around it. You have to grieve before you can completely let go enough to go forward...before you can heal.
It is my suggestion, that at this point you get additional support for yourself. Like alanon and a personal counselor. There are other forms of support, also. It is just too hard and lonely to go alone.
You have us at SR....who will always have your back and best interest at heart...but, there is nothing like a human face that completely understands. Sometimes, that is what is needed.
I remind you that it is not always going to feel like this. It is short-term pain for the long-term gain.
One day, you will look back on this period of time and realize that it was all worth it.
Just hang on, Emmy!
dandylion
It is hard to come face=to=face with this. It it were easy, this would be a very small forum rather than the size that it is. As you read, story after story illustrates this.
Wher a person is in the process makes a difference, also. Some people come out of the denial and grieve the loss of their "dream" while they are still living with the alcoholic partner. For them, they often report relief as their major feeling when the separateion comes.
Emmy, for you, I honestly don't think you have allowed yourself to really grieve very much, so far........I think keeping up a lot of the former family structure has kept your connection pretty close to him.
But, I think your current sadness is the beginning of the process. Grief is composed of several emotions--sometimes all mixed together! And it DOES hurt...it hurts like HEL*!!
Unfortunately, there is no way around it. You have to grieve before you can completely let go enough to go forward...before you can heal.
It is my suggestion, that at this point you get additional support for yourself. Like alanon and a personal counselor. There are other forms of support, also. It is just too hard and lonely to go alone.
You have us at SR....who will always have your back and best interest at heart...but, there is nothing like a human face that completely understands. Sometimes, that is what is needed.
I remind you that it is not always going to feel like this. It is short-term pain for the long-term gain.
One day, you will look back on this period of time and realize that it was all worth it.
Just hang on, Emmy!
dandylion
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Originally Posted by EmmyG
Yes that's so true. I was just saying to my sister this morning that I was so isolated for the first five years of our marriage. I was pregnant twice and working from home. So when it's just you and this unhealthy person, you can easily lose sight of what is normal and start questioning your own instincts. That's why I come here. I get that it's frustrating to see someone coming here and struggling with the same issues over and over, but it's been a SLOW process for me. It took so much for me to leave him. I am physically out, now I just need to detach emotionally, which I'm finding difficult.
A few months separated is great, but a lot of that time was also filled with busy-work adjustment... packing, unpacking, new schedules, etc. Now it's time to LIVE... but first you need to really draw some firm boundaries for yourself.
You have a lot of Codie-hurdles with your mom too, so I know it can be overwhelming & start to feel like you are just getting poked from all sides. That's how holding firm boundaries feels though, because those around us don't like it when we change the dynamics that way, especially at first.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,805
Originally Posted by EmmyG
So when it's just you and this unhealthy person, you can easily lose sight of what is normal and start questioning your own instincts. That's why I come here. I get that it's frustrating to see someone coming here and struggling with the same issues over and over, but it's been a SLOW process for me. It took so much for me to leave him. I am physically out, now I just need to detach emotionally, which I'm finding difficult.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 494
For years it ate me up inside that I could not get my then-husband to acknowledge that I held the family together and he was a mess. For some reason, I thought it was vital that he admit this and internalize it. It's not! He's homeless and jobless due to his drinking and is still trucking along under the delusion that he's the real victim. Nothing I said in that regard, no amount of badgering him to see my truth, had the least effect. You won't get your alcoholic husband to understand - stop turning yourself inside out trying.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pa
Posts: 4,872
Didn't read any responses here, only read initial thread.
Why are you waiting for him to validate you?
I waited and waited for validation. It never came, I just knew at one point that I couldn't live like that anymore.
PS, lets take Stockholm Syndrome, same as PTSD. Always waiting for validation that you are doing the right thing. You sit around accepting crumbs and hoping someday that you will have the cake, and I can't even say the cake here. Maybe a slice. Then no crumbs or anything for another week.
Why are you waiting for him to validate you?
I waited and waited for validation. It never came, I just knew at one point that I couldn't live like that anymore.
PS, lets take Stockholm Syndrome, same as PTSD. Always waiting for validation that you are doing the right thing. You sit around accepting crumbs and hoping someday that you will have the cake, and I can't even say the cake here. Maybe a slice. Then no crumbs or anything for another week.
Last edited by amy55; 07-12-2014 at 08:23 PM. Reason: added PS
Bunnies!
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,905
Emmy, we're all very concerned for you. I understand what Fandy was trying to say. You're not the only person here who seems to be on repeat, essentially posting the same things over and over again and seemingly not allowing yourself to progress. And that's ok, frustrating though it may be for us armchair quarterbacks who so badly want to see you free of this mess. And you certainly aren't setting a record for length of your holding pattern. There are members who have been here longer than you and are still stuck in the same spot. However, YOUR HUSBAND TRIED TO KILL YOU. That means that time isn't really on your side in re: do I stay gone or do I give it another shot. Nobody here wants to find out through the grapevine that he was able to finish what he started before. Alcohol isn't his only problem, which I'd say is the case in just about every alcoholic. This goes so much deeper than him drinking. (((HUGS)))
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pa
Posts: 4,872
Emmy, I want to build you up so much. But sometimes I think I needed to feel the fall. I needed to get slapped in the face with reality. No matter how much it hurt. I needed to start accepting the hurt. So Ok, you moved out, you thought he might change, (common thinking). I thought the same thing. But he didn't.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mine didn't either, he got nastier, if that is even imaginable. Just know we are here with you.
and ((((((((((hugs)))))))))))), I think you really need them tonight.
and ((((((((((hugs)))))))))))), I think you really need them tonight.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Posts: 2,066
Originally Posted by Fandy
Emmy, there were 20 thoughtful responses from people to the thread you started 4 days ago, you never responded or read them? (Sad again).
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
now you start another thread that basically says the same thing and you expect everyone to respond again? while you continue to do the same thing, say the same thing month after month after month.
You do not follow anyone's thoughtful advice to help you. You are stuck thinking that texting and communicating is going to work...obviously it does not.
Emmy, listen to your husband. He knows what he wants and it's not the same thing that YOU want for HIM or that his mother wants for him. You ARE oppressing him. The man wants to drink. You are trying your hardest to prevent that. You are powerless over other people. You can only control yourself and to an extent, your children. Anything besides you and your kids are way outside if your power.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
