desperate and defeated

Old 06-10-2014, 09:56 PM
  # 1 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2
desperate and defeated

I divorced my husband a year ago. He was a heavy binge drinker who would be gone all night, if not days, leaving me alone with out two children. Or worse, bringing drunk strangers back to our home in the middle of the night with our children right upstairs...it was hard but life was better on our own...eventually I decided to try to date. And I honestly thought I found the perfect man...he was kind and sweet and attentive. All the things I've gone without for so many years...he told me he was in recovery and had a previous dui...I was ok with that. He said he was sober. I felt proud of him...it's been many months now and suddenly it's as if the other shoe dropped...there was a night where no one could find him. it turned out he had checked himself into a hotel. 9 empty bottles were found hidden in his bedroom and more in his car. he hadn't been to work all week...he cried and said he was ashamed and said he was desperate not to lose me...I was afraid to make the relapse worse and I do love him very much, so I stayed the night. But I found him trying to sneak a bottle even that night when he thought I was distracted in another part of the house...I took it from him and expected the worst he could give me...he didn't. he just went quiet...now I have to admit my worries go to him drinking all the time...I look for it, but never come right out and ask...I'm fairly certain he is still drinking in small amounts every day, avoiding becoming drunk but drinking enough to not suffer physically from not drinking, but I don't have proof. it's a gut feeling like someone is lying to you...he dances around or avoids the subject any time I try to bring up sobriety...I want to be able to tell him that I need him to become involved in a program of some kind, that I don't feel that he can fight this battle alone. And that I'm willing to stand by him and fight it with him, as long as I'm not the only one...he has told me how much he despises the 12 step program and how he feels it doesn't work...but I've never heard of a more successful way to stay strong and healthy...after this last episode he tried to tell me he had only been drinking for a few days and had been sober for all the time before that, but he was sweating and shaking and throwing up and his eyes had this crazy look I'd never seen in him before. And when that passed he just looked ill and hollow and yellowishly pale...it was frightening...he had promised me a future and that he loved me...but I'm not sure he loves me more than drinking...but I need a way to find out before I invest even more of myself into a man that I'm afraid isn't really the man I fell in love with...at least not all of the time...how do I begin this conversation? I don't want to hurt him and I don't want to set off a binge...do these conversations ever work? can you be enough of a reason for someone to want to be healthy and work to stay sober? or am I just dreaming that this man could ever love me enough to be able to walk away from alcohol?
bgb1980 is offline  
Old 06-10-2014, 10:52 PM
  # 2 (permalink)  
Member
 
ladyscribbler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,050
It's not you. Not at all. Alcoholism is a disease. It's never about you, however personal it feels.
Would I be way off base in thinking that there's some history of substance abuse or mental illness with one of your parents?
My dad is an alcoholic and my mom suffers from paranoid schizophrenia. I have spent a significant part of my adult life trying to recreate and "fix" these unhealthy relationships from my childhood with no success. No reflection on me, except my choices were skewed because I was gravitating toward what was familiar to me.
I think because you have no children or real ties to this second man,the best option is to let him go and begin working on yourself.
I attend Alanon meetings and individual therapy and am working through my childhood issues so that I can stop making these poor relationship choices.
Hugs and welcome.
ladyscribbler is offline  
Old 06-10-2014, 11:29 PM
  # 3 (permalink)  
Keeping it simple!
 
LadyinBC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Surrey, BC
Posts: 3,282
Originally Posted by bgb1980 View Post
how do I begin this conversation? I don't want to hurt him and I don't want to set off a binge...do these conversations ever work? can you be enough of a reason for someone to want to be healthy and work to stay sober? or am I just dreaming that this man could ever love me enough to be able to walk away from alcohol?
You are not responsible for setting him off on a binge. When I was drinking I found lots of excuses to drink and I can tell you not one of those excuses was ever my fault. It was my choice to pick and drink, it is also his choice. No one "forces" us or "makes" us. However, we are quite happy to let you think this so that we can continue to have an excuse to drink. And notice how you walk on eggshells so that you won't set him off. That is what we want you to do because you are interfering in our drinking.

You have already gone thru this with one man, in my opinion, you should walk away from this one before you invest in anymore time with him. You can't fix him.

I had to walk away from the alcohol for me. I had to want to be sober more than I wanted to be drunk. He doesn't sound like he really wants to put the effort into staying sober.

Lady gave some great advice on trying to find out why we make these relationship choices. It is not uncommon to move from one alcoholic to the next. Because you couldn't fix the first one, you keep trying to fix someone else. Not on purpose mind you, but it is a cycle and it does repeat itself. We do stick with what we are use to and what is familiar. It is human nature.

Be good to yourself and always look out for yourself first. Do what your gut tells you, not your emotions or heart.

So sorry that you are having to go thru this, but you will find lots of support and help here.
LadyinBC is offline  
Old 06-10-2014, 11:57 PM
  # 4 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 250
I'm sorry you are going through this again . You couldn't save your husband, you won't be able to save this guy either. Pay more attention to his actions (and your instinct) than his words. Is he working any type of recovery program?
Sara21 is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 12:13 AM
  # 5 (permalink)  
Member
 
honeypig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,478
bgb, welcome to SR. This is a wonderful, supportive community and I hope you find help for yourself here.

While your desire to "stand by your man" is admirable, unfortunately he himself is the only one who can make the decision to get sober. He is the only one who can do the work and make the changes. What you describe doesn't sound like someone who is even close to that.

I'd like to suggest that you read as much here as possible, and make sure to check out the stickied threads at the top of the page. Educating yourself about alcoholism will go a long way in helping you decide what you want to do in the coming days. You'll likely recognize yourself in many of the posts; you are NOT alone.

I'd also like to suggest getting to an Alanon meeting. Having some face-to-face support in addition to online can be a very good thing. Here's a link to help you find one: http://www.al-anon.alateen.org/

Please do remember, as others have said--his drinking is not about you and whether he loves you or not. It's about him being an alcoholic.

Wishing you strength and clarity.
honeypig is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 02:25 AM
  # 6 (permalink)  
Member
 
9111111's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 258
Originally Posted by bgb1980 View Post
I divorced my husband a year ago. He was a heavy binge drinker who would be gone all night, if not days, leaving me alone with out two children. Or worse, bringing drunk strangers back to our home in the middle of the night with our children right upstairs...it was hard but life was better on our own...eventually I decided to try to date. And I honestly thought I found the perfect man...he was kind and sweet and attentive. All the things I've gone without for so many years...he told me he was in recovery and had a previous dui...I was ok with that. He said he was sober. I felt proud of him...it's been many months now and suddenly it's as if the other shoe dropped...there was a night where no one could find him. it turned out he had checked himself into a hotel. 9 empty bottles were found hidden in his bedroom and more in his car. he hadn't been to work all week...he cried and said he was ashamed and said he was desperate not to lose me...I was afraid to make the relapse worse and I do love him very much, so I stayed the night. But I found him trying to sneak a bottle even that night when he thought I was distracted in another part of the house...I took it from him and expected the worst he could give me...he didn't. he just went quiet...now I have to admit my worries go to him drinking all the time...I look for it, but never come right out and ask...I'm fairly certain he is still drinking in small amounts every day, avoiding becoming drunk but drinking enough to not suffer physically from not drinking, but I don't have proof. it's a gut feeling like someone is lying to you...he dances around or avoids the subject any time I try to bring up sobriety...I want to be able to tell him that I need him to become involved in a program of some kind, that I don't feel that he can fight this battle alone. And that I'm willing to stand by him and fight it with him, as long as I'm not the only one...he has told me how much he despises the 12 step program and how he feels it doesn't work...but I've never heard of a more successful way to stay strong and healthy...after this last episode he tried to tell me he had only been drinking for a few days and had been sober for all the time before that, but he was sweating and shaking and throwing up and his eyes had this crazy look I'd never seen in him before. And when that passed he just looked ill and hollow and yellowishly pale...it was frightening...he had promised me a future and that he loved me...but I'm not sure he loves me more than drinking...but I need a way to find out before I invest even more of myself into a man that I'm afraid isn't really the man I fell in love with...at least not all of the time...how do I begin this conversation? I don't want to hurt him and I don't want to set off a binge...do these conversations ever work? can you be enough of a reason for someone to want to be healthy and work to stay sober? or am I just dreaming that this man could ever love me enough to be able to walk away from alcohol?
Welcome to sober recovery and sorry for what you are going through. I had a binge drinker in my life as well, and know what a toll disappearing and other acts of disrespect can cause to families.

To me there's a lot of strength and wisdom in your post: You were very brave to remove your children from a situation that sounds rather toxic and you are a smart woman, listening to your gut feeling telling you that something might not be right in this relationship.

Living with an alcoholic taught me that words are just words, and actions speak way louder.
You are brave, you are smart and you care - and you deserve to be loved by a kind and caring man. Someone who will stand by your side and be true to himself and you.
9111111 is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 03:06 AM
  # 7 (permalink)  
Member
 
Hopeworks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,243
My heart goes out to you because my life used to follow patterns and the men who I used to be attracted to were extremely poor choices with many red flags flying over their heads...oh they looked really shiny and they were completely charming....irresistible in fact.

Now in recovery and looking back and having the benefit of 20/20 they were trying to win me with all that charm and Perfection all the while hiding the big holes they had...for most it was an addictive issue and they were allegedly sober during our courtships and marriages (as a hyper controlling personality all of them hid their drug and alcohol usages until I caught them).

Alcoholics and drug addicts always have a lot of issues (as we all do) along with abuse and that is why they even in recovery they make very, very risky choices for relationships. The future is always uncertain with an A and relapse becomes the nightmare we all know oh so well. Sober is just not drinking and honeymoon periods are just that....periods of time where everyone is floating on clouds and its easy to let our feelings sweep us along into a relationship much too quickly to really, really know them.

So... my thoughts are "why do we have such broken pickers over and over"? I do because of the family disease of alcoholism I grew up in and both of my parents were emotionally unavailable and other reasons I have sorted out in therapy.

But... I no longer see the A across the room and my radar go crazy and have overwhelming attraction for that broken guy...now... my radar goes off and I hear that robot voice go off in my head "Danger, Danger Will Rogers Danger"!!!!!!! Thats Lost in Space talk for you young people.

I retrained my brain with recovery. Alanon, this site and counseling. Lots of books...and more books.

And one more thing... your kids are learning from you how to choose a mate and it becomes hardwired. We have to demonstrate and model healthy behaviors... fortunately my kids both had enough counseling growing up that they didn't choose A's or addicts for mates. I like to think I had something to do with that because I was very, very proactive in their learning that Mom's broken picker did not have to be heritable! But it can be and very often children of alcoholic or addictive families choose mates that emulate the same patterns of behavior that are "home' to them so they can "fix" the brokenness at last.

We can break the cycles by recovery... so maybe you are on a path of discovery like many of us found ourselves that will be life changing for you. You are among friends who care so stick around. I would find an alanon meeting ... they are great!
Hopeworks is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 04:51 AM
  # 8 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Philly burbs, NJ
Posts: 99
You already know the answer to this. You've only been divorced a year. And now you're heavily involved with another alcoholic, who will lead you down the same road you just got off.

Walk away. Yes, it will hurt. But do it.
queenapple is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 05:09 AM
  # 9 (permalink)  
Member
 
lillamy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
No.
You can never be enough for an addict to give up their addiction.

And you are not the problem.
The addiction is.
lillamy is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 07:00 AM
  # 10 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2
My father did drink much too much when I was young. And when my Mother left him she went on a long tangent of drinking as well. But she made the choice to get help when she say how it was effecting the three year old me. But I remember it all well...I grew up very aware not to "set Dad off."...I don't want that kind of anxiety for my children...I think what kills me in this situation is that he fooled me...I believed that this was "the man" that I made a good choice this time...I saw no signs of drinking for seven months. Not a single one...he was that good...but it fooled me; it drew me in and my heart became involved...and just as I let my heart be open is when things fell apart...I feel betrayed and like an idiot...I start to feel like every time I let myself love a person, my choice of that specific person bites me in the butt, in ways I think I should have been able to see coming...I've never experienced being around a person who "needs" alcohol to function...my ex didn't drink every day. His issue was that when he started to drink that he was incapable of stopping until he was almost blackout and angry. He'd blame me and say he went out and drank so much because he didn't love me and being married to me made him miserable. it hurt so much...this man seems to physically require alcohol to function and psychologically to cope with his life...he pulls on my sympathy saying that his time in jail, almost a year, from his dui, was traumatizing for him...he never gets aggressive or mean like my ex and I suppose that made it easier for me to buy into it...but I know that my children deserve stability and love and an anxiety free existence...as much as possible...and so do I. I need someone I can rely on to be safe and be there...at the same time I do find myself just desperate to "make it all better" and help or "fix" him...I have this irrational belief in my head that I am capable of solving the issue and with me by his side that he can be strong enough to conquer the urge...but I am realizing that just isn't based in reality and that it's all on him to want to change...I've been looking for any signs and analyzing him which tells me that some of the trust that comes easily at first is gone...I hoped he'd show me he was committed to the fight and earn it back...it's so heartbreaking to fail at another relationship...but I am starting to see that all of you very kind people are right...the chances are that he won't get better until he decides to...the hard part is not blaming myself...I'm trying. But I do realize that none of his issues are my fault or responsibility..they existed before we met and they may continue to exist after I'm gone...I am going to ask him to go to meetings and prove to me that he attends and if he can't do it then I don't think I can either...sounds so harsh and it hurts me deeply to do it...but I can't survive another relationship that hurts that much again...I just can't do it.
bgb1980 is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 07:23 AM
  # 11 (permalink)  
Member
 
atalose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
I'm sorry you feel like an idiot. YOU ARE NOT!! You made what you thought was a good decision based on NOT seeing alcohol abuse and that was good. Now that you have discovered differently, you need to make a good decision to let go and move on.

This is a fairly new relationship, it's in that getting to know you faze and now that you know, he's just not the one for you or your children, this is what dating is all about.

When we fall hard so soon for someone, discover things we don't like about them and look to change them.........that's when we know it's OUR issues at work not theirs.
atalose is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 07:54 AM
  # 12 (permalink)  
Member
 
9111111's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 258
Why do you think you "failed at a relationship"?

It normally takes (at least) 2 people to have a relationship - with an alcoholic there's normally one person who keeps the dream alive, a bottle (or more...) and a sick person addicted to the bottle.

I can read a lot of pain in your post, but also a lot of clarity and insight. By seeing the red flags and acting on them you might "miss out" on the chance to have a "relationship" with this man, but I can only imagine the impact that this decision will have on your relationship with your children and their future relationships.
9111111 is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 07:59 AM
  # 13 (permalink)  
Member
 
Refiner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Be kind to yourself, bgb. You acted on the information you had... and for 7 months you didn't see ANY signs (b/c he's THAT GOOD as you said) and he was a kind, thoughtful person who cared about you (as opposed to the mental unloving abuse from your X). You shouldn't feel foolish because that was the info you had. You should be PROUD of yourself, however, that you are acting on this new information you have! He's obviously in deep with the addiction having the severe withdrawals. And a YEAR in jail for a dui? Ummmm... then that wasn't his first dui. It looks like he hasn't hit the bottom yet. I wouldn't want to go on that ride down with him if I were you. Take care of yourself (and your kids).
Refiner is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 08:24 AM
  # 14 (permalink)  
Member
 
lillamy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
Yes. Be kind to yourself. And again -- you are NOT a failure.

I didn't grow up in an alcoholic home, but I dated several mentally unhealthy men, some of them addicts, before I married one. I spent four years in Al-Anon and here at SR before I left AXH, and started counseling after I left him. During that time, I slowly learned to understand what it was about me that attracted me to these men.

For me, as I suspect is the case for you, it was behaviors that were modeled for me when I was a child, and beliefs I held about myself -- often things that my parents had praised me for, like putting other people's needs above my own -- that sort of prepped me for subconsciously looking for men who were needy. I felt like I was worthwhile and praiseworthy when I took care of them. None of them upfront seemed like needy disturbed people to me -- but friends and family who were healthier could see that my "picker" was off. I thought I was drawn to extremely intelligent men -- my friends could see that I was drawn to extremely needy men.

When I remarried after my divorce, it was to a man who was very grounded and very solid. For the first time in my life, I was OK with not being the person who controlled a relationship; who was the emotionally stronger and more capable one. I am very happy in my marriage today. And I'm not saying that to rub it in your face in any way; I'm saying it because despite that fact, I still have behaviors and fears that are grounded in my former marriage to an alcoholic.

And also -- there's a statistic somewhere that says that a person who divorces once is more likely to divorce again, and that's often held up as evidence that some people are just bad at marriage. I think, on the contrary, that it's evidence that once you have survived one divorce, you are actually less likely to put up with dysfunction in your next marriage. While I'm happy right now, and today believe I'll spend the rest of my life with this man -- should he become addicted to a substance, or become abusive, I would hope I would not feel like a failure because of it. And I hope I would be quicker to leave instead of trying -- again -- to fix another person.

I think for me, my first marriage taught me that while we all want the union-that-turns-two-into-one, it's in a way a very unhealthy way of thinking of a relationship. It taught me that you are always two in a relationship, and when one is unhealthy, the relationship can't be healthy either.

And you are always free to leave an unhealthy relationship. Always.
lillamy is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 08:56 AM
  # 15 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: East Coast
Posts: 28
Be kind to yourself is great advice. It appears your reflections are appropriate in deciding your position in this unstable world we live in. Most of us unstable souls are too busy trying to cover up, mask and create illusions, we cannot possibly be in a healthy relationship because of our self centeredness and addictions.

Stay the course, you will persevere.
flyboy7200 is offline  
Old 06-11-2014, 09:37 AM
  # 16 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 94
bgb - so sorry this has become such a heart-breaking let down. Been there too, and have recently been trying to read and understand why I fall into the same trap. I found this site which has spelt it out .... It really made stop and think about what I wanted/didn't want from any (unlikely right now) future relationship. It may not be a great help to relieve the pain you're in right now, but looking to the future, I will be looking out for the 'red flags'.

12 Core Boundaries To Live By in Life, Dating, & Relationships | Baggage Reclaim by Natalie Lue

Hugs x
Brindie is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:10 PM.