Florence

Mmm, it depends where you live. I filed for divorce then did nothing to see if my STBXAH would screw up badly enough to justify me asking for full custody with supervised visitation for our toddler. I didn't move forward with the divorce after filing for about six months, maybe more. Frankly I wanted to see what he was going to do, where he was emotionally, especially since I always got the "everything's fine! move along!" charade and didn't know if he was a safe person for my daughter. He held it together in front of me until recently, when he had to prove to the court that he was doing all the **** he said he was doing, and the short version is that he wasn't. Told my lawyer to wrap it up.

Get the free consultation.

NYCDoglvr

I worked hard in letting go of expectations and have a lot less heartbreak. It's a way I set myself up to be constantly disappointed.

FireSprite

IDK anything about the legalities Stung, so I have no words of experience to share with you there.

I just wanted to chime in that I understand the frustration I hear in your latest post..... and that we all have to do what feels right for ourselves regardless of how other's handle it.

The bold part I highlighted above is, in reality, the way IT IS for many F&F of A's. The reality is that relapse is only ever one choice away, every single day, for the rest of their lives.

When we choose to stay with our qualifiers it is awesome when they work a program & maintain sobriety but we have no more control over their recovery than we do their drinking. There is no way we can anticipate or throw ourselves in front of every decision that they make on a daily basis in order to stay sober. (& we know it is unhealthy behavior for us as well) We have to accept that they CAN and MAY choose to break that promise of sobriety on any given day. When you say "bystander" it's the best word for it really - we will ALWAYS & ONLY be bystanders to their recovery successes & failures since Recovery is an Inside Job. I won't lie - I understand this in theory 100% but in daily practice it sometimes feels like a very heavy straw that may someday break my back.... it creates a feeling of insecurity that I don't like & that keeps making me double-up on my own therapy needs because I just know that that insecurity is really coming from somewhere inside of me. But if I choose to stay it IS something that I HAVE to accept fully --- I am working on it. you have to decide if that is something that you can live with for the rest of your married life.

Do you know what ultimately allowed my RAH's AV to talk him into relapsing last fall after he'd been strong in the face of alcohol so many other times and through just as stressful times? When he was offered a beer that time, it was already opened. That's it. Everything else, every other rational reason to stay sober & walk away, 2+ yrs of sobriety flew right out the window when he saw the bottle cap off of the bottle already.

On one hand it's the stupidest thing I have ever heard & on another, I totally get it. And it showed me just how simple & how in a *flash* those decisions can be made & regretted.

Obviously, yes, you need to set boundaries & follow them through however you see fit. But stop & think before you Do - are you trying to enforce a boundary here or make an ultimatum? It sounds very ultimatum-y to me, driven by an effort to draw a hard line to protect your sense of security. (understandable reaction)

Stung

I'm being totally reactionary. And I'm angry. Which is why I'm not looking to do anything today.

I just feel like there is such a fine line between being patient and compassionate or being a disgruntled doormat. I don't like feeling like I'm at his mercy and that as long as he follows his program that this are good and that when he slips things are bad. It's like he just flipped a switch and we're at square one again. Idk, maybe I just haven't done a good enough job insulating myself from him but hell things WERE going pretty damn well. I'm frustrated.

Hammer

And then Stung sat and thought. And she thought. And thought a bit more . . . .

And then an annoying person from the intertoobs said . . . "maybe THIS is why folks are telling ME to WORK on MY Program."

Well, you sit and mope a bit. Men's Step Study Folks are out finishing the morning jog. Will stop and do some pushups and prayers with you if you are still sitting there in a lap or two.

Left, Right, Left, Right, Huah, huah, huah.

Florence

This is what it came down to for me: I could no longer trust him.

I couldn't trust him to do the right thing for himself, for me, for our kids, for our stuff, for our careers, for our money, whatever. Whether he was incapable of it (which inspires compassion) or just an ******* (which inspires resentment) stopped mattering. I couldn't trust him.

And I can't be in a sexual/financial/intimate/parenting relationship without trust.

FireSprite

Stung, it reads to me like too much of your happiness/sense of security is wrapped up in his decisions/choices. I absolutely agree with you that there's a fine line & I go back & forth as to which side of it I think I am on depending on the day. You are not alone in this feeling of internal tug of war. There are the days that I can see how it would be easier to just be single & not try to rebuild my life with RAH.

If you are feeling at his mercy & your world rocks that far out of balance when he slips, then I would offer that you must still have high expectations tied to his actions, leaving you vulnerable to a crash just like this every time he makes a bad decision. This is where YOUR program kicks into high gear & carries you through the rubble. Things were going along great & you got a lot more comfortable but none of that was any kind of guarantee about what would come next.... so in that aspect, nothing has changed.

My security has to come from knowing that *I* will be A-Ok regardless of his decisions.... I will be disappointed if he drinks again, of course, and I will hope that any relapse he chooses also leads him into a stronger recovery afterward but I will cross that bridge when it is built. For me there is also a difference between a slip & long bender (although both reset sobriety to zero days).... I can tolerate a slip/incident followed my redoubled efforts toward sobriety & true recovery from all the deep-inside issues... but I know I could never handle him actively drinking again or going on an extended bender, thumbing his nose at all his progress & growth. I've never discussed this with him because these are some of my boundaries just for me.

Stung

Yeah, I definitely still have work to do on my own foundation/program/source of security. I don't think I'm really crashing here but it's a gut check after the high I was on from our wonderful little weekend away and then bam! Here we are at square one again. Truth be told, it wasn't like a bolt of lightening and to a degree I saw this coming and was staying away from his crap. First his sponsor dropped him, then he decided to stop doing Soberlink, then his therapist went on vacation. Thread by thread his whole program unraveled. His finding a new sponsor was him grasping at straws as the urge to drink started to creep into his mind. I guess I saw this coming but was staying away from his struggles however being in his proximity while he stinks of booze was too much for me last night because now divorce is on my mind.

If he still smells when he comes here this evening then I'm going to ask him to book a hotel because it just makes me mad. I told him last night that if he ever lies to me again that I'll divorce his ass in a hot second. I do not deserve to be lied to or be manipulated and will not tolerate it at all. I will accept the truth or nothing. That is one area here where it's rightfully black and white. My tolerance for bull is at an all time low and now I don't know what to do with the steaming load that is my husband. I only want him if he's working his program. He can have bad days but he just cannot drink. Period. Since he relapsed I'm not exactly sure what to do. If he thinks he can be here, literally stinking up my life, then I just don't want him anymore. I'm not interested in this situation in the slightest, or the apologies. They're just so meaningless. Every apology is like why are you even saying sorry, what are you actually sorry for? If he had any respect for himself or our family we wouldn't be doing this **** AGAIN. I need major space away from him when he's in crisis mode like he is now, because I just cannot handle it. He wants to put all of his crap on me and I'm trying so hard to push him away kindly but I'm starting to get really pissed.

Stung

I guess I need to enforce some boundaries that I haven't had to enforce in a few months.

hopeful4

I'm sorry Stung. It's so hard knowing it could happen again and again.

You can have divorce papers w/out filing them in my state. What I found is every attorney has a general format and then they go in and modify it all based on your information that you need changed. It's pretty easy on their end.

I hope you find some peace this weekend. Pulling for you!

MissFixit

I am not sure how else you insulate yourself from his drinking (potential) and stay married to him. You guys are separated, you have an emergency fund (for major fallout), you run your life and your kids lives without his daily input. You have 2 kids together and are financially tied to him, but otherwise, your life is very separate, I think.

For me a relationship requires trust, intimacy and vulnerability. I do not know how one has an intimate relationship without those things or with unreliable/inconsistent supplies of them. Like Florence wrote about trust being important for her (it is for me too), reliability is important. I must be able to rely on my partner without question. It is not a codependent thing, it is a relationship thing for me. I can support myself and I can know I am a valuable person, don't need those from others, but if I am in a relationship, I must be able to rely/count on the person to keep their word.

You are in a tough spot and I do not envy you. I agree with what others wrote about you still having expectations of him (that he cannot meet) and you will be let down by having those...however, how does one be in an intimate relationship/partnership without basic expectations of trust and reliability? Don't know. I think that is the basic issue that people end up facing when continuing with an A.

LoveMeNow

I am sorry to read about your husband's relapse.

I am curious, because I have noticed a trend.......did he relapse once he was allowed to move back home?

Stung

I didn't allow him to move back home. I told him that I made a mistake and was moving too quickly and it was making me uncomfortable. Instead we agreed that he could stay one extra night at my home during the week. He decided to still move out of his apartment and go back to hotel living. The turbulent behavior with his sponsor dumping him started about 2 weeks before he was supposed to move back in.

He isn't staying here tonight either. He's in full fledged dry drunk mode to the point that I wonder if he's been drinking again today. He's an a-hole.

LoveMeNow

Awwww, I am sorry. I understand your pain and anger all too well.

My husband or STBXAH was supposedly working a strong recovery program. I saw amazing growth and we were happier then we had been in years. Then, without any warning or red flags, he relapsed.

To be honest, I crashed right along with him because my recovery stunk. I knowingly fell into the "if he is good, then I am good" thinking. This relapse was the end of our marriage and so much more. I am still struggling to find my own serenity.

My only advice would be please keep working on you. Don't make the same mistake I did. It just makes it more devastating. God, do I hate addiction.

HopefulinFLA

I'm sorry you're having a tough time with this. Who wouldn't right? And I completely get being angry. That was my first reaction when my AH relapsed. I was so flipping P@##$%D off at him. I really thought I was prepared for a relapse if it happened...nope. Boy was I wrong.

I think it's a very very special kind of person who can live with an RAH and not be un-nerved by the fact that relapse can happen at any moment.

I don't really have any advice/wisdom for you. I'm still processing "our" relapse situation and wondering what the future holds. Just know that you are far from alone.

Hugs!

CodeJob

Stung,

I am sorry. You get to choose who is with you on your path.

Stung

I'm floundering. I agreed that if he went to a meeting and used some sobriety tools (Soberlink, phone an AA friend, listen to recorded AA speakers) that he could stay the night here. Some boundaries, huh? I'm being tested here and I'm failing big time. Fuuuuuuuuuuudge.

I'm beginning to see why an Al-Alnon type support system would come in handy and although I'm still not crazy about going to a meeting I just might do that tomorrow in lieu of surfing. I suck and I have no room to complain because I'm allowing this crap to happen.

Hammer

Step 1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.

Living it, huh?

Welcome Home, sister.

psssst, I would bet that in no time you will be organizing Beach-Party-bring-your-kids-along-Study Meetings, and combining your work and pleasure. There are no schedule schedule conflicts in God's Economy.

EVERYTHING is right where it should be. Right Now.

MissFixit

Are you two still in marriage counseling?

CodeJob

Why must you sacrifice surfing for Al Anon? Perhaps both would be kinder to my spitfire Stung? Are you setting up a meeting with the disadvantage from the start?