DocSobrietist

So I had another couples therapy session with the wife today. I had my rubber band with me all ready. Was using it at various times throughout the day, but used it extensively in the couples session – more than I thought I would!

My wife was emotional, she said she felt "hormonal." She felt like she didn’t have a good Mother’s Day, felt like I wasn’t really attentive enough, was mixed up about not feeling like she was able to ask for what she needs, etc. I was snapping furiously away at my rubber band as she was saying these things.

I knew this was going to be yet another difficult session. The therapist asked if it was possible that I could make a note that my wife, despite anything or everything else that might ever be going on between the two of us, really wants to the occasion to be marked with something special, say, more than just a card (I got her a simple card). I had originally debated getting her a full bouquet from FTD but at the last minute decided against it. WE’RE GETTING A SEPARATION. I feel like I’ve been rejected by my wife not just over the last year, but on and off, fairly constantly, FOR YEARS.

I explained at the session this feeling of accumulated rejection, and the fact I’m trying to figure out my own boundaries, and I’m trying to figure out how to be good to my wife without always having to be about taking care of her bad feelings all the time and sublimating my own needs in the process.

Then, because it seems like every couples therapy session I have with my wife, she says that she is “sick of keeping secrets.” She explained that she has spoken with her parents about the fact that she is getting a separation from me, and her parents (particularly her Mom) was less than supportive. She said she now is planning, or at least would really like to tell her parents that we’re separating because 1) I overdosed on drugs, 2) I endangered the kids and 3) it was on a Really Hard Drug (naming the drug specifically – which I can’t even do because it’s so horrible). She explained that she wants to do that because (in part) otherwise her parents will blame the separation on her. Oh, OK.

I basically started to vent in the session. I started to raise my voice. I didn’t swear, I didn’t insult, but I did raise my voice. I said I’d almost totally had it. Here I am, barely a year sober. I’m hard at work trying to keep some semblance of stability in my life, establishing a separate residence, keeping some sort of status quo going amidst all of this abject chaos and unpredictability. A couple of weeks ago I was told my wife didn’t want to speak to me anymore, I was convinced it was all over, my marriage was flashing before my eyes. I was living in a hotel, convinced my wife literally only wanted to communicate with me by fax or email from now on – that it was over. Then the next week I hear oh no, she does want to communicate with me, but she wants a separation from me for a year. Then this week she tells me she wants to spill the entire story to her parents, to her Mom, who continues to be a practicing alcoholic, and to her Dad, who is a practicing codependent with early-stage dementia besides. What, exactly, is she expecting to accomplish by telling them “the whole truth” (including virtually all the gory details)?

Ultimately, she seemed like she was just going to tell them whatever she was going to tell them. I’m actually more than OK with her telling them that I’ve had problems with addiction (she said she has told them about her issues as well), and that I have been sober the past year. I was even OK with her telling them that I spent time in acute care secondary to complications related to substance use, and even that I put the kids at risk (although that's hard). She wanted to go even further, she was insisting she wanted to use the words “OD” and to specify exactly what drug I took. Again, she seemed to want to do it to really let her parents know “hey, this isn’t my fault," just to make sure her unsupportive parents don't trash her, but instead focus their ire on me. Greeeeeat. To me, this seems kind of ******. I don’t want her to keep secrets if she doesn’t have to – but to me this feels like this 'speaking her truth' is being done squarely at my expense. And I have only just short of a year at this. Why can’t this wait? Why now?

I know that my recovery has been quite selfish – I’ve hit the “me me me” stage of my recovery where I’m busy trying to get what I need so I can be well. But I think she’s really finding her selfishness now, and it’s getting a little extreme. One thing I was able to say, and clearly at the couples session. THIS IS ALL VERY HARD. It’s extremely difficult to be barely a year into my sobriety and have to manage a separation, fearing (at times) the marriage and even the relationship has fallen completely apart, wondering what’s coming next, feeling scared. I just want some status quo, some stability, just for a little while, PLEASE. I don’t know if she heard me. I also mentioned I might want to take a break from couples therapy for a little while and frankly, my wife’s desire to have “pleasant events” and “pleasant interactions” with me really just wasn’t something I think I can deliver on right now, frankly – I’m far too consumed with just holding everything together right now to be obsessing about whether events are pleasant or not – I’m just interested in having NO MORE FREAKING CHAOS RIGHT NOW.

Also the question came up about my supposed fear of abandonment by my wife. I thought about it – more I think about it, I actually don’t think I’m afraid of abandonment by my wife. Strictly speaking, I’m not afraid of divorcing her. Actually at times I’ve openly fantasized about it (especially lately), at times I would honestly welcome the idea! No, I don’t fear losing my wife – what I really fear is being stuck in this marriage (or even just a relationship with her) for the next 10, 20, 30 years and having things be the same between us. The bottomless resentment and anger from her, the stonewalling and silence, the verbal abuse, and my constantly feeling like I’m trying to dig myself out of a hole (represented by all the Bad Things I’ve done over the years), and yet never be able to complete the process. Being trapped.

Because for sure, I’ve done some Bad Things. The drugs, the booze, the gambling, the porn – and the lengths some of my addictive behaviors went to crossed the line for me into committing not just illegal, but illegal and very taboo acts that I won’t even detail here, but I’ll have to carry with me the rest of my life. But this does NOT define who I am, much like my dalliance with the drug that landed me in the hospital, but it’s just one of many things that make that hole I have to dig myself out of so seemingly very deep and so insurmountable.

In response to my comments about feeling like I’m a hole I can’t dig myself out of - my wife said she didn’t know if she could forgive me, or if she could let go of resentments and anger, but she’s working on it and that’s why she goes to Al Anon and does therapy. It was honest, but unsatisfying.

I don’t know how this is going to turn out but frankly this seems so far from being repaired. I would welcome a relationship with my wife where we are cordial and friendly and communicative about how to manage our kids, but right now I don’t want anything more.

She is exhausting me at a time in my life where I just-can’t-handle-anything-else-right-now. I wish, wish, wish she could try and start respecting that. Like, yesterday.

-DrS

lizatola

I haven't read your back story or other posts recently so I don't know much about your wife and the relationship. Based on this post, I can say that she sounds like me. Maybe there's just too much water under the bridge for you guys and maybe the separation is a good place for both of you to figure out just what each of you need for yourselves?

My AH and I are in a standstill, as well. I live in fear of being hurt again. Of course, he's not working on recovery so it makes it harder to see the light at the end of the tunnel, but still I know that I've put up walls and that I am harboring resentments galore.

I'm sorry that your session didn't go well. Just take what you learned and tuck it away as 'more information' and try not to dwell on the details too much because it will drive you crazy. Trust me. Better to just journal it out, do something for yourself tonight, and get a good nights sleep.

redatlanta

Sometimes I read your posts and I favor your wife. Then I read them and favor you. I feel some real empathy on this roller coaster you have been on.

What I am getting ready to say is only my OPINION and what and how I would feel in the situation.

Not everything needs to be told. Especially when it comes to extended family. I see ZERO purpose in your wife telling your inlaws about the drug, and the overdose. You told her you were fine with them knowing about substance abuse issues that should be sufficient. To me it would be a betrayal I doubt I would forgive.

At this point I would stop the counseling for awhile. This relationship is exhausting - a break could be used by you both.

BlueChair

You brought up a lot of painful things in front of the doctor. Things that maybe have been hidden a long time? It needed to happen because your feelings and needs are important and need a voice.

The thing about her telling her parents. It sounds like she's doing it for the wrong reason. Not so much needing to be truthful because they have a close and loving relationship, but because she wants their approval and cant own her decision. Maybe she wants sympathy ?

I wouldnt worry about the gift not with the back and forth youve been getting. If you had done something big, she probably would have called it manipulation.

Maybe you need to switch the band to the other wrist?

embraced2000

imho.....we need to drag the monster outta the closet into the light before we can begin to repair ourselves.

it appears from your post, that you are still sugar-coating the truths....especially truths that relate to you, eg. no matter what you call an episode that landed you in critical care unit, it is still an overdose. get it out.... into the open....then there is nothing to hide and real healing can begin.

gotta name it. gotta claim it. gotta see it in the light. gotta deal with it.

then......it goes away with good recovery.

once we reveal all, there is no more to hide. revelation creates freedom to live and prosper in a positive manner.

amy55

I'm somewhat going to agree with Redatlanta. Sometimes I can see my ex when you speak, sometimes, I can see me.

I know that you come here for help, because you want to be a better person, and for some reason, I think this is the place for you.

Sometimes, it's which came first, the chicken or the egg.

I know when I was married, I also became controlling, abusive, wanting to analyze every sentence. It was a learned experience for me. I needed to know when to shut up because things may escalate, but at the same time, I knew that I needed to have boundaries.

I don't personally know you or your wife. So I can't say what came first, the chicken or the egg. I do know that you are coming here for help, and in a way, and sorry to say it this way, developing the female side of yourself. You do know that men have that also? Right?

I do agree that maybe MC is not good right now, that perhaps individual therapy might be better. Just learning new communication skills.

Did you ever read anything about the "Four Horsemen", not sure of the exact title but it is by John Gottman. Just different ways to communicate. I know that I was not abusive, but at times, I did get abusive. There is abuse which is all about control, there is reactionary abuse, and there is sometimes abuse from both sides.

I think you are trying really hard, and I do compliment you on that.

anykey

It sounds like she talks too much.

Bullfrog

If you both are in recovery and even sort of want to save the marriage, IMHO it's still better to make the effort, as long as that takes. Divorce is awful. It's not a free ticket away from your troubles.

Whenever I read your posts, it strikes me that you are white knuckling the marriage recovery. You know what you want it to look like. But that might not be the best plan. Let go and Let God.

Fathom

Hugs Doc,

The way I see it is she is building her support system, just like you do here. We all need a place where we can share our truth. And I see nothing inherently wrong with sharing. It is painful and embarrassing, sure. There are things that I have done that I am not proud of. But, for me, I needed to speak my truth in order to acknowledge it, accept it, and deal with it. And, I expected my XAH to do the same.

I'm actually surprised that she asked your opinion. I think all it did was invite more unnecessary drama. We have a saying "what others think of me is none of my business." Focus on behaving today and into the future in ways that YOU are proud of, and people will either appreciate that, or they don't need to participate in your life.

Be gentle with that rubberband. It sounds painful!

Wishing you peace,
Fathom

Stung

Yep. This 100%. This applies to both sides. I think this is paramount to rebuilding trust and respect.

anykey

Does it really matter what she tells her family?

You are the bad guy. Thats how she sees it. Expecting more then a card is un-realisitic.

amy55

Hey Doc, I really think that it is great that you are examining at this time, your part in it, and your wife's part in things. It's a long process, but you have the commitment and the tenacity for it.

inpieces314

I definitely think MC needs to be put on hold, maybe indefinitely.

There are a lot of resentments here and it doesn't sound like your wife is willing to work through them all (although, to be fair, I don't have her side of the story). The water under the bridge thing sounds just about right. Maybe she is just too angry to be anything else right now, including being a productive member of the marriage in marriage counseling.

Nothing personal. It's just how we get when addicts do what they do. But sometimes, it's too much to get over. Sometimes that anger is all that gets us through the day, and why would we want to stop being angry? That's stupid-they deserved it!

Forgiveness is awesome. I stopped being so angry at one point last year, but I never fully forgave until a few weeks ago. It put a whole new spin on things-if I had forgiven him sooner, things would have (NOT could have) been different. I was so angry for so long, and I am sure that damaged the relationship as much as his alcoholism did.

That said, it's is solely your wife's decision when (or even if) she wants to forgive you. But trust and believe, nothing will get better until you two are working together toward a common goal.

LoveMeNow

At first I thought a card? Just a card? Wth? But then I understood your point too.

It sounds like neither you or your wife truly know if you want this marriage. I think that must be answered before you continue with MC. Although, individual therapy sounds like a good idea.

Keep taking care of you. Your recovery must come first. It's not selfish.

Lastly, one of the most important things I have learned is "it's none of my business what other people think of me." It's so true and very freeing.

Stung

A quick thought about the rubberband, just based on my own experience...my husband was told to count to 10 when he was starting to feel controling/frustrated and it was meant to be a way for him to calm himself but rather it ended up being his way of communicating his feelings to me. "1, 2, 3, 4, 5, ..." was the only way he could say "this conversation is really frustrating me, can we take a break for a second so I can gather my emotions and thoughts." Truly, the later would have been more helpful because the former ended up feeling antagonistic like "you're pissing me off so bad that I have to shout out numbers!" If you're snapping your rubberband a lot, maybe you could try calmly communicating how a situation is making you feel rather than snapping yourself silly.

embraced2000

when a house is partially destroyed by a tornado, one must first remove all the debris before repairs begin. after the repairs, it's time to rebuild.

does this make any sense when used as an analogy for a broken marriage that has suffered addictions, secrets, control, anger, co-dependency, irrational reasoning?


there's a whole lot of cleaning up that needs to be done, and it's gonna take more than a rubberband on a wrist......

al-anon. it works.
honesty. it works.
learning humility. it works.

FeelingGreat

Hi Doc, you have an amazing amount of work to do on your marriage, and if it succeeds it can only be long term.
I think you've identified your priority correctly, which is your recovery. Nothing, not even your marriage, can take precedence over that.
Maybe you should call a halt to the couples therapy for now, but if you do, see if you can do it sensitively, leaving the way open for the future, if that's appropriate. Try to get your wife to understand that if your recovery fails so does everything else. It will give you both breathing space to work with your own therapists, AA and Al-anon.
Maybe further down the track you can meet now and then for coffee or a movie, just to make sure you don't lose touch.
As for telling her parents; you can't control that, and it's not your business anyway. She can only give them information from her perspective, and that's her prerogative.

DocSobrietist

I think as I've had a few hours to process the couples therapy session its not so much that she's going to tell her parents X, Y or Z and leave out A, B and C details or skew this or emphasize that or whatever - yes, absolutely, it's her business what she communicates to her parents, and ultimately, correct - let the chips fall where they may. I'm nearly a year into my sobriety and that really has to stand on it's own and so be it.

What really bugged me more is what Fathom (above) noticed too - how she made a point of asking me my opinion about what she was going to tell her parents. I really actually would have preferred she just tell her parents whatever the heck she wants and really it's none of my beeswax and I don't need to know either way. It felt like she was poking me with a stick. It felt aggressive.

My best friend at work (who happens to be a therapist) says she thinks it's a terrible idea to stop the couples therapy. Her take is that with all the problems we have communicating, we desperately need a professional on board to manage things between the two of us. I see her point - but I also really feel like this couples stuff isn't accomplishing anything right now, it feels like it's just stirring up stuff between the two of us unproductively, when for both of us we just need to focus on settling into a new groove right now before we attempt anything else.

I don't think she's sure she wants the marriage anymore. I'm not sure I do either. I'm starting to feel like this is impossibly insurmountable. I don't think this is me trying to "control" things as much as it is me just stating my boundaries here - my breaking point - I feel like I could maybe handle another six months of this, tops, before I say we should just throw in the towel and file for divorce. If we get a break from couples therapy, really actually do "divorce training wheels" for a couple months, maybe that could be extended after we really both get a break from each other.

Ultimately, whether or not it means good or bad things for the marriage, oddly - I think I did good today. I spoke up for myself.

-DrS

Croissant

Yes, I think I asked that too in another one of your threads, Doc - are you having individual counselling, perhaps even a psychologist? (I think your therapist friend may be biased possibly not knows the full extent of your addictions / actions also.)

I think it would help if you could explore your feelings in a safe environment? If I see how you analyse your emails and interactions with her, I can imagine your stress levels in couples counselling in front of a therapist would be through the roof.

I do see that losing your marriage is a fear for you, and as others have said, is it a sense of abandonment? Where will you put all these whirlwind emotions if she just ends the marriage? Or if you do? What will you do with all that angst? Not asking, just proposing what that might feel like?

Your anxiety levels seem through the roof right now. Extremely so. That is not good for your sobriety. I think paring it back to you for now is important - after working on yourself, you may then see if this marriage is actually the best thing for either of you.

DocSobrietist

She knows more than anyone. The only one to know more about my stuff is my wife and of course me. She visited me in rehab last year.

Working on it. I think stopping myself from over-analyzing is harder than stopping myself from ACTING on my over-analysis. Which is what I'm working on. Boundaries, keeping them simply stated, and that's it.

Again, I'm not so sure I'm scared of losing my marriage at this point. I'm scared of something, but increasingly, I'm less and less scared of losing my marriage.

Right. Which really argues for really slowing things down in the couples therapy department, and ramping things up as far as individual therapy goes. Could be just what the doctor ordered, as they say.

-DrS