Blossom717

Im asking because I'm doing it too. We don't leave because its "better for the children". How is that? I think it used to be when my DD was an infant I'd worry about him taking care of her with visitations. He's a good dad, but a bad alcoholic.

Now that she's a toddler, a very independent toddler at that, I wonder. Could he even get custody? If he did, would those visitations have an effect on her mental state? I grew up around alcoholics and drug addicts. I don't want that for her, I don't want her to end up like me and be a spouse of one either.

So how do we finally let go? I guess "detachment" is part of that, right? After a while I just realized I have to do my own thing. I don't plan things on his schedule anymore, and I don't avoid going out somewhere just because it might make him unhappy. But I'm still here. He's been in the hospital 3 times with pancreatic issues from long term alcohol abuse. One time, a nurse even told him point blank that he was a functioning alcoholic (she was my hero at that moment!) but it did no good.

His parents handle all his bills. He's 35 years old! They don't even come to the house, the bills go to his parents. He blows through his paychecks and his dad ends up paying his bills for him. (We have separate accounts)

I've cried. I've screamed. I've gone to bed early and pretended to be asleep so he wouldn't yell at me anymore. He's woken up our DD and now she just assumes hes yelling at me everytime his voice is above normal. The next morning he always wonders why am I so distant. Really?

But I'm still here. This is my new norm. This is my comfort level. Wiping up pee off my entire countertop is normal. Not getting to joke around or be myself in the house I live in is normal. Never knowing what I'm coming home to is normal. Being resentful, spiteful, and not trusting is normal.

I don't want my daughter to think this is normal.

myfreedom

I am going thru this now for the third time and 13 yrs of marriage. It is very hard to let them go. If you read my newest post, " I don't know how", there is ALOT OF GOOD ADVICE on their. I have two children ages 11 & 9. They have witnessed verbal and physical abuse, parties, loud music and more. I regret putting them thru that. Though things are not to that extreme as of now, AH still drinks. We are seperated and I have a hard time with it. My children do not want to be with their father or want to spend alot of time with him. They also beg me not to go back to him because they say, " you know he is not going to change"!!!!! They are way too smart. AH has let them down too many times and they have had enough of living that. They did not ask for it or deserve it. I don't know how to tell you to let go because I can't even tell myself. But I can tell you that if he continues to drink, you really should consider leaving for your sake and your child.

JustAGirl1971

I don't know but I did it for years. He's been gone a couple of months and I can't believe how much happier and more peaceful my life and my home are! The irony is that we think we're staying for the benefit of the children, but in the end we end up screwing them up worse than we would if we left (at least that's the case in my situation.) There's a lot more laughter and love in our home with him gone.

lillamy

I did it too. I think it's like that story about the frog in the pot, you know? If you put a frog in cold water in a pot and turn up the heat gradually, it will survive temperatures that would kill it if you threw it into the boiling water without it getting to adapt to it.

We adapt to dysfunction and abnormal behavior a teeny tiny bit at the time. We tell ourselves that it isn't that bad. That we can handle it. That we're strong enough. All the while, it kills us a little bit at a time on the inside.

Courts are unpredictable. I won't lie. I lived in fear that AXH would call in his lawyer friends and take the kids away from me. I knew his parents would fund a court fight longer than I could pay for a lawyer.

But they're not completely irrational. Courts.

The advice I got was to start documenting everything. Keep a journal (you can keep a private blog that timestamps everything) of his behavior, his drinking, his actions, his abuse. Keep nasty text messages and e-mails. Keep receipts and bank statements that show how much money he spends on booze. Document everything.

And maybe even consult a lawyer in secret? See what advice you can get?

I also thought the kids weren't really affected because AXH mostly drank at night after they went to bed. I was so wrong. You are so wise in realizing that you don't want your daughter to grow up thinking this is normal. My kids are slowly learning what normal is. They're no longer creating drama for the sake of it (drama was their normal; when there was no fighting, they got nervous). But yes, they suffered. More than I realized.

We are so trained that "two parents are essential" -- nobody ever taught me that dysfunction can harm a kid more than single parenthood. An ACOA here used to say "It's better to have no father than an alcoholic father."

And I'm not saying any of that stuff to make you feel guilty. Us codies are plenty good at feeling guilty without help. I'm saying it because it's important. Nobody here is going to judge you for not leaving tomorrow. Many of us have been where you are. Your gut feeling is that you don't want your daughter to grow up with this. Trust that gut feeling. But you don't have to fix it all today. You can start making a plan for how you can fix it, when you feel ready.

suki44883

I have always said...It is better to come from a broken home than to live in one.

hopeful4

I finally left. I tried and tried because I thought I was doing what was best for my children. Then I decided that I do not want my children to grow up and think that this is a normal marriage. I understand having a toddler would complicate things. If you are thinking of leaving I can tell you what my attorney told me, journal every single thing with times, dates, photos, any evidence you can gather up. You will need it for a costody battle.

I waited until my kids were older, they are 8 and 14. I have alot of anxiety over his time with them but am educating them best I know how. I hope you get an attorney who can advise you and a therapist who can guide you.

Tight Hugs. God Bless.

mauihope

We do the best we can with the information and life circumstances that we are given. I believe once we know better, we do better (thank you Maya Angelou). It takes time to start trusting ourselves again to make the right decisions for ourselves and our kids. I feel like if we didn't have kids, I would be outta here.....but I do have kids and I need a plan of action and that is what I'm working on. I'm also taking the focus off of my h and what he does. It's a tough situation, no matter what.

Norasq

While I was struggling with whether to leave, a guy I know pointed out how women are taught from the time we are tiny that it is our job to take care of the family. We absorb that it's our job to keep things running smoothly and keep the children happy and keep everyone TOGETHER. I don't think men get that same message, actually. But I think that's part of why leaving a bad alcoholic situation is so hard even when we're miserable. The thought of breaking up the family feels like it will tear our hearts and ruin our children's lives.

Like you, Blossom, I didn't want my daughter to think our life was normal. I also realized that I was so withdrawn and depressed and exhausted, and that she hadn't seen ME as a happy energetic person in a long time. I hated the thought that she'd remember me during her childhood as a flat, frustrated, depressed mom. And I was that, for some time. I hated that she might think that that's how families are supposed to feel, and that her role model for dealing with unacceptable behavior was to just take it and ignore it.

The truth is, our kids see the reality and feel the strain even if they are too young to understand or verbalize it. They are often better sensors of true feelings than adults, I think. So if you think you are hiding your feelings and the difficulty of life with your AH from your kids, you're wrong.

It's so hard. I really empathize with you. I can tell you I am much happier having separated, and even while my daughter hasn't had an easy time through it, I think she's coping well.

missboots

Are we married to the same man! Mine is 34, three times hospitalized for pancreatitis, parents pay a chunk of the bills. My four months old has seen mommy get hit twice now and reacted badly both times. A custody battle means you're fighting to love and mother and raise your child away from an alcoholic. Raising the child with the alcoholic is a different battle with no winners.

EmmyG

I stayed for a long time "for the kids." I only recently moved out (it's been about two weeks). I think a lot of my fears were irrational and more related to my own unwillingness to let go of my dream. Everyone's situation is different and it's scary when your A is unpredictable and you don't know they'll be when they have the kids. So far my AH hasn't been actively drinking since we left (that I know of, I'm not on the "watch" anymore), and he's actually been really hands on and stable for the kids. But hey, it's been two weeks, so I fully expect a nice binge/bender to come along here soon. Hopefully not, but it won't be a shock.

My kids don't have to witness the fighting and anxiety anymore. That's huge. My six-year-old even said to me the other day "daddy doesn't yell anymore. I don't like it when he yells, it scared me." He was referring to his daddy yelling at me. I was just really determined to make it work, until I realized that by staying and not changing myself, nothing would change. Ever. I won't lie, I'm a little lonely and sad. But my kids aren't nervous, they're seeing the best of their dad, I'm not anxious like I used to be, and we're all sleeping well.

peaceofpi

You asked if he could get custody. It depends on your jurisdiction. Most state laws don't provide any protection to kids of alcoholics. The law assumes a child needs both parents and doesn't recognize that alcoholism is a progressive disease that just gets worse when the alcoholic won't work on recovery.

That is certainly the case with my state. It took me a long time to decide to split, and I stayed out of pure fear of a small child being left alone with an alcoholic. The courts in my area will give maybe a 30 day supervised visitation, require the alcoholic to have AA check a box for those 30 days, maybe visit an outpatient center, etc. You might get an injunction against the alcoholic drinking around the child or some form of testing that mostly requires the sober parent to continually monitor the alcoholic.

Personally, I wish courts would order an MRI and see the shrunken brain. Then, if the alcoholic gets off the hooch and sobers up and regains their brain and the better judgment that goes with sobriety, THEN they could get shared custody. It just isn't fair to kids to subject them to unpredictable, ranting, screaming, night-peeing alcoholics.

Separation and divorce has given me so much peace and lowered my anxiety considerably. Our child is doing better as well - on the whole. He has one stable home where there is consistency, love, discipline. On the dad-every-other-weekends, there are some good days with museum trips and Lego building, and there are some awful days.

My biggest fear is the harm from unsupervised visits when my ex is drunk - for example, a friend told me (a day late) that my ex was drunk when he drove my child last week. How do I protect my child?

LoveMeNow

I think for many it is just another lie and excuse we tell ourselves. That and I take my vows very seriously, it's not that bad, he is different, etc. For me, fear, obligation and guilt (FOG) kept me stuck. I had to really work on my fears of what leaving would mean.

NWGRITS

Many parents will also say, "the kids want us to stay together." Honestly, children don't know what's best for them. And the prospect of not having both parents around can be scary. Mom+dad together= happy, right? That's what's pushed on us, so it's what we think needs to happen. My parents were divorced before I ever got a say in anything or really knew what was going on. I was four. The state gave custody tp my alcoholic mother because "a child needs to be with their mother." My dad never stood a chance. Life in that home was a living hell and I used to dream of getting out. The only problem with that was I wasn't equipped with the life skills necessary to function in the outside world, or to take care of myself. I did finally get out when I was 28. And I'm never going back.

hopeful4

Let me give some words of wisdom I just received from my daugheter's counselor this morning. Apparently my DD of 14 has some very pent up rage for what her father has done. She is also filled with rage that he tells her inapproprite things about me and tells her not to tell me. He is a crap person that she does not respect at all. Yet...he is her father.

I encourage you if you stay or go to do two things. PUT YOUR KIDS IN COUNSELING. That is the number one most important thing. They need someone to tell all of this to, someone who can also guide them in how to respond b/c they have no idea. Secondly, find a positive male role model for your children who is kind and treats others with respect. Your kids need to see what a real man is like, and have a good and postivie male influence in their lives or vice versa if the problem is mom.

It is so hard but I know I could never go back to what I lived for all of those years. While I will always be linked to him through my kids, I AM FREE.

God Bless.

wanttobehealthy

I think that the ACOA forum shows pretty clearly it's not better for kids that we stay.

I said for a long time that my kids deserved an intact family and they wanted us to stay together. Im not sure I was being honest with myself. I think I wanted the intact family and I was willing to lie to myself about the negative impact the dysfunction was having on my kids in order to gamble that the intact family dream could happen.

And even if it is the kids who want us to stay, on what universe do young kids make major life decisions?

Kids of course want their families together -- often times even when it's bad-- bc they hope like us that it will be okay or they accept the status quo bc they are used to it. Like Stockholm Syndrome sort of.

I know I owed it to my kids to have left a long time before I did. If their dad had wanted to get well he could have without me there and I would have gone back if things were better. Instead, I stayed, and the damage done to my kids, who are still quite young, is undeniable.

I have many friends who are ACOA's and not ONE of them is glad that they grew up with their intact family and had to live with an alcoholic.

littlesister1

Oh man, this really hits home.
My dad was an A and our home life SUCKED
Our parents pretended, pretended pretended we all ok

Most people don't give kids enough credit, we see and hear it ALL even when you think we don't. We KNOW when things are going wrong and because of the secrecy and "keeping face" BS we begin to think it has something to do with US.
Becasue our parents will not talk about it or change it, so it MUST be us right?

I would personally like to slap the crap out of anyone who keeps their kids with an active alky
They don't deserve to be a parent, they need to step out of the way before they DAMAGE THEIR CHILDREN FOR LIFE.

Rant over

Blossom717

I forgot to mention, I grew up with an addict father, and my step dad was an addict and a raging alcoholic...among other things. I think the cycle just repeated. My mom is a codie. Now I'm one. It gives me motivation to take steps to leaving, so my sweet, strong dd will stay that way and not repeat my mistakes.

You all give me inspiration to keep that going. Some days its more obvious that I need to leave, some days I think I'm just crazy and over dramatic. Does anyone else feel like this? I just want to keep her smiling, and that's my motivation.

littlesister1

You are NOT crazy, thank you for putting your child first!

mauihope

Yes, I feel crazy and over-dramatic on most days.
It is a viscous cycle but you got to put your child first. That is most important.

peaceofpi

Sometimes the choice isn't quite as simple as "intact family with alcoholic" versus "alcoholic-free family." In my area, the alcoholic gets the right to almost 50 percent time, unsupervised, because state law presumes a child needs both parents. Alcoholic rights trump protection of children.

For me, it was like riding an airplane that's losing pressure. You're supposed to put on your oxygen mask first before helping your child. Divorce and therapy were the very best thing for both me and my son, because I no longer live with screams, quacks, lies, abuse, fear, and everyday anxiety.

The joy and peace in my life has in turn helped my child, who not only has a stable home half the time but also has a happier mama who can better meet his needs.

He doesn't see his father yelling at and mistreating me, and as a result he no longer emulates that behavior toward me. The "Children See, Children Do" video on cynical one's blog here was a powerful reminder of how bad things were. Our relationship now is so much improved and filled with love. My son is doing remarkably well on the whole.

His father still drinks, drives him drunk, and yells. I'm not there to run interference and protect my son - and that eats at me, and I have to give my worry to God, to hold him in the palm of his hand.