First Counseling Appointment Tomorrow
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First Counseling Appointment Tomorrow
My husband and I have our first counseling appointment tomorrow. We have been living separately and communicating only about practical matters (our son, bills, etc.) for two and a half weeks, since I discovered he was secretly drinking. He is in such deep denial that I refuse to talk about his drinking/our relationship outside a counseling setting, and I put the ball in his court to set that up. (We had been seeing a counselor, on and off, because our relationship was suffering as a result of this "mysterious illness" that has turned out to just be his drinking problem.) Eventually, he angrily informed me that he wanted me to come to his next appointment, and my stomach is in knots. Anyone have stories/words of wisdom to share? I don't have a lot of plans or expectations, but I'd sure like to know what this experience was like for others.
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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I think it's very smart of you to set your boundaries to not talk about his drinking problems and the state of your marriage outside of a counselors office.
From my own experience of seeing a marriage T with my stbxah, he was unable to be honest. We went to three different Ts at three different times in my 2.5 year marriage and each time he kept secrets and blamed me for why the marriage was so unhappy. He hid his drinking too, I only discovered it because of his accident. By this point in our marriage, 1.5 years, he was in full blown self destructive mode. I hung in there for another year, but finally got the final "straw" this past December and left him the end of January.
I didn't know much about addicts and their behaviors before I met him, he told me he was in recovery, but I didn't understand what that really meant. After going to Al-Anon, reading lots, and visiting SR, I see I was in way over my head from the very beginning.
I know my stbxah is still drinking, I know he still is in his denial, and I know that is his choices to be there. I also know his choices have no effects on me any longer. His life not mine. My life is calm and drama free, just like it was before I met him.
From my own experience of seeing a marriage T with my stbxah, he was unable to be honest. We went to three different Ts at three different times in my 2.5 year marriage and each time he kept secrets and blamed me for why the marriage was so unhappy. He hid his drinking too, I only discovered it because of his accident. By this point in our marriage, 1.5 years, he was in full blown self destructive mode. I hung in there for another year, but finally got the final "straw" this past December and left him the end of January.
I didn't know much about addicts and their behaviors before I met him, he told me he was in recovery, but I didn't understand what that really meant. After going to Al-Anon, reading lots, and visiting SR, I see I was in way over my head from the very beginning.
I know my stbxah is still drinking, I know he still is in his denial, and I know that is his choices to be there. I also know his choices have no effects on me any longer. His life not mine. My life is calm and drama free, just like it was before I met him.
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I dunno I don't see much reason in going to counseling with someone who is actively drinking. I think there is much information on here about that.
Sitting for an hour listening to denials, and how crazy I am, and how its all my fault sounds like a good way to waste - my- time.
Perhaps put the ball in his court to see the counselor first for awhile before you participate.
Actually after reading your post again and that he "angrily demanded" you come there is no way in HELL I would go. I smell a gaslight.........
Sitting for an hour listening to denials, and how crazy I am, and how its all my fault sounds like a good way to waste - my- time.
Perhaps put the ball in his court to see the counselor first for awhile before you participate.
Actually after reading your post again and that he "angrily demanded" you come there is no way in HELL I would go. I smell a gaslight.........
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He has had one session with this counselor sine The Discovery, and we've seen her jointly in the past. I feel like I have to give him a way to communicate with me, and I am trying to protect myself by making sure an objective third party is in the room. We'll see how it goes...
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psalm--Like redatlanta asks....is counselor aware that he is drinking? What was his motivation to go to this counselor in the first place (alone)---was it to satisfy you and get you back.....or, to prove that he isn't an alcoholic...or, to substitute the counselor in place of AA program.....etc. These are important questions (in my opinion)--but, you don't have to answer them here (unless you want to).
The reason for asking such questions is to point out to you that he might well have an agenda that has little or nothing to do with working on the marriage.
You already know this therapist to some extent. My advice (from experience) to you would be prepared to put ALL of your cards on the table. Be completely honest and tell the unvarnished truth as you know it--to the very best of your ability.
If he is like most drinking alcoholics (or even early recovery)--you can count on him to point a lot of blame and anger toward you; minimize the extent and impact of his drinking; lots of effort to get the counselor to see him as a victim in all of this--and, to paint you as the misguided aggressor. He might try to enlist the counselor to try to get you to come back to the co-habitation. These are all possibilities....at least
It would be of great importance that this person has had experience with addictions--'cause if not--a slick and m anipulative alcoholic can lead them straight down the rabbit hole....
Best of luck to you......just tell your truth....remember that you are not there to please anyone else but yourself. You will live through this....LOL
dandylion
The reason for asking such questions is to point out to you that he might well have an agenda that has little or nothing to do with working on the marriage.
You already know this therapist to some extent. My advice (from experience) to you would be prepared to put ALL of your cards on the table. Be completely honest and tell the unvarnished truth as you know it--to the very best of your ability.
If he is like most drinking alcoholics (or even early recovery)--you can count on him to point a lot of blame and anger toward you; minimize the extent and impact of his drinking; lots of effort to get the counselor to see him as a victim in all of this--and, to paint you as the misguided aggressor. He might try to enlist the counselor to try to get you to come back to the co-habitation. These are all possibilities....at least
It would be of great importance that this person has had experience with addictions--'cause if not--a slick and m anipulative alcoholic can lead them straight down the rabbit hole....
Best of luck to you......just tell your truth....remember that you are not there to please anyone else but yourself. You will live through this....LOL
dandylion
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My AH and I went to counsiling about 2 yrs ago....it was the best our marriage ever was, IMO. It helped alot. We just couldn't afford to keep going at $100/visit...we were going twice a week then once a week. My husband was honest during the sessions and I felt safe to say the things that I needed to say. He's still an A and our marriage isn't good now, but I had a positive experience with counsiling, so good luck.
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Originally Posted by dandylion 
psalm--Like redatlanta asks....is counselor aware that he is drinking? What was his motivation to go to this counselor in the first place (alone)---was it to satisfy you and get you back.....or, to prove that he isn't an alcoholic...or, to substitute the counselor in place of AA program.....etc. These are important questions (in my opinion)--but, you don't have to answer them here (unless you want to).
The reason for asking such questions is to point out to you that he might well have an agenda that has little or nothing to do with working on the marriage.
You already know this therapist to some extent. My advice (from experience) to you would be prepared to put ALL of your cards on the table. Be completely honest and tell the unvarnished truth as you know it--to the very best of your ability.
If he is like most drinking alcoholics (or even early recovery)--you can count on him to point a lot of blame and anger toward you; minimize the extent and impact of his drinking; lots of effort to get the counselor to see him as a victim in all of this--and, to paint you as the misguided aggressor. He might try to enlist the counselor to try to get you to come back to the co-habitation. These are all possibilities....at least
It would be of great importance that this person has had experience with addictions--'cause if not--a slick and m anipulative alcoholic can lead them straight down the rabbit hole....
Best of luck to you......just tell your truth....remember that you are not there to please anyone else but yourself. You will live through this....LOL
dandylion
The reason for asking such questions is to point out to you that he might well have an agenda that has little or nothing to do with working on the marriage.
You already know this therapist to some extent. My advice (from experience) to you would be prepared to put ALL of your cards on the table. Be completely honest and tell the unvarnished truth as you know it--to the very best of your ability.
If he is like most drinking alcoholics (or even early recovery)--you can count on him to point a lot of blame and anger toward you; minimize the extent and impact of his drinking; lots of effort to get the counselor to see him as a victim in all of this--and, to paint you as the misguided aggressor. He might try to enlist the counselor to try to get you to come back to the co-habitation. These are all possibilities....at least
It would be of great importance that this person has had experience with addictions--'cause if not--a slick and m anipulative alcoholic can lead them straight down the rabbit hole....
Best of luck to you......just tell your truth....remember that you are not there to please anyone else but yourself. You will live through this....LOL
dandylion
In reality, I am a very rational person. To keep my head on straight in this emotionally-charged situation, I have written a letter that I can read to him, which chronicles how alcohol has been a progressively more serious issue in our marriage. There was even a time in our marriage when he admitted, in writing, that drinking had become a problem for him. I hope this will help counter his efforts to manipulate the counselor.
I do not know the extent of her experience with addiction, but she is part of a large practice and could pass us along to someone else. Whatever his motivation, I feel there is at least some hope if he keeps showing up. I am doing other things to help myself: Al-Anon, a separate counselor, connecting with others in my life who can support me, and even beginning to explore legal options in terms of our marriage and children.
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Psalm, you are really wise to confine these subjects to a counselor. I too am a bit concerned that the effort might be wasted if he is actively drinking. If you know this counselor, can you call her/him and express your concerns?
Marital counseling was a bust for me in early recovery. This morning I thanked RAH for all of his work around the house. He is trying but we are on different planes emotionally. I think we are 2 days from his one year anniversary sober. I think I am done bugging him about the state of our marriage. Denial is denial is denial. He refuses to do anything about what is wrong with us as a couple - intimacy and communication - and it makes me Codie to keep fighting his denial. Hopefully working my steps will free my of my fears to end this 20 year relationship.
Marital counseling was a bust for me in early recovery. This morning I thanked RAH for all of his work around the house. He is trying but we are on different planes emotionally. I think we are 2 days from his one year anniversary sober. I think I am done bugging him about the state of our marriage. Denial is denial is denial. He refuses to do anything about what is wrong with us as a couple - intimacy and communication - and it makes me Codie to keep fighting his denial. Hopefully working my steps will free my of my fears to end this 20 year relationship.
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I definitely was in a stage of we have to try. I have to try and at each session I would say I was grateful he would show up. There are some counselors who say they will only meet with you if both are sober and others that just let the session happen. I learned the hard way that not having boundaries and going to sessions with someone who was drinking only meant they got to say "I went to counseling - see I don't have the problem you do...." but the reality was the sessions were still a smoke screen....are you in recovery if you show up to sessions, meetings, AA etc? or are you in recovery if you are sober and working the steps? showing up doesn't necessarily mean true commitment to end the selfish behavior.
As long as you go to the session with a bit of understanding and healthy radar up. It is worth your time to keep communications open.
My problem was I thought a few sessions would cure us and in the end things still went downhill.
As long as you go to the session with a bit of understanding and healthy radar up. It is worth your time to keep communications open.
My problem was I thought a few sessions would cure us and in the end things still went downhill.
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I tried counseling with my husband. It was a joke because the counselor was clearly trying to get him to see and admit his problem and he took that as being ganged up on. I had specifically made sure this was a counselor that neither of us knew or had ever been before because I knew that would happen. That is two different counselors that has happened with, it is a lost cause.
We are divorcing and now we are all in counseling, us and the kids, with all separate counselors. I am very thankful that he is seeking counseling on his own although that will not change the fact I want a divorce and he knows that. I still want him to be well as I still care what happens to him and obviously I want him to be well for our children and their relationship.
I think it is great that you refuse to talk to him outside of the counselor. That is a clear boundary you are sticking to and it does not allow him to manipulate you. Anyone who deals with an alcoholic in their lives knows 90% are master manipulators.
Good luck to you and God Bless!
We are divorcing and now we are all in counseling, us and the kids, with all separate counselors. I am very thankful that he is seeking counseling on his own although that will not change the fact I want a divorce and he knows that. I still want him to be well as I still care what happens to him and obviously I want him to be well for our children and their relationship.
I think it is great that you refuse to talk to him outside of the counselor. That is a clear boundary you are sticking to and it does not allow him to manipulate you. Anyone who deals with an alcoholic in their lives knows 90% are master manipulators.
Good luck to you and God Bless!
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The only thing that would concern me apart from what's already been mentioned is that you are coming to see his counselor. Yes, you've seen the T jointly before, but I would be concerned that the T sees it as his/her job to help your husband first and foremost, and that you are there simply to give input so that the T can help the husband.
I would also be concerned that if you see his therapist, that the T can testify against you in court during the divorce proceedings, if you get to that point.
My ex had his T wrapped around his little finger to the point where she, without ever having met me, testified in court that I was mentally unstable and that I had caused significant harm to AXH by cheating during the marriage. Not a syllable she said was true, and after my attorney asked her how many times she had seen me to be able to make that diagnosis, she had to admit she hadn't. Her testimony was thrown out (the judge was none too pleased) and my T reported her to the licensing board. So happy ending there for me -- but if I had actually agreed to see her (as AXH demanded), her testimony would have carried some weight.
Just a thought -- and probably not the reassurance you were looking for.
I would also be concerned that if you see his therapist, that the T can testify against you in court during the divorce proceedings, if you get to that point.
My ex had his T wrapped around his little finger to the point where she, without ever having met me, testified in court that I was mentally unstable and that I had caused significant harm to AXH by cheating during the marriage. Not a syllable she said was true, and after my attorney asked her how many times she had seen me to be able to make that diagnosis, she had to admit she hadn't. Her testimony was thrown out (the judge was none too pleased) and my T reported her to the licensing board. So happy ending there for me -- but if I had actually agreed to see her (as AXH demanded), her testimony would have carried some weight.
Just a thought -- and probably not the reassurance you were looking for.
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Like Hopeful and others on here mentioned, we tried counseling for 8 months last year and it made things worse for me. We would spend 45 minutes listening to him rant and rave about stuff that had nothing to do with any emotional recovery for us. Anytime the counselor talked about the drinking, AH would get defensive. He lied many times to the counselor, he made up exaggerations, he took us all on a ride on the crazy mobile and he was the happy driver.
I had hopes, but despite the failings of marriage counseling, I did get something out of it. I was able to express my fears, specifically state why I don't trust him, and get MY stuff out on the table. It also gave me a chance to open my eyes and ears to just who he really was and to just how much he will have to change for our marriage to even succeed at this point. I used it as a tool to help me really understand the disease of alcoholism and to help me understand my own shortcomings, as well. Best of luck to you. It might not be a successful experience but any time you can learn more about YOU, it can at least be an opportunity!
I had hopes, but despite the failings of marriage counseling, I did get something out of it. I was able to express my fears, specifically state why I don't trust him, and get MY stuff out on the table. It also gave me a chance to open my eyes and ears to just who he really was and to just how much he will have to change for our marriage to even succeed at this point. I used it as a tool to help me really understand the disease of alcoholism and to help me understand my own shortcomings, as well. Best of luck to you. It might not be a successful experience but any time you can learn more about YOU, it can at least be an opportunity!
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Counseling, joint counseling, my ex was the "king" of these. Every time he would "run away" from home, and see or threaten to see a lawyer to divorce me, he would call a therapist to prove to me how much he loved me. 
So the first one ----- he sees her about 6 x's by himself. She now wants to meet me.
So, ok, I say ok. I go there with a tape recorded conversation that I had with him, where I had asked him what he thought was the problem with me. (lol). I play it for her. She tells me that is not the man that comes in to see her.
She then wants to do a joint session with us. I say OK. He was in his "mood" that day, didn't want to go, but I got him to go. I brought a list of 143 things that he had told me about what is wrong with me. I gave the T the list, she read it, gave it to my ex to read it, then she asked him if he agreed with it. He responded he agreed to most of it, except that I am a good cook. She looked at him and said to him, "I don't know why you are wasting your money to see me, when you are doing nothing that I had asked you to do. Then she turned to me and said, "Would you like to continue to see me during your divorce proceedings?" (lol)
Second T, the same thing. He sees this T about 3 x's before asking to see me. Things are going somewhat OK, then my ex opens up his mouth. He tells this T that he gets mad at me if I am upset or hurt. That he doesn't like people being mad at him.
T says to him, isn't that like manipulation, that your wife can't be upset with you because it makes you mad?
T then says to me, while my ex was there, your husband has the emotional IQ of a 5 - 7 yr old, if he works with me, and I mean really works with me, I can raise this up to about a 12 yr old, is this good enough for you?
So, in my case I got a lot of validation from my ex's T's.
My ex refused to go back to either of these T's because he said we ganged up on him, and he didn't know how I turned them away from him, and wrapped them around my finger. I just replied, well, I just told them the truth.
Joint counseling is not recommended. I would strongly recommend separate cars.
So the first one ----- he sees her about 6 x's by himself. She now wants to meet me.
So, ok, I say ok. I go there with a tape recorded conversation that I had with him, where I had asked him what he thought was the problem with me. (lol). I play it for her. She tells me that is not the man that comes in to see her.She then wants to do a joint session with us. I say OK. He was in his "mood" that day, didn't want to go, but I got him to go. I brought a list of 143 things that he had told me about what is wrong with me. I gave the T the list, she read it, gave it to my ex to read it, then she asked him if he agreed with it. He responded he agreed to most of it, except that I am a good cook. She looked at him and said to him, "I don't know why you are wasting your money to see me, when you are doing nothing that I had asked you to do. Then she turned to me and said, "Would you like to continue to see me during your divorce proceedings?" (lol)
Second T, the same thing. He sees this T about 3 x's before asking to see me. Things are going somewhat OK, then my ex opens up his mouth. He tells this T that he gets mad at me if I am upset or hurt. That he doesn't like people being mad at him.
T says to him, isn't that like manipulation, that your wife can't be upset with you because it makes you mad?
T then says to me, while my ex was there, your husband has the emotional IQ of a 5 - 7 yr old, if he works with me, and I mean really works with me, I can raise this up to about a 12 yr old, is this good enough for you?
So, in my case I got a lot of validation from my ex's T's.
My ex refused to go back to either of these T's because he said we ganged up on him, and he didn't know how I turned them away from him, and wrapped them around my finger. I just replied, well, I just told them the truth.
Joint counseling is not recommended. I would strongly recommend separate cars.
Last edited by amy55; 04-15-2014 at 08:54 AM. Reason: editing, because I wasn't finished yet.
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Originally Posted by lillamy
The only thing that would concern me apart from what's already been mentioned is that you are coming to see his counselor. Yes, you've seen the T jointly before, but I would be concerned that the T sees it as his/her job to help your husband first and foremost, and that you are there simply to give input so that the T can help the husband.
I would also be concerned that if you see his therapist, that the T can testify against you in court during the divorce proceedings, if you get to that point.
My ex had his T wrapped around his little finger to the point where she, without ever having met me, testified in court that I was mentally unstable and that I had caused significant harm to AXH by cheating during the marriage. Not a syllable she said was true, and after my attorney asked her how many times she had seen me to be able to make that diagnosis, she had to admit she hadn't. Her testimony was thrown out (the judge was none too pleased) and my T reported her to the licensing board. So happy ending there for me -- but if I had actually agreed to see her (as AXH demanded), her testimony would have carried some weight.
Just a thought -- and probably not the reassurance you were looking for.
I would also be concerned that if you see his therapist, that the T can testify against you in court during the divorce proceedings, if you get to that point.
My ex had his T wrapped around his little finger to the point where she, without ever having met me, testified in court that I was mentally unstable and that I had caused significant harm to AXH by cheating during the marriage. Not a syllable she said was true, and after my attorney asked her how many times she had seen me to be able to make that diagnosis, she had to admit she hadn't. Her testimony was thrown out (the judge was none too pleased) and my T reported her to the licensing board. So happy ending there for me -- but if I had actually agreed to see her (as AXH demanded), her testimony would have carried some weight.
Just a thought -- and probably not the reassurance you were looking for.
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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Originally Posted by amy55
Counseling, joint counseling, my ex was the "king" of these. Every time he would "run away" from home, and see or threaten to see a lawyer to divorce me, he would call a therapist to prove to me how much he loved me.
So the first one ----- he sees her about 6 x's by himself. She now wants to meet me. So, ok, I say ok. I go there with a tape recorded conversation that I had with him, where I had asked him what he thought was the problem with me. (lol). I play it for her. She tells me that is not the man that comes in to see her.
She then wants to do a joint session with us. I say OK. He was in his "mood" that day, didn't want to go, but I got him to go. I brought a list of 143 things that he had told me about what is wrong with me. I gave the T the list, she read it, gave it to my ex to read it, then she asked him if he agreed with it. He responded he agreed to most of it, except that I am a good cook. She looked at him and said to him, "I don't know why you are wasting your money to see me, when you are doing nothing that I had asked you to do. Then she turned to me and said, "Would you like to continue to see me during your divorce proceedings?" (lol)
Second T, the same thing. He sees this T about 3 x's before asking to see me. Things are going somewhat OK, then my ex opens up his mouth. He tells this T that he gets mad at me if I am upset or hurt. That he doesn't like people being mad at him.
T says to him, isn't that like manipulation, that your wife can't be upset with you because it makes you mad?
T then says to me, while my ex was there, your husband has the emotional IQ of a 5 - 7 yr old, if he works with me, and I mean really works with me, I can raise this up to about a 12 yr old, is this good enough for you?
So, in my case I got a lot of validation from my ex's T's.
My ex refused to go back to either of these T's because he said we ganged up on him, and he didn't know how I turned them away from him, and wrapped them around my finger. I just replied, well, I just told them the truth.
Joint counseling is not recommended. I would strongly recommend separate cars.
So the first one ----- he sees her about 6 x's by himself. She now wants to meet me.
So, ok, I say ok. I go there with a tape recorded conversation that I had with him, where I had asked him what he thought was the problem with me. (lol). I play it for her. She tells me that is not the man that comes in to see her.She then wants to do a joint session with us. I say OK. He was in his "mood" that day, didn't want to go, but I got him to go. I brought a list of 143 things that he had told me about what is wrong with me. I gave the T the list, she read it, gave it to my ex to read it, then she asked him if he agreed with it. He responded he agreed to most of it, except that I am a good cook. She looked at him and said to him, "I don't know why you are wasting your money to see me, when you are doing nothing that I had asked you to do. Then she turned to me and said, "Would you like to continue to see me during your divorce proceedings?" (lol)
Second T, the same thing. He sees this T about 3 x's before asking to see me. Things are going somewhat OK, then my ex opens up his mouth. He tells this T that he gets mad at me if I am upset or hurt. That he doesn't like people being mad at him.
T says to him, isn't that like manipulation, that your wife can't be upset with you because it makes you mad?
T then says to me, while my ex was there, your husband has the emotional IQ of a 5 - 7 yr old, if he works with me, and I mean really works with me, I can raise this up to about a 12 yr old, is this good enough for you?
So, in my case I got a lot of validation from my ex's T's.
My ex refused to go back to either of these T's because he said we ganged up on him, and he didn't know how I turned them away from him, and wrapped them around my finger. I just replied, well, I just told them the truth.
Joint counseling is not recommended. I would strongly recommend separate cars.
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LOL Amy...I second the separate cars! At the last session my XAH and I had he would not get into the car with me and had his codependent, enabling sister come and get him and take him home. I had forgotten that! The counselor came out to make sure I was ok and had a way to get home safely, he did not say a word to my XAH.
Good times...Good times. Ha....
Good times...Good times. Ha....
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