Am I overreacting?
 

I can almost feel this question being answered internally as I "Swype."

So, I have set the NC boundary with XA/child's father in September. I drop my son off to all his visits which are "supervised" by X's family members. I have repeatedly told him in the last few weeks not to come outside if I'm out there and not to come into the room if I'm in it. I find myself hiding behind the car or hiding behind my son while holding him, because X repeatedly disregards my request. I don't want to see X's face. I don't want him to see me at all. I'll say things like, "Why are you out here? I told you NC."

I think the obvious solution is to have someone else liaison to drop DS off, but I don't know who wants to do this for me at 9am on Sunday. I've had friends suggest this solution, but I'm still afraid to ask them. They all say ,"Couldn't 'Someone'..." Am I making excuses? I guess I can't know who will do this unless I ask.

I think that X and his family think I'm being a big baby about wanting NC and I've been afraid to get too vocal about it in front of my son. I don't want him to witness drama. We know how rational X is. I'm starting to not care what his family thinks of me. I still wonder if this something I need (NC). No, it is. I guess I just kind of feel like this is my cross to bear for choosing to have a baby with this clown.

And the mindeffery isn't limited to this. I've seen him stand at the window and watch us drive away (he can't see DS, because the back windows are tinted and DS is on the other side of the van). X has texted me, "You're still you, " and, "I love the two of you." I'm trying to detach, but I just feel confused. I'm pretty sure he's screwing anything under the Sun and Moon these days and I wonder if he just throws these me these sentimental crumbs to keep me hooked and have power over me. I think he's getting near me just to mess with my head and I don't understand why he still feels the need to do that. If you don't know, HE left me and then moved back into "our" house.

I try to "act as if" he has no power over me. I try not to "react" to him. I avoid responding at all, but obviously this affects me or I wouldn't be posting about it.

Thanks for listening to me process this.

I think you answered your own question:

He's doing what he's doing because neither one of you are handing this situation in an adult way. And certainly not putting your childs emotional well being first. Sorry to be so BLUNT!!

YOU have to find a way to deal with the exchange better. You have shown him what buttons he can push to get a reaction out of you and he's going to keep on pushing them for as long as he gets a reaction.

And it is NOT someone else's responsibility to bring your child for his visits with the father that is up to you.

Unless there is a court ordered restraining order where he cannot be within 100 yards of you then you must figure out a healthy way to address this issue when exchanging your child for their visits.

You can "act" like he has no power over you but the truth is he has allot more power over you then you can believe.

How about you stop expecting him to change and second guessing whether he wants you back or not. How about you accept this relaitonship is no good for you and there is no gong back for you because you know you deserve far better. How about you put your feelings aside as least for the few moments of the exchange - for the best interest of your child.

The only person's behavior you can control is your own. When I ask my husband to do or not do something, I'm setting an expectation of that. I feel let down or frustrated when he does something else, especially when he agreed to it. That 'expectation' is why I get upset. Why would I expect him to act like a normal person when he has all this craziness going on inside his brain? Because I tend to forget I'm not dealing with a normal, sane person. PAWS is going to be keeping that at bay for quite some time, and for anyone still using it's not going to be there at all.

He's getting the reaction he wants and being rewarded with you breaking the NC rule also. Think about what you want to happen and how you can follow up with a solid consequence that you are able to do. (((hugs))) I understand. No easy answers there, except to keep working your program. Have you read the stickies on abuse and any books on emotional abuse?

Can you block his number? If it's supposed to be NC, that would include texts. You can't stop him from typing them, but can you block them? Same for his emails and phone calls. If there was an emergency regarding your son, someone else can still contact you.

Having someone else drop off your son is a great idea, IMO. This is where reaching out for help comes into play. It's not easy at all, but can be very therapeutic. When I've had to sit down and figure out who to call, and that number is busy or I get a voice mail, and the next person can't help and then a bunch of people down the line... and then I have to brainstorm what else to do -- who else to call... and eventually I'll get it figured out and feel so good about having done that. It doesn't matter all the people who couldn't help, it's great that I found people to call and I did that!

If having a full break from seeing him is what you need, you have every right to that. Could the person supervising the visit pick your son up at your place and bring him back? If they aren't trustworthy enough or willing to do so, maybe line up friends to do this for the next month. If you have a calendar to fill when you call, maybe that'd make it easier for some of them to fit it into their schedule.

Baby steps are fine. It's not that you won't ever be dropping your son off, it's that right now you need some breathing room to take care of you. If seeing him each week is messing that up, you have every right to brainstorm other ways to handle it. The biggest part of empowering myself has been seeing that I have options, whether I like them or not, or even if I don't choose a different one than I'm currently doing. KNOWING I have options is very important to me.

LightInside, now you know you can't control his behaviour, and if you can't find someone to drop your son off, I think the situation could be handled by you not engaging in conversation and not making eye contact. That makes it very boring and unproductive for your XBF to keep trying.
If he tries to get you to engage you could repeat a simple phrase like 'I don't intend to talk to you'. I that's all he gets, he'll stop trying.
Can I assume you have a method for communicating on a practical level to make arrangements for your son? Because your X might need to do that occasionally.

Sending hugs, LI. I think it's perfectly acceptable to ask some one to help you with drop-offs and pick-ups. It doesn't have to be a forever-task; it can be a next-couple-visits task. Maybe after a few assists you'll be feeling strong enough to brush off his failure to back off. If you don't feel like asking them to do the entire 'transfer', maybe asking a friend to go with you, walk your kiddo to/from the door, and enjoy a cup of coffee or tea with you after?

FeelingGreat's suggestion on dealing with seeing him by not making eye contact, not engaging so he can't feel like he's getting a rise from you is great. Maybe dark sunglasses, too?

My situation may be a bit different, but family helped me with transferring DS to AXH when he still had visitation. If they weren't available, friends would head over to help act as a buffer, if I asked, and then we'd hang out. (I'm quite certain my favorite coffee place got tired of seeing me walk in all teary-eyed and anxious.)

Your husband is one of those "poking the bear" kind of people. I am pretty sure he is doing what he is doing to annoy you and its working.

NC is a request so he doesn't have to do it - I most likely would not block his phone when he had my child.

Perhaps having someone drop your son off will work for a while but its not a long term solution. At some point you will have to resume these drop offs.

I learned from a Master Ignorer that the best thing you can do IS ignore. No reaction whatsoever. No response whatsoever. You can't control him but you can control you. Maybe looking it from there perspective of why he is crossing your boundary will help you with this. He's a jerk and only doing what jerks do which is expand their jerkishness to higher levels. He is feeding off your reactions - I would try not to give him any more fuel. When people stop getting reactions its not fun to poke the bear.

Tough situation for sure. Sorry you are going through this.

I agree that he is poking the bear. You told a non - rational person what you need from their behavior, and he is not capable of rational behavior.

No Contact is something I did for myself. I wasn't trying to punish my alcoholic, I was trying to get him out of my head so I could think and feel for myself. I didn't expect my alcoholic to understand or to do the same.

I did keep our conversations to business only conversations. That was hard for me as I was accustomed to picking up the phone and sharing my day with him for 14 years. No contact helped me keep my focus on me during the early part of separation. Eventually, it was easier for me to see him and speak with him.

It's difficult to do but you have our support.

In my opinion I would still do the drop off, just don't speak to him at all. And if he watches you drive away, let him. There are some things you have to let go. One thing is that you have a child together. At some point you will have to see him, you may as well get usto it. I am not being harsh and totally understanding wanting to not speak to or see him, but when you have a child I just don't think it is possible when said child is in their lives.

As far as his quackery, see it for what it is and move on. Eventually if you don't answer or speak to him he will get the hint. Be strong, you can do this.

XXX

My husband, from whom I am currently living apart, is in deep denial and tries to manipulate his way back into a relationship. We don't have "no contact" but we have very little contact. I shut down any conversation that dips into dangerous territory (really, anything outside our son and the household budget) and will only discuss our relationship in a counseling setting. If you can, maybe you can work on putting up an emotional wall of sorts. Drop off your son and turn away without looking back. Ignore his texts if it's not productive to respond. (I still respond to the nightly "I love you" texts, because I do still love him even if we can't have a relationship right now...I believe he will eventually come to terms with his addiction and I want him to feel that I will support him in recovery. It's early days for us.) Focus on the things that make you happy...those with experience tell me that I have to let go of giving him power over me, for good or bad.

Good luck!

Active alcoholics try to hang on to their enablers (codependents) because these people make drinking easier. He is very manipulative, don't even entertain the idea of honest emotions. You seem pretty focused on him but it's time to face and deal with codependency. Have you gone to Alanon? It can be a lifesaver.

Thank you all for your opinions. In my emotional state, I was all convoluted and lost track of the condition I was unsure I was overreacting to. I was really wondering if I'm overreacting just to want NC. I think NO at this point, and really it's a question that I know no one else can answer for me.

Just to be clear, no one ever said anything about getting back together. Though I miss the person my X was, that person is gone now. The conditions I'd have for getting back together with the creature who lives in his shell are so far of the map that I'd be way better off starting new with a healthy partner and I already know that.

I'm here to talk about my pain. I'm here for validation. I'm here for ES&H. I appreciate the validation, support, and ES&H I've received here.

It is definitely not anyone's responsibility to be a liaison for me and my child. It is also not anyone's responsibility to log on to SR and give support, but many people do it if they feel so inclined.

I talked with my therapist about this situation and she pointed out that I need to do what helps me emotionally so that I can be a better parent (Somehow I already knew this. It's that whole oxygen mask analogy). She also pointed out the ways that I am being a responsible adult and protecting my child's well-being. Yes, I pay her to "tell me the things I want to hear," but believe me when I say she tells me stuff I don't want to hear as well.

Though I would be doing total NC if we didn't have a child together, texting and email are my compromise. I think it's important to have this form of communication to work out all the details, but it's also a way that X can throw in the lovely little "extras." I already do no eye contact when X comes outside. I don't go in the house anymore now that my stuff is all out. When I'm hiding, it's not like I'm crouching down dodging bullets or anything. Maybe my son senses the awkwardness, but I communicate with him during these times as if Dad just isn't even there. I encourage him to say goodbye to his dad (His dad doesn't always do this on his own). I ask him if he had a good time. To my son, I do my very best to act as if all is well. In other words, I set aside my own emotions for the time of the exchange.

I get that NC is a boundary and boundaries are something that I an responsible for keeping. I just haven't found a way to do this and be a responsible parent at the same time. I haven't figured out fair consequences for when he steps across the line I drew. I like the suggestion of saying, "I don't intend to talk to you."

Thank you!

((((LightInside))))

I'm still learning what triggers me --one I've found here is dealing with people that I want emotional protection from. Looking back, my total NC comments were a knee jerk reaction to wanting to protect you. For some people, full NC seems to be helpful. With children, whatever works best for your comfort levels. :)

I'm creating a protective bubble around me and that is where I'm having a hard time reaching out to people. When I have, it's been very therapeutic. Mixing 'needing to feel safe' and 'learning to reach' out feels counter-intuitive to me. It's so much easier for me to pull back. I'm sorry for putting it so cut and dry as the tone I meant to type it in was much different.

Now that I can breath again, I finally understand the oxygen mask analogy! It sounds like you have a wonderful therapist. :)

Keepingthefaith,

Thank you. I didn't feel like your response was too cut and dry. It is true that sometimes we need to hear a truth that maybe we're overlooking. I don't feel like you specifically were too harsh with me. I thank you for wanting to protect me. That makes me feel safe and worthy.

I am doing a lot better the last few days. Part of why I was hurting so bad the day I posted was that I had gotten together with a mutual friend of my X. She told me some stuff that was hard to hear. I got together with her so that I could tell her I'll be putting a Facebook PM between her and me into my court evidence because she admitted to something my X was involved in that endangered our child. It was just a dramatic thing. I'm still trying to wrap my brain around this: This mean man is in the same body as the man who treated me better than any other boyfriend/partner ever has.

Also, it seems like other people in my life have time limits for my grief and realizations. It's hard for me to not feel like I'm just totally screwed up for being slow with this process. I'm balancing my own reaching out for support and wisdom with the new skill of "leaving the rest" and learning who I can really trust to allow me to be where I am right now.

I'm a person who has been believing what others think of me, taking that as fact for so long. Now, when I hear something about my actions that doesn't feel good, it takes me a lot of thought, prayer, and talking with others to figure out what I really believe. Am I really acting "wrong" or "bad" or am I doing my absolute best?

how do you know he is watching you as you drive away? are you looking back to see if he was looking back at you? I get it....old habits can change.

I was glancing to the side (and rubbing my nose, so it's not like I was trying to look cute or anything). After that I started taking the long way so that I wouldn't leave or approach the house from the window side. That doesn't really matter anyway, as I know that I an trying to protect my heart and I am not manipulating my X. Breaking NC for the sake of my son, yes, but not manipulating.

You're right about old habits dying hard though. That's why I want NC in the first place. That was or house, our yard, our flowers. There's an exercise ball in the yard. I used it during my labor, X used it to bounce baby to sleep, then baby used it for a toy. Why wouldn't I have a hard time not looking at that stuff when I drive away, or feeling sad when I see it? That was my life, my space. Why wouldn't my grief be triggered?

Light, I don't think going NC is over-reacting. It was necessary with AXH. And it was necessary with one of the guys I'd gone on a date with a while after the divorce, and he wasn't an A. Whatever you feel you need to be able to get through this period of breaking-up and sorting out the co-parenting thing is what you need.

The one thing I had a hard time letting go of was the expectation that AXH would finally get it and be reasonable... about anything. I could ask him to only text or email and only about DS and the court could tell AXH that was the mode of operation, but it didnt mean AXH would actually behave as asked or directed. I could tell him and the court that him standing in my doorway, hands on both sides of the frame, and shifting to either side as I tried to get out to chase my cat, who ran out because AXH forced the door open at pick up, left me panicked and afraid. He could then, all sweet and wide-eyed profess he didn't know, and promise to stand away from the door after knocking. I continued to expect him to do what he said he'd do. And I continued to be disappointed. Scared. Angry.

Until. Until it sunk in that he was going to keep doing these things and I made changes. I stopped picking up the phone. I asked my sister to review emails and texts and weed out the crap until I felt strong enough to do so. My family or friend would answer the door and I'd say good bye to DS in the entry-way rather than doorway. (I shut my cat in my room until they left so he couldn't make a mad-dash for the door if/when AXH held it open.) They'd walk to his door for, and later with, me to shoo DS to the car.

Despite all evidence to the contrary, it took a while to let those expectations go. If we couldn't be the married couple or family I'd wanted, I hoped we'd be the divorced couple that could co-parent our child; be civil standing on the sidelines of DS's games together; discuss DS's appointments and what we needed to do... Even that wierdly-adjusted dream was hard to let go.

But I got there. And you'll be get there, too. Just be patient with yourself. Remember to let go of expecting him to behave. (((hugs)))

Thank you. I do get all excited and surprised still when he is not logical. It's weird because I feel like I start expecting the worst from him, but that's not what I get either. I guess I'd benefit by getting to the open minded place of expecting nothing in particular, or anything on Earth. I pray for that almost every day. It's a prayer my sponsor gave me that I can insert any issue or concern into.

it took me a very long time to figure out the simplest of issues. it was difficult to wake up from the addictive marriage coma and function at full capacity.

I still stumble. however, now I stumble on pebbles instead of falling down mountains.

Hi Lightinside, I do admire your parenting when it comes to your son's relationship with the X.
I think it's very beneficial to children to have a workable arrangement with X partners because children do get very anxious if they perceive conflict. Also flawed as it may be, boys benefit from a good relationship with their fathers, if that's possible taking the addictions into account.
Sometimes pure NC just isn't possible so it's great you're working on a compromise you can live with.