HikerLady

You do see that you are allowing her to walk all over you, right? The act your age not your shoe size comment could be applied to you as well in terms of your secretly reconnecting with an old GF...come on that's the way teenagers act when they don't give a shite about integrity and facing responsibilities in the adult world. You are committed to your AW up and until you legally separate. Do yourself a favor (and the other woman) and pull your big boy panties up and act like the man you are. It's totally unfair for your wife to act like the alcoholic she is, but it doesn't mean you have to act ridiculous too. If you want more and need more than your wife is offering up, do it the right way and stop adopting your wife's insanity into your ability to think rationally. I don't know, I just feel bad for this other woman in it all..it just feels icky, like you are hoping for her to give you what you want so badly, attention, maybe love, but what you are doing is sucking her into the mess of your current life...so not fair, and probably the last thing you really want to do but just aren't thinking clearly right now. Bet of luck to you Snood, I hope you find the way that really works for you and a sense of peace and true happiness in this life.

Sungrl

It is frustrating reading your posts Snood. I get what you are going through. Been there done that. If you are going to stay in this situation at least detach and salvage a little pride and dignity. You are worth that. Stop driving her and her daughter around to these outrageous outings and let it go. She has absolutely no respect for you. She cares about drinking and socializing and that is it. Unmesh yourself. It will do wonders for you and you can move on with a clear head. I also agree please leave the other women out of it. She does not deserve being brought into the game you and your wifey continue to play. Look on the bright side if you do hook up in the future, maybe she won't throw things at you.

Snood

, roasted!

Did I make a subverted comment about leaving SR? Or was something lost in translation?

This evening's Al-Anon meeting was a good one - the theme was step 4, the moral inventory one. I can't help thinking step 4 is happening without my conscious volition. It feels that way. I've had the complaint that, "As my other half, you're getting it wrong." Wifey no longer feels like my OH.

'Nice' is too feeble a word...my various friends are affable, agreeable, personable. Wifey's a loaded gun.

I like a quiet life. So, it could be worse than to travel 14 miles after rifle shooting, to pick up the pair of them. of course wifey will be hammered, and will become more so later. So what's new?

Finally, please don't misinterpret my motives about my former GF. She's about to turn 57, in her second marriage, with two boys at university. We have fond memories of two years in the mid '70s. What's wrong with reminiscing. We both know you can't go back but friends are valuable - especially ones that don't throw things!

Hawkeye13

"A quiet life" can be very expensive. . .

It can cost you your peace, your money, your last chance at real companionship, and leave you with a demented bully abusing you from inside her bottle.

Like I said, it's all downhill from here and a lot quicker than you might think.

Good on you for attending Al-Anon, by the way.

You asked what I shoot and how far a few posts ago--don't have too many details but
I shoot an inexpensive rifle and a Mossman shotgun (slugs) at about 30 yards for a bit of fun.

Gun clubs are very expensive where I live so I just do it at home with my husband.
We have a farm so totally legal

SeriousKarma

Hi Snood,

Life married to an alcoholic is hell, I know, but I've just got to ask you:

Do you hate your wife?

I'm kind of getting a "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf" vibe from your responses, and I'm not quite sure what to make of that.

If you still love her deeply, and are simply just torn apart by her addiction, join the crowd. I'm sure nobody here would ever think less of someone just because they "tried too hard" to keep their marriage together. I would suggest, however, that if you want her to be respectful of you, you should treat her with respect as well, even when she isn't around. The way you talk about her in this post, and certainly the little fantasy about the ex, isn't quite respectful, is it?

But if you hate her, then for God's sake leave her.

Snood

Hi SeriousKarma,

Do you hate your wife?

I don't hate my wife. I used to adore her; now I love her, not as deeply as before.

I think the things I say, on here, at Al-Anon and to my counsellor are a product of years of my thoughts, feelings and feelings being 'edited'. I've considered this as living under terms and conditions for a long time now.

A simple question is the key...where else can the frustration, disappointment, anger and fear find an outlet?

Bottom line...I'm trying very hard.

wanttobehealthy

I agree 100% with SeriousKarma that there is a definite Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf thing going on here...

You feel like you're living under terms and conditions, are unhappy, are reaching out to other women on line but still love her and choose to stay married?

I recognized only AFTER I got out of my unhealthy marriage, that I was in many ways JUST as sick as my AH as a result of living with active alcoholism and trying to control the chaos... It's impossible to do....

Maybe you deserve a break from it...

MissFixit

Hi Snood,

I always thought you really disliked your wife by what you wrote. I thought you stayed married b/c of money as you once wrote something about the financial aspect being limited if you split. Relationships are complex, but she takes advantage of you A LOT and she says horrible things to you A LOT.

Of course you can complain here, but why do you stay in something long term that you need to complain about? At a certain point (once we realize we are in a relationship that upsets us) you leave the toxic relationship if you want to be well and happy.

SeriousKarma

I hear you Snood. Thanks for answering.

It's just my opinion, but I feel that healing comes faster if we honor that love (even if it's gone), respect the addict as a person, and try not to get caught up in their drama. "Loving Detachment" and all that.

It's worked for me.

It sounds like you really value having a place and a way to vent. I know it can be so frustrating when the person you want to communicate with can't or won't listen. Like banging you're head against a wall. But, just like banging your head against a wall would leave you with a nasty bump, venting can be a bit dangerous too. Sometimes we say things we didn't mean to say. Or sometimes we say things we didn't know we meant. Either way, It's never a bad idea to go over what we wrote a day or two later to see if anything jumps out that we can learn from.

Thanks again for answering. I'm glad you don't hate her. You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.

CodeJob

Working on the steps, counseling, and a bit of Al Anon has indeed caused me to realize I have a template relationship that I keep repeating to my own detriment. I am not sure how to fix it, but hopefully Mr. T was not sleeping through class and will have the therapeutic skills to get me more alert and watchful to this imprinted preference for relating to partners.

What that means to my current relationship? Well, I keep rethinking it and keep coming up at the same choice in the road. I hate being right. I hate being intuitive. I hate logically thinking something through and coming up with an answer that is painful but is the same answer with every rethinking. I hate the fact I will be attracted to another emotionally withdrawn partner, so I look at the one I have and try to see if I can work on me enough for acceptance, forgiveness of self and in the relationship, and break that template preference in my current relationship.

MissFixit

Snood,

I agree with what Codejob wrote. I have/had a template of a dysfunctional partner that I was attracted to. Never even realized that about myself until after the second failed relationship. The first one could have because of him. The second one could also have failed because of him, but I am the common denominator in both relationships. Now, I am not that awful of a person, so what is going on here? I tried my best at each relationship and still wasn't getting what I ultimately wanted. What gives? That is when I went back into therapy and took 2 years off from relationships to get back to me and figure myself out. What I was doing before sure wasn't working, so maybe I needed to try something different. That time allowed me to reflect on myself and how the hell I got into two destructive relationships...both men are awesome guys to have dinner with or go to a party with, neither one makes a good partner/boyfriend/husband.

Is this a second wife? The reason I ask is that I have heard of men (I guess women could too, but the examples I have heard of are about men) who stay in second marriages that are very toxic because they have trouble admitting their marriage failed a second time. The first divorce is easily to blame on the first wife, but the second one isn't as easy/feasible/realistic/probable to blame on the second wife, you have to take responsibility for the demise too. I don't know if you fit into that category, but if you do, that reaction/denial and refusal to accept blame is a real thing that happens to many people (men people).

Snood

Thanks again, people. More news in a while...I came home to find my wife's younger brother has a resurgence of cancer. Support being given, of course...she's hugely upset.

ladyscribbler

Hey Snood. Of course you're being supportive of your wife during this difficult time, but don't let her use it as an excuse to mistreat you. She drank before you got this news, and she will drink after. My ex used any excuse like that as a reason to drink himself stupid.

I am not sure how to fix it, but hopefully Mr. T was not sleeping through class and will have the therapeutic skills to get me more alert and watchful to this imprinted preference for relating to partners.

Ok, sorry this is so off topic, but LOL Codejob. I just had this image of Mr. T. sitting across from me in my therapist's office yelling "I pity the fool who don't detach from their alcoholic with love! And stay in school!"

BoxinRotz

Sometimes it's cheaper to keep'er huh Snood?

Snood

Now the plot has thickened somewhat I'll have to go in for biding my time.

I turns out that wifey's brother's outcome is liable to go one of two ways, depending on the results of a biopsy.

Way 1 = benign, which suggests a medium-sized operation to remove the mass.

Way 2 = malignant, which would mean a major operation (Whipple procedure).

In event 1, the prognosis is fair, in event 2, it's poor (20% chance of living 5 years longer.)

I'm sure you'll all agree that my saying, "...by the way, you're leaving." would be the act of the biggest b**t**d in the Western Hemisphere. Certainly, It isn't something I'll be doing soon.

So, I'll support, even though the drinking remains the same, as it has tonight, though there has been no abuse.

Luck required all round, methinks.

MissFixit

It depends. How long you been married?
What has she done for you in times of need?
How close are you or she to the brother?

Snood

Ten years

She helped me through the particularly harrowing circumstances of my mother's illness and death.

She's very close to Andrew. To me he was and is 'little brother'. Pleasant chap about 8 years younger than me.

CodeJob

Snood, do they suspect pancreatic cancer? I will keep your Andrew in my thoughts. Peace.

Snood

Thank you.

He had testicular cancer three years ago, and a successful resection op, plus chemotherapy (he swore he'd never have it again).

The possibility of a Whipple's procedure suggests pancreatic cancer is likely to be present...

'A pancreatic head resection entails removal of the head of the pancreas, the duodenum (the first piece of the small intestine), part of the bile duct (the pipe which drains bile from the liver into the bowel), the surrounding lymph nodes, the gallbladder, and sometimes part of the stomach.'

The docs have mentioned a 4-inch mass in (or by) the duodenum. Apparently, monthly blood tests didn't indicate it until recently, after it had been felt as a physical entity by Andrew and his wife.

We await news.

Stung

Maybe I'm an a-hole (most likely I am), but I think these questions are like living in a tit for tat world.

None of that changes the fact that she is still an active alcoholic, it also doesn't change the way that she does treat you. You having respect for yourself and your happiness doesn't change because her brother is ill. Does your marriage or even your living with your AW somehow benefit your brother in law?

Whether you stay and accept things as they are or whether you go and live life on your terms (or heck, whether you stay there and stay miserable) is completely and entirely 100% up to you, but her brother's illness doesn't make any of your decisions about YOUR happiness wrong or malicious. If you're unhappy with your situation and want to do something different with your life, you can do something different at any time. If you're looking for a good excuse to stay you'll always be able to find one.