suki44883

JustAGirl responded to this quite well a couple of posts up.

choublak

I don't know.

FireSprite

They aren't asking for the RIGHT in this situation (IMO), they are asking for PERMISSION which is entirely different & speaks to the dynamic between them inside of their relationship, not to any basic human rights.

Have you ever hear of an alcoholic asking their partner for permission to drink unless the drinking is already a known issue in their relationship? I think without the difference of opinion on this topic, they just drink without discussion. (as is their right )

LifeRecovery

Sometimes the simplest things are not the easiest things.

For me what you wrote is the most important learning I have had in this journey of recovery.....

I don't have the right to another's self determination. I do get to own my own.

My life has been so much lighter, more joyous and free since this got into my head, heart and body.

One of the ways that I know I struggled prior to my relationship with my loved one that got me here is that I did this with alcohol, with behavior, with many other things in other people's lives.

Thanks for this reminder.

lillamy

And along those same lines -- your qualifier's feelings are not yours.
They have a perfect right to be upset when you choose to do things they don't like.
And you have a perfect right to let them be upset.

Mellybug

I love that - "Not my monkey, not my circus" line!

I'm very partial to monkeys as it was one of my nicknames as a kid...and the simplicity and humor helps me to remember it.

THANK YOU

Missus

Thank you for this thread

theuncertainty

Choublak, no one has the right to try to change you. (((hugs))) You're not a flat tire or a burnt out light bulb. If you're not OK with some one's drinking, you don't have to be just because they want you to be.

And some one asking you if it's OK to drink isn't so much asking for permission, as it is looking for an excuse.

choublak

In relationships, it's not a thing of "ALLOWING", both persons are adults and shouldn't be asking PERMISSION, it's more CONSIDERATION for your partner and if something you do will bother them, or would you like it done to you.

choublak

They have the right to try, not the right to succeed.

Hawkeye13

I've been on both sides of this coin and even on its edge.

I grew up with an alcoholic mother--no choice nor control but had to live with consequences.

I became an alcoholic, inflicted it on my spouse until we both had enough. I quit,
but no way was he going to "make me" do anything until I was good and ready for myself.

Now he drinks too much and I realize I can't "make him" either. I can say no and divorce, or deal with it with my limits. He has the same freedom I did.

Can't say I like it. In fact, I don't like it one dam bit, but fair is fair.

LightInside

For me, this is tricky when it comes to children and parenting. My X has the right to drink and be unsafe, but my child has the right to be safe and loved. It just all falls on me to make sure that he is safe and loved (He us loved by his dad). My X's consequence is limited time with his child and never alone. I lose sight of this all of the time. I feel like by preventing X from being alone with the child and by my getting the courts to protect my child, I am trying to change the drinker. I have to constantly remind myself of my actual goal. It is ALL ABOUT the kid. It's about me choosing to be responsible for my child's safety. It is NOTHING to do with changing the alcoholic. And yet, there are all these requirements he has to meet in order to see the kid alone eventually. I lose track...

Okay, so when I was making the decision of whether to pursue this legally, my sponsor said, " You can do the same action for the right reasons or the wrong reasons."

I need frequent reminders of my reasons. Child, not man. Child, not man. Child, not man.

wolfpackfan45

Yep. My recovering alcoholic son has the right to drink. He's told me "Mom, I can go out to a party or bar near my college and drink anytime I want". And he's right. I can't control it. But as I told him, I also have the right to quit paying for his college tuition and housing as a consequence. There are consequences for our actions.

Hopeworks

Accepting this truth was the key to my self imposed prison.

Our choices determine our destiny... And learning to stay in my hula hoop and set boundaries gave me the wings to fly.

Ironically or miraculously he scraped himself out of the gutter two years later and is 7 months sober. Got offered a job at 130 k a year and asked me to come spend it. I still love him but I am happy in my single hula hoop for awhile as life is uncertain...especially with a's!

Pia

Although I despised what you said. You are right.

Let me explain it to the credit card company and mortgage company. lol

Lyssy

LOL. I would always reply "whatever" or "you are an adult and can make your own decisions" or "I really don't care" I never really thought about my response. It doesn't matter if they ask or what our responses are. THEY WILL DRINK.

Trailsky

I once learned 5 responses for your A in a workshop

Wow
Really?
Yes
No
Whatever

AH: I am going to have a few drinks tonight
Me: Really?
AH: yes is that ok?
Me: Whatever


Sometimes these simple words work like a charm. Sometimes they don't lol

ResignedToWait

I am going to politely disagree with the wording of this thread…and say that your A in many cases does NOT have the right to drink. I can think of far more places that an A is not legally allowed to drink, than they are.

In many states, it is illegal to drink alcohol in a public place. A private business or their own home are the only places they can legally drink alcohol. In many cases, a court has ordered an A to remain sober and abstain from drinking…in those cases, it is illegal for the A to drink anywhere.

Of course, the original intent of this thread was to show that we can’t control the A’s drinking…I understand that. The A can drink, even if it’s illegal, and they have a “right” to do so. Semantically speaking, however, they don’t have a “right” in those cases. A right is something that is legally recognized as a thing that cannot be withheld from an individual. Alcohol does not fall into that category…it CAN be legally withheld from an individual.

Do you have the right to break into your neighbor’s house and take whatever you want? Do you have the right to murder someone if they make you angry? No, of course not.
Can you do those things if you want to? Of course you can.

An alcoholic does not have the right to drink. They do, or they don’t, but it’s not a right.

CAPTAINZING2000

Thought provoking post. I'm on both sides of the fence . Recovering alcoholic and father of an alcoholic.

My political science teacher summed it up best, I have the right to swing my arms, I don't have the right to swing my arms and hit someone.
When, I drank my behavior caused pain and suffering to those around me. That isn't a right I have to cause pain to others.

Lyssy

True, but the person you are causing pain doesn't have to stick around to take the abuse. I can only control my actions and reactions. I think that is the spirit of the post.