Wife is drunk, inarticulate and daft...so she's leaving
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
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yep, attorney has said "dont let her have them if she's drunk" - it will be a bit tricky as the way we are doing it, on her days, I'll drop them at school and she'll collect them...then take them the next day. So I wont see her.
I'm not sure on that one.....historically she's not driven drunk - but now maybe she would if the alternative was to rat herself out to me asking for help???
Just going to have to see.....I suppose if I suspect and she denies it will just be a court to step in.
I'm not sure on that one.....historically she's not driven drunk - but now maybe she would if the alternative was to rat herself out to me asking for help???
Just going to have to see.....I suppose if I suspect and she denies it will just be a court to step in.
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Southern US
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Originally Posted by Lewis73 
Sadly, I'm going to have to rely a bit on the 13 yr old. Which will be tough...because I'll have to email her saying "he said you had 4 cans, etc" - that will be horrible.
It's a subtle difference but an important one, I think. First thing, it doesn't identify which son told (so she doesn't get angry with that son and so she doesn't start hiding it from just that child.) Second thing is, you don't want your son to start counting beers. You know from your experience how consuming and stressful that is. My dd 14 did that for awhile. I didn't know she was doing it until she started telling me what she was observing. If the boundary is no alcohol, then it doesn't set the kid up for counting, just noticing when she starts drinking? Idk, I'm obviously not experienced with this since my AH hasn't left yet but I do know that it was not good for my dd to count.
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Join Date: Oct 2013
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Originally Posted by m1k3
Justagirl, the way out is always there. Sometimes we just aren't read to use it.
There is a saying I like. Pain instructs or it brings more pain. It appears that I was a really slow learner.
There is a saying I like. Pain instructs or it brings more pain. It appears that I was a really slow learner.
I do think I'm getting closer every day. I'm still too fixated on him... how it will affect him when he leaves next month... whether he'll be ok on his own, etc, etc. But, I've noticed that every day I'm starting to focus on how things will be for me & the kids more and him less.
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Sadly, I'm going to have to rely a bit on the 13 yr old. Which will be tough...because I'll have to email her saying "he said you had 4 cans, etc" - that will be horrible.
So the minor will be expected to count cans and report? Blecccch. My heart goes out to him. Memories of my childhood!! If I knew then what it subsequently took me years of AlAnon and therapy to figure out I would have screamed: "Not healthy! Not my job!"
Peace,
B.
So the minor will be expected to count cans and report? Blecccch. My heart goes out to him. Memories of my childhood!! If I knew then what it subsequently took me years of AlAnon and therapy to figure out I would have screamed: "Not healthy! Not my job!"
Peace,
B.
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Location: Sweden
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It seems that this question is just hanging in the air and not being addressed. It's a really vital question: your kids safety and mental health hang in the balance.
Seems to me that taking a "we'll see" attitude is a set up for disaster. Maybe now is the time to make clear demands and be very specific about them? Such as: absolutely no contact with the kids when you are drinking. That could be determined during your trade offs. Always make sure you drop the kids off, don't let them go there on their own, and if needed, get yourself a breathalyzer.
Are you going to feel okay leaving them with her and not being sure if she is drunk or sober?
Seems to me that taking a "we'll see" attitude is a set up for disaster. Maybe now is the time to make clear demands and be very specific about them? Such as: absolutely no contact with the kids when you are drinking. That could be determined during your trade offs. Always make sure you drop the kids off, don't let them go there on their own, and if needed, get yourself a breathalyzer.
Are you going to feel okay leaving them with her and not being sure if she is drunk or sober?
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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fwiw
you can always write up a list of "requirements" or rules and wait to give them to her once she has moved out. that was no drama in house. both lawyer and therapist should have ideas of guidelines to set with spouse.
you can always write up a list of "requirements" or rules and wait to give them to her once she has moved out. that was no drama in house. both lawyer and therapist should have ideas of guidelines to set with spouse.
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: London
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Lewis
Sounds like its going well. Hang in there for the last few days mate
Your story has many similarities to my families.
My children are much younger, So solicitor made it clear that (once she left) we had to get wife to agree in writing, before they went to stay with her that,
She would not drink at all before, or whilst with the children.
She would actually be looking after the children herself, when they are supposed to be in her care (at one point she started to nominate slightly more sober friends and family as caretakers while she was drinking)
She would not take children to licensed premises or functions where it was likely that heavy drinking would be occurring.
She rings each night once children in bed to confirm sobriety.
And that I did all transportation.
Once in a written legal agreement, breaking the agreement is far more serious in the eyes of courts etc,
Seems to be going well so far, wife still getting drunk, but not on days she sees kids, so best we could have hoped for I guess.
It's been a couple of months now, I still have good and bad days. But on the whole each week gets better for me.
Good luck
Sounds like its going well. Hang in there for the last few days mate
Your story has many similarities to my families.
My children are much younger, So solicitor made it clear that (once she left) we had to get wife to agree in writing, before they went to stay with her that,
She would not drink at all before, or whilst with the children.
She would actually be looking after the children herself, when they are supposed to be in her care (at one point she started to nominate slightly more sober friends and family as caretakers while she was drinking)
She would not take children to licensed premises or functions where it was likely that heavy drinking would be occurring.
She rings each night once children in bed to confirm sobriety.
And that I did all transportation.
Once in a written legal agreement, breaking the agreement is far more serious in the eyes of courts etc,
Seems to be going well so far, wife still getting drunk, but not on days she sees kids, so best we could have hoped for I guess.
It's been a couple of months now, I still have good and bad days. But on the whole each week gets better for me.
Good luck
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I assume your attorney is getting all of this legally into a parenting plan?? Please say yes.
I would like to touch on something here. This goes back to my dilemma of leaving, not trusting the AH. Here many have been on Lewis to leave. However....now that he is it is who will protect the children? If you have a parenting plan that helps as it can be enforced IN COURT. However....at least here where I live...the police will not get involved as they see this as a civil matter. Now, if she is driving them drunk that is a whole different matter as that is clearly so illegal and it would be quite easy to turn her in and have her arrested for it. But...you have to catch them first. And, taking someone back to court does not keep your children safe at that immediate second.
My friend keeps a journal. If she knows her AXH is drinking she writes it down in the journal and does not send her daughter. He is not allowed to pick up said child from school for this very reason, they meet at the sheriffs station right outside for the exchange of the child. Now, she is older (14) so that is easier, she understands and can be told what to look for. He would have to take her to court to say she is not sending her daughter when she is supposto and of course she has the journal backing her up why. So far so good. However, she does not trust that her daughter will tell her if he drinks while she is there out of fear her mother will not let her go see him. Insert: Guilt/fear/manipulation by father, which is just crap.
So, I know this is an ongoing delemma...or it is for me. I am just wondering if anyone has any proactive ideas for this type of situation and for Lewis for that matter.
Lewis, I personally think you are amazing. The progress you have made is just great and I think your kids are lucky to have such a caring father.
Thanks in advance for reading!
I would like to touch on something here. This goes back to my dilemma of leaving, not trusting the AH. Here many have been on Lewis to leave. However....now that he is it is who will protect the children? If you have a parenting plan that helps as it can be enforced IN COURT. However....at least here where I live...the police will not get involved as they see this as a civil matter. Now, if she is driving them drunk that is a whole different matter as that is clearly so illegal and it would be quite easy to turn her in and have her arrested for it. But...you have to catch them first. And, taking someone back to court does not keep your children safe at that immediate second.
My friend keeps a journal. If she knows her AXH is drinking she writes it down in the journal and does not send her daughter. He is not allowed to pick up said child from school for this very reason, they meet at the sheriffs station right outside for the exchange of the child. Now, she is older (14) so that is easier, she understands and can be told what to look for. He would have to take her to court to say she is not sending her daughter when she is supposto and of course she has the journal backing her up why. So far so good. However, she does not trust that her daughter will tell her if he drinks while she is there out of fear her mother will not let her go see him. Insert: Guilt/fear/manipulation by father, which is just crap.
So, I know this is an ongoing delemma...or it is for me. I am just wondering if anyone has any proactive ideas for this type of situation and for Lewis for that matter.
Lewis, I personally think you are amazing. The progress you have made is just great and I think your kids are lucky to have such a caring father.
Thanks in advance for reading!
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,414
It seems the problem is first for the AW to leave the home and take her addiction and drama out of the children's primary living space.
However, to do that, Lewis has to be careful not to pi$$ her off too much, or make her feel like she is losing parental rights, or she may not leave at all and dig in her heels in and make life hellish for all. From what he has reported, she will have to have access, including overnights, and being too harsh or trying to get total protection for children "upfront" just may not be possible.
However, to do that, Lewis has to be careful not to pi$$ her off too much, or make her feel like she is losing parental rights, or she may not leave at all and dig in her heels in and make life hellish for all. From what he has reported, she will have to have access, including overnights, and being too harsh or trying to get total protection for children "upfront" just may not be possible.
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Join Date: Nov 2013
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Very good summary from hawkeye (in my opinion).
That took me about a year to work out!
Thank you again for your postings Lewis, it's helping me a lot to realise that I probably dealt with a very bad situation in the best way possible.
That took me about a year to work out!
Thank you again for your postings Lewis, it's helping me a lot to realise that I probably dealt with a very bad situation in the best way possible.
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Originally Posted by Hawkeye13
It seems the problem is first for the AW to leave the home and take her addiction and drama out of the children's primary living space.
However, to do that, Lewis has to be careful not to pi$$ her off too much, or make her feel like she is losing parental rights, or she may not leave at all and dig in her heels in and make life hellish for all. From what he has reported, she will have to have access, including overnights, and being too harsh or trying to get total protection for children "upfront" just may not be possible.
However, to do that, Lewis has to be careful not to pi$$ her off too much, or make her feel like she is losing parental rights, or she may not leave at all and dig in her heels in and make life hellish for all. From what he has reported, she will have to have access, including overnights, and being too harsh or trying to get total protection for children "upfront" just may not be possible.
Folks are either screaming -- WHY HAVE YOU NOT LEFT THE CRAZY BITCH, YET?!?!
- or -
YOU ARE NOT LEAVING THE CRAZY BITCH CORRECTLY!!!!
Sometimes there just is no Win.
Those are the games that are just best not to play . . . or change the rules.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
Posts: 324
interesting day.
Had a VERY long chat with daughter. She is 110% sure that AW shouldnt get the boys AT ALL because she is sure she wont stop drinking. I have tried to explain the two factors I feel are important...a) If I tell her now that she will face losing the kids when she goes she will either not go, or go jump off a cliff. and b) IF ....and its a GIANT if....her mum DOES get better as she says she will, then she is fine to have the kids and it would be wrong for her to have anything less than 50%.
Daughter keeps saying...but she wont stay sober.....and I keep saying....but she might...and she looks at me like I'm stupid!
lol....at least we smiled about it all rather than fighting.
So sticking with the plan.....we have a mutually agreed rota, 65/55 in favour of me....that the courts will not be involved with. HOWEVER.....after the first 2 weeks (which I will give her to get clean....she wont have the boys during this time) if she drinks around them - I will refuse her access and get the court to approve that action.
Now...how the hell will I know she's drinking???? No idea...have to cross that bridge when I suspect something.
I still want to belive she'll do it....she knows I have gathered evidence to use for full custody. She belives that I intend to go for that (this belife is what she uses to hate me....so she has a reason to drink)...she is wrong, but its not the point. The point is she thinks she will lose the kids....and she is still going. So, I have to belive she is doing that for a very good reason - either to be able to drink more, or to get herself fixed for her kids. Eitherway, it will be obvious.
Fingers crossed for her....I dont love her anymore (i'm still head over heels for the girl she used to be...but she is long dead) but I dont want my kids mum to be dead/ill. So....good luck wifey.
Had a VERY long chat with daughter. She is 110% sure that AW shouldnt get the boys AT ALL because she is sure she wont stop drinking. I have tried to explain the two factors I feel are important...a) If I tell her now that she will face losing the kids when she goes she will either not go, or go jump off a cliff. and b) IF ....and its a GIANT if....her mum DOES get better as she says she will, then she is fine to have the kids and it would be wrong for her to have anything less than 50%.
Daughter keeps saying...but she wont stay sober.....and I keep saying....but she might...and she looks at me like I'm stupid!
lol....at least we smiled about it all rather than fighting.
So sticking with the plan.....we have a mutually agreed rota, 65/55 in favour of me....that the courts will not be involved with. HOWEVER.....after the first 2 weeks (which I will give her to get clean....she wont have the boys during this time) if she drinks around them - I will refuse her access and get the court to approve that action.
Now...how the hell will I know she's drinking???? No idea...have to cross that bridge when I suspect something.
I still want to belive she'll do it....she knows I have gathered evidence to use for full custody. She belives that I intend to go for that (this belife is what she uses to hate me....so she has a reason to drink)...she is wrong, but its not the point. The point is she thinks she will lose the kids....and she is still going. So, I have to belive she is doing that for a very good reason - either to be able to drink more, or to get herself fixed for her kids. Eitherway, it will be obvious.
Fingers crossed for her....I dont love her anymore (i'm still head over heels for the girl she used to be...but she is long dead) but I dont want my kids mum to be dead/ill. So....good luck wifey.
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: London
Posts: 324
also.....may have convinced daughter to come to al anon with me. She is VERY dubious and tells me how she'd find it no benifit. I explained it helps thousands of people and she started to explain how and why that didn't apply to her.
I pointed out that she seemed to suffer from the same "terminal uniqueness" that her mum has when it comes thinking that what works for so many doesnt apply to them.
At this point she realised she may be a smart ass teenager, but she can't out argue her dad
So....we are going to go!
I pointed out that she seemed to suffer from the same "terminal uniqueness" that her mum has when it comes thinking that what works for so many doesnt apply to them.
At this point she realised she may be a smart ass teenager, but she can't out argue her dad
So....we are going to go!
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Join Date: Oct 2013
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My fingers are certainly crossed for your wife--
I really hope she does find herself again.
I spent some time in the bottle myself, and it isn't a good place to be
but it can be so hard to find the way out.
Very delighted you and daughter are going to Alanon
I really hope she does find herself again.
I spent some time in the bottle myself, and it isn't a good place to be
but it can be so hard to find the way out.
Very delighted you and daughter are going to Alanon
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,062
Really glad that your conversation with your daughter went well!! Glad she will go to the meetings with you!! When are you starting the meetings??
I'm sure these last few days before move out are going to be awkward and difficult. Praying you can stay firm and as detached as possible and let her do what she needs to do to get moved out and settled.
Let us know how you are doing Lewis, we care!
I'm sure these last few days before move out are going to be awkward and difficult. Praying you can stay firm and as detached as possible and let her do what she needs to do to get moved out and settled.
Let us know how you are doing Lewis, we care!
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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Lewis, I am glad you are still riding this wave in good form; it is so hard. Communication with your daughter is very important, and your wife may get sober; having a positive attitude while taking such difficult steps strikes me as essential. You are an extraordinary person.
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