custody question *unmarried parents*
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Northeastern US
Posts: 122
custody question *unmarried parents*
Does anyone have any sort of experience with establishing legal custody if parents are unmarried? Do I need legal counsel to file for legal custody? Have any of you dealt with this? Thanks in advance for any light you can shed on this.
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: The planet Earth, or at least that's what I've been told.
Posts: 130
Bod -
You don't need legal counsel to fight for custody. Usually there are places in every county called "Self-Help Legal Centers". Find one in your area and figure out their hours. Usually they will have the day split into two sessions. The first part of the day they might deal with divorces and the second part of the day they might deal with custody. Basically they will guide you through the legal process. They will help you fill out the forms, but you are responsible for going to the court house and filing them.
There are also nonprofits and subsidized groups that offer free legal counsel. Again, you would have to find these services in your area.
You don't need legal counsel to fight for custody. Usually there are places in every county called "Self-Help Legal Centers". Find one in your area and figure out their hours. Usually they will have the day split into two sessions. The first part of the day they might deal with divorces and the second part of the day they might deal with custody. Basically they will guide you through the legal process. They will help you fill out the forms, but you are responsible for going to the court house and filing them.
There are also nonprofits and subsidized groups that offer free legal counsel. Again, you would have to find these services in your area.
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 2,899
It varies quite a bit from state to state. In my state, we were required to use lawyers to hash out a legal agreement. Sometimes legal mediation can be used.
My suggestion is that you get a free consultation with a lawyer to find out what you need to do in your area.
My suggestion is that you get a free consultation with a lawyer to find out what you need to do in your area.
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Real World
Posts: 729
Bodkin -
Marriage has zero to do with custody rights. The presumptive determining factor in deciding issues of custody is 'best interests of the child'.
I have more practice with pro-se litigation than I'd like and eventually went that route because the XW who got arrested for trying to go through me to get to the daughter who wanted to be away from her... well while said XW was in the mental hospital her roomie was... wait for it, wait for it.... a family law attorney! Gotta love that sort of luck.
The sort of legal aid Chantal mentioned is usually fairly easy to come by if you are female but pretty rare for men. There are organizations for dads as well.
Step one is to google "Custody law MYSTATE" which will get you a link to the incomprehensible family code for your state and 973 sites from family law attorneys, usually some with pretty good information.
If you can afford an attorney, step two is talking to one. Many will do a free consultation during which they will tell you they can do a lot for you and make the $5-25K retainer check out to.....
Before you go that route, if you are comfortable sharing a little basic info perhaps those with a little experience can share some thoughts. That''s different from legal advice mind you - for a non lawyer to give legal advice would be a crime because well, lawyers write laws and the custody industry is a billion dollar industry. Industry? Oh my yes.
When I had my last custody battle the XW had a free attorney and no money but no matter there. Even though teen daughter was old enough to and did express her desire to stay with me there was money for the social study, money for the gaurdian ad-litem (child's attorney), mediation fees, and on and on and on - and Oh yeah, the counselor assigned by the court that my daughter did not want to see. All of those 'professionals' were.... wait for it.... on the Judge's list of donors.
So sarcasm and bitterness aside I've done it both ways - the $100K plus in legal fees way and the do it yourself when dead broke studying by candles because the out of state lawyer one the 'retainer or light bill?" debate.
Like any other game, the custody maze is one that has a set of written rules and then there is how it really works. Knowing the difference is critical and the hardest and smartest thing a person can do when thinking about taking that plunge is to study, think, study, study and think some more until the urge passes UNLESS a child is in danger or you feel certain that things need to change and negotiation is not working.
...and then don't kid yourself, a custody battle is brutal on a child so ask yourself some very hard questions about whether the time, expense, stress on the child etcetera is warranted.
If so? Well then it's time to review the facts and start thinking about what a Court is realistically likely to do because again, there is the law and there is what happens in reality and then there is truth and justice and neither of the last two has a damned thing to do with anything once you open Pandora's courthouse door.
So that's my attempt to talk you out of it, good news is that I prevailed 4 times over 18 years - prevailed mind you, nobody 'wins' a custody battle but when you need to go there then you need to go there and you don't need money or a lawyer to prevail, you do however to understand what the game is, how it is played and what the unwritten rules are. Study study study and before you do, say or write ANYTHING to the other party or about the other party you might close your eyes and imagine having to read it or see it projected on a screen in front of the Judge. Pretend the judge is watching and listening to you at all times... might be a good rule for life frankly.
Marriage has zero to do with custody rights. The presumptive determining factor in deciding issues of custody is 'best interests of the child'.
I have more practice with pro-se litigation than I'd like and eventually went that route because the XW who got arrested for trying to go through me to get to the daughter who wanted to be away from her... well while said XW was in the mental hospital her roomie was... wait for it, wait for it.... a family law attorney! Gotta love that sort of luck.
The sort of legal aid Chantal mentioned is usually fairly easy to come by if you are female but pretty rare for men. There are organizations for dads as well.
Step one is to google "Custody law MYSTATE" which will get you a link to the incomprehensible family code for your state and 973 sites from family law attorneys, usually some with pretty good information.
If you can afford an attorney, step two is talking to one. Many will do a free consultation during which they will tell you they can do a lot for you and make the $5-25K retainer check out to.....
Before you go that route, if you are comfortable sharing a little basic info perhaps those with a little experience can share some thoughts. That''s different from legal advice mind you - for a non lawyer to give legal advice would be a crime because well, lawyers write laws and the custody industry is a billion dollar industry. Industry? Oh my yes.
When I had my last custody battle the XW had a free attorney and no money but no matter there. Even though teen daughter was old enough to and did express her desire to stay with me there was money for the social study, money for the gaurdian ad-litem (child's attorney), mediation fees, and on and on and on - and Oh yeah, the counselor assigned by the court that my daughter did not want to see. All of those 'professionals' were.... wait for it.... on the Judge's list of donors.
So sarcasm and bitterness aside I've done it both ways - the $100K plus in legal fees way and the do it yourself when dead broke studying by candles because the out of state lawyer one the 'retainer or light bill?" debate.
Like any other game, the custody maze is one that has a set of written rules and then there is how it really works. Knowing the difference is critical and the hardest and smartest thing a person can do when thinking about taking that plunge is to study, think, study, study and think some more until the urge passes UNLESS a child is in danger or you feel certain that things need to change and negotiation is not working.
...and then don't kid yourself, a custody battle is brutal on a child so ask yourself some very hard questions about whether the time, expense, stress on the child etcetera is warranted.
If so? Well then it's time to review the facts and start thinking about what a Court is realistically likely to do because again, there is the law and there is what happens in reality and then there is truth and justice and neither of the last two has a damned thing to do with anything once you open Pandora's courthouse door.
So that's my attempt to talk you out of it, good news is that I prevailed 4 times over 18 years - prevailed mind you, nobody 'wins' a custody battle but when you need to go there then you need to go there and you don't need money or a lawyer to prevail, you do however to understand what the game is, how it is played and what the unwritten rules are. Study study study and before you do, say or write ANYTHING to the other party or about the other party you might close your eyes and imagine having to read it or see it projected on a screen in front of the Judge. Pretend the judge is watching and listening to you at all times... might be a good rule for life frankly.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: my own prison
Posts: 108
I agree with pf
I initially wasted $ I didn't have for an attorney, during my consultation she told me she would do x y z with the $ I paid her. Midway through the process (8mo and only 2court dates) she informed me she would need more money to finish her end of the agreement. I fired her right then. It was very scary but the more I read into case law the more comfortable I felt handling my own. I mean who can fight for my kids better than me? It took a lot of patience and tongue biting, it's is crucial that you avoid slamming the other parent at ALL cost. How you tell a judge your child's parent is endangering them without becoming irate is difficult but it can be done.
You can find the right paperwork to file in your court house or you can create your own. All bs aside, the courthouse will take a hand written note on a greasy napkin as long as it's signed and filed! Ours was a room in the basement but the people who worked there could not tell you anything. Not even if you were wondering if it was the correct paper. The self help center was exactly the same. I didn't qualify for free council because my state only offered it for domestic violence victims. This is when Google became my best friend. I stayed up hrs on end searching and reading and taking notes ( a must as I could not retain important information while taking in so much) You should familiarize yourself with your states laws and any cases you can find that are similar to your situation. Even if you do decide to use an attorney I would suggest this, you never know if and when you may need it.
The most important thing I had to learn was to keep calm. I have a temper, she can be a bad bad girl sometimes. Things did not move nearly as quick as I wanted them to as I was exhausted from all the chaos and turmoil that accompanies custody cases.
Best advice I can offer is stay calm, educate yourself and find somewhere to vent outside of your home and away from your kids. Not on FB or Twitter, not in text messages. Grab some close friends and get old school. Just be careful of who you say things in front of. I unfortunately found out I couldn't trust people I thought were friends or my employer!
I initially wasted $ I didn't have for an attorney, during my consultation she told me she would do x y z with the $ I paid her. Midway through the process (8mo and only 2court dates) she informed me she would need more money to finish her end of the agreement. I fired her right then. It was very scary but the more I read into case law the more comfortable I felt handling my own. I mean who can fight for my kids better than me? It took a lot of patience and tongue biting, it's is crucial that you avoid slamming the other parent at ALL cost. How you tell a judge your child's parent is endangering them without becoming irate is difficult but it can be done.
You can find the right paperwork to file in your court house or you can create your own. All bs aside, the courthouse will take a hand written note on a greasy napkin as long as it's signed and filed! Ours was a room in the basement but the people who worked there could not tell you anything. Not even if you were wondering if it was the correct paper. The self help center was exactly the same. I didn't qualify for free council because my state only offered it for domestic violence victims. This is when Google became my best friend. I stayed up hrs on end searching and reading and taking notes ( a must as I could not retain important information while taking in so much) You should familiarize yourself with your states laws and any cases you can find that are similar to your situation. Even if you do decide to use an attorney I would suggest this, you never know if and when you may need it.
The most important thing I had to learn was to keep calm. I have a temper, she can be a bad bad girl sometimes. Things did not move nearly as quick as I wanted them to as I was exhausted from all the chaos and turmoil that accompanies custody cases.
Best advice I can offer is stay calm, educate yourself and find somewhere to vent outside of your home and away from your kids. Not on FB or Twitter, not in text messages. Grab some close friends and get old school. Just be careful of who you say things in front of. I unfortunately found out I couldn't trust people I thought were friends or my employer!
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