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A great article on progression

Old 12-11-2013, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Hammer View Post
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So. What title, name, or description would you prefer?

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Really. Please. Tell me the right term.
I prefer the name that fits the diagnosis of the individual addict, not a blanket term that denigrates a group as a whole. This doctor is on very shaky ethical ground IMO. And I also sense a good deal of gas lighting opportunity by those of you who casually send the article to someone still in the grip of addiction.

Reflect on that, please.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:08 AM
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Sometimes "crazy" is shorthand for a lot of things. In my case with my AH, "crazy" was what I called the never-ending appeals to forgive his addiction despite the consequences it had on me and the kids, AND the willingness we had for so long to go without basic needs and expectations to be compassionate to the active addict.

It's not abusive or gaslighting to have an unflattering opinion about something or someone that ruined a decade of my life. I get to define that experience for myself, even if it makes other people uncomfortable.

Also, learning to express ourselves without soft-pedaling the effects of addition on our lives because it might hurt the feelings of someone, somewhere, is part of recovery for codies. We also learn that if we don't like the way others express themselves, it's great for us to find other ways to participate without telling others what to do or how to think.

Addiction is crazytown, that that's why we're here trying to figure it out. It's a learning process.
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Old 12-11-2013, 10:32 AM
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Johnson---don't worry too much about an addict reading the material presented in this article. The reason that I say this, so confidently, is that the addict (and alcoholic) is so well shrouded in their defense systems that any reality feedback regarding their disease just rolls off like water off a quacking duck's back. Seriously. The denial is almost impenetrable in the active alcoholic. Ask any of us who have tried to get them to see that there is a "problem" with their drinking.

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Old 12-11-2013, 10:55 AM
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Bravo!! Well said, Florence. Addiction IS crazytown. And it has indeed ruined so much of what I hold dear- not the least of which at times- MY OWN sanity. And I'm not afraid to say it, and I need not put any other label on it. My home, my haven, feels like insanity....and if my ah is suffering some brand of it, well it is what it is. I would hazard to say he cares not what name it is given...that even he just wants it to be fixed.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:03 AM
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I can't dismiss your personal experiences but I can have issues with the article. The doctor is out of line. I would not want him treating a loved one.

Best of luck with the addicts and alcoholics in your lives. I'll stay off the thread
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:10 AM
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Johnson---I don't want to chase you away. Issues can be discussed and there can be honest differences of opinion (done respectfully, of course).

Did you ever watch "Meet the Press"?....LOL.

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Old 12-11-2013, 11:25 AM
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Interesting point Johnston. I relate to the article hugely. I do agree it is a term that should not be used lightly.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Johnston View Post
I prefer the name that fits the diagnosis of the individual addict, not a blanket term that denigrates a group as a whole. This doctor is on very shaky ethical ground IMO.
What you are proposing is considered so heinous in the industry that it is rarely spoken and close-to-never in front of nor to a person who has it, in our case -- seems to come closest to what is called Borderline, or more specifically for us -- Borderline Traits.

The name is from a turn of the (last) Century description "somewhere on the Borderline between Neurosis and Psychotic." Would have been better (mho) if the term had been upgraded to Emotional Dyregulation in the DSM - V, or (again mho) Hyperactive Amygdala Dysfunction, which actually describes the portion of the brain where the problems are observed.

But in all that -- Any real diagnosis is rarely done, unless for Insurance Billing Purposes. Because many common US carrier insurance policies do not cover Long Term Personality Disorder Mental Illness . . . real diagnosis are rarely made, or even mis-stated to ensure insurance payment for treatment.

And I also sense a good deal of gas lighting opportunity by those of you who casually send the article to someone still in the grip of addiction.
As far as real Gas Lighting. If you follow the real context of Gas Lighting, it is usually done as the reverse of what you may be supposing. In practice it is generally done by those who are considered "High Functioning" Personality Disorder types . . . which frequently are Alcoholics, and/or Addicts, and/or Dual Diagnosis. To cover and conceal their own illness.


Reflect on that, please.
You have offered nothing, have you?

Not trying to debate this, but did I miss something?
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:39 AM
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A lot of posts occurred while I was on the phone (lol) and prior to posting. I would like to add that I saw plenty of my spouses behaviors as insane but to say overall he is insane, no way. There has to be better terms to use.
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Old 12-11-2013, 11:59 AM
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Heck, we are all human so we are all a little crazy. And people with specific diagnoses, well you can always argue about each diagnosis, say they are social constructions, blah blah blah.

Fact is, xah made me a little crazy, xah himself is a bit crazy, and the psychotic folks I used to work with weren't completely crazy. I think this article is right on and alcoholics, at least the one I know so well, can be more insane than the insane.

Why do you have a problem with this? Do you feel protective of someone, or yourself?

Some of us protected our As for years and years. And they thanked us by threatening murder. This is just a forum so it is kind of a total relief to say the honest to God truth here without worrying what the f**king neighbors think.

I will shout it to the virtual rooftops: xah is f**king looney tunes mad!!!
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