what our kids learned from me - the message I didn't mean to give them
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,281
what our kids learned from me - the message I didn't mean to give them
What our kids learned from me:
That being in environments where socialized drinking is the norm... is normal. That over-abundance of drinking is normal.
My AH is a wonderful dad. Our kids have learned a lot of great things from him. Yet, from both of us -- with his drinking and my 'acceptance' of that with not removing ourselves from this environment -- they've learned all of that to be "normal".
Although I don't use, I was also conditioned to it by my A, his family and friends and so many others we know, including employers. I always felt like the odd duck out. There is nothing I've ever said that made an impact greater on our kids than what they've seen and been a part of. While I thought it'd be a negative effect (for them to realize all the reasons they shouldn't drink), it just showed them how "normal" it was to so many people.
Staying in an alcoholic situation, I conditioned them to that. There are no ifs ands or buts about it. Amazingly, to me, there actually are people out there whose social lives don't revolve around drinking. I need to FIND THEM and create a healthy life for myself. If need be, I need to learn to walk away and create that world for myself. Before I knew it, the kids grew up and I've found signs of them falling into some of the patterns of what they've grown up with. They said the right things and I did too (about not using and learning from those with problems), but it's still **so easy** to fall into what they've been conditioned to see as "normal" in their life. In addition to the genetics in our family, the social conditioning is stronger than I realized.
I need to create my boundaries and figure out how to enforce them. Where and when I'll take myself and our youngest child away from drinking environments and what I'll do as a substitute.
Congratulations to those who've put your children's long-term health above the difficulties of dealing with your A. I applaud you because NONE of this is easy. Having older kids and a younger one makes this easier to see in retrospect, but it's still not easy to deal with. I'm even realizing that family reunions may need to be brief drop-in visits instead of staying the weekend. I love them all and there is a lot of good, fun times but there is no way to totally separate that from the drinking going on. I am no longer going to be setting the example of acceptance by continuing to be in situations that send that message. Yeah, easier said than done, but day by day, I am going to be living that.
Beyond all that, thank you to everyone here who's made me realize that decisions and action don't need to be made immediately. That I can take time to stop and think and take little steps until I'm ready to take bigger ones. I needed to understand the path I want to take instead of leaping into something I couldn't deal with. Thank you for helping educate me so I'd be strong enough to deal with it.
That being in environments where socialized drinking is the norm... is normal. That over-abundance of drinking is normal.
My AH is a wonderful dad. Our kids have learned a lot of great things from him. Yet, from both of us -- with his drinking and my 'acceptance' of that with not removing ourselves from this environment -- they've learned all of that to be "normal".
Although I don't use, I was also conditioned to it by my A, his family and friends and so many others we know, including employers. I always felt like the odd duck out. There is nothing I've ever said that made an impact greater on our kids than what they've seen and been a part of. While I thought it'd be a negative effect (for them to realize all the reasons they shouldn't drink), it just showed them how "normal" it was to so many people.
Staying in an alcoholic situation, I conditioned them to that. There are no ifs ands or buts about it. Amazingly, to me, there actually are people out there whose social lives don't revolve around drinking. I need to FIND THEM and create a healthy life for myself. If need be, I need to learn to walk away and create that world for myself. Before I knew it, the kids grew up and I've found signs of them falling into some of the patterns of what they've grown up with. They said the right things and I did too (about not using and learning from those with problems), but it's still **so easy** to fall into what they've been conditioned to see as "normal" in their life. In addition to the genetics in our family, the social conditioning is stronger than I realized.
I need to create my boundaries and figure out how to enforce them. Where and when I'll take myself and our youngest child away from drinking environments and what I'll do as a substitute.
Congratulations to those who've put your children's long-term health above the difficulties of dealing with your A. I applaud you because NONE of this is easy. Having older kids and a younger one makes this easier to see in retrospect, but it's still not easy to deal with. I'm even realizing that family reunions may need to be brief drop-in visits instead of staying the weekend. I love them all and there is a lot of good, fun times but there is no way to totally separate that from the drinking going on. I am no longer going to be setting the example of acceptance by continuing to be in situations that send that message. Yeah, easier said than done, but day by day, I am going to be living that.
Beyond all that, thank you to everyone here who's made me realize that decisions and action don't need to be made immediately. That I can take time to stop and think and take little steps until I'm ready to take bigger ones. I needed to understand the path I want to take instead of leaping into something I couldn't deal with. Thank you for helping educate me so I'd be strong enough to deal with it.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,582
hey there
i cannot believe you are saying this! since i arrived on this site, i would read about your struggles and determination to stay with him in spite of it. to me you always seemed defensive and i understood those feelings well having felt them too.
the fact you are even entertaining removing yourself from the toxic world of alcoholism is amazing to me seeing your changes.
i actually smiled and felt proud (dont mean that condescending) of you when i read your post.
go girl
i cannot believe you are saying this! since i arrived on this site, i would read about your struggles and determination to stay with him in spite of it. to me you always seemed defensive and i understood those feelings well having felt them too.
the fact you are even entertaining removing yourself from the toxic world of alcoholism is amazing to me seeing your changes.
i actually smiled and felt proud (dont mean that condescending) of you when i read your post.
go girl
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
None of this is easy. Ain't that the truth.
I have beaten myself up plenty for not leaving sooner, because the effect on my children of AXH's alcoholism will take time to heal and reverse.
For me, I left when I was able to.
It's not that I wanted my children to suffer that made me stay. It's that I honest-to-God didn't think they were suffering. Heck, I didn't even know I was suffering, really -- I mean, I knew I was suffering, but I wasn't sure I had the right to feel that way. Because AXH was so good at telling me that he was a great husband and father, that I should be happy to be married to him, and that the children should be grateful to have him as their father. In retrospect, if he had really believed that, he wouldn't have needed to preach it to me all the damn time. But he did.
I was gaslighted, emotionally and verbally abused, and manipulated to the point where I did not see that I had the right to leave; nor did I see that living with him harmed my children. I was so broken down that I didn't really live, I just survived. And when people told me my children were suffering, I brushed it off on the surface but it really, really hurt because nothing has ever been more important to me than the well-being of my children. Ever. And to have other people insinuate that what I was doing was harmful to them added a burden to a life that was already... burdened. It was like I was carrying a million boulders on my back and my well-meaning family and friends added another thousand.
I was unburdening to an older woman at Al-Anon -- telling her how I was torn apart inside from guilt that I chose such a poor father for my children. She then told me her story -- she was a double winner -- which was much worse than mine: One of her children had died from an accident while she was passed out drunk. She said, "When we know better, we do better." That was all. When we know better we do better.
I tell myself that I need to not beat myself up for what I did when I didn't know better. I need to forgive myself. And not look back in guilt but take those boulders I carried on my back for so long and use them to build a foundation for something useful today.
I have beaten myself up plenty for not leaving sooner, because the effect on my children of AXH's alcoholism will take time to heal and reverse.
For me, I left when I was able to.
It's not that I wanted my children to suffer that made me stay. It's that I honest-to-God didn't think they were suffering. Heck, I didn't even know I was suffering, really -- I mean, I knew I was suffering, but I wasn't sure I had the right to feel that way. Because AXH was so good at telling me that he was a great husband and father, that I should be happy to be married to him, and that the children should be grateful to have him as their father. In retrospect, if he had really believed that, he wouldn't have needed to preach it to me all the damn time. But he did.
I was gaslighted, emotionally and verbally abused, and manipulated to the point where I did not see that I had the right to leave; nor did I see that living with him harmed my children. I was so broken down that I didn't really live, I just survived. And when people told me my children were suffering, I brushed it off on the surface but it really, really hurt because nothing has ever been more important to me than the well-being of my children. Ever. And to have other people insinuate that what I was doing was harmful to them added a burden to a life that was already... burdened. It was like I was carrying a million boulders on my back and my well-meaning family and friends added another thousand.
I was unburdening to an older woman at Al-Anon -- telling her how I was torn apart inside from guilt that I chose such a poor father for my children. She then told me her story -- she was a double winner -- which was much worse than mine: One of her children had died from an accident while she was passed out drunk. She said, "When we know better, we do better." That was all. When we know better we do better.
I tell myself that I need to not beat myself up for what I did when I didn't know better. I need to forgive myself. And not look back in guilt but take those boulders I carried on my back for so long and use them to build a foundation for something useful today.
Living in a Pinkful Place
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,545
I had no idea the damage I was doing to my daughters by allowing my such unhealthiness in our home.
My girls learned about accepting unacceptable behaviors, not having healthy boundaries, and not having a mutually beneficial relationship with people.
My heart was so broken and I was so overwhelmed with guilt when I realized that I had given them these examples . . .
And then my sponsor said, you can't undo the past but the future is waiting for YOU and for them ~ show them something different
So from September 3, 2003 ~ I have changed my life for me and for them. So that they can see you are never too old to do things differently ~
To have respect, dignity & self-love and to distance myself from those who can't respect me & honor my boundaries.
I see my daughters slowly making healthier choices sometimes - sometimes I see my old behaviors in them and that hurts me ~ but as adults they have to find their own way now - they have been exposed to a better way now - hopefully they will choose it.
wishing peace & recovery for all
pink hugs
My girls learned about accepting unacceptable behaviors, not having healthy boundaries, and not having a mutually beneficial relationship with people.
My heart was so broken and I was so overwhelmed with guilt when I realized that I had given them these examples . . .
And then my sponsor said, you can't undo the past but the future is waiting for YOU and for them ~ show them something different
So from September 3, 2003 ~ I have changed my life for me and for them. So that they can see you are never too old to do things differently ~
To have respect, dignity & self-love and to distance myself from those who can't respect me & honor my boundaries.
I see my daughters slowly making healthier choices sometimes - sometimes I see my old behaviors in them and that hurts me ~ but as adults they have to find their own way now - they have been exposed to a better way now - hopefully they will choose it.
wishing peace & recovery for all
pink hugs
Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Here and now
Posts: 325
Originally Posted by lillamy 
"When we know better, we do better." That was all. When we know better we do better.
I am an ACOA and also stayed in a toxic relationship with my high school sweetheart (father of my child) My mom just buried her head in the sand, got up, went to work, carried the weight and basically left it in Gods hands.
My 21yo son is currently in Rehab and he said to me "Mom, dont feel bad for anything, You have always been there for me, You did what you had to do!" I carry around a lot of guilt. Guilt for not leaving sooner, for exposing my child to this life, which he turned around and embraced. I feel like the worst mother in the world, and thats where Ms. Fix it comes in. Im a day late and a dollar short (or at least thats how I feel) I still have alot of work ahead of me but I "KNOW BETTER' now!
Bunnies!
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,905
I applaud all of the parents here who have made choices to get better and provide a better life for their kids. This is one of those "later is better than never" situations. It's the fact that you recognize what you did and own up to it. That is the lesson these kids will take away in the long run. I never had that as a kid, or even as a young adult, so I spent so much of my teens and 20s emulating what I grew up with. Definitely not the path most people would want for their kids, and certainly not something I want my own children to think is acceptable. So good on all of us for seeing the bad for what it is and working to change it into good.
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