DV- Please don't use the children

Old 04-02-2014, 11:07 AM
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I went through a very very difficult time in my 30's. I was on the brink, this was before my drinking got bad. I was beyond lucky that someone at work mentioned a therapist she had been seeing, I called and made an appointment. We met, and the woman agreed to see me but only if I would commit to 2x a week.

I spent almost 10 years sorting things out. My God, the patience, understanding and kindness she showed me I will never be able to repay. It is only in looking back that I can see how she was gently, ever so gently, guiding me to begin to trust myself. It had taken me three decades to wind myself into knots, it took a long time to untangle. She probably could have summed up my issues in one or two sessions, but I needed to figure it out for myself. I hadn't had that type of unconditional kindness in a long time, if ever. What seems to linger in my mind is the process, it was gradual. I would glean a bit of support, go back out in the world and test it out, and look at it again the next week. I had no idea that I was changing.

At first I wanted confirmation that the way I was being treated wasn't normal. Then I went through a process of needing to confirm how bad the person who was hurting me was, she gradually helped me shift the focus back to myself. It was only after a long time that I started to realize that I did have power, and that my focus was on all the wrong things. But, I would not have believed it any earlier, I had to work through that gradually. Now I understand that what I was struggling was codependence.


I needed someplace soft to land, a haven that allowed me the room to sort things out, and a gradual sounding board as I found my own voice. She would catch the slightest inflection in my voice and call me out on contouring my responses to what I thought I should say versus what I felt. Being guarded and trying to anticipate how best to interact with someone who has the capacity to hurt us becomes a habit. In a way, it is a natural and rational response, at the beginning. The problem is we become partners with whoever is hurting us, and when isolation is added that can be a grave combination.

It is hard to remember sometimes what it felt like to feel so victimized, how confusing and alone I felt. I grew up skiing, have taught friends, and there are times when I don't understand why they are struggling so much, I get frustrated because the right way to do it seems SO APPARENT. A few years ago I tried to snowboard. I had forgotten the terror of look down a tiny slope fearing I would kill myself, it was a huge wake up call for me. I think of that often on the newcomer boards. Sometimes when we move ahead it does become really hard to remember that confusion and fear we felt when we first sought our own recovery. What seems apparent later takes conditioning, patience and trust. I believe in SR so much, it has been my lifeline. My wish is that everyone who comes here will be given the time to try out the bunny slope first, and that gradually they will trust enough to know that they too are capable of skiing the moguls.
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:08 AM
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When I post I to put myself back in time to when I was originally seeking help. I did know things weren't right, it was like I just couldn't place my finger on what was wrong. I had no one at all to talk to. I already alienated my family and friends, already lied to cover up things that were going on, no one would have believed me, (or at least that is the way that I felt).

Even now, today, as I am typing this, I went back to 10 years ago.

I was lonely, I was depressed, I didn't know what I was doing wrong. I came seeking help and validation for my feelings, because I feel I can't have a feeling unless I get an OK from someone. I was suicidal. I had no one to turn to, I needed to talk. I needed help to get out of that abyss that I fell into. I had no hope left, I could see no future. I just felt like if this is life, please stop the planet and let me jump off. I had no rational thoughts at the time. I needed to be heard, and I needed to feel loved.

Ironic, I go to the internet. People that I will never meet. Hoping that someone out there knows or can understand how I feel, I don't want to feel crazy anymore. I don't want to feel alone anymore. I was told repeatedly that I was a lousy mother by my AH. My kids are in honor classes, but they are afraid to express an opinion in their own home. I want to be a good mother, but was my H right, they aren't old enough to have their own opinion? Are they just really parroting what their teachers are saying? Are their teachers brainwashing them? Then I think about my own opinions. Am I still too young to have my own? Is my H the only one old enough to have his own? So I have questions, but my mind is so effed up, I don't know how to word it correctly.

Then I get jumped on. I shut down again. I stay on the forum, I only read, I don't post anymore. I post only to say Happy Birthday to someone. But I'm still reading, still trying to figure things out for myself. Even though I am learning, I think I would have learned a lot faster if I didn't feel I was under attack. I was under attack everyday of my marriage. It was almost cultlike. I had already given up my views, my opinions, my feelings. I had to agree with everything in the marriage, if not, there was a penalty to pay.

My freedom from all of that, is that I did stay, I didn't participate like I should have, and I always felt bad when a newcomer would come in and get pounced on. A lot of them left, and didn't benefit from the wealth of knowledge that I gained by staying.

I will always try to judge for myself where that person might be at the time of their initial posting. If they need someone to just listen, and lean on for support until they can stand on their own, I can give that.

I needed my "oxygen mask" before I could help my children. I needed to have support, I needed to know that I wasn't crazy. I was told that everyday. I needed to trust again.
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:10 AM
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Wow jaynie, thank you for that beautiful post.
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:15 AM
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Amy, did I tell you that I love you today? You are an angel.
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jaynie04 View Post
Amy, did I tell you that I love you today? You are an angel.
Thanks, that made me smile !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I love you too.

PS - I used to lie to my therapist all the time so that she would feel she was doing a good job.
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Old 04-05-2014, 08:07 PM
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It is taking me a long time to come to grips with what happened to me. I was still surprised, last week, when my therapist congratulated me for recognizing I'd been in an abusive relationship--my first thought was, 'are you sure I'm right about that?' !!!!

The time to get out may seem logical--the lowest possible point, the worst abuse. But How the hell do you get the confidence to upend your children and yourself, after years of being told how incompetent and stupid and wrong you are?

And then, the world says, "If you don't leave him, fight him in court, stand up to him then you are..... incompetent and stupid and wrong."

It's only as I delve into normal life that I see how manipulated and destroyed I was. Within the alcoholic family system, it felt normal, and mostly bearable. A great post. We don't need people telling us what to do. We need people telling us we are strong, and capable of doing what we know in our hearts is right.
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Old 04-07-2014, 12:59 AM
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fairlyuncertain, just know that you can do it.

I was a long term person. I don't pride myself for that. I will never give myself pats on the back for that. I know what you are dealing with. You need support. I would suggest alanon, but if you can't get there, this board, and I will never give up on you. We are here for you. Talk to us. I knew everything for many years. It really does do a mindf..k on you.

Here for you and ((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))))
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Old 04-12-2014, 08:13 PM
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Thanks! I'm actually out of the relationship. It's just taken me a long time to realize how abusive and controlling it was. It's a process for me, and for the kids. Al anon really helped me, and continues to help me, sort it all out. Hearing the stories of a friendly group of people has been a source of so much healing.
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Old 04-13-2014, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by amy55 View Post
Let me continue with what I had originally started

As a newcomer, I am here looking for validation, looking for a place to talk and feel safe, would really like to vent also. You see, I have been in my situation for so long, I only know what I am use to. I don't have any tools to work with, except for the tools that I am currently working with, and I know that they aren't working, so I am coming here to seek knowledge, but I may be slow at times, you see, the way I have been doing things, well, it's kinda ingrained in me. Perhaps since childhood, perhaps my many years of marriage. I may be in denial at times, but sometimes, I think, not that much, since why would I be seeking out help, if I thought I knew everything.


Please don't condemn me for what I am doing, it's the only thing that I know. It may take me a while, but I am looking for friends and support, you see, I have none. I have isolated myself so much, I have no one to talk to.
Oh my gosh, Amy.
I'm not really all that much of a newcomer, but I started to cry tonight reading this. It feels like you were advocating for me specifically. I thought maybe you posted this in response to the way another member responded to my recent thread, but I see that you wrote this several days before I wrote my thread.

When I read a response the other day, I felt very defeated and self destructive. I felt like a bad mom. It is definitely not that person's fault that I feel attacked or that I reacted in a self destructive manner, but I sure didn't need to hear honesty in that manner. It just wasn't helpful. I had a boss once who would say, "It's not what you say. It's HOW you say it." Certainly there is a happy medium to find in that too, but I think it's a great guideline.

I do come here for support and validation. I do come here for ES&H. That's what I'll be benefiting from the most. Without me explaining every little detail of my whole life, people here might not know what is progress for me. I think we need to keep that in mind with our responses.

Some of us are very slow too. I am slow in every area of my life. My XAStepfather, my father, all authority figures, and my XA have all made sure that I know this is a very undesirable character defect. I don't really need anyone else to add to my shame about this, especially since it's MY recovery.

I absolutely agree that moms need to get emotionally healthy before we can really be totally sane and responsible regarding our children's emotional well-being.

And yes, I wouldn't be asking the questions if I already had the answers.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:36 AM
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Thanks to all of you, especially Amy for bringing this very important and complicated subject to the forefront. As a community of posters we bring a lot of different backgrounds and perspectives to a forum that often becomes "first responders" to a someone in crisis reaching out while they are in extreme pain and confusion. We are all in different states of recovery and some of us are still "walking wounded" ourselves who trigger very easily when we view children being in possible danger.

I am not going to go back and look at my posts as I don't have time this morning but I am sure I might have been one of the folks who screamed "fire" when the poster was obviously in shell shocked PTSD themselves. Sadly, there isn't a perfect "formula" for when is the exact right way to handle one of the more dramatic and scary posters whose children are obviously in harms way psychologically and physically.

We deeply need all of us to speak into that persons life who has come here for direction and HOPE... we need Amy most of all. Someone who has been in their shoes and afraid of rejection and judgment to speak to them of how much she cares and how she found her way out of her situation.

Sometimes a very scared person who is at the tipping point might need to hear someone like me... an advocate for the scared child hiding in the closet or crying in the night wishing someone would help them escape the misery and horror of the alcoholic home. I was that child and a half century later I am still affected and while I am living a dream life of joy and gratitude I will never forget what it is like to be a helpless and innocent child frightened so much that she lost her ability to fear to this day. My brain actually destroyed that function of my brain... I never get icy tentacles of fear even if attacked or in a dangerous situation.

So I am the opposite of fearful and tentative... I will tear someone apart if like a mother tiger fighting for their cub....even if it is your cub or your child. I have to be reminded by
Amy and others that we are dealing with very broken people and have to use discernment and judgment when speaking to those coming out of the fog of abuse.

Balance is the key and most importantly reaching out to our HP and thinking through our responses carefully when it is a crisis situation with a newcomer who we could potentially drive off with too harsh or judgmental a response.

Truth is what sets us free ultimately... getting a new pair of glasses to view our world and life situation and for all of us it took a LOT more time than we think it should take for others...lol! I was here for years and I read my old posts just to remind me how blind I was! NO ONE could tell me that I wasn't going to get my man sober...lol!

Anyway... maybe we could always make sure that the newcomer knows that this is a community that welcomes EVERYONE to share their experience (I do try to stay in this realm but I have been known to stray) strength and hope and just like everywhere else on the planet we are very diverse in our opinions and styles of communication.

Eating hay and spitting out straw is a good thing. Years later I found the straw I hated two years ago was actually the delicious stuff that set me free in time! The posters who told me the truth years ago that I ignored I now LOVE their posts and nod my head at their sage wisdom and the newcomers don't like what they have to say!

So... I say "stick around" and "keep coming back" and now we need to add "we love you right exactly where you are right now" .... "one day at a time" ....

I love this place.... because we are all different and we are still "growing".... thanks for the lesson Amy and I will work on my "kinder and gentler side" that my A father robbed from me when I was 6 years old and crying in the closet hoping that he wouldn't really throw that gas in his hand and match on the house to kill us all.
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Old 04-14-2014, 08:51 PM
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Wow, I just need to say that there are many powerful posts here. I want to thank you for that and for your support. I don't even know how to tell you how much I appreciate each and everyone of you for sharing your experience here. Just know that I have a place in my heart for all of you. Thank you so much for sharing, and I welcome any others that want to share.

Just know we love you, and we care about you.
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Old 04-26-2014, 04:45 PM
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I had several posters tell me at times that I was harming the children.

It really hurt my feelings, and for a while, I left the SR community because I just didn't want to get bashed every time I said something.

Looking back now, I needed it. Maybe not at the time, but of course, the people who said those things were right, and if I looked at the me of two years ago now, I would be even meaner about it. There were times when I was not emotionally in a good place at all, and in all honesty, probably shouldn't have had the kids with me when I was dealing with all of those issues.

BUT, I got through it, it made me stronger, and looking back, these people were right. At the end of the day, no one can tell what anyone else is feeling, and even if we think we wouldn't handle something the same way, we don't know the whole story. Everything on this forum is one sided, after all, we never get to hear THEIR side of the story.

In light of recent events, yeah, I was an idiot, and thank you guys who told me that, even though it took a while for me to notice. Just at the time when I came for help, it didn't come across as helping. My feelings were really hurt. I had nowhere to turn. Now, I am happy that I keep coming back regardless of what was said at those few times, because I do need it.
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Old 05-17-2014, 05:50 AM
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For anyone who has been reading this, I am ACOA, RA, and a DV survivor. I still stand by what I originally said, always will. See as an Acoa, I never knew what was normal, that is why I got involved and thought DV situations were "normal". I guess I could have gone through my lifetime believing this, that it was normal, but I had questions. I asked, a lot of times I didn't like the answer, I was just trying to fix things, and I somewhat turned away, but I kept reading. Some may not. The ones in the worst situation may not, and that is why I thought I would bring this up. I know this is an old topic, and I am sorry about that, that I brought this up again.

So many times we can just relate to black and white areas, just remember there is always the outside of the box, the gray area.
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Old 08-26-2017, 02:52 PM
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I will be bumping some older stickie posts so we don't lose them from our search feature. It might be a little cluttered until you post on the normal threads.
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