What IF....

Old 10-06-2013, 06:34 PM
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Question What IF....

My ABF is incarcerated for his second DUI and facing a few years in prison due to complications from his first DUI which almost killed him and his passenger.
I just joined this site yesterday looking for some insight from others who are facing similar battles. When I told my story all the feedback I received was to get out of the relationship now. As hard as it is to swallow I know this is true but the part of me that still believes in my ABF doesn't want to leave. I want to stay in hopes that he will change. Every thought I have that confirms my need to leave him is followed by a doubt... The question "What if..." is haunting me. I just go back forth between staying and going.

"What if he really does mean it when he says he wants to change and he's just having a hard time figuring out how."
I know he wants to be better but I don't know if he wants it enough. He has cut back significantly but when he does drink he still lies and attempts to deceive me.
However, he seems to be trying to control it rather than actually fix it.
I wonder - Is he just attempting to control it to pacify me or himself? I want to believe that people tell the truth. I want to believe that everyone isn't just self-serving.
But WHAT IF that's a wish made in vain?

"What if I make a mistake by leaving him?"

"What if he changes and goes into recovery?"
I know that everyone's battle with alcohol is different. It is harder for some people to stay in recovery than others. It is also harder for some to realize they need to recover but easier to maintain recovery once they are in it.

"What if he just relapses once he recovers? And what if he doesn't?"
If I could look into the future and see that he recovers fully without relapsing constantly or turning into a "dry drunk" I would stay with him because when he's sober our relationship is wonderful and full of love.
He seems to be trying to

"What if I stay with him just to discover he will never change?"
I know I could not live that way. I won't live that way and that's why I want to leave him now. But the "What if" and the hope that he can make a sound recovery is causing me to second guess my decision.

Again, everyone and everyone's battle with alcoholism is different. How can I know if he will change how can I know how far gone he his?

"What if I leave him and he gets better? What if I left the one man I've ever loved?"

"What if the skies just opened and a great voice boomed down on me to tell me what to do." Would I do it, even then?
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:57 PM
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Your post, again, is all about HIM. You're focusing on the wrong person here. Everything he has told you indicates that he doesn't want to stop drinking. He is telling you who he is, so believe it. The odds of him getting and staying sober long-term are slim.

Do you want to What If yourself for the next five, 10, 15, 20 years? Because that's what life with an addict brings. What do YOU want for YOURSELF in life? What kind of marriage do YOU want? What kind of father do YOU want for your future children to have? What are YOU prepared to do should you have children in an alcoholic home? It's a hell on earth that no child deserves. What about YOUYOUYOU??? Forget about HIM right now. You need to figure out what it is about YOU that makes this life even remotely appealing. Therapy, Al-Anon, something for YOU. I think I sense a theme here...
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:03 PM
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I understand your point. But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober. If he were sober he could give me the life I want.
Let's pretend he didn't have a drinking problem... If that were the case he would be everything that I want for the future.
That's what kills me.
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by FreeTheLOVE View Post
I understand your point. But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober.
You're avoiding the real question here. What kind of life do you want for yourself? Not WHO. You want a sober partner, and that's great. The only control you have is over yourself. You can't change him and never will. If he doesn't want to change, he won't. So, what so you want for your life, and are you realistically going to get that in your current situation? What are you going to do if you get five years down the road and you're still here posting the same threads? Nothing changes if nothing changes. Are you ok with that?
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:32 PM
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When you play "what if" you are playing a game of let's pretend. The reality is that he is what he is. When someone shows you who they are believe them. As they say in Game Of Thrones, words are wind.

If you understand then things are just as they are.
If you don't understand then things are just as they are.

Believe him when he shows you who he is, someone who is willing to drive drunk even though he almost killed someone once before.

Your friend,
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:40 PM
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I get what you are saying! I asked myself this question for along time and every now & then I struggle with it even today but nothing changed in my XABF case. I wasted a lot time and did a lot of damage to myself.

I believe people can change but I also understand addiction is very powerful. I had to ask myself...even if this person was sober would I want to deal with the after math of the big mess! Don't really think so bc lots of damage has been done. Would I trust him? Don't really think I could after the trusting so many times. The list goes on....

I really loved him or the person he could be. I really think I always will love him. He had some very wonderful qualities. I finally had to stop asking myself that same ol question and move on for myself.

Wishing you the best.
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by FreeTheLOVE View Post
I understand your point. But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober. If he were sober he could give me the life I want.
Let's pretend he didn't have a drinking problem... If that were the case he would be everything that I want for the future.
That's what kills me.
I've been where you are now, playing the "what if?" game about my XABF...I'm sure you can't help it now, but when you catch yourself doing it, try to remind yourself that this way of thinking is NOT helping you and it will not bring you closer to peace. It is basically self torture.

Many people here on this forum, including myself, can totally relate to the pain of the XA (or RA, or current A) being "everything [I] want for the future"...except for the whole alcoholism thing. My XABF had so many wonderful qualities, and we had many moments were things just felt "right." It was something I hadn't felt in years, and before I met him, I began wondering if I was ever going to feel it again....Then we met, and it was amazing. Until, of course, his alcoholism revealed itself.

My XABF also had a criminal record with alcohol related charges. All of the incidents involved him wasted and arguing/fighting with police when they confronted him. When we met, he'd been on probation for 3 years because he kept violating it. He sounded remorseful and embarrassed, so I gave him the benefit of the doubt. I'd forgotten about all that until I saw him wasted for the first time, and he got into a fight at a bar. I was terrified....What was I thinking, dating someone with that criminal record, someone who gets into bar fights?? Sometimes I think we listen to our hearts more than our heads...

It's incredibly painful to not only mourn the loss of a relationship, but you also mourn the loss of this person who you thought you knew/loved/had a future with. This is not to say what you or I or anyone else here had with their XA wasn't "real," but what we had was not enough to 'win' over the A's addiction. In my case, I thought my XABF wanted to change when he said he did. I believed him when he said I was the "best thing" that ever happened to him. But what he showed me with his actions, was something totally opposite. He showed me that he could manipulate me, put me down, ditch me, minimize my feelings, because I was a roadblock to his alcohol. Still, I mourn him and what I hoped we could have. No one here will blame you for doing the same. The thing is, you must focus on what DID happened...not what could have, or what you wished would have. I realize this is difficult now, but it will get easier with time. You deserve someone who is available NOW, not 'maybe' or 'what if?' in the future...
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:47 PM
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You're asking for a crystal ball. Nobody here has one.

You're future tripping. The "what ifs" of life are endless, not just about him, but about any thing you can future trip on...think about it!

The only him you know is the person he is today. Who will he be tomorrow? What's his potential?
We tell people a lot here something that seems to sink in on that note.
Are you loving someone's potential, or who they are today?
Why love someone's potential?

Not let's take a look at that potential that you see.
Who says it is what he wants to be?
Who says he will ever turn into your fantasy?
He's going to turn into who he wants to be, not who you want him to be.

One more thing...prison for two years, from my understanding, is not exactly an enlightening zen orientated growth experience.
In other words, he could very well come out of there worse than when he went in.
It's well understood our prison system does not cure criminals, but rather, hooks them up together for more bad behavior, demeans them, treats them like children, and offers little opportunity for growth, or skills to make it on the outside.
Of course, there are no absolutes.
You could wait it out for a few precious years in your 20's to see...tick tock...tick tock....time waits for nobody.

Let's get back to the subject at hand, shall we?
YOUR life.
Not him, not his life. We don't give a rat's patootie about him, naturally. You're here with us seeking help, he's not, and apparently in denial.
YOUR LIFE!
Who do you want to be? What's your potential?

Coming from an alcoholic family, and now this ABF that is going to spend a couple years behind bars, is NOT breaking the mold.
I thought you wanted to break the mold?
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:54 PM
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But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober." (Free the Love)

^^^^^^^^^^^^


Oh FreetheLove, this is NOT how this works.

While you have some valid "what ifs" running through your mind, I can only assure you that there is absolutely no way of knowing if he is ever going to quit drinking.

If you want to choose to start basing your life on the facts of this serious situation a lot of those "what if's" will vanish.

I would let go of the romantic movie that is currently playing, and come to the present and face the fact that I probably have all these feelings for someone who is NOT currently available. The only way I know to handle issues like this is to get real honest with myself and face the truth. ( and yep, it's going to hurt for awhile)

your boyfriends battle with alcoholism is NOT UNIQUE, he is no different than anyone else who is struggling with active addiction.

Let's just fast forward for a minute here, what do you think his life is going to be like when he gets released from prison? He's not going to have a driver's licence, how is he going to get back and forth to work? In the event, he is granted a restricted licence, the cost of insurance, and other fees associated with getting your licence back are astronomical, he'll be lucky to have enough money to buy a can of beans at the end of the week. Also employers do these background checks now days, he may have great difficulty in even finding gainful employment. it would be real easy to become resentful being the sole provider for the household.

And you know what, none of the above is your problem, set yourself free, pick yourself up, brush yourself off, and go do what 24 year women do, Live your life, currently he has nothing to offer you.

You have the power of choice, you get to decide if you want to continue to hurt and feel the way you currently do, or you can choose exit the crazytrain.

Doing the right thing is never easy, but I can assure you you will not always feel like you do today.

Get proactive in your own life, and allow him the consequences of his choices.
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by FreeTheLOVE View Post
I understand your point. But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober. If he were sober he could give me the life I want. Let's pretend he didn't have a drinking problem... If that were the case he would be everything that I want for the future.
That's what kills me.

If he were sober he could GIVE YOU the life you want?
No.
Nobody gives you a life.
That's something you go MAKE for yourself.
That's something you GIVE yourself.
Others can't do that for you. You hold the reins here, you are writing the story of your life, nobody else...just you.

Let's pretend there are no wars.
Let's pretend there is no starvation.
Let's pretend everyone is fair.
Let's pretend everyone is loving.
Let's pretend...
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:04 PM
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You posted yesterday that both of your parents and your step father are alcoholics. When we are children and the people who are supposed to protect us hurt us over and over we are victimized and traumatized. Children in these situations can't leave, they are helpless.

When we grow up we tend to gravitate towards people that feel familiar. Even though they might be hurting us, we stick with it, because it resonates deep within us. Just as importantly we think that we can fix them. Often without knowing it we have recreated the most painful part of our past. Someone who lets us down and hurts us. We try to do as adults what we couldn't do as children.

It took me years to believe that. I didn't think I had it that bad, and it felt excruciatingly disloyal and like I was breaching a trust to admit that I was harmed. I would encourage you to check out a ACOA meeting.

I was lucky enough to have some really good relationships with guys when I was younger, high school, college, my twenties. I've been married for almost 17 years now.

I have never looked back on any past relationship and regretted ending it, I promise you that when one door closes another one will open.
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:07 PM
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I understand the feeling of "it's her and no one else".

It is one of the worst effects of a terrible relationship. Nothing about that feeling is healthy.

In a healthy relationship, I find I'm glad to have that person in my life. I could see it without them, I know I could fall in love with someone else - we both could. It is because I know I'm worth loving.
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:10 PM
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Trixie spoke my heart, as I am 5 years past my first what-ifs. Blue Skies has a very good point about the effect prison might have.

So maybe you like to think, 'what if'. Okay. What if he only gets worse? What if he starts to abuse you down the road? What if he dies from his disease? What if there is someone even better for you? What if you go too Al anon (perhaps you already do) and you get serious about your recovery and feel great about yourself? What if you feel so good about yourself that you start attracting saner people and more joyful experiences onto your life? These are questions that I need to ask myself just as much as you might need to ask them.

The what-if questions that you have asked smell like fear. Most Americans, in my opinion act consistently on fear, not faith. I'm still new at complete faith, but I know that acting out of fear has NOT helped me to create the life I really want. It has helped me to feel less self-assured. It has helped me to become dependent on someone who was unavailable to me. I'm ready to be brave and have faith in my Higher Power and myself and ask, "What if I start really loving myself and attract a very sane, healthy partner who loves and honors my child and me?" "What if I have fun in this process?"
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:16 PM
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Hi freethelove, I felt the same way about my AH 13 years ago. I thought we could sort things out, that our life and all that we had invested in it (emotionally more than financially) would not be wasted.
After numerous relapses (which are perfectly normal, so everyone kept telling me, and I kept believing), I have now decided the only option is to get out. His behaviour along with his drinking has just got more and more extreme over the years.
We have been married for 29 years and it is a huge wrench for me, but it is the only way I can see myself having a relatively normal life.
I think he will always be a part of my life, until the point at which he actually kills himself but he will not be my life.
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:21 PM
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Your happy future won't start to unfold until you start to look at yourself. It won't be found in the empty promises of an active alcoholic.

Most of us here have been right where you are. If only. Only if. What if? Those are really torturous words. They keep us trapped.

My heart goes out to you, Free. I sincerely hope and pray that you are able to start putting your focus on you because at the end of the day, the only person responsible for your happiness is you.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:08 PM
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Free the love, I just want to let you know that you are not alone in your pain. It is so hard to let go of someone, especially if we think they are part of the dream that we are trying to bring true. The good thing is that if you do decide to let go of your ABF, the pain won't last. I am 2 & 1/2 months past my AX (son's dad) ditching me. We were together for 7 years. It still hurts now, but it has gotten better. It always gets better when you let go. There are ways to let go and still keep contact with someone. I used to be afraid to go through this pain of losing my partner so I stayed. Ironically I just had to go through the pain anyway. Life just gives us pain sometimes. Oddly enough, the pain of staying with him and wishing he would change lasted longer than my darkest, most hopeless and depressed days following the breakup - YEARS longer.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by FreeTheLOVE View Post
I understand your point. But the problem is I want him. I just want him sober, completely sober. If he were sober he could give me the life I want. .
OH my gosh, I completely understand you! I have SAID those words, I still have days when I say those words, but, guess what... I'm starting to say them less and less.

I guess the only difference is that I really don't think my AH can give me the life I want. I am very religious, so I know the life I really want it already waiting for me in the hereafter. This isn't my home,it's just a pit stop.

But, yes, of course, many of us think or thought that. "He would be sooo perfect if he would just stay sober!"

Over the last few weeks, I've come to the realization that I need some major detachment. I'm taking baby steps right now, I'm trying to build the life I want for ME, even if he is under the same roof. I'm doing more for me, I'm letting him do what he wants (so far that hasn't been drink, but we'll see... Regardless, I need to figure out what it takes for AllThings to make HERSELF happy, no matter what he's doing.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:38 PM
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I think one of the biggest mistakes we codies make is seeking out someone to MAKE us happy. Happiness is a state of mind. It is something you decide to be. It isn't something someone else decides for you. Nobody can give you a good life or happiness. You give those things to yourself. If you are unhappy or not living a good life, it is because you choose not to. The definition of "good" has been twisted to mean that we have material things, money, fame, popularity, or whatever the media pushes us to desire. Having a good life isn't mutually exclusive of not being rich or famous. We live on a tight budget. I work two days a week and am a homemaker the other five. We don't take vacations, drive fancy cars (all of our vehicles are used), or dine out except for special occasions. I shop at thrift stores for clothes. But I'm happy. Why? Because I choose to be. Plenty of women would be unhappy in my situation, but I'm not. I have nothing but gratitude for what I do have, and that's enough.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:59 PM
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I've been there. My A got into recovery, it was all peaches and sunshine and i felt a glimmer of hope--turns out, A's sometimes faithfully attend AA meetings and spout recovery quotes--and still continue to drink and lie!

If your A was saying stuff like, "as soon as she loses weight/changes her nose/has a baby/accepts Jesus/etc, etc--THEN we will be able to have a good love relationship," you'd run for the hills. Because love is accepting what IS, and embracing it.

What Al-Anon taught me is that no one else's changes are going to change my attitudes. It's my own choice. I chose to look at my A AS HE IS NOW, and ask myself if I could accept the reality of his temper, relapses, dishonesty and erratic behavior--and his unwillingness to seek help. NO.
He deserves to be around people who accept him exactly as he chooses to be. Whether it's the fellowship of AA or the regulars at the bar, is his choice. I just know it's not me.
I wish you the best, and highly recommend the sticky threads here, and al-anon meetings. They did wonders for me.
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Old 10-06-2013, 10:00 PM
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IMO this issue has got nothing to do with recovery, like a bunch of them in here do. People entering relationships or staying in them in which they expect the other person will magically change, or that they can change them, are likely making a mistake that will lead to misery.

Accept that this may be as good as it gets, or move on.

I wish you well.
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