Florence

A question:

Do you feel like you're trying to save them? I never wanted to save anybody necessarily, but deep down I guess I felt that nobody who was sane and whole would be with my broken a**. I guess it was more a reflection of me and where I was.

I feel like a lot of well-meaning guys are attracted to "broken" women because they want to save them, or control them (as in the case of abusers and addicts), or are afraid of having a relationship with an intellectual equal.

I can think of several nice guys in the past who were interested in me, and I flatly turned them down because I wasn't interested in being treated like a damsel in distress -- even if I was actually in distress.

firebolt

I think a lot of times it stems from a combination of low self esteem, young age (not sure how old you are?), and yeah, codependency.

On the self esteem - we are attracted to people that we think will be attracted to us - meaning subconsciously, sometimes we think that only think the crazies, or the unhealthy, or the addicted will be attracted to us (because deep down, we feel wqe're a little the same way). Also - we can create these self fulfilling prophecies in our lives (as lillamy said) - if we don't think we deserve healthy relationships, then we don't seek them out.

The other side of that is, healthy people won't be attracted to us if we are unhealthy, or have unhealthy thinking for ourselves.

It's a viscous cycle. You can break it by focusing on yourself for a while. I agree with some of the other posters that some counseling may be in order to get to the root of your feelings, and then learn how to cope, and then flush them out. Others said this too, but seeking out healthy friendships is a wonderful place to start 'training your picker.' Good luck!

Tuffgirl

Yes, this is possible. But the person who has to change first is you, Zen.

Here's what I've found, similar to Lillamy's description of the ride at the fair...its easy to confuse "adventure" and "dysfunction". There are a lot of emotionally available adventurous women in this world, so yes, you can find someone who lights up your world while at the same time has her "head on straight", but if you don't know what to look for - you may not see it.

A woman who has her head on straight isn't necessarily going to dive head first into a relationship. She will take her time getting to know you and sussing you out (which may make you feel uncomfortable because it will take a while to figure out where you stand with her). She will have her own life that she thoroughly enjoys and isn't interested in giving up. She may not make you soup if you are sick - at least not for a while in the beginning - because she is more interested in whether you can take care of yourself or not, because that is important to her.

It's these little actions you need to be on the look out for. Great sex doesn't necessarily happen right away, either. For emotionally available women who are taking their time to choose the right man for them, great sex won't be at the top of the immediate list of must-haves. But once she decides you are the one she wants to be with - chances are highly likely that will change! ; )

Be wary of the women who come on super strong right from the start - who chase you, who offer sex immediately, who are wild right from the get-go. These are actually red flags. An emotionally available and mature woman is going to have a high level of self respect - she won't feel the need to do it this way because she is confident the right man will stick around for as long as it takes, and she doesn't care about being alone or not.

Nuudawn

Our relationships are mirrors. Get healthy yourself.

ZenMe

It's funny because the first time I read that...in my head..."wow 2 years? I mean I was planning on going 6 months until 2014, me alone for 2 years? ouch!" I have actually been trying this, and unconsciously I was already doing the look but don't touch. I will definitely continnue to do this. I need to learn how to releate and be friends with healthy people and not insecure women who NEED me. The other reason it's funny is when I broke it off with the X I told her something similar (at her request) that a therapist told me she needs at least a year of no dating with her sobriety. She freaked at this comment! Clearly coulnd't even wait a day. I've already convinved myself I have to be patient, my happiness and well being depends on it!

As it turns out the 2 previous women I have dated seriously did flick the caretaker switch in me. Was I looking to rescue them? no. In my case I believe it stems from me needing a "strong" connection early on because otherwise I feel they aren't interested and not into me. Healthy girls i have approached in the past seem to not be interested because that intensity isn't there. Which it shouldn't be because they are in a good space. I'm looking for balance, a girl shouldn't have to quit her plans to come hang out with me (re-arrange her life for me), but I do want her to show me she cares when she does have time or need something. My xagf couldn't even drop off a package for me at the UPS store while I was out of town...always some excuse...I mean cmon...

My other problem I think is that when I get physically invovled I form a waaay to strong attachment. A girl I dated between my serious Xs went nuts on me on date 3 (alcohol was involved I see now) and I was easily able to end that and extricate myself. Had we slept together...uh oh. She tried to sleep on me at date 2 and was already harboring resentment because I didn't sleep with her.

Yea I would stick around, and prefer it that way. With my x before the xagf I had sex too quickly and with the xagf although we did pace the sex part...we had been embraced in each others arms towards the end of the first night we met while both enjoying a concert, she definitely put the moves on me. At the end of that night (in hindsight she was tipsy) we kissed. This type of behavior is now a big red flag for me. I could lie to myself and say I was special and it was meant to be BUT, her behavior after I broke up with her, dating other guys, having a bf a few weeks after...tells me it's more of her MO. =(. Live and learn.

Also I will not have sex with a girl unless we both get tested beforehand. If she has a problem with that...they get the door.

One thing I have also been practicing is saying to myself when I maybe don't want to go somewhere because I don't feel up to it, nothealthy enough, or what not is "I'm good enough", just because I am.

Thank you all for the wonderful insights. I definitely need some time to regroup or I will succumb to the cycle again, which I too refuse to do. I think I start to get healthy after a breakup and then fall back in vs keeping the focus on me and getting way healthier. I have my plan, it's ok to be alone in order to reach my goals, here we go!

petmagnet

Interesting thread. I grew up in a stressful home, mom was probably bipolar- never went to get diagnosed and brother was an addict. But, I always ran from what I thought was the " wild n crazy" people. I thought I could tell, I guess not. The stable focused and goal driven man I thought knew since age 14 and eventually married became an alcoholic. Was there warning signs looking back? Yep. He drank a lot at parties, fun in bed if he wasn't too drunk (yes, I consider myself normal for the most part and like fun in bed, we do exist), and he lived for the weekend cuz he could binge. I hoped it was normal and he'd out grow the love of drinking. BUT (here's the important part)...Intuition told me different even back then. I had fears and doubts but didn't listen. I thought he'd out grow it but instead it just got worse with time. My advice, listen to your head not your hearts desire. If it is telling you it's not right, it not. Follow your gut and if something feels "wrong" about the person or situation then get the heck out! I've learned the hard way to trust my instincts, they are almost always right. I bet yours are too. We are not hard wired in anyway, just hard headed.

drunkyjules

I think I've always gone for a bad boy type but have always been a little bad myself. I needed someone who would accept my behavior and most nice guys wouldn't be with a pothead alcoholic.

I'm sober now and still think about it when seeing people and their "nice guys".

And there is something about crazy people. My ex was that way - when he was up it was great times, he just had this sparkly personality but when he was down it was like, oh my god what do I do with you how do I make it better. One of my friends told me I always want to fix people.

Ultimately I have calmed down but still crave the excitement, something I can't have, something I know I shouldn't have.

Its something I need to work on because its only going to cause me trouble.....funny I was just dealing with it today........

AnvilheadII

women can't fix ya. hot women, sexy women, broken women, crazy women....not even HEALTHY women! ok, on the last bit...a healthy woman can inspire to you KEEP getting healthy if you are ready...like a gym partner or a personal trainer....personal trainers don't go skulking about LOOKING for someone to SAVE....they are already in the gym, already doing the "healthy" thing and if someone comes in "wanting what they have to offer" they are there.

kinda like AA - if you want what we have to offer and are willing to go to any lengths to get it....

wait until you can see women like a doubles partner in tennis instead of THE ONE, as someone who has some similar interests, skills, etc, that complements YOUR interests and skills, etc.

look for someone you could survive a 5000 mile roundtrip road trip WITH a dog in the car and never once wish to kill the other. not NEED to touch to feel connected. that you can be intimate with your clothes on.

actually don't LOOK for anyone. work on YOU, become that exciting, interesting, centered person you keep seeking in others. be ok being YOU.

LifeRecovery

Zenme-

This statement is as much about me as it is about insight.

I am finding that what I do in intimate relationships, also, often gets me into trouble in friendships too (both with same sex and opposite sex relationships). I do that and the complication of sex is not even in place.

I guess my question for you is are you repeating this in other areas of your life?

ZenMe

I can fix me.

For a second there I was like...she plays tennis...I loved road trips with her... lol. I'm still in the grieving process. I'm feeling less depression and more acceptance. As the relationship got worse I can totally see how I contributed. Things like this help me accept.

I'm getting stronger and all that jazz, I just can't afford to lose that strength and identity in relationships. I have been cleaning house, taking care of business and I'm now getting excited on a startup idea I had on the back burner.

It's not for new ideas, people, things, girlfriends to get me excited, it's for me to put myself in a place where I can actually feel it from within.

LifeRecovery,

With friends and others who are healthy, I get along fine and do not find them boring. Thread title could have used some elaboration but I was on a small cell. To me this is exclusive of girls I fall for.

Kimmieh

Precious boredom...

LifeRecovery

Zen-

What great info you are getting about how you do it, and how you would like to do it differently.

What a great gift you are giving yourself.

nbay2013

I can't really contribute except to say, awesome conversation.

OnawaMiniya

I believe that certain experiences can happen repeatedly due to our personal need to learn/resolve/let go of specific things. Often you will experience a similar thing over and over until that lesson is learned, and therefore those experiences are no longer something you attract/are attracted to.

What are you trying to relive and resolve from your emotionally abusive upbringing? What are you trying to redo? What ending are you looking for?

Peace.

Hopeworks

Highly dysfunctional foo set the stage for me to be drawn to the handsome, charismatic, sensuous man with an addictive personality.... Like a moth drawn to a burning candle I repeated this destructive pattern over and over. I found stable "normies" boring as well.

Years of unraveling myself has set me free from my gathering toxic people under my wing and you are on the path to freedom and serenity.... Keep exploring addiction, codependency and spend time with a great counselor.

And on the subject of great chemistry.... That is exactly what it is ... Our brains dumping heavy loads of feel good chemicals that become our drug of choice. When we break up our brains and body dump chemicals that are just te opposite to draw you back to the mate you are leaving!

Time is the healer and your friend. Knowledge and understanding ourselves and weaknesses makes for informed choices. Sticking our hand on the hot stove repeatedly eventually changes behavior... At least for me!

ZenMe

Hrmm... I believe I'm trying to find someone who will actually be there for me, from an emotional stand point.

Not looking for a specific ending. My best friend, excitement, companionship, to be a priority etc.

Can you go into more detail about how the brain/body dumps chemicals to draw you back to your mate?


In re-reading this thread and thinking about it. It wasn't the sex that got me attached first, it was actual physical touch, the first time on her lap as she stroked my head, the first time we were in eachothers arms as we listened to a band.

Wisconsin

Well, as someone who has been almost totally starved of affection from her spouse for almost 3 years, I can say that the physical touch stuff can be very powerful emotionally. When my mom died last year, a woman I didn't know very well at work came up to me and gave me a hug, and in that moment, when I was in that place emotionally, it was the best, most meaningful hug I had received in months. So much about these things is just so complex and difficult to understand.

dandylion

ZenMe, go to a website called Chemistry.com and you will see a ton of articles about the chemistry aspect. It can be a complex subject--but, these interesting articles are written for the layman and are easy to understand.

dandylion

dandylion

ZEN---if you would like more detailed (meatier) reading on the subject--check out any books written by Helen Fisher---she is an anthropologist who has done lots of recent research on this very thing. Her research has been pretty well received.
Go on amazon and you will find her books there---you can get the used ones at discount.
This stuff should be fascinating to you....... It is to me......

dandylion

Summerpeach

You really want to know how to stop the cycle? Be alone!!! Stop dating and be alone to fin out who you really are and learn how to love yourself.
No one is "normal" so don't think you will find normal. I also think you're mistaking healthy for boring. There are amazing and fun healthy people everywhere, but since you probably have self esteem issues, you will gravitate towards people who also have self esteem issues.

Get to an Al Anon meeting and be alone and learn about YOU. It's the only way