Regaining Male Identity
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NE Wisconsin USA
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Regaining Male Identity
Not sure about that title...
But years ago at an Alanon meeting a man said something that has stuck with me for years....honestly I have thought negatively about it...but now see I have a long way accepting myself as the male I am.
He said: "My ex married me because I was a kind, sensitive man, who was unafraid to show his feelings. She divorced me because she wanted a real man."
Seemingly trivial but hard to let go, "If I was more of a man my ex wouldn't have sought out all of those other men." "If I had a backbone I would have confronted the men, and quickly divorce."
I no longer mentioned my belief in Jesus in meetings, "because she said it was inappropriate."
I accepted her criticism when I "acted gay."
I accepted her criticism of my mother and family.
on and on...I even felt lower when she divorced me!
Over twenty years since we divorced.....I truly made amends to her by letter and in person....after the divorce I abandoned her with 3 toddlers.
After 10 years I saw her at our son's wedding...I avoided her as much as possible...a hello and handshake...it was quite amusing to sit at the family table with her, her current boyfriend, two EH, and a former boyfriend.
One thing I noticed is that she is still a terrible dancer...it was so embarrasing...and I remembered her telling me I didn't know how to dance!
Whatever...I'm embracing my maleness...I had pretty much loss my identity in several dysfunctional relationships and with my own alcoholism/addiction.
At 52 I'm still trying to be male...kind of sad....but a lot to work on.
Any advice/suggestions? Experiences?
Thanks
But years ago at an Alanon meeting a man said something that has stuck with me for years....honestly I have thought negatively about it...but now see I have a long way accepting myself as the male I am.
He said: "My ex married me because I was a kind, sensitive man, who was unafraid to show his feelings. She divorced me because she wanted a real man."
Seemingly trivial but hard to let go, "If I was more of a man my ex wouldn't have sought out all of those other men." "If I had a backbone I would have confronted the men, and quickly divorce."
I no longer mentioned my belief in Jesus in meetings, "because she said it was inappropriate."
I accepted her criticism when I "acted gay."
I accepted her criticism of my mother and family.
on and on...I even felt lower when she divorced me!
Over twenty years since we divorced.....I truly made amends to her by letter and in person....after the divorce I abandoned her with 3 toddlers.
After 10 years I saw her at our son's wedding...I avoided her as much as possible...a hello and handshake...it was quite amusing to sit at the family table with her, her current boyfriend, two EH, and a former boyfriend.
One thing I noticed is that she is still a terrible dancer...it was so embarrasing...and I remembered her telling me I didn't know how to dance!
Whatever...I'm embracing my maleness...I had pretty much loss my identity in several dysfunctional relationships and with my own alcoholism/addiction.
At 52 I'm still trying to be male...kind of sad....but a lot to work on.
Any advice/suggestions? Experiences?
Thanks
I'm not a man, so my only experience on the subject comes from being the "person" we want to be.
First of all, let go of her criticisms. They are pointless and her opinion only.
Secondly, be the man you are proud of at the end of each day, when standing in front of the bathroom mirror. If you can look yourself in the eye and think "I rocked today!" than you are doing great! Because in the end (of the day or of your life) it is just you anyway. Be the man you want to be.
Lastly, I think the concept of "real man" gets really blurry. But to me, a real man has integrity. It isn't about having a "backbone" as much as it is having values and standing up for those values, even in the face of great adversity. Doing what's right, even when you don't want to. It isn't about how you dance or if you like interior decorating. Don't buy into society's stereotypes.
Peace,
~T
First of all, let go of her criticisms. They are pointless and her opinion only.
Secondly, be the man you are proud of at the end of each day, when standing in front of the bathroom mirror. If you can look yourself in the eye and think "I rocked today!" than you are doing great! Because in the end (of the day or of your life) it is just you anyway. Be the man you want to be.
Lastly, I think the concept of "real man" gets really blurry. But to me, a real man has integrity. It isn't about having a "backbone" as much as it is having values and standing up for those values, even in the face of great adversity. Doing what's right, even when you don't want to. It isn't about how you dance or if you like interior decorating. Don't buy into society's stereotypes.
Peace,
~T
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NE Wisconsin USA
Posts: 6,223
Secondly, be the man you are proud of at the end of each day, when standing in front of the bathroom mirror. If you can look yourself in the eye and think "I rocked today!" than you are doing great! Because in the end (of the day or of your life) it is just you anyway. Be the man you want to be.~T
Seriously, this will be my focus today....never quite thought of being the man I want to be...but what society, women, even men think I should be.
Damn it I like cooking, cats, gardening, and houseplants, poetry, and art.
Ignore anything your XW ever told you about being a "Man".. I LOVE sensitive, creative, and emotional men. Not just for company but sexually too. I've been told what I am looking for is a "lesbian in a man's body."
I have this gay friend who takes me out on "dates". He's always dressed perfectly and dances so beautifully. Honestly, even though he is gay, he feels like more of a man to me than any of the straight guys I know. And when I am with him, I feel like more of a woman.
If you're not the beer guzzling, football watching, porn watching type, GOOD. Embrace it. I think being a "man" is about having the courage to be yourself, and like TG said, ignoring society's norms.
Maybe your XW's issue was more about how she felt about herself as a woman. She was looking to you to help her define her feminity or something, and when you didn't do it, she blamed you for not being masculine enough?? It's just a thought.
I have this gay friend who takes me out on "dates". He's always dressed perfectly and dances so beautifully. Honestly, even though he is gay, he feels like more of a man to me than any of the straight guys I know. And when I am with him, I feel like more of a woman.
If you're not the beer guzzling, football watching, porn watching type, GOOD. Embrace it. I think being a "man" is about having the courage to be yourself, and like TG said, ignoring society's norms.
Maybe your XW's issue was more about how she felt about herself as a woman. She was looking to you to help her define her feminity or something, and when you didn't do it, she blamed you for not being masculine enough?? It's just a thought.
"My ex married me because I was a kind, sensitive man, who was unafraid to show his feelings. She divorced me because she wanted a real man."
My definition of a "real man" is much like Tuffgirl's. Come to think of it, that's pretty close to my definition of a "real woman" too. A real mensch is true to themselves, their values, and their principles. And that's the people I want to surround myself with. Whether as friends or as a spouse.
I was married to John Wayne's wanna-be twin, and Ill tell you, I am looking for the kind, sensitive type of man next time.
I work around firefighters all day long at work. And they may seem like the manliest of men to outsiders but my firefighter boss is a cat loving cook.
Whatever your loves and beliefs are, embrace them. If you know what you like and what you want from life, you will be the manliest of men in my opinion.
4MyBoys
I work around firefighters all day long at work. And they may seem like the manliest of men to outsiders but my firefighter boss is a cat loving cook.
Whatever your loves and beliefs are, embrace them. If you know what you like and what you want from life, you will be the manliest of men in my opinion.
4MyBoys
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 236
Fitting into stereotypes has never really been my thing. Especially when it comes to my identity as a man. While I'm gay, I can fix cars, build houses, cook, clean, and decorate a mean birthday cake. I don't dress in the latest fashions, I don't have the flashiests of cars, I'm more at home on my ranch (well used to be mine) than I am in a city. I'm from the south yet I'm educated and street wise. I was in the military yet I'm more of a peace activist, all the while supporting my brothers and sisters in arms for the job they do to keep us as safe as they can.
I think we all are very much like the old sunday comics. From afar we look pretty normal, but up close we're just a bunch of dots making a bigger, more complete, complicated picture.
It's been said already on here but I'll paraphrase from Popeye "I yams what I yams and I can't be no mores".
I think we all are very much like the old sunday comics. From afar we look pretty normal, but up close we're just a bunch of dots making a bigger, more complete, complicated picture.
It's been said already on here but I'll paraphrase from Popeye "I yams what I yams and I can't be no mores".
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..."
Posts: 5,273
So I wonder how your ex wife would respond if I told her she should be more like a good woman and keep her mouth closed and be a little more submissive and ladylike. I would imagine that ridiculous sterotype of a woman wouldn't fly with her....nor should her stupidtabulous characterization of a man.
I have been in a very conservative field for the last 25 years, yet I have some piercings and lots of big tattoos. My friends tell me that although my outer appearance is very feminine, I often think and act like a dude ( whatever the eff that means)...people just can't seem to reconcile what they see as opposing traits. But you know, that's their problem, not mine.
I have been in a very conservative field for the last 25 years, yet I have some piercings and lots of big tattoos. My friends tell me that although my outer appearance is very feminine, I often think and act like a dude ( whatever the eff that means)...people just can't seem to reconcile what they see as opposing traits. But you know, that's their problem, not mine.
Actually, TG, in Alaska, that makes you extremely desirable wife material. I'll never forget when AXH got compliments from guys who had been driving by our house and saw me out shoveling the four feet of snow that had fallen. "DAMN good wife you got there, mate!"
Yeah, I never understood that either -- why your sexual preference should have anything to do with your other interests. It's not like there's an automatic tie between being attracted to men and having a great fashion sense or liking interior decorating -- I'm a real damn good example of that!
Fitting into stereotypes has never really been my thing.
My dad's gay.
When I went to college I joined a fraternity and slammed beers and picked up sorority chicks because I wanted to prove I was a "real man". I'd be damned if anyone thought I was the son of a limp-wristed fag. Guess how that worked out? Sound healthy to you?
We can spend our lives trying to regain identities, or create new ones. But putting on a different mask (ie "embracing maleness") is still a disguise. Stop looking for a new mask, even if it has a big beard and motorcycle, it's still a mask.
The only reality is the present. The past and future do not exist (we'll exclude space-time physics for the purpose of this discussion), and the only true reality that we can experience is NOW. So be who you are. And don't apologize.
Dress your cat in a peapod outfit and enter her in a cat show if it makes you happy. Who cares what others think? Dance to the beat of your own drum. If you do, then you WILL be a real man, and not caring about what anyone else says makes you an even better one. And stop worrying about impressing the ghost of an ex-wife, while you're at it. Good luck, bro!
When I went to college I joined a fraternity and slammed beers and picked up sorority chicks because I wanted to prove I was a "real man". I'd be damned if anyone thought I was the son of a limp-wristed fag. Guess how that worked out? Sound healthy to you?
We can spend our lives trying to regain identities, or create new ones. But putting on a different mask (ie "embracing maleness") is still a disguise. Stop looking for a new mask, even if it has a big beard and motorcycle, it's still a mask.
The only reality is the present. The past and future do not exist (we'll exclude space-time physics for the purpose of this discussion), and the only true reality that we can experience is NOW. So be who you are. And don't apologize.
Dress your cat in a peapod outfit and enter her in a cat show if it makes you happy. Who cares what others think? Dance to the beat of your own drum. If you do, then you WILL be a real man, and not caring about what anyone else says makes you an even better one. And stop worrying about impressing the ghost of an ex-wife, while you're at it. Good luck, bro!
Damn it I like cooking, cats, gardening, and houseplants, poetry, and art.
I was listening to NPR with some segment on Bruce Springsteen fans, and one of them said something I really liked, that Springsteen's music was all about what it meant to be "a decent man." I'm not a huge Springsteen fan, I like him fine, but what I really liked about it was that by this definition, a "decent man" is someone who is honest, kind, and hard-working, and who knows he is needed and special in the role he is in.
Notice that that has nothing to do with the size of his junk or the thickness of his beard and/or wallet and/or Popeye forearms. It has nothing to do with a stereotype, and yet we (Americans, anyway) all probably have an image in mind of what Springsteen's "decent man" is AND totally respect it.
Honest, kind, and hard-working.
Here's another meditation when you want one:
“Do I contradict myself? Very well, then I contradict myself, I am large, I contain multitudes.” -- Walt Whitman
Being a man is not what you are but who you are. I am 6'6" around 260lbs and most people say that their first impression of me is they are intimedated. But I am known among my friends as the gentle giant. I ride a big ol' Harley and also like to watch those movies on Hallmark that needs tissues. I love to garden and watch mixed martial arts on TV. What is important is that you are comfortable with who you are. It really doesnt matter is and is really nobody's business. I have tried for a long time being a fixer and thought it a noble calling. It wasnt until after I was on this site that I realized that all I was was an enabler. This is my biggest thing I work on. Of course I want people to like me. Of course I want to be noticed for the things I and accomplish. But at the end of the day what is most important is looking in the mirrot and being ok with what is looking back.
grizz
grizz
This cracked me up - and it is totally true! Not uncommon in our neck of the woods, but when I lived in the south (for 10 years) anytime I'd fire up something with a motor, one of the neighbor guys would be along within minutes to see if I needed help!
I once changed a flat on my car.
On 5th.
Right outside the mall.
In -15 degrees.
In a skirt and high heels.
Not one person stopped and offered to help me.
That's Alaska for you. It's not that men aren't chivalrous. It's just that the idea that I couldn't handle the situation on my own wouldn't occur to them.
On 5th.
Right outside the mall.
In -15 degrees.
In a skirt and high heels.
Not one person stopped and offered to help me.
That's Alaska for you. It's not that men aren't chivalrous. It's just that the idea that I couldn't handle the situation on my own wouldn't occur to them.
men who can cook just make me weak in the knees. in fact when hank first made me eggs benedict for breakfast i said "oh this one is MINE"!!!
i think it's akin to what grizz was saying...it's not what you do, it's confidence and joie de vivre with which you do it.
i think it's akin to what grizz was saying...it's not what you do, it's confidence and joie de vivre with which you do it.
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