choublak

Why do people always say that, like it's your fault for picking an alcoholic partner?

LexieCat

I've noticed that a LOT of people tend to "blame the victim." Sorta the way people blame rape victims for making bad choices, blaming HER for what someone else is responsible for doing to her.

I think some of it is a way of insulating themselves or making themselves feel invincible ("*I* would never be in that situation.")

dandylion

Choublak, I think that people usually say that when they become very frustrated at the partner for complaining endlessly about their victimhood---yet not taking responsibility to change their situation. Really, they are saying it out of frustration.

dandylion

LifeRecovery

In my case it WAS a pattern, and I did pick inappropriate people in my life (friendships too).

When I started to realize that and work on it, I started to step out of the victim role and start realizing I was responsible to the most important person in my life....me.

I don't regret those relationships.....I needed them for the opportunity for healing that I am not sure I would have gotten some other way.

AnonK

I've wondered the same question myself.

What people fail to realize sometimes is that a person is only going to reveal as much about himself/herself that he/she wants someone else to know. Obviously, if our alkies had come to us and said: "Hi, I'm _____. I'm an alcoholic and when I'm drunk, I'm angry, loud, violent, obnoxious, abusive, etc., we would have most likely run the other way.

I like to think of everyone as a character. There's no way to know who ANY person truly is. No one is perfect.

dandylion

Welllll......many times, in the beginning, the behavior and history is screaming ADDICTION!!

The newly "in love" tends to rationalize away any negative features--if they even see them at all. The love hormones definitely mask reality to a certain extent. I think it is a real problem with relationships (not just alcoholic) that we do not get to know the person well enough or long enough before making a committment. Also, we don't look close enough.

dandylion

akalacha

And for some of us, our partners weren't As when we picked them, it came years later.

dandylion

akalacha, I think your situation is different--if they started drinking later. I am just having a discourse here...sharing thoughts...(LOL).

Really, it doesn't matter how the cow ate the cabbage, does it? The cabbage is gone!
Whether they were an in-your-face alcoholic or a smooth master of deception---everyone is in the same boat when they realize that their life is unmanageable due to alcoholism.

It isn't about blame at that point--blame is a waste of energy. It is about waking up and realizing that you have to save yourself--no matter what it takes. You have to save yourself--cause nobody else can or will.

At least, this is how I look at it.......


dandylion

choublak

Not necessarily. Many alcoholics in the early stages of alcoholism blend in with all the other "normal" drinkers.

dandylion

Actually, if read carefully....I said "many" times---I didn't say all the time or every time.

Yes, I agree, that in the early stages and especially among younger people, it is hard to determine at what stage---or, any stage, for that matter.

dandylion


P.S. There are times that behaviors ARE there in the beginnings of a relationship but are overlooked, or rationalized, or minimalized. Red flags that are ignored or not recognized.

NYCDoglvr

The first time a sponsor said that to me (while I was bitterly complaining about abf) it hurt a lot. But for me, it was true. I started taking responsibility for myself by seeing I didn't have to be with someone who was destructive and cruel. Change is a very slow process but until I changed what was wrong with me I couldn't have hope of any kind of happiness. Lots of women meet alcoholics, they just don't go out with them a second time.

fluffyflea

NYCDogLVR,

I just had such a rush of empowerment from reading your post.

It changes everything when we take responsibility for ourselves.

Tuffgirl

Personally, I find the statement offensive. But I can also see saying it out of frustration to someone who was moaning on and on about their miserable lot in life. If people are always saying it to you, Choublak, I'd suggest looking closer at what precedes that statement.

JMHO.

Amber23

my MIL asked why I married RAH. She said this after I was freaking out about his illness and effects on me and DD. I was annoyed and said, "well everyone else thinks he can just quit. Why would I be any different?"

firebolt

I say this to and about myself....to remind myself that my decisions lead me here, and my decisions will lead me out of it as well.

I *hope* it isn't meant as degrading or negative, but as an empowering reminder that your future is in your control - when someone says it to another person.

BlueSkies1

I don't think it's about having "picked" them. Maybe you knew but were ignorant, didn't have a crystal ball, didn't understand it, didn't see the worst of it, etc., and onward.

It's about at some point your life becomes painful, and we have to find a way to stop being in so much pain. THat's where the decision making and skill learning starts.

Having picked them as a partner is not evidence of our having some fatal flaw, anymore than having a child who later chose to become an addict, or a parent...or a friend.

I've said it. I remember saying it once to someone on this board. I was simply trying to remind the person that they chose to be in the relationship and that they could unchose that too. Remind the person that they played a part. It's so difficult to remember we are making choices and living a life when we are completely focused and obsessed about someone else! We forget we are half of the equation, with half the power, half the choices, and half the outcome.

CarryOn

This is one of those things that I think we can really beat ourselves up over...we really don't need others to do it too. My counselor reminds me that I knew what I knew at the time and made the best decision given the information I had. She also reminds me of that when I get frustrated with RAH about some things. So, now that I know, what am I going to do about it? Great responses here.

I came across this quote after being in counseling a few months and find it so appropriate...

"Learn to forgive yourself. When you do something that does not make you proud realize this; if you knew better, you would do better." Maya Angelou

Florence

Yes and yes. A major turning point to me was realizing that I have a string of emotionally unavailable, abusive men in my history. I was wildly attracted to all of them.

Something in my wiring makes me like the arrogant, cocky, distant guy. That has *yet* to turn out well for me. I didn't ask to be abused or mistreated, and I shouldn't have been and I deserved better.

But more telling to me about me is not that I didn't see red flags, but that many times I saw the red flags as their ASSETS. Or that I read the writing on the wall and believed I was powerful enough to rewrite it. The fat lady was singing and I was trying to shut her up, change her tune, and push her out of the colosseum.

Alternately, there's some good research out there that suggests that just as we "pick" the abuser, the abuser also "picks" us. They often groom their victims into accepting increasing levels of unacceptable behavior. This is one of the reasons I get so frustrated with the "just leave him!" narrative. Nobody enters a relationship hoping to get yelled at, cleaned out emotionally and financially, physically abused, and hope it all ends in an exhausting, messy divorce and/or an early, miserable death. We enter with the best intentions, and some of us just get conned by bad people. Straight up. Some of us are victims of con men.

Florence

And women! This is an equal opportunity mindf***.

Thumper

I used to say that to myself a lot.

For many years I'd say it "I picked him" and the ending was "so make it work." It kept me stuck for a very long time.

Along the way I became a little more self empowered and it changed. I'd say "I picked him" and the ending was "and I can un-pick him too."

Ultimately I see that line as a way for people to say that only we have the power to steer our own ship.

No one else dated, married, or lived with him. It was my choice, step by step, and all the future steps are my choice too. The fact that I was tricked, or misled, or to unhealthy to see, or in denial, or the other person did a 360 and went from sober and perfect to drunk and disastrous, or that I have four kids, or to big of a house - does not change the fact that are my steps to take, and mine alone. There is no other way.

ETA: when I was very unhappy and in that 'stuck' mode I used to complain a lot about my husband. I didn't even really complain about the drinking because part of my illness was to deny or hide that. I look back and I think about how that must have seemed to other people. :sigh: That was a reflection of me, not him. It must have been exasperating to outsiders, people not part of a support group like this. I bet there was more than one time they wanted to throw up their hands and scream at me "You picked him!"