Why do Alcoholics...
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Join Date: Jun 2013
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Why do Alcoholics...
Why do alcoholics allow a person to get so close to them, only to push them away?
Do they believe that that person will never find out about their drinking?
Or is a simply a case of they enjoy the persons company until they become a threat to the thing they enjoy the most? If this is the case, then why even get close to someone, if you know it will end in pushing them away?
I am no longer in contact with the person in my situation, and am moving on for myself, but my mind can go wandering back and just think....why?
Do they believe that that person will never find out about their drinking?
Or is a simply a case of they enjoy the persons company until they become a threat to the thing they enjoy the most? If this is the case, then why even get close to someone, if you know it will end in pushing them away?
I am no longer in contact with the person in my situation, and am moving on for myself, but my mind can go wandering back and just think....why?
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Because alcoholics are not known for their logic.
Even though their emotions are screwed up, they have them. They enjoy someone's company, they delude themselves that the drinking won't be a problem, that they can "control" it. They often don't think they are hurting anyone but themselves, and are shocked and annoyed when their partners complain about it.
Alcoholics are screwed-up people, but they ARE people. They want a relationship, but can't manage to maintain one. And they are often clueless as to why. So, rather than blame their drinking, they blame the other person, convince themselves everything would be fine if that person would just get off his/her back.
IOW, don't try to make sense of it. It makes no sense, except in sort of a warped, alcoholic way of thinking.
Even though their emotions are screwed up, they have them. They enjoy someone's company, they delude themselves that the drinking won't be a problem, that they can "control" it. They often don't think they are hurting anyone but themselves, and are shocked and annoyed when their partners complain about it.
Alcoholics are screwed-up people, but they ARE people. They want a relationship, but can't manage to maintain one. And they are often clueless as to why. So, rather than blame their drinking, they blame the other person, convince themselves everything would be fine if that person would just get off his/her back.
IOW, don't try to make sense of it. It makes no sense, except in sort of a warped, alcoholic way of thinking.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
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Well, they are people too. And people, in general, prefer to live with others.
Yet with an addiction, any perceived threat must be dealt with immediately, as to protect the addiction.
So it becomes a catch-22; the desire for companionship, love and acceptance vs. protecting the addiction, because the two don't mesh well, obviously.
Yet with an addiction, any perceived threat must be dealt with immediately, as to protect the addiction.
So it becomes a catch-22; the desire for companionship, love and acceptance vs. protecting the addiction, because the two don't mesh well, obviously.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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unindated, some others have been very articulate in their response to this question.
If I were to restrict my answer to just one word, it would be: "denial"
Denial is so powerful and can be used to justify about anything!
dandylion
If I were to restrict my answer to just one word, it would be: "denial"
Denial is so powerful and can be used to justify about anything!
dandylion
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Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 14
Thank you for this post and responses today. It's exactly what I needed today. You guys are right the are people and want to be loved just like everyone else. I kept wondering how in the world if he loved me... why he even wanted a relationship. I think he thought he could fight it. Now I see he really needs a recovery process it's not something you can just overcome or beat with will power alone. I think this post gave me a new sense of peace. I hope he can find it as well on his journey to sobriety. Everyone does deserve a chance at happiness!
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Join Date: Nov 2012
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This is a copy if a sticky in classic reading
What Addicts Do
My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, is my needs and how to go about fufilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and since I don't, I cannot love you.
My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by my drugs that I could be considered sociopathic. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, cheat on you and steal from you.
My behavior cannot and will not change until i make a decison to stop using/drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.
And until I make that decsion, I will hurt you again and again and again.
Stop being surprised.
I am an addict. And that's what addicts do.
__________________
Have A Great 24
-jon
What Addicts Do
My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, is my needs and how to go about fufilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and since I don't, I cannot love you.
My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by my drugs that I could be considered sociopathic. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, cheat on you and steal from you.
My behavior cannot and will not change until i make a decison to stop using/drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.
And until I make that decsion, I will hurt you again and again and again.
Stop being surprised.
I am an addict. And that's what addicts do.
__________________
Have A Great 24
-jon
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,572
Involved is right. The self delusion and lying in alcoholism leads you down a road that would be very close if not outright sociopathic.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Rochester, ny
Posts: 405
I needed this too, thank you EVERYONE
I think that the early time when you meet them and they are madly in love and sweep you off your feet and go above and beyond for you....I have been thinking that it's the very young part of themself wanting love and nurturing as we all do. Like a baby, their feelings in this stage are very very strong.
And our part in the mess (ok, MY part) is that my inner infant responds IN. TENSE. LY. I am hooked, if he has qualities looks, etc that ring my chimes.
I've fallen for true psychopaths, true Narcissistic Personality Disordered, Borderlines, loads of A's... (FOO--it's a frikken killer)...and i can say, the psychopath and the NPD were different. There was a coldness--malevolently playing me. The others who charmed my pants off WERE really head over heels, but I think it's different in that they were sincere.
Unfortunately, they couldn't sustain that level of connectedness with another person.
Meanwhile, as a codependent, I respond from that inner child place, which is ALSO close to the surface. I respond because my "inner child" RECOGNIZES another infantile adult and feels safe.
That reversion to infant-mind is so hard to manage. And then, SHAZAAM! Were hooked.
I think that the early time when you meet them and they are madly in love and sweep you off your feet and go above and beyond for you....I have been thinking that it's the very young part of themself wanting love and nurturing as we all do. Like a baby, their feelings in this stage are very very strong.
And our part in the mess (ok, MY part) is that my inner infant responds IN. TENSE. LY. I am hooked, if he has qualities looks, etc that ring my chimes.
I've fallen for true psychopaths, true Narcissistic Personality Disordered, Borderlines, loads of A's... (FOO--it's a frikken killer)...and i can say, the psychopath and the NPD were different. There was a coldness--malevolently playing me. The others who charmed my pants off WERE really head over heels, but I think it's different in that they were sincere.
Unfortunately, they couldn't sustain that level of connectedness with another person.
Meanwhile, as a codependent, I respond from that inner child place, which is ALSO close to the surface. I respond because my "inner child" RECOGNIZES another infantile adult and feels safe.
That reversion to infant-mind is so hard to manage. And then, SHAZAAM! Were hooked.
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Illinois
Posts: 25
This thread is great and exactly what I needed to hear.
Attraction is so powerful. Knowing what I know now, i only hope that I can stop, look and listen before becoming romantically involved with someone. I need to truly evaluate the attraction I feel to identify if the person is available, respectful and reciprocal. I have to allow myself time to get to truly know them before jumping in with both feet! When in the relationship I have to be able to step back and observe if I am doing all the work and giving or if it is shared. I have to also learn how to be better at receiving.
Attraction is so powerful. Knowing what I know now, i only hope that I can stop, look and listen before becoming romantically involved with someone. I need to truly evaluate the attraction I feel to identify if the person is available, respectful and reciprocal. I have to allow myself time to get to truly know them before jumping in with both feet! When in the relationship I have to be able to step back and observe if I am doing all the work and giving or if it is shared. I have to also learn how to be better at receiving.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Waterford MI
Posts: 4,202
Unfortunately, they couldn't sustain that level of connectedness with another person.
Meanwhile, as a codependent, I respond from that inner child place, which is ALSO close to the surface. I respond because my "inner child" RECOGNIZES another infantile adult and feels safe.
Meanwhile, as a codependent, I respond from that inner child place, which is ALSO close to the surface. I respond because my "inner child" RECOGNIZES another infantile adult and feels safe.
Thank you so very much argnotthisagain.
I married two immature men with alcohol problems, the second one moved to addiction and then crack.
But that first attraction, it was amazing!
My most recent learning experience, I was sure was not addicted.
Turns out he was married, and let me know after all the romantic stuff.
Yes, I shoulda, coulda woulda, but I didn't and it bit me on the butt hard.
Dropped me like something that smelled bad after a two week trip together.
said, I will call you tomorrow, never heard from him again.
stop, look and listen before becoming romantically
Geez, getting the wind knocked out of me, it hurt so much.
I heard some warning signals, paid them no mind.
I had decided this guy was IT!
Yes, I have much to learn and look out for Not2Old2Learn.
Still learning and still alive. So always hope.
Beth
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Real World
Posts: 729
I smiled reading this... not at the OP and their hurt certainly but at my buddies Lexie and TuffGirl ...wise, kind and bereft of ******** as ever.
I'll echo their thoughts but expand on them a tad.
Why do I, or you, or the alcoholic or whomever engage in self-destructive patterns of behavior? Because we are all screwed up.
Some of the best people I have ever known are the alcoholics here and in my wife's AA group. They are honest, self-effacing and accepting of their own faults and those of others. Of course they have an advantage, they know they are broken in some way.
Why do I have a list the length of one arm of disastrous relationships with a diverse group of women who had serious issues? When my therapist asked me that I just looked at him and said "Jesus dude, you have PhD in this stuff, we've been talking for a year and you can't see that I've spent my whole life trying to fix women who have major issues because I could not fix my crazy mother but still want her acceptance and love?"... he spit his coffee halfway across the room forgetting who he was talking to. I'm self aware if nothing else. Why did I risk everything on an alcoholic with major underlying problems even if she is the most stunningly attractive woman I've ever met? I figured I could fix her. Thank God she fixed herself and I went to work on fixing my effed up brain or it would have been a disaster.
She gots issues, I gots issues, you gots issues too or you would not have found this board. Figure out what they are and work on em. Love with all of your heart, dance like nobody's watching, sing like nobody can hear you... Everyone has problems and issues but we all desperately want and need to love and be loved regardless of whether we are capable of it.
You can't change the need and desire - that's NORMAL. You can change your capability... but not someone else's.
...and life is hard sometimes :-)
I'll echo their thoughts but expand on them a tad.
Why do I, or you, or the alcoholic or whomever engage in self-destructive patterns of behavior? Because we are all screwed up.
Some of the best people I have ever known are the alcoholics here and in my wife's AA group. They are honest, self-effacing and accepting of their own faults and those of others. Of course they have an advantage, they know they are broken in some way.
Why do I have a list the length of one arm of disastrous relationships with a diverse group of women who had serious issues? When my therapist asked me that I just looked at him and said "Jesus dude, you have PhD in this stuff, we've been talking for a year and you can't see that I've spent my whole life trying to fix women who have major issues because I could not fix my crazy mother but still want her acceptance and love?"... he spit his coffee halfway across the room forgetting who he was talking to. I'm self aware if nothing else. Why did I risk everything on an alcoholic with major underlying problems even if she is the most stunningly attractive woman I've ever met? I figured I could fix her. Thank God she fixed herself and I went to work on fixing my effed up brain or it would have been a disaster.
She gots issues, I gots issues, you gots issues too or you would not have found this board. Figure out what they are and work on em. Love with all of your heart, dance like nobody's watching, sing like nobody can hear you... Everyone has problems and issues but we all desperately want and need to love and be loved regardless of whether we are capable of it.
You can't change the need and desire - that's NORMAL. You can change your capability... but not someone else's.
...and life is hard sometimes :-)
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 128
Originally Posted by DoubleBarrel 
Involved is right. The self delusion and lying in alcoholism leads you down a road that would be very close if not outright sociopathic.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
Originally Posted by amharter
I do think mine started with good intentions. It's like he then started wrestling with an invisible enemy. And now I have to suffer alone and in silence since the enemy won.
I looked at my ex's addiction as the enemy for a long time. Eventually I had to let go of that idea as it kept me locked in the mind set that his addiction was something that was done to me, rather than being a lifelong struggle of someone else's. Accepting that taking it personally was hurting me more than it was helping was a big hurdle.
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 128
Originally Posted by DoubleBarrel
Involved is right. The self delusion and lying in alcoholism leads you down a road that would be very close if not outright sociopathic.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
The disease wants what it wants, and it doesnt care what else gets trampled in the way.
Even if we meet you with good intentions, the alcoholism wins. Until we maintain long term sobriety.
Originally Posted by SparkleKitty
Why in silence? You are venting here, which is good.
I looked at my ex's addiction as the enemy for a long time. Eventually I had to let go of that idea as it kept me locked in the mind set that his addiction was something that was done to me, rather than being a lifelong struggle of someone else's. Accepting that taking it personally was hurting me more than it was helping was a big hurdle.
I looked at my ex's addiction as the enemy for a long time. Eventually I had to let go of that idea as it kept me locked in the mind set that his addiction was something that was done to me, rather than being a lifelong struggle of someone else's. Accepting that taking it personally was hurting me more than it was helping was a big hurdle.
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