Does 'moderated drinking' work?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 453
Originally Posted by Yurt 
So how do you determine if your loved one is a heavy drinker or an alcoholic?
Living and Loving Life at Last
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: gods own country
Posts: 12,168
I believe that I am an alcoholic, because I could not conceive of never drinking again. But as moderation doesn't work for me, I absolutely will not, can not ever drink again. And since making that decision, life is actually a whole lot better for me.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
The AA Big Book definition of an alcoholic is someone who has a physical reaction to the consumption of ANY alcohol, which makes him or her want MORE, plus a mental obsession that causes the person to drink even when he or she intends not to. I have the craving for more, plus the mental obsession (though the obsession has gone away with recovery), so I have no difficulty identifying myself as an alcoholic.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 70
Hmmm all very good points here, thanks everyone!
In relation to the 'is he an alcoholic?' question, I think that's a pretty definitive yes, because:
1. He's said 'I'm an alcoholic' (not only in AA rooms, but also to me, some family and friends [a very limited number, mind you])
2. He's attended countless impatient rehabs, and each time (though not the most recent), he's returned to drinking at one point or another
3. His drinking has strained his relationship with me, his family, etc.
4. No proper job, lost it due to alcoholism and he's reluctant to return to the workforce 'because it's too stressful and I might start drinking again'.
5. Feels odd being around alcohol at times because it upsets him to see others drinking and know that ultimately, he can't.
So I think on that front, it's ok for me to say he's beyond the 'heavy drinking' stage and is actually an 'alcoholic'. In which case, moderated drinking isn't an option.
So here's the next question, in light of the above, he's finding it difficult to be a normal young person (late 20s).
Doesn't want to watch the game (because he always had a few beers with it, and it's not the sane without)
Doesn't want to go out for dinner (he always had a few wines and it's not the same without)
Doesn't want to go to a bar (obvious one there)
Doesn't want to go out for lunch (same as for dinner above)
Doesn't want to catch up with friends (they always had a few drinks together at every catch up)
So...does anyone have any bright ideas for non-alcohol related activities? I came up with breakfast and even that got shot down due to connotations of a champagne breakfast).
In relation to the 'is he an alcoholic?' question, I think that's a pretty definitive yes, because:
1. He's said 'I'm an alcoholic' (not only in AA rooms, but also to me, some family and friends [a very limited number, mind you])
2. He's attended countless impatient rehabs, and each time (though not the most recent), he's returned to drinking at one point or another
3. His drinking has strained his relationship with me, his family, etc.
4. No proper job, lost it due to alcoholism and he's reluctant to return to the workforce 'because it's too stressful and I might start drinking again'.
5. Feels odd being around alcohol at times because it upsets him to see others drinking and know that ultimately, he can't.
So I think on that front, it's ok for me to say he's beyond the 'heavy drinking' stage and is actually an 'alcoholic'. In which case, moderated drinking isn't an option.
So here's the next question, in light of the above, he's finding it difficult to be a normal young person (late 20s).
Doesn't want to watch the game (because he always had a few beers with it, and it's not the sane without)
Doesn't want to go out for dinner (he always had a few wines and it's not the same without)
Doesn't want to go to a bar (obvious one there)
Doesn't want to go out for lunch (same as for dinner above)
Doesn't want to catch up with friends (they always had a few drinks together at every catch up)
So...does anyone have any bright ideas for non-alcohol related activities? I came up with breakfast and even that got shot down due to connotations of a champagne breakfast).
Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 1,118
Originally Posted by kasie
So here's the next question, in light of the above, he's finding it difficult to be a normal young person (late 20s).
Doesn't want to watch the game (because he always had a few beers with it, and it's not the sane without)
Doesn't want to go out for dinner (he always had a few wines and it's not the same without)
Doesn't want to go to a bar (obvious one there)
Doesn't want to go out for lunch (same as for dinner above)
Doesn't want to catch up with friends (they always had a few drinks together at every catch up)
So...does anyone have any bright ideas for non-alcohol related activities? I came up with breakfast and even that got shot down due to connotations of a champagne breakfast).
Doesn't want to watch the game (because he always had a few beers with it, and it's not the sane without)
Doesn't want to go out for dinner (he always had a few wines and it's not the same without)
Doesn't want to go to a bar (obvious one there)
Doesn't want to go out for lunch (same as for dinner above)
Doesn't want to catch up with friends (they always had a few drinks together at every catch up)
So...does anyone have any bright ideas for non-alcohol related activities? I came up with breakfast and even that got shot down due to connotations of a champagne breakfast).
I think that's one reason why AA is so successful, because it plugs something meaningful in that gap. If your ABF is really serious about not drinking, he will have to explore the best ways for him to have fun without compromising his sobriety, and it will probably take time.
When AH was sober, we went to a lot of movies, BYOB restaurants (of course we didn't bring anything), and hung out with church folk who tend not to drink much (at least they didn't at the church we went to).
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Yup, the guys I know in AA have a great time together. They go motorcycle riding, get together at each others' houses to watch the game, etc.
Meals without wine is a matter of practice. I generally have unsweetened iced tea, or plain ice water. Both go great with anything. It's like giving up sugar or fatty food. Once you get accustomed to it, you don't miss it.
Bars and drinking friends can be tricky. I don't have a problem being in a bar if I have a good reason to be there (e.g., an office going-away party), but I don't go there to hang out and watch other people drink. I don't mind if a friend of mine has wine with dinner or a cocktail before, but if the main event is going to be drinking, or if they intend to get sloshed, I'd prefer to bow out. Most people don't have to give up all their friends who drink, but it's usually best to avoid drinking buddies in early sobriety.
Honestly, though, it is a lifestyle change, but not an overly burdensome one. It IS tough in the beginning to imagine a fun life without alcohol, if all your good times are associated with it. It wasn't that big a deal to me, but I think it is more so with younger people whose friends are still in party-mode. OTOH, my first husband had a lot of fun with new friends in AA when he was in his early 20s. It was an adjustment, but one that he made successfully.
Meals without wine is a matter of practice. I generally have unsweetened iced tea, or plain ice water. Both go great with anything. It's like giving up sugar or fatty food. Once you get accustomed to it, you don't miss it.
Bars and drinking friends can be tricky. I don't have a problem being in a bar if I have a good reason to be there (e.g., an office going-away party), but I don't go there to hang out and watch other people drink. I don't mind if a friend of mine has wine with dinner or a cocktail before, but if the main event is going to be drinking, or if they intend to get sloshed, I'd prefer to bow out. Most people don't have to give up all their friends who drink, but it's usually best to avoid drinking buddies in early sobriety.
Honestly, though, it is a lifestyle change, but not an overly burdensome one. It IS tough in the beginning to imagine a fun life without alcohol, if all your good times are associated with it. It wasn't that big a deal to me, but I think it is more so with younger people whose friends are still in party-mode. OTOH, my first husband had a lot of fun with new friends in AA when he was in his early 20s. It was an adjustment, but one that he made successfully.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 91
My RABF and I are both in our late twenties, and when he decided to stop drinking about a year ago, he got heavy into golfing, fishing, and running. As far as things we do together, we see a lot of movies, hike, watch tv series, cook, and eat out. He's usually okay with social things as long as drinking isn't the main event. Weddings are particularly difficult, it seems.
To weigh in on the moderation thing, I'm not a believer in that at all. RABF didn't drink for four years - when we started dating, he was in a period of thinking he could go back to drinking in moderation. It was nothing short of terrifying. He decided to stop drinking a year ago again and he's already had two relapses since so.. Yeah. Moderation. I think not.
To weigh in on the moderation thing, I'm not a believer in that at all. RABF didn't drink for four years - when we started dating, he was in a period of thinking he could go back to drinking in moderation. It was nothing short of terrifying. He decided to stop drinking a year ago again and he's already had two relapses since so.. Yeah. Moderation. I think not.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
To use the First Step "alcoholics are powerless over alcohol".
He doesn't know he's powerless, he's still in denial and probably has more drinking to do to "get it". There's nothing you can do or say that will change him. So the big question is what are YOU going to do? Is this what you want for your life? If not, the only person who can change the course is you. Reaching out to others is a wonderful step .... keep focusing on yourself.
He doesn't know he's powerless, he's still in denial and probably has more drinking to do to "get it". There's nothing you can do or say that will change him. So the big question is what are YOU going to do? Is this what you want for your life? If not, the only person who can change the course is you. Reaching out to others is a wonderful step .... keep focusing on yourself.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 602
You could ask him/yourself/us these questions all day long and never get a definitive answer. And he knows that.
What's going on here is that he's giving himself permission to drink and trying to manipulate you into remaining in the role of caretaker.
What's going on here is that he's giving himself permission to drink and trying to manipulate you into remaining in the role of caretaker.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,796
No, it doesn't work.
However every day there are new threads, mostly in "Newcomers to Recovery" asking that same question.
Every alcoholic wishes they could "moderate"...until they've either had enough, or end up dead, whichever comes first.
However every day there are new threads, mostly in "Newcomers to Recovery" asking that same question.
Every alcoholic wishes they could "moderate"...until they've either had enough, or end up dead, whichever comes first.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
