Buried Alive

Old 05-28-2013, 04:36 AM
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Buried Alive

I'd first like to start off by saying, "Hi." and I welcome all forms of advice from whomever wants to give it. I'm a person who understands tough love generates real love. I can also see the gamut of facets and perspectives and ask that people try this as well when it comes to my post. Also, I posted this in the welcome section but people suggested I also come here. So, any advice is always welcome.

Now, with that out of the way, let me state why I've come to this site.

About three years ago, I started dating my current boyfriend. Six months in, our relationship dismantled due to the fact I wasn't ready for real love and I had no real clue what it meant to love someone. At that point, I knew he,(we'll call him Mr. Hero) had tried acid, weed and alcohol but all in good young adult measure. Experimentation, if you will.

With time and experience fostering on, we kept in touch ever so often. A text here, a call there, small things. He always called me for my birthday, even though I didn't remember his, unfortunately.

Approximately, six months ago in November, we decided to give our relationship another chance. This time, we'd be open and honest about ourselves to each other. I remember clearly, telling him, "I'd accept him anyway I could have him." He in return, told me the same thing. At that time I didn't believe he had an addiction, I thought he simply liked to drink due to his youth but shortly after that he made me a believer. Mind you, I've always been a "fixer" and innately like a therapist. So, once he told me how he'd been in a car accident from him hitting someone because he passed out behind the wheel, woke up in the hospital hand cuffed, had to go to court, do community service and received a DUI, I figured I could save him from himself and help him become the man I know he can be.

Quickly, I began to see the trappings of dating an alcoholic. He would forget things almost as often as I told him. There would be day's when I wouldn't hear from him, not a call, not a text or anything. I would get angry with him but eventually, we got passed it. I chucked it up to small bumps in the road that every relationship goes through, in spite of him being an alcoholic. In my perspective it is better to be "happy" than "right." I remember at our three month mark asking him if he remembered telling me, "I'd accept you anyway, I can have you." Which he replied, "No, but I'm sure I said it." In that moment, I knew this addiction wasn't as lighthearted as I was making it out to be.

I tried talking to him about his future and what he wanted, in hopes of that igniting an unyielding desire to have those things so he would focus on that and put the vodka bottle down. I tried talking him out of drinking whenever I could. There was a moment when he bought two vodka bottles and he drank one but while he was outside, the second came up missing. Instantly and deductively, he narrowed it down to his mother taking it and hiding it. I was both shocked and amazed at the transformation my boyfriend under went. I knew alcoholism was an addiction but Mr. Hero mutated into this mindless zombie transfixed on finding the bottle while spiraling down a rabbits hole of anxiety out of no where.

I told him, "It wasn't that serious." Despite me trying to change the subject or pleading him with him, he feverishly searched through the house, almost manically until discovering it under his bed. It was more than an eye- opener. Mr. Hero wasn't the man I knew, wasn't the man cared for; wasn't a man at all...just the shell of a machine. From then on, I tried having deep and insightful conversations with him about the mechanics of being an alcoholic but he would brush me off stating, "You're not an alcoholic so you'll never understand." And when he wasn't shooing me away from the topic with that statement he'd throw his favorite word at me, "Apathy." Oh, how I've I come to dislike that word. Let, Mr. Hero tell it, he's apathetic about everything.

What bothered me most is that he would talk to his friends and heed their words over mine because they too were alcoholics and in my opinion worse off than him. I just don't understand that.

His grandma fell ill two months ago and he went to Texas to be with his mother and family. Thankfully, his grandma is doing okay but while there his mother paid for him to go to a program. And just like that, I had Mr. Hero back. He remembered things again, was conscious again and most off all he was present. Truly, present. He was engaged in everything around him and for the first time in a long time...he saw me. Without the wafting blurred haze of alcohol blinding him. We were connecting again and I was so proud. More proud, that he did it HIS way. No more drinking to avoid withdrawals, no more sleeping all day and still feeling tired and no more forgetting. In two months, he gotten sober, started medication to treat his depression, formulated a plan to take a certification exam and get his life back on track. What I knew for sure is that we would go the long hall without question in our relationship but I now knew he would be aware and conscious for the ride.

When he got back from Texas, I had some reservations and concerns because his roommate drinks and I knew how tempting that would be. We talked rationally and bluntly but he assured me he was prepared and knew how to deal with it. About two week's in, I started to settle down and think of him being sober as second nature. He had a routine going and stuck to it regularly. This past week, I let my emotions get the best of me and due to me texting him and not receiving anything for three days, I decided to treat him with the same treatment. He began texting me but I ignored him. On the second day, he called me at nine something at night. I answered but kept it short not wanting to be all cute with him till the next day which would have made three days. I told him I was on the phone and would call him back. I thought about calling him back hut stuck to my child like stubbornness. Insisting on talking to him the following day.

I did just that and when I called him that following day in the afternoon, I found my love drunk and back to his old ways. In disbelief I asked, "When did this happen?" He cleverly told me, "11" in his drunken glee. I asked, "At night or today?" He informed me it was last night.

I can't help but feel it's my fault, despite knowing he was going to do what he wanted to do, despite knowing you can't control anyone but yourself, despite my friends and even him saying don't blame myself. I FEEL that it's my fault based on the following criteria. One, he called me at nine and I told him I would call him back yet I didn't. Two, he didn't start drinking till 11 and I was up till 2 in the morning doing nothing. Three, I kept asking my friend should I call him back and she said she would have but regardless of that I chose to be difficult and refused to call. It just seems like God, the universe and the logistic's of it all directed me to intervene and I didn't listen. I could've been there when it mattered to at least try and prevent him from relapsing but I missed the opportunity because I stood in my own way.

I just don't know how to forgive myself for choosing not be there when I could have, whether I knew this would happen or not, I still should've been there. It's so HARD to accept all of his progress, all of his efforts and all he was becoming is thrown out the window. Two months and a couple weeks of progress thrown out the window, and the fact that I could've prevented it for at least another day cuts me to my core. I wasn't there when he needed me most...and now I've got to live with my lack of action.

First let me say, how appreciative I am for people responding and for how swiftly they responded as well. I hear and acknowledge what all of you are saying and I am truly humbled by each and every one of you taking time to listen to a stranger.

With that said, let me follow up with some unmentioned things and updates.

One person asked, "Why didn't he text me back in the first place?" Mr. Hero has been known to read a text and get distracted by something and forget to text back or he'll type a text out and forget to send it. This is just how he is at times, unfortunately.

I spoke with him today and I'll give you the play by play of how that conversation went.

*phone rings*

(Hero)-"Hello?"

(Me)-"Hi..."

(Hero)-"Hey, what's going on?"

(Me)-"Nothing much, how are you?"

(Hero)-"Alright."

(Me)-"How was last night?"

(Hero)-"I don't remember. I passed out early and woke up late in the night."

(Me)-"Oh?"

(Hero)-"Ya, I threw up all night even though I was drinking water. Like, I just kept chugging it trying to take in as much as I can."

(Me)-"I'm sorry, my love. I mean, maybe it was good that you went through that to remind you of what it was like."

(Hero)-"Ya, I deserved it to be honest."

(Me)-"Did you eat something?"

(Hero)-"Ya, my roommate made some spaghetti. It was actually really good to be honest."

(Me)-"That's good."

(Hero)-"What's new with you?"

(Me)-"Not much... I just can't help but feel like I could've intervened last night if I would've called you back."

(Hero)-"Don't blame yourself. I was gonna drink anyway."

(Me)-"I understand. At least you got it out of your system."

(Hero)-"Uhh, I'm drinking right now." *snickers*

(Me)-"Oh, is this your first drink?"

(Hero)-"No. I had two beers earlier and I'm drinking vodka right now."

(Me)-"So, is this your last one?"

(Hero)-"Probably not."

(Me)-"I thought yesterday was the exception?"

(Hero)-"I thought so too"

(Me)-"I just don't want to see all your hard work go out the window."

(Hero)-"Ya, me either."

(Me)-"What about taking the A+ certification exam? I know how drinking messes with your memory."

(Hero)-"I can still do it. I've been taking practice test and getting A's and B's."

(Me)-"Oh, good... Well, what are you going to do for the rest of the day?"

(Hero)-"Probably go food shopping. I should do that."

(Me)-"That'll be good. Get out the house and get some fresh air."

(Hero)-"Ya, I probably won't."

(Me)-"...Well, I'll just talk to you later then."

(Hero)-"Alright."

*phone call ends*

After that, I laid in bed and cried for an hour. It's so frustrating to know how far we got to end right back where we started. Only reason he stopped before is because his mother got him into a program and he was living with her and away from his roommate who's a bad influence on him, though I don't blame her because he's an adult. I think what hurts the most is knowing that he's longing for a better life. He'll be twenty-four in July and he wants so badly to have something going for himself. His friends have career's and families. He is so naturally smart that if he wanted he could become a doctor without much thought. I am trying to push him towards that brighter tomorrow because he WILL be GREAT.. someday. ...I just know it.

Someone recently asked, "Are you going to be able to be at peace and happy in this relationship if he never recovers?"

The honest answer that aligns with my intentions say's no. My selfish ego, wants him to be better, to be a better version of himself. That version I dream about year's from now when were thirty, have career's, live together, are talking about marriage and we both look happy. If never recovering means I can never have that then I won't be at happy.

However, at my core. My authentic self knows and understands that I wouldn't push him away either because of it. I'd love him through it all because I'd accept him as is. I'd hastily settle for his circumstance and try to over look it. What I know for sure is, we shouldn't have preconceived notions of what a partner should be, which allow's us to have endless-discoverable possibilities. His burden will become mine and I'll become blind to it and only think of it as a relationship "issue" much like everyone else has. A silent devotion between him, I and his addiction. But even here, I won't be truly happy.

With all this said, I don't have a problem letting him go in terms of a relationship. I am happy to have known him at all and at the end of the day there is a blessing in every lesson. I am capable of knowing just because you love someone it doesn't mean you're meant to be. I just don't want to throw it away over a trifle whim. Nothing worth having comes easy.

My greatest HOPE and wish for him is that he finds himself when all looks lost.
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Old 05-28-2013, 05:21 AM
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Wow, you have a lot here, MetallicThorn--my brief reply is that you sound as if you already know the answer(s) to your problems/questions. You do state that you know you can't be happy with him as he is, and since you didn't cause his addiction, you can't control his addiction and you can't cure his addiction, you will be signing up for a lifetime of unhappiness if you stay with him now.

Could he get sober and could you have a happy life together in the future? It's certainly possible, but for now, you need to focus on YOU. You deserve better than this, and his drinking and the way he treats you is certainly not "a trifle." Also, bear in mind that alcoholism is a progressive disease, and things will get worse, not better, as time goes on.

Please do as much reading here as you can, and don't miss the stickies at the top of the page. There is a lot of experience, strength and hope to be shared here. I would also like to suggest getting to an Alanon meeting as soon as possible--you'll learn a lot there about how best to cope w/the situation you find yourself in. If you don't like the fit of the first meeting you try, then try a different one.

Hoping you find some peace and clarity today.
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Old 05-28-2013, 05:22 AM
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Hi, and welcome.

Someone else's alcoholism is hardly a trifling whim. He's got a long LONG way to go before he is this "hero" you have in your mind.

What you do has nothing to do with why he drinks. If you had been there, the most you would have done is postpone it for a short time.

You are romanticizing his disease. I'm not sure how romantic you will find it when he starts to pee in the bed, when you are supporting him financially because he can't hold a job, when he winds up in jail again, when he becomes abusive because you are trying to stand between him and a drink. Because that's where this is all likely to wind up.

I suggest you get to Al-Anon. You may have worked as a therapist, but it is fairly clear to me you are not familiar with the course and effects of alcoholism. If you stay with this man, you are in for a lot of pain and anguish.
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Old 05-28-2013, 05:50 AM
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Hi MetallicThorn,

Sounds like life is pretty stressful for you! You've come to the right place

My (ex?)(R?)ABF is in his late 20s and has done countless inpatient rehab stints. We've been together for 5+ years, so what I'm writing comes from my experiences over that time.

1. I too am a 'fixer'. I love knowing that people need me, that I'm the one they turn to to solve their problems, that I'm the dependable and reliable one. And to see someone transform and know that I've contributed to that is really self-satisfying. I now know that being like this all the time, and having pet projects (people) is really unhealthy - and I'm a codependent. I'm working on that and it's certainly not easy!

2. Your BF says that you'll never understand because you're not an alcoholic. Hard as it is to fathom, he's right. I've been tolerating alcoholism for 5+ years, read all the literature and go to AlAnon and I still don't get it. That used to bug me, but not nowadays. I don't want to understand it anymore, it's too difficult and a waste of my precious thoughts. Equally, the A will never understand exactly how I feel as someone affected by their alcoholism.

3. You mention that his mother paid for his rehab treatment. While it's great that he went to rehab, he has to WANT to go for himself, and WANT to get well for himself. It shouldn't be imposed on him by anyone else. True recovery starts when the A initiates it him or herself - not when someone does it for them.

4.His living situation doesn't sound ideal, but that's for him to address - not you.

5. You didn't cause his relapse. Phone call or no phone call, text or no text, it was him and his choice. As a (R?)A, he needs to have strategies in place to manage situations which trigger a relapse - like calling a sponsor. It's not for you to control.

6. You state that he wants a better life, career, family, etc. That's great - but he has to put in the work to get those things. One of the key parts of recovery is As actually doing stuff for themselves, rather than relying on others to make it happen. He has to take steps toward achieving those things for himself, you can't propel him along.

7. Think about what would happen if you were to meet him today - would you want him?

8. Have a think about AlAnon. It's a wonderful place for you to grow and thrive in a non-threatening environment, and will help you deal with the daily stresses associated with loving an alcoholic.

9. Think about detaching with love. That doesn't mean that you don't care - it just means that you know you have a very limited influence over the situation - and there's little point in wasting precious time and energy trying to fix and control it.

10. Remember the 3Cs. You didn't CAUSE it, you can't CONTROL it and you can't CURE it.

Your life is important too! And you only get one shot at it If you're spending your time, energy and efforts trying to fix someone who isn't ready to be fixed, or doesn't want to be fixed you're not going to get too far...the A needs to make the first move, work a program (and keep working it!) and embrace life as someone who is sober and recovering - and that's a long process.

Keep focusing on yourself - stay fit and healthy, catch up with family and friends, take up a hobby, etc. You need to ensure that your life doesn't revolve around a single person at the expense of you living your own life.

Good luck!
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:47 AM
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Metallicthorn, the title of your post "buried alive" implies you are in a situation that is out of your control.

The fact remains, you are currently in a new relationship (six months) and are choosing to remain involved with an active alkie.

This guy has zero intention of embracing recovery at this time. He has told you that, and yet you think you possess some magical power that will save him ? Please, please continue to educate yourself about addiction. There is no romantic "I will save you and we will live happily ever after" in this situation.

Nothing you do or say, will change anything for him.

When dealing with addiction, we pay attention to actions, the addicts words are meaningless.

You get to decide how much of you, you are willing to invest in someone who is currently unavailable.
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Old 05-28-2013, 07:25 AM
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(((((MetallicThorn)))))

First let me say, WELCOME to SR. You have found a really GREAT place with lots of folks with lots and lots of Experience, Strength, and Hope (ES&H).

He is correct in that you will not understand unless you are an alcoholic, and to be honest I doubt if he truly understands. I am almost at 32 years of continuously being sober and clean and I still don't understand, how a simple little liquid could totally destroy me and my life so long ago.

AA helped me a lot in those early years and at 3 years sober (to the day) because I was married to a 'sober' alcoholic, who changed his drug of choice to GAMLING my AA sponsor literally ordered me (I like to say 'strongly suggested', lol) to start Alanon IMMEDIATELY and to get an Alanon sponsor, preferably one that was a 'double winner' (one who is also sober in AA).

I did do that, not totally willingly but I did start Alanon, and it has been very beneficial all these years in helping me to keep a handle and a 'rein' on my codependency issues. I am a retired RN and yes it can be difficult to be kind, warm, caring, and helpful in my work (and sometimes 'fix' things) and not carry it into my personal life, or at least know when NOT to 'fix'. rofl

I would suggest that you step back, maybe try Alanon and/or get some one on one counseling, and just WATCH his ACTIONS. His ACTIONS will tell you how serious he is about recovery. Right now it sounds like he is not serious at all.

'Enabling' which is what as a codependent I do if I am not careful is doing things for others, All others that they can do for themselves. This includes when it comes to A's (even the ones I sponsor) the whole gamut from balancing their checkbooks to finding them a rehab to lending them money, etc

When I stay in this mode, my life is great and so is the lives of the folks that are around me, when I let that mode slip, well ................................................ here is a good example:

In January of 2010 I got a phone call out of the past, the way way past. My first love, whom I had not seen or spoken to in 45 years! Yep, quite a surprise, and I have to admit, my 'blinders' were on full force, so it escalated quickly. We started flying back and forth to each others homes, he was in FL and I in NM. Now as I said the 'blinders' were on full force, so I did not (I was in full denial) see all the red flags popping up. Finally in Oct. of 2010 it came to a head, the Elephant in the Room was visible in all it's glory as were all the 'red flags.' I had to end it, as I finally realized why I had broken off with him those many years ago (he drank too much back then for me) before I later became an alkie myself. I flew home in mid October, not yet realizing the amount of stress I had been under.

I am a diabetic and 'stress' is not good for a diabetic as our immune systems are compromised and we 'catch' infections easier. I ended up with a low grade infection that went on for a while, and I was getting more and more dehydrated (not good) to the point that there was literally no potassium left in my brain. When that happens a Grand Mal Seizure can happen and it did. In early Janurary of 2011 my daughter found me out cold on the bathroom floor and could not get a response. I was in the hospital for 5 days.

Hopefully I have learned my lesson about getting so damn complacent about my recovery. I even posted on here, several times throughout the year how 'wonderful' life was and how much fun I was having, etc etc I spent the majority of 2011, returning to my Alanon meetings, working with MY sponsor who is in CA and getting back on track! It was a very unique event which I hope never happens again in my life!


So ................................ please TAKE CARE OF YOU and allow him the dignity of taking care of his own life.

Please keep posting and let us know how you are doing, as we do care so much.

Love and hugs,
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Old 05-28-2013, 09:03 AM
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Please free yourself.

I know what you're talking about. I only advise you to listen to the other people who are posting to your thread. It seems insensitive not to respond to each of the points you have made, but honestly, this is hard work -reading what other people are saying and evaluating each and every response, but it is a good antidote to your addiction to this guy. I am not in the position to give you the specific help you seem to want; you seem to want a detailed response. I am speaking in generalities, but I can relate to your misery Buried Alive. I am calling you Buried Alive because that seems more apt than your other moniker, Metallic Thorn.

Trust me, I know how hard it is to let go, but you need to detach yourself even further than you can imagine in order to save yourself. You are not a therapist! Please dump this man and get yourself some therapy of your own.

I am Meercat Manor because of the connotations it has. Please take heed of what the people here are telling you. Be gentle with yourself but be strong and resolve never to contact this man again. Best Wishes.
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Old 05-28-2013, 09:10 AM
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The only Hero in your life is you. The only life you have control over is yours. You are only 6 months into this relationship, be grateful you found out now when you can still extricate yourself and seek a healthy loving relationship. This is the stage in dating where we learn if the person is the right person for a life long journey. CLEARLY this guy is not.

You would "settle for his circumstance"??? Why settle? Why have you given up on yourself so quickly? Are you not worth a person who can give you all of himself? And alcoholism is not a circumstance, it's an awful progressive disease that will take you down with him if you let it. It gets hard to "overlook" it when he gets a DUI, loses a job, loses the ability to have sex, embarrasses you in public, gets injured, injures you, develops other health issues, leaves you with kids to parent alone.

You need to stop romanticizing this sitatution, it's too serious for that. Find an AlAnon group near you, and start back on your own path to serenity. You can care about this guy, but let him go on his own path. You deserve better. You're not here to "save" him.

I know this sounds harsh, and I'm sorry for that. I don't mean to be harsh, but sometimes there's no other way to put it. If you read on here, you'll see posts from people who wish they had gotten out at 6 months....instead of 20 years later. Don't be one of them.
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Old 05-28-2013, 09:38 AM
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Dear Metallic--"Let go, or be dragged"

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Old 05-28-2013, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by MetallicThorn View Post
I figured I could save him from himself and help him become the man I know he can be.
Welcome, Metallic Thorn.

First of all, I quoted this one sentence above because it is where I stopped reading. With all due respect, this one sentence, to me, is really key to your entire post.

You see, we (and I mean that generally in reference to women) tend to romanticize broken men. We'll "fix 'em" with the love of a good woman. We'll stand by them as they lie, cheat, use, and abuse us, because we know the "good person" they can be if only they would live up to their potential that we know is in there somewhere.

In Hollywood - this works! It makes for a dramatic movie ender, cue the sweeping music as the female lead changes the male lead, the characters overcome their drama, and they waltz off into the sunset together.

Its the plot of many romance novels, songs, poems, etc.

Some of us truly believe our investment is worthwhile. We've been taught our self worth comes from being in a relationship.

But really - this is a LIE and a FANTASY. No one can save anyone but themselves. Sure, we can influence people sometimes, but when it comes to self-destruction, often we are simply aiding and abetting someone from growing the heck up.

Ok, so you got conned by an addict. That's the real issue here. You got played and now have a broken heart and dashed dreams. Addicts do this to others, because they are playing themselves first and foremost.

So you have two paths in front of you now. You can continue down the "I can fix him with my love" path and waste even more of your life, or you can take the path that trust me - has the least amount of resistance - and walk away (or run, whichever). Walk away and go find yourself again. Spend some time introspecting on why you chose a man like this and how to avoid it next time around.

And again, trust me when I say this, it only hurts for a little while. Life does go on, and hurt feelings fade, and there are plenty of other fish in this big sea we live in.

Peace,
~T
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Old 05-28-2013, 10:22 AM
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Aww babe, what a situation to be in. His mother must be aware of his previous actions, but is she aware of the way he is now? *hugs* *hands you a big, shiny, glittery, multicolored box full of tiny squeaky kittens*
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Old 05-28-2013, 10:35 AM
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Response 3

Someone asked,"His mother must be aware of his previous actions, but is she aware of the way he is now?"

Allow me to be honest, his family life growing up was very comfortable due to his family being upper middle class. Openly, his mother has always been a fan of wine and his father liked the hard stuff. All in all, he grew up around alcohol, cultivated in it and at the age of 12 was given his first taste by his mother. So, alcohol is as much apart of his DNA as the rest of his chromosomes. His mother had/has always known of his habits and though from my understanding dislikes them, doesn't fuss about them. She too has her own issues and perhaps that is why she is more understanding in his case.

(Shifting gears)

What I've discovered here today, has truly revolutionized the way I see the world. I am so appreciative to each and every one of you for responding, caring and advising me. My experience of this site has taught me a very hopeful lesson. To feel someone else's condition, their sorrow, their grief is a transcended moment and i'm honored to have shared it with all of you.

I understand that the monsters have a way of getting out and we still need a hand to reach for in the dark. What matters most is even though we can surrender those feelings to that thing bigger than us(God, the universe) people are still able to connect, elevate and lift us up when we need it.

Personally, I will continue to invest in myself and stay grounded in who I am so that I have more love to share and more love to give. Moreover, I still believe we all have the ability to put forth the best of ourselves. Even..those who can't seem find a reflection in the mirror anymore.

I am a better human being because there is scared in the ordinary.

(Please continue to post and raise questions, concerns and I will continue to respond accordingly and openly. Thank you.)
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Old 05-28-2013, 11:12 AM
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HI MetallicThorn,

I am so sorry you are here. But as other said, if he is tuly an alcoholic with no desire to stop, things will get so much worse. The biggest helper for me was pointed out by Kasie in prior post:

Remember the 3Cs. You didn't CAUSE it, you can't CONTROL it and you can't CURE it.
You can't wish it, dream it, or fantasize it away. And you can't influence it away. While we all try to employ logic in these situations, it is imperative that you learn that there is no logic. Our actions that we think will help, generally do not. When we try to figure out WHY they drink (so we can take actions to prevent that from happening), we need to understand there is not an answer to that question. If there was, there would be no alcoholics! And WE will eventually make OURSELVES crazy thinking we have any control over it, or understand the why of it.

One great piece of advice I received from this forum is that the most helpful thing I could do is to stop helping. "If she is on a downward spiral, the best thing to do is get out of her way." I did. She received her 4th DUI, her kids moved out, she lost her career, and even her new puppy. She may spend some time in jail. But I can tell you this- she is safe in rehab, and to the best of my knowledge hasn't had a drink since Easter Sunday.

When I read your play-by-play conversation, I am sort of jealous. I wish my conversation went so smoothly. It is logical. You ask questions, and he answers. He seems to be truthful, even though what he is saying is painful and not what you want to hear. Fast forward a few years- This EXACT conversation will most likely be COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. Your questions will be answered with denial, lies, minimization, blame-shifting, etc. Then there will be the gaslighting* While it is painful to know the truth, it is more painful and crazy-making to never know the truth. And that is generally what active alcoholism progresses to.

That being said, it is SO SO SO hard to step away from an alcoholic that we love. Especially if we know in our hearts, that we can help them.... WAIT - back to the beginning- We can't help them. Only they can help themselves.



"Gaslighting is a form of mental abuse in which false information is presented with the intent of making a victim doubt his or her own memory, perception and sanity"
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Old 05-28-2013, 02:06 PM
  # 14 (permalink)  
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Response 4

I just wanted to clarify and update on a few things.

I'm quite curious as to why some people perceive some of my statements as I'm Romanticizing the disease?

I've stated that I'm aware of the possibilities, both positive and negative of being in a relationship with an alcoholic. Moreover, I've pointedly explained that I would leave him if it came down to him or me. Also, when expressing care and love it's always been directed towards him, the person, not the disease. I must admit, I'm torn. I understand that everyone's feelings are valid, everyone experiences and perceives things differently, I just want some clarification because I don't want to be misunderstand.

Mr. Hero has also informed me he's going to try stopping tomorrow, he's happy I've begun to educate myself through this site and doesn't want me to take on such anguish due to his condition. Although I've explained what I've gathered from each and every one of you (even the not so nice things) and he is more than grateful to you all for arming me with knowledge and wisdom.
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Old 05-28-2013, 02:15 PM
  # 15 (permalink)  
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After that, I laid in bed and cried for an hour. It's so frustrating to know how far we got to end right back where we started. Only reason he stopped before is because his mother got him into a program and he was living with her and away from his roommate who's a bad influence on him, though I don't blame her because he's an adult. I think what hurts the most is knowing that he's longing for a better life. He'll be twenty-four in July and he wants so badly to have something going for himself. His friends have career's and families. He is so naturally smart that if he wanted he could become a doctor without much thought. I am trying to push him towards that brighter tomorrow because he WILL be GREAT.. someday. ...I just know it.

ok, out of all of the above what is FACT? he's 23 years old. all the rest is conjecture, supposition, assumption and hope. you seem very romantically swept up in who he COULD be, much more so than who he is. a guy in his 20's who likes to get wasted, a lot. and that has caused him problems.

not your job to fix him. actually while that sounds so martyrish and humanitarian, it's actually quite rude and presumptuous of US to ASSUME we know better how someone else should live their lives and then make it our life's mission to redirect them and change them into who WE want them to be. who he is RIGHT NOW is all you have to go on....it's all any of us have.

in the dialogue you shared its as if the people are having two different conversations...he wants to talk about his drinking, and you wan to talk about food shopping and taking exams. he's a party boy, face it....and you're not his mama, there to remind him of stuff!!!
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Old 05-28-2013, 03:53 PM
  # 16 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by MetallicThorn View Post
I'm quite curious as to why some people perceive some of my statements as I'm Romanticizing the disease?
After that, I laid in bed and cried for an hour. It's so frustrating to know how far we got to end right back where we started. Only reason he stopped before is because his mother got him into a program and he was living with her and away from his roommate who's a bad influence on him, though I don't blame her because he's an adult. I think what hurts the most is knowing that he's longing for a better life. He'll be twenty-four in July and he wants so badly to have something going for himself. His friends have career's and families. He is so naturally smart that if he wanted he could become a doctor without much thought. I am trying to push him towards that brighter tomorrow because he WILL be GREAT.. someday. ...I just know it.

Someone recently asked, "Are you going to be able to be at peace and happy in this relationship if he never recovers?"

The honest answer that aligns with my intentions say's no. My selfish ego, wants him to be better, to be a better version of himself. That version I dream about year's from now when were thirty, have career's, live together, are talking about marriage and we both look happy. If never recovering means I can never have that then I won't be at happy.

However, at my core. My authentic self knows and understands that I wouldn't push him away either because of it. I'd love him through it all because I'd accept him as is. I'd hastily settle for his circumstance and try to over look it. What I know for sure is, we shouldn't have preconceived notions of what a partner should be, which allow's us to have endless-discoverable possibilities. His burden will become mine and I'll become blind to it and only think of it as a relationship "issue" much like everyone else has. A silent devotion between him, I and his addiction. But even here, I won't be truly happy.
This. It's romantic drivel and nonsense.

"A silent devotion between him, I and his addiction." You are buying into that Hollywood archetype of the tragically flawed, yet brilliant man, who is only understood by his true love, the woman who will save his soul, if she cannot save his life. I recognize the syndrome, because I once believed in it, too. After two marriages to alcoholics, and my own recovery from alcoholism, my romantic illusions are no more.

There is nothing beautifully sad and poignant about alcoholism. It is an ugly, ugly disease that sucks the life and beauty and potential out of the alcoholic and anyone close to him or her.

Unless and until this man is good and ready to quit for his OWN good reasons (hint: it usually requires a LOT of suffering, humiliation, degradation and desperation), he is going to get worse, and drag down anyone holding onto him.

If he's only 23, I'm betting you are under 30. You can waste years of your life chained to this relationship, or you can enjoy your youth and the possibilities life has to offer you.
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:02 PM
  # 17 (permalink)  
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Response 5

Someone, actually raised a facet I myself had not even thought of or seen. They stated, "actually while that sounds so martyrish and humanitarian, it's actually quite rude and presumptuous of US to ASSUME we know better how someone else should live their lives and then make it our life's mission to redirect them and change them into who WE want them to be. who he is RIGHT NOW is all you have to go on....it's all any of us have."

This made me recallibrate some of my thinking and rationalize with what I truly want and how my approach can be perceived. As human beings we sometimes push off on others what was good for us and what works for us, off on those we love without considering what they may want and how they will feel about it. I am guilty of this and I am now aware of it. Much like the other millions of people who BELIEVED, I am not perfect but I'm trying to become whole. To reside in my skin and be at peace.

Another person brought up some factual statements I've made in terms of how other's are perceiving me and my views. This is really important and I ask that people pay attention to this. By no means have I meant/desired/intentionally wanted to promote "romantic illusions" of any substance abuse situations. For me, I just wanted to be open and honest with not only you guys but with myself and this process.

This is what I wanted to say and make most clear, I accept Mr. Hero as he is today, the guy who is a certified EMT, the guy who is studying for an exam to better his life, the guy who likes to lay in the sun on top of his roof, the guy who finds it hard to express emotions and is more logical than I. Who he is today and yesterday are the reasons I'm with him, why we were friends first, why we decided to give us another chance. Those roots are ingrained in me and how I relate to him.
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:54 PM
  # 18 (permalink)  
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if you are THAT ok with him AS HE IS, then what caused you to google stuff and end up on SR?

mr certified EMT, mr taking some test, was drunk to the point of puking LAST nite and was drinking AGAIN by 11 am today.

they say when people show us who they are, BELEIVE them. what do you see? right NOW?
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Old 05-28-2013, 07:18 PM
  # 19 (permalink)  
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MT--alcoholism is progressive. It doesn't stay the same, it gets worse.
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Old 05-28-2013, 07:33 PM
  # 20 (permalink)  
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Yeah, to be perfectly honest (as you asked us to be), I'm not totally sure what it is YOU are looking for. If it's validation of your notions that somehow he is going to either heroically defeat his disease or that you will valiantly stand by him as he tragically destroys himself, I don't think you are likely to get much positive reinforcement for those ideas around here. We've been on this ride too long, we know our own, and each other's experiences too well.

If you see nothing wrong with the way things are right now, I'm not quite sure how anyone here can help you. Personally, I think you are headed for a lot of heartache unless you take off the rose-colored glasses. But it's your life. If you are satisfied with it, then you don't need anything from us.

But as Anvil so perceptively observed, something made you seek us out.
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