Readysteady

Wise words indeed. You make total sense. It really is up to him. I have to run to work, thank you again!

laurie6781

The part in the Big Book of AA that you were referring to is:

My Sponsor's hubby (also in AA and my sponsor also) used to share this when he spoke from the podium. First he would share that phrase, then he would say:

"Yep, the Smart Azz and the Wet Brain. Now if you are sitting on the curb and wondering which one you are, I will tell you Wet Brains can't think."

He would get a little tittering from the newcomers and belly laughs from those of us in recovery.

So as to your brother, no matter the 'health' warnings, he is NOT READY for recovery. And no matter what you do, he may never be ready. Maybe spend some of that energy on yourself. Go try some more Alanon meetings now that you know that Alanon is for YOU. Step back from your brother, I know it is hard but if you make yourself unhealthy and very ill then you are of no help to anyone.

In January of '79 when I was 33 1/2 years old, my family had a meeting with me. Not an intervention per se just a meeting. At that meeting I was told they were done. If I called on the phone they would hang up. If I came to the door it would be closed in my face and if I tried to steal from them the police would be called. That this was my problem and I had to deal with it.

Well I left there very angry. Moved across the country to Los Angeles. It took me another 2 1/2 years to find recovery, the last 1 1/2 years living on the streets of Hollyweird. When I finally 'surrendered' I went to the ER at Olive View Hospital where I proceeded to have 11 episodes of seizures and my heart stopping. The 11th time after 28 minutes the ER doctor was writing my TOD on my chart when my heart started on it's own.

So any detox could be his last and he is given a 2nd chance, or he may decide to not quit drinking.

It wasn't until I had been sober and clean about 3 years that my mom and I finally had a very 'serious' talk. She told me that at that time if they had not 'shut the door' on me that she and daddy would have ended up in a padded cell in straight jackets. that they were truly at the 'end of their rope.' I thanked them both many times while they were still alive that what they did was THE VERY BEST THING THEY HAD EVER DONE FOR ME AND I WOULD BE TOTALLY GRATEFUL FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE.

Your brother is an adult. He is still capable of making decisions. Might not be the decisions you would like to make but ......................... he is still capable. Please give yourself a break and step away, step back, and just watch his actions. Right now everything you say to him is just going in one ear and out the other. In his state of mind and body your are that 'pestering little gnat' that keeps buzzing around his ear.

Please start to help YOU.

J M H O based on my personal experiences these almost 32 years in continuous recovery.

Sending healing thoughts and prayers for you and your family.

Love and hugs,

quote is from "Alcoholics Anonymous" reprinted 2nd edition.

choublak

He's only doing that because he has an "audience".

Readysteady

Thank you, Laurie and everyone. He said he does want help and says he is checking things out. And as long as he does, I'll help him. I'll be able to tell his sincerity. I know what you mean about taking care of myself first. I haven't been eating much, very depressed, not sleeping well (already have sleep issues but worse now). So I need to take some focus off of it for now. Thank you once again.

m1k3

Hi Ready, you've been given some great advice here. Looking at your last post this is what jumped out at me.

First, you can't help him. There is nothing you can do to help him until he wants it himself.

Second, as long as you are trying to help him he won't feel any need to try and help himself.

Sorry but there isn't anyway to sugar coat this.

Al-anon has a great saying that really applies here.

Let go or be dragged.

Your friend,

Readysteady

Thanks Mike. What I meant was, if he wants help looking at and setting up to get detox and rehab, I'm there for him. Are you saying not to even do that? Also, should I not spend time with him and talk with him until he gets help? And yes, a lot of great advice here!

m1k3

He's a grown man, he can call whomever needs to be called, set up what ever needs to be set up and do whatever needs to be done to get himself help.

As for spending time with him and talking with him that is up to you.

I separated from my AW 2 years ago and have pretty much gone no contact. I still talk with her when it concerns finances or taxes or something like that since we are still married but beyond that I avoid contact as much as possible.

I don't know if she is drinking or not, I don't know if she is in recovery or not and it's none of my business whether or not she is.

I will say that my life is much quieter and much more happy now that I don't have much to do with her.

Your friend,

Readysteady

I hear ya Mike. Thanks.

atalose

That’s great that you will be there to drive him to detox and rehab AFTER HE has set that up for himself.

As for spending time with him, that is your decision, do you get pleasure from it or has it become a tense situation? Can you spend time with him and NOT talk about HIS drinking or detox or rehab?

NeedHappiness

ReadySteady...... I have been in your position for the past 8 years. If only we could "love them" into recovery...... but WE cannot do it for them. Don't mean to sound like a broken record. Everything you've heard from others here who have been through it.... well, it is so true! Your A will tell you whatever you want to hear to get you off his back! He will lie to you, make empty promises (and appear SO SINCERE).... and believe me when I say this can and will go on for years and years...or until a tragedy happens.
I am still working on myself and my co dependency. My ABF is still actively drinking, but I am still learning to set boundaries and take care of myself. Honestly, you won't believe what a relief you will feel if you quit trying to FORCE your A into recovery.
Please continue to visit this forum.... there is a wealth of knowledge, understanding and experience from people here. Reading other's stories has helped me in so many ways. People have been here for me.....and as brutually honest as it may seem sometimes... it helps to hear the truth from those who have been there.
Take care

Readysteady

Good question, Atalose . I do want to spend time with him, especially being that I'm aware that there may not be a whole whole lot more time TO spend. And I'm not getting so testy with him (catching myself) for the same reason. Its always been tense between us, we're brothers, Lol. But ironically it hasn't been as tense lately. As far as not talking about his drinking and rehab.....ah, well, I'll try harder not to, as you seem to suggest its good not to. I'm just very worried cause his health is very bad, and everytime in the past he would drag it out as far as going in. His health doesn't have the wiggle room for effin up anymore. But I hear ya though and will do what you suggest.

Readysteady

Thanks NHappiness. The more I hear from folks like you, the more I'm getting it. A lot of what you said sounds so familiar.

thequest

BEEN dealing with alcoholic relative for yearS at this point. Same attitude. Everything is somebody else's fault. "you don't know squat, they don't know what they doing". When others found out he made a midnight call to get out of jail for his most recent dui most quiped did he get arrested or a dui. When he found out about others responses he was furious. He's still living off the perception that he is percieved as a good little boy as a grey haired adult. He doesn't get how far gone he is or needs real help. He's griping about the mandated classes and counseling. We remind he's not doing it from prison.

As most of said until the alcoholic or addict admits and wants help there's not much you can do. And don't cater your life to them either. If you cant take of yourself who will be left to help anybody out.

LexieCat

You are getting excellent advice, here. My second husband almost died during alcohol withdrawal. His kidneys and liver stopped functioning, and he was in a coma for over a week. Thirty quarts of fluid (ascites--common with liver disease) was drained from his belly. I was told that IF he lived, he would need a liver transplant, and that he might not make it through the year of sobriety required to be eligible.

Long story short, turned out when they finally did a biopsy of his liver he had EARLY cirrhosis, and if he quit drinking he would live a full life. A few months later he went back to drinking. I eventually left, as I could not bear another deathbed vigil. That was fifteen years ago. He is still drinking, and still alive.

I know you are terrified that his death is imminent. And it may well be. OTOH, he may live for decades longer, wasting away from his disease. OR, he might finally decide for himself that he is done with alcohol.

What is going on right now is that he is stringing you along, claiming he is "wanting" to recover, but it is just a ploy to keep you from abandoning him. Trust me, if he decides he wants to recover, there are free programs that can help him. AA is free, for that matter.

I think you are wasting your energy and your own health for the sake of trying to accomplish the impossible. Whether you choose to remain in contact with him is totally up to you, and what you feel you can personally endure. My suggestion is, however, that you lay off the "encouragement" for now. He KNOWS he needs to quit drinking, he knows that is what you want, but he simply isn't ready to do it. He may never be ready.

You don't have to give up all hope, though. I know people who recovered after a few months of literally living in a cardboard box. People who now have years of sobriety. Recovery will be on HIS schedule, though, not yours. When and if he makes the decision that he is serious, THEN you can worry about what to do to support that effort.

Keep going to Al-Anon. It will help you more than you can imagine.

Readysteady

Thank you. Update....he did make calls and wants help, and he's scared. He admitted it's his fault. Told him not to beat himself up with it, just do what he knows is the right thing. Told him we can't MAKE him....he has to want it. We'll see what the next couple of days bring.

tromboneliness

In other words, forget it, basically. He's doing everything they always do: blame everything on yo, tell relatives whatever they need to tell them so that everyone thinks you're the crazy one... and to you, keep saying "I'm working on it, I made an appointment, I went to a meeting, I haven't had a drink in 4 days, really I mean it this time."

It means exactly as much as when Lucy tells Charlie Brown, "Really, I'll let you kick the football this time."

Nothing is going to work if he does not want to get healthy. "Yes, but he's mentally ill, so we can't just detach with love, we have to do something." Well, here's the thing: it will not work.

What puts it into perspective, for me, is turning it around. Because there are any number of things I do myself, which are not healthy, not good for me, and so on. But if someone tells me to change, do I say, "Oh, gee, wow, I never thought of that -- I really should see my doctor more often, exercise more, eat a better diet, and take my vitamins. I never would have figured that out -- thanks for telling me!" Uh, no. Of course I do not jump when someone says, "Boo!" So why do I think I can walk up to an alcoholic -- someone who is more than intelligent enough to know that drinking a quart of vodka a day is not healthy -- and they'll listen to me?

Having said all that, my own "qualifier" finally got sober and healthy when I did an intervention -- hired a professional intervention counselor to come in, get three of her best friends together, and do one -- in her hospital room, the morning she thought she was going home. We persuaded her to go to treatment, she stayed for 5 months, and has been healthy ever since (17 years). But it worked because it was her decision to go, not ours. She told me later that she wanted to get sober and healthy, but that it was just too much to do on her own -- too scary. Your brother is in the same situation -- it has to be his decision to go. It does not sound as though he's anywhere near that point -- he's still giving you all the ******** drunks give you, when all they want to do is drink themselves to death -- which is what most drunks end up doing, and which he has every right to do, if that's what he wants.

Al-Anon was (and still is) very helpful to me, as is a good sponsor. Good luck!

T

amanda39

I've been through this with my A brother over & over & over. He's now being hospitalized after an overdose. He won't get help until he wants help, or until he is given literally no other option but to get help. You can't control him.

thequest

'no other option but to get help'

That says it all. The individual must want and take the initative to get help OR CHANGE for the better.

Dealing with so called functional alcoholic for decades who has always been able to weasel out of stuff although the openings get smaller and smaller every time. Gives him false confidence in defeating the law AND reinforces his attitude that he is the victim of judgemental people including the police. But do alcohol, drugs and misc substances he's been using affect him, NAH... Everyone has legal trouble from personal actions silly.

I used to think people could be nudged or guided but too many have to hit a brick wall literally or figuratively before they get serious help if not an attitude change.