choublak

I'm probably going to be told I need to focus on my own recovery, but let me just say that statement "only you know if you're an alcoholic" is the most BS statement I have ever heard.

LifeRecovery

From my side of it, if my loved one that got here is an alcoholic or not stopped mattering.....his drinking impacted me significantly regardless of if he called himself that or not.

That was an incredibly freeing moment when I got there.

choublak

I'm not even talking about a loved one or any one person in particular. The general statement...it could even be phrased like "only you know if you have a problem or not". As far as I know, that statement is only applied to alcoholics...I don't even think, for example, a drug addict gets told "only you know if you're a heroin addict"...and alcoholism is supposed to be a disease yet no other disease is put into a similar context: "only you know if you have cancer or not". It sounds ridiculous.

redatlanta

Perhaps there is some truth to the statement. The secrecy and denial of Alcoholism is part of the illness. Even if you live with someone you don't know all that they do in regards to drinking or anything.

I also believe many perpetuate their drinking by convincing themselves they are NOT an alcoholic. By typical definition an A being someone who gets up in the morning and has their first drink, drinks all day, and can't go without it. We all know that not every A is like this in fact many can go without it for days, weeks and months at a time.

And certainly just because someone drinks, drinks often, or regularly drinks too much it DOESN"T make them an alcoholic.

Drug addicts are simply not as open with their use. Its illegal - you aren't going to walk into a bar and see someone laying out lines, and there are many recreational drug users who aren't addicts. Drug use is frowned upon in general so ....IMO far more secretive when it comes to use.

So yeah - I get the statement - it says to me "You can lie to everyone else but you can't really lie to yourself'.

choublak

If whether you're an alcoholic or not is something you have to think about and discuss, you have a problem.

If you have to try and "moderate", you have a problem.

If you're saying or thinking, "I think I might be an alcoholic, but I'm not sure", you have a problem.

It's not up for discussion. It's what it is.

Or maybe I should say, it shouldn't be up for discussion.

soberlicious

Well, if you think about it, a person is not really addicted until they try to quit. It is in the process of quitting that the struggle becomes apparent.

I can call another person an alcoholic, or an addict, or whatever I want but the fact remains that it's a free country (in the USA anyway) and a person has the right to drink themselves to death if they so desire. They have the right to never identify as having a problem. People who choose this often die completely alone. There are prices for choices that's for sure, but the choices remain.

choublak

People who identify as maybe having a problem get told "only you know if you're an alcoholic" though.

soberlicious

Personally I think it should be less about the label and more about helping that individual who has reached out and identified as having a problem, by pointing them toward resources that can help them solve their problem. It's not necessary to identify as an "alcoholic" to end an addiction.

Eddie2010

The real statement should be "Only you can stop denying that you have a problem". Most alcoholics know down deep that they are alcoholics just from past actions.

I don't agree with the only you know reasoning. Many close to me told me I should quit or get help, so they knew as well.

choublak

It isn't, but you're "supposed" to say "I'm so-and-so, and I'm an alcoholic" otherwise you're still thought to be "in denial". But that's a whole new topic.

soberlicious

Or "Only you can want to stop drinking."

Not everyone utilizes the same system.
and yes, indeed it is a whole new topic. One that is sure to get rather heated.

doggonecarl

I see a similar phrase used on the "A" side. Someone will post, "I don't know if I'm an alcoholic," the the replies are often, "No one can tell you that you are an alcoholic. Only you can make that determination."

This doesn't mean other people can't tell or don't know. It just means they are wasting their breath trying to tell an alcoholic that they are one. Hence the decision becomes the A's to make.

I am sure many a loved one here knew their A was an alcoholic before they (the alcoholic themselves) admitted it.

choublak

That is exactly what I'm talking about.

pravchaw

It's not BS. If a person is not sure he is addicted then either he is in denial or not an addict. Either way it is his decision and not ready to quit.

choublak

A person who isn't an alcoholic never wonders if he might be one.

If a newcomer joins this site and makes a thread about "am I an alcoholic?" it's like...okay, you're asking that question about yourself, on a forum for alcoholics and addicts...what do you think?

I'm sorry; I still see that statement as BS.

LadyinBC

Actually when you put it that way, it certainly makes sense.

Sueski

Objectively, of COURSE that statement is BS! You, and I, and many other people, can 'tell' (determine) that someone is an alcoholic. What we can't do is 'tell' (ie, get through to them) that they are alcoholics. I think the key to not letting that statement tick you off is to see the word 'tell' differently!

JohnMcMahon

Of course it is nonsense. If a drinker were to go to a doctor or therapist there are very clear diagnostic criteria. Can you imagine turning up at the Docs, paying the large fee and saying "Doc am I an alcoholic?" to be told "Sorry I don't know, only you can tell that. Make another appointment on your way out".

I really don't think that this is going to happen. However they do not tend to use the word 'alcoholic' any more (too much argument about definition, AND a big barrier to admitting a problem and getting sober) instead they use the word 'dependent'.

LexieCat

Yup, I think that is it, in a nutshell. One of the many maddening things about alcoholism is that, although it MAY be obvious to other people, without acceptance by the alcoholic, treatment is, essentially, impossible.

Although there are some diagnostic criteria, they are not as objectively definitive as a blood test or a biopsy. Alcoholics tend to be untruthful about how much they are drinking, and how important it is to them. They are often very good at hiding how bad things are even from THEMSELVES. I know I spun endless rationalizations and explanations in my own head.

And in the early stages, it can be very hard to determine whether someone is, or is not, an alcoholic. Many young people, for example, party hard and do stupid things while intoxicated. They grow up a little more, mature, and they quit doing it. Yet, if you looked at them at their most irresponsible, you might conclude that they are alcoholics. And someone who drinks less than the hardest partiers might just BE alcoholics, who are only getting warmed up.

In addition, as incredible as it might seem, many alcoholics who have concluded that they ARE alcoholics are faced with friends and family members who insist that they are not, that they are over-dramatizing things. These may be friends who don't want to lose a drinking buddy or family members who are scared by the label. Or a partner or spouse who is put off by the idea of the alcoholic having to go to meetings or disrupting their social life.

So, in that light, it isn't exactly a B.S. statement. Obviously, a person either is, or is not, an alcoholic, and how the alcoholic FEELS about it doesn't change that fact. But from a recovery standpoint it is critical that the alcoholic understand who and what he or she is, and accept it. And having the facts presented by others may help, but in the end, the alcoholic has to BELIEVE it.

soberlicious

I agree with what you are saying. It wouldn't matter anyway even if there was a definitive test. The cure is in stopping the behaviors, and the individual is solely responsible for that. In other words, if there was a test, it doesn't mean more people would recover. People are diagnosed with life threatening things all the time, and refuse to act. Diabetics may still eat tons of fat and sugar, Cancer patients may still smoke...
and I agree with you Choublak. I believe that most people who drink too much know that they drink too much. Denying that it is causing problems is just a way to continue drinking, but most of us know inside that there is a serious problem.