recovering from my lapsed recovering alcoholic
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recovering from my lapsed recovering alcoholic
I feel unstable. I check this forum over and over and over again, particularly when I'm lonely at night and missing him so badly I can hardly stand it. I keep hoping this community will offer clues, pieces of the puzzle, some essential insight that will help me understand where he is...dare I say who he is? I don't understand the mind of an alcoholic, but I'm an eager student. Anything at all that you can tell me would be exceedingly helpful.
I still want to contact him.
When I met my XAB, he'd recently returned from a year of drunken debauchery in Ireland. After a spell of sobriety, he arrived at graduate school expecting that a new location/group of friends would help. When he drank an entire bottle of tequila at a very mellow (semi-professional) event, he spent the next few days wallowing in self-loathing. He felt like a "lost cause," doomed to a life consumed by either dry or wet drunkenness.
The following week, he met me. (Don't worry, I make no pretensions to be the hero of this story.) We met in class; a friend of mine had actually told him to keep his eyes peeled for a girl with dark hair and freckles. Later I found out he was so intrigued by my friends description, that it ultimately made his decision to enroll in the course. Shortly after meeting me, he asked permission to ask me out on a date.
He was up front about his problem with alcohol from the outset. I was honest with him about my past, he was honest with me about his. We spent an immense amount of time and energy talking about his drinking problem. It took me a long time to convince him that he wasn't burdening me, that I wanted to be there for him. He had nightmares almost every night of waking up some where hung over, not remembering how he started drinking again. Each night would be a different dream with the same ending: me hurt from his drinking.
And guess what: I am hurt. I am deeply hurt. And this forum helps me realize I have my own sort-of recovery to do. He didn't hurt me by cheating, or being a drunken mess, in fact: I still haven't seen him drunk. He hurt me by growing distant (ever-so-gradually) and then claiming to "not know" whether or not he loved me. He once told me that he has a harder time saying "I love you" than hearing it, because he doesn't think he is capable of loving anyone--given his addiction and all the bar fights. That being said, he told me he loved me and at the time, it seemed to me, he meant it.
Can you guys help me remember that he's incapable of love right now? I want to know more about the personality of an alcoholic. How they tick.
More than that, I know I am the only person in his life who he has EVER been able to open up to about alcohol. In college he was coerced into substance abuse counseling, AA meetings, the whole nine yards. (He was considering being a part of a religious order at the time, which is why they were able to have that kind of authority in his life.) He said he wasn't able to open up with them, but for some reason he could with me. Again, I don't think I have "the magic touch," but I do believe him when he says there was something different about our relationship that made it possible for him to be so open, vulnerable, and honest.
His drinking buddies keep telling him "moderation... you can drink in moderation." He and I both know that's ********, but he's drinking again and told me to my face "This time it might be different, if not I'll just be sober again I guess."
I know I'm not a super hero and I can't save him. But I want to listen. I want to ask him how he's doing. I want to do this for my sake, not just for him. I think it is safe to say that I will fall out of love with him sooner rather than later. But knowing I'm the only person he's ever been able to open up to about this--well, it's hard not to want to be there in some way, shape, or form.
I know I'm helpless and this is completely out of my control. It's too big for me. But I've searched out my impulses as carefully as I can, and I keep returning to this basic desire to reach out and listen.
I hear no contact is often the only way to truly recover. Am I kidding myself?
I still want to contact him.
When I met my XAB, he'd recently returned from a year of drunken debauchery in Ireland. After a spell of sobriety, he arrived at graduate school expecting that a new location/group of friends would help. When he drank an entire bottle of tequila at a very mellow (semi-professional) event, he spent the next few days wallowing in self-loathing. He felt like a "lost cause," doomed to a life consumed by either dry or wet drunkenness.
The following week, he met me. (Don't worry, I make no pretensions to be the hero of this story.) We met in class; a friend of mine had actually told him to keep his eyes peeled for a girl with dark hair and freckles. Later I found out he was so intrigued by my friends description, that it ultimately made his decision to enroll in the course. Shortly after meeting me, he asked permission to ask me out on a date.
He was up front about his problem with alcohol from the outset. I was honest with him about my past, he was honest with me about his. We spent an immense amount of time and energy talking about his drinking problem. It took me a long time to convince him that he wasn't burdening me, that I wanted to be there for him. He had nightmares almost every night of waking up some where hung over, not remembering how he started drinking again. Each night would be a different dream with the same ending: me hurt from his drinking.
And guess what: I am hurt. I am deeply hurt. And this forum helps me realize I have my own sort-of recovery to do. He didn't hurt me by cheating, or being a drunken mess, in fact: I still haven't seen him drunk. He hurt me by growing distant (ever-so-gradually) and then claiming to "not know" whether or not he loved me. He once told me that he has a harder time saying "I love you" than hearing it, because he doesn't think he is capable of loving anyone--given his addiction and all the bar fights. That being said, he told me he loved me and at the time, it seemed to me, he meant it.
Can you guys help me remember that he's incapable of love right now? I want to know more about the personality of an alcoholic. How they tick.
More than that, I know I am the only person in his life who he has EVER been able to open up to about alcohol. In college he was coerced into substance abuse counseling, AA meetings, the whole nine yards. (He was considering being a part of a religious order at the time, which is why they were able to have that kind of authority in his life.) He said he wasn't able to open up with them, but for some reason he could with me. Again, I don't think I have "the magic touch," but I do believe him when he says there was something different about our relationship that made it possible for him to be so open, vulnerable, and honest.
His drinking buddies keep telling him "moderation... you can drink in moderation." He and I both know that's ********, but he's drinking again and told me to my face "This time it might be different, if not I'll just be sober again I guess."
I know I'm not a super hero and I can't save him. But I want to listen. I want to ask him how he's doing. I want to do this for my sake, not just for him. I think it is safe to say that I will fall out of love with him sooner rather than later. But knowing I'm the only person he's ever been able to open up to about this--well, it's hard not to want to be there in some way, shape, or form.
I know I'm helpless and this is completely out of my control. It's too big for me. But I've searched out my impulses as carefully as I can, and I keep returning to this basic desire to reach out and listen.
I hear no contact is often the only way to truly recover. Am I kidding myself?
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More than that, I know I am the only person in his life who he has EVER been able to open up to about alcohol
that thinking will keep you stuck. thinking you are the ONLY one...that's part of that superhero thing!
thing is, TALKING about drinking isn't recovery. talking about not drinking isn't recovery. he would do well in the rooms of AA talking to OTHER recovering alcoholics, who KNOW his story and are living in the solution.
it's easy to get drawn into the sad tale, to see this tormented soul with his demons, to hear him say how great it is you listen.....they tug at our heart strings, calling up our mother instincts and our dreams of being the one that makes a difference.
it's not that he doesn't care - it's how limited he is while under the influence. the booze will always get in the way, take precedence. and while the only way to stop is to STOP, it's not that "easy." he'd have to WANT to stop more than anything, and he'd have to commit himself body and soul to recovery. that's a tall order. and you don't get there by talking about it.
don't feel bad for wanting to reach out. don't feel bad for caring. but DO make sure that you are ok first and foremost.
that thinking will keep you stuck. thinking you are the ONLY one...that's part of that superhero thing!
thing is, TALKING about drinking isn't recovery. talking about not drinking isn't recovery. he would do well in the rooms of AA talking to OTHER recovering alcoholics, who KNOW his story and are living in the solution.
it's easy to get drawn into the sad tale, to see this tormented soul with his demons, to hear him say how great it is you listen.....they tug at our heart strings, calling up our mother instincts and our dreams of being the one that makes a difference.
it's not that he doesn't care - it's how limited he is while under the influence. the booze will always get in the way, take precedence. and while the only way to stop is to STOP, it's not that "easy." he'd have to WANT to stop more than anything, and he'd have to commit himself body and soul to recovery. that's a tall order. and you don't get there by talking about it.
don't feel bad for wanting to reach out. don't feel bad for caring. but DO make sure that you are ok first and foremost.
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Join Date: Dec 2012
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Originally Posted by redatlanta 
A couple of questions - has he ever been in recovery and is he in recovery now and....what lead up to no contact?
Can't really comment without knowing the above.
Can't really comment without knowing the above.
I broke up with him 6 weeks ago...not b/c of alcohol but b/c of his distance. He started drinking again after we broke up. (I found out through a mutual friend). We spoke about three weeks ago, and I created space for him to be honest with me about it... and he was! He even offered more information, and I could tell he wanted to keep talking even though he kept saying: "it's not your problem anymore, you shouldn't have to deal with it."
I told him it never was my problem.
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Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
the thing is, TALKING about drinking isn't recovery.
Since we broke up, he hasn't once approached me to talk. I had to ask him to meet up to discuss what happened, and he was happy to oblige. It is obvious to me that he enjoys my company, and that he still cares about me a great deal. But te is as stoic (and for that matter as Catholic) as they come, and I think he is afraid of hurting me more than he already has by letting me into his life.
So he won't ask for my company, even though I'm still his self-professed "best friend." Plus, he told me all the lies that he tells himself when he's drinking. It makes sense that he'd keep me at arms length; I know too much.
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The part that you mentioned that he was involved in a lot of "bar fights" is scary. There is no moderation for this guy & his friends are wrong suggesting that to him. He is either on or off "the wagon" and will be the rest of his life. He seems like a fairly advanced alcoholic & just because you have not seen him drunk does not mean a thing. You are seeing the after effects of his binging on alcohol.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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You asked about the personality of the alcoholic and how they tick I will give it to you straight up
Alcoholism is a disease of denial. This denial usually affects every person around the A, but it really affects the A the most. The first love of an A is booze. It takes precedence over, people, family members, job, friends, children, spouses, everything. The addiction untreated will do WHATEVER it takes to survive. There is no reasoning with it. It is illogical.
The only way to treat it is for the alcoholic to choose recovery and then to continue to treat it for as long as they live. There is no person, on this earth, that can cause, cure or control the alcoholism of another. While it sounds like your ex found a true confidant in you your relationship sounds like a (false) method for an A to stay sober without recovery.
My guess is he pulled back from you because he had already relapsed - I use that term loosely because its one used to indicate that a person was in recovery, and he wasn't when you met him. He quit drinking for awhile. Its called 'white knuckling" or a "dry drunk". It doesn't mean ANYTHING as far as sobriety.
You talk about his honesty - perhaps he was. Don't count on it now.
My advice would be to proceed with extreme caution. You do need to understand this disease more. Read through the forums there is lots of information here and post often.
Sorry you are going through this - its very painful. Keep reading.
Alcoholism is a disease of denial. This denial usually affects every person around the A, but it really affects the A the most. The first love of an A is booze. It takes precedence over, people, family members, job, friends, children, spouses, everything. The addiction untreated will do WHATEVER it takes to survive. There is no reasoning with it. It is illogical.
The only way to treat it is for the alcoholic to choose recovery and then to continue to treat it for as long as they live. There is no person, on this earth, that can cause, cure or control the alcoholism of another. While it sounds like your ex found a true confidant in you your relationship sounds like a (false) method for an A to stay sober without recovery.
My guess is he pulled back from you because he had already relapsed - I use that term loosely because its one used to indicate that a person was in recovery, and he wasn't when you met him. He quit drinking for awhile. Its called 'white knuckling" or a "dry drunk". It doesn't mean ANYTHING as far as sobriety.
You talk about his honesty - perhaps he was. Don't count on it now.
My advice would be to proceed with extreme caution. You do need to understand this disease more. Read through the forums there is lots of information here and post often.
Sorry you are going through this - its very painful. Keep reading.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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Hi Irbear,
A few months ago I went through a devastating break up with my A as well. Like you, I was the only person he had ever talked with about his drinking problem. While you and I would interpret this kind of intimacy as a sign of love, to the active alcoholic it is more of a threat to their addiction. My ex left me because I was seriously starting to get in the way of his drinking. It sounds like the same thing may have happened to you..
I probably read on SR a thousand times that "their addiction comes first", until it finally started to sink in. It is so powerful, and so destructive, that you and your love are simply not a match for it. If you hang around SR long enough you will begin to see that his leaving was NOT about you. Active alcoholics are extremely sick people in body, mind, and spirit. When you read on here about the crazy things they do, and all that they destroy during the progression of the disease, you will begin to understand your bf, and find some peace.
Unfortunately NC IS the only way to really heal. I was completely resistant to it for a while but after I finally accepted it, things started to get so much easier for me. Now I feel like I have my life back, and honestly never want to see this man again.
Take things one day at a time. Try to nurture and comfort yourself EVERY DAY. You will get through this as many others have. Until then, we are all here to support you!
Hugs, DoS
A few months ago I went through a devastating break up with my A as well. Like you, I was the only person he had ever talked with about his drinking problem. While you and I would interpret this kind of intimacy as a sign of love, to the active alcoholic it is more of a threat to their addiction. My ex left me because I was seriously starting to get in the way of his drinking. It sounds like the same thing may have happened to you..
I probably read on SR a thousand times that "their addiction comes first", until it finally started to sink in. It is so powerful, and so destructive, that you and your love are simply not a match for it. If you hang around SR long enough you will begin to see that his leaving was NOT about you. Active alcoholics are extremely sick people in body, mind, and spirit. When you read on here about the crazy things they do, and all that they destroy during the progression of the disease, you will begin to understand your bf, and find some peace.
Unfortunately NC IS the only way to really heal. I was completely resistant to it for a while but after I finally accepted it, things started to get so much easier for me. Now I feel like I have my life back, and honestly never want to see this man again.
Take things one day at a time. Try to nurture and comfort yourself EVERY DAY. You will get through this as many others have. Until then, we are all here to support you!
Hugs, DoS
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Originally Posted by lrbear
So he won't ask for my company, even though I'm still his self-professed "best friend." Plus, he told me all the lies that he tells himself when he's drinking. It makes sense that he'd keep me at arms length; I know too much.
sending you my best!
shawty
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Join Date: Oct 2010
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All of us (I think) at one time or another thought we would be "the one" that would make the alcoholic stop drinking. We were the only one they could talk to, the one that really understood them, the one that would save them from themselves.....
We knew the alcoholic would see that we loved them and were perfect for them, their true love-and they would stop drinking for us and we would live happily ever after.
STOP
What most of us found out the hard way is the alcoholic loves only one thing-alcohol.
And the sad fact is that will never change.....
I'm sorry you're going through this, it sucks but you will get through it.
Save yourself and let him go.
We knew the alcoholic would see that we loved them and were perfect for them, their true love-and they would stop drinking for us and we would live happily ever after.
STOP
What most of us found out the hard way is the alcoholic loves only one thing-alcohol.
And the sad fact is that will never change.....
I'm sorry you're going through this, it sucks but you will get through it.
Save yourself and let him go.
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 342
I broke up with him 6 weeks ago...not b/c of alcohol but b/c of his distance. He started drinking again after we broke up. (I found out through a mutual friend). We spoke about three weeks ago, and I created space for him to be honest with me about it... and he was! He even offered more information, and I could tell he wanted to keep talking even though he kept saying: "it's not your problem anymore, you shouldn't have to deal with it."
JMO after being married for over 25 years with last 10 active A and 1 year sobriety. First love always alcohol from what I see, comes out in so many manipulative and cunning ways.
Best to take care of oneself and no contact is usually the best way especially if you can't recognize what is going on with yourself or with the A.
Take care.
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Join Date: Dec 2012
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Thank you all so much for all of these responses. I know I'll be reading them over and over again until I'm finally able to be at peace.
I have two classes with him this semester. One is a course on music and theology. E. and I used to play guitar together all of the time, and I spend most of the class period thinking about our spotify playlist "Music to Cover" and all of of the times we'd spend harmonizing away in his tiny apartment.
Any advice for how to manage seeing him ALL the time on campus? He works in the library... and that coupled with the fact that we have two classes together-- I don't know how to do this NC thing and still see him everywhere. Sometimes I feel so strong, and then I hear his laugh or see his nerdy black zip-up vest that he wears with everything and I just melt. I feel like he need only say the word and I'd be back. But I know all of you are right, and that I need to head in the opposite direction.
How did I end up addicted to this guy? and now addicted to reading about/thinking about alcoholism?
Thank you again for listening and responding. It helps more than I can say.
I have two classes with him this semester. One is a course on music and theology. E. and I used to play guitar together all of the time, and I spend most of the class period thinking about our spotify playlist "Music to Cover" and all of of the times we'd spend harmonizing away in his tiny apartment.
Any advice for how to manage seeing him ALL the time on campus? He works in the library... and that coupled with the fact that we have two classes together-- I don't know how to do this NC thing and still see him everywhere. Sometimes I feel so strong, and then I hear his laugh or see his nerdy black zip-up vest that he wears with everything and I just melt. I feel like he need only say the word and I'd be back. But I know all of you are right, and that I need to head in the opposite direction.
How did I end up addicted to this guy? and now addicted to reading about/thinking about alcoholism?
Thank you again for listening and responding. It helps more than I can say.
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Since he's definately an alki, u're ALWAYS going to be 2nd to the booze..plain & simple. He can say & sweet talk u otherwise but we all know actions spk louder than words. If he wants to show u diff, then ask him to an AA mtg & watch his reaction. If he's open to it, then that's good sign but will have to give it up completely @ some point. If he refuses, then there u're answer
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The whole "I'm the ONLY one he can open up to" is pure alcoholic manipulation. And you respond because there is something you are getting out of being in that position. Are you in Alanon? If not, get online and find a meeting near you. You will start to see the relationship for what it truly is.
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Originally Posted by DreamsofSerenity
I just read the other posts.. I totally agree with redatlanta that he pulled away because he was drinking. That is typical A behavior.
I'm an alcoholic and sometimes I don't even understand my own mind. Never understood how the booze became more important than anything else. It became more important than my daughter, my granddaughter, my family. If I was to have one drink tomorrow, it would be all about me and the alcohol once again.
The frustrating thing is that I will always be an alcoholic. There is no cure, no going back to drinking "normally", I can't promise anyone that I'll never drink again. I could snap tomorrow, 1 year from now, 4 years from now. No guarantees. I have to commit to a lifetime of work on myself. I have to say that being with me isn't for the faint of heart that is for sure!
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I advise you start Al Anon - it will help you tremendously in your situation.
As far as seeing him and NC - there are plenty of people on here that are "NC" with people that they have to have some contact with usually parents divorced.
If you have to see then you do - "NC" to me is about becoming personally involved with someone. I have an A friend that I am NC with but I do see here and there. I am always pleasant to her and say hello but that's it. We used to be really good friends. She would often ask me to meet her to 'Hang" aka drink. I started telling her I was always busy. I used to try and help her with her drinking - that was long before I was ever on SR and didn't know there was nothing to help. Many hours spent trying to figure out ways to get her to moderate or quit. Every once in a while she will catch me on the phone. I am pleasant, the conversation is brief, if she asks to see me I am always busy. She seldom calls anymore. There is no point in discussing with her why - that is IMO an A's way to manipulate you back into their mess by reaching out for so called "help".
Anyway just remember that YOU are in control of this situation not him. it may be awkward a little the first time you see him but it won't be eventually.
As far as seeing him and NC - there are plenty of people on here that are "NC" with people that they have to have some contact with usually parents divorced.
If you have to see then you do - "NC" to me is about becoming personally involved with someone. I have an A friend that I am NC with but I do see here and there. I am always pleasant to her and say hello but that's it. We used to be really good friends. She would often ask me to meet her to 'Hang" aka drink. I started telling her I was always busy. I used to try and help her with her drinking - that was long before I was ever on SR and didn't know there was nothing to help. Many hours spent trying to figure out ways to get her to moderate or quit. Every once in a while she will catch me on the phone. I am pleasant, the conversation is brief, if she asks to see me I am always busy. She seldom calls anymore. There is no point in discussing with her why - that is IMO an A's way to manipulate you back into their mess by reaching out for so called "help".
Anyway just remember that YOU are in control of this situation not him. it may be awkward a little the first time you see him but it won't be eventually.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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Feelings are so very real and hurt so much when in reality they are brain chemicals and hormones that create those feelings... certainly not logic or sensible thinking.
Racing thoughts, anxiety and inability to focus or enjoy any other part of my life was something I knew very, very well for many years. I thought my XA was the love of my life and only I could "help" him or he could "open up to about his problems".
For four years I was his rock, his champion, his cheerleader, his probation officer, his nurse, his counselor, his girlfriend, his maid, his personal shopper, his taxi driver, his banker etc, etc, etc.... because he had so much "potential"!!!
I was deeply emeshed emotionally and every other way and when he was sober (and he was sober quite a lot because I do a very, very good job when I have a mission!) he was a wonderful loving and caring partner... but drunk he was meaner than the devil himself!
I tell you all that because I know... we all know how you are feeling... it hurts so much its almost too much to bear. But they are... they really are ... just chemicals... and in time... if you don't feed the feelings and work hard at changing the thoughts and working hard on focusing your attention and time on other things they will lessen and go away in time.
That is why as much NC is helpful. If you see him nod, smile and walk away. It's like alcohol don't even take a sip. It's toxic. He is NOT relationship material. Red Flags are not party favors. Do not collect them. Never, ever fall in love with potential.
You like to play guitar? Focus on locating others with your same interests. Start another hobby. Volunteer.
Alanon, alanon, alanon. Keep reading. Keep coming back. You can do this and you deserve someone who will be YOUR ROCK... dependable, steady, loving... all the time not just when sober.
Racing thoughts, anxiety and inability to focus or enjoy any other part of my life was something I knew very, very well for many years. I thought my XA was the love of my life and only I could "help" him or he could "open up to about his problems".
For four years I was his rock, his champion, his cheerleader, his probation officer, his nurse, his counselor, his girlfriend, his maid, his personal shopper, his taxi driver, his banker etc, etc, etc.... because he had so much "potential"!!!
I was deeply emeshed emotionally and every other way and when he was sober (and he was sober quite a lot because I do a very, very good job when I have a mission!) he was a wonderful loving and caring partner... but drunk he was meaner than the devil himself!
I tell you all that because I know... we all know how you are feeling... it hurts so much its almost too much to bear. But they are... they really are ... just chemicals... and in time... if you don't feed the feelings and work hard at changing the thoughts and working hard on focusing your attention and time on other things they will lessen and go away in time.
That is why as much NC is helpful. If you see him nod, smile and walk away. It's like alcohol don't even take a sip. It's toxic. He is NOT relationship material. Red Flags are not party favors. Do not collect them. Never, ever fall in love with potential.
You like to play guitar? Focus on locating others with your same interests. Start another hobby. Volunteer.
Alanon, alanon, alanon. Keep reading. Keep coming back. You can do this and you deserve someone who will be YOUR ROCK... dependable, steady, loving... all the time not just when sober.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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Irbear, the desire to be "the One" for him to open up to is really your own ego talking---it is a kind of "Head trip" to be the special one. Active alcoholics are drawn to those of us who think like this---and then turn us on our heads before it is over!!
Honey, it has been only 6wks.---I'll wager that you are going through a grief reaction to the loss of this relationship. Allow yourself time to recover from the grief---As you go on with your life in a healthy way--trust me--these memories will become part of "history".
Also, read everything you can get your hands on about co-dependency. Alanon would be a great comfort to you.
sincerely, dandylion
Honey, it has been only 6wks.---I'll wager that you are going through a grief reaction to the loss of this relationship. Allow yourself time to recover from the grief---As you go on with your life in a healthy way--trust me--these memories will become part of "history".
Also, read everything you can get your hands on about co-dependency. Alanon would be a great comfort to you.
sincerely, dandylion
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This morning I woke up feeling serene for the first time in a while. I found an Al Anon meeting that's a few blocks away from my house, and I'm going tonight. I don't think I'd have had the courage to go without all of your encouragement.
I'm also going to skip the class we have together tomorrow, just this once. I have a paper to write, so I'll still be productive. The codependent side of my brain is hoping he'll notice I'm not there and be bothered by it. The side of my brain which is fighting said codependency is trying not to care what he thinks, this is about doing something healthy for me.
Like I said, he hasn't tried to reach out or contact me at all. That's been a HUGE source of pain for me. Now that I'm beginning to understand how essential NC is for me to get over him, I can see that his continued distance is a blessing in disguise.
I'm also going to skip the class we have together tomorrow, just this once. I have a paper to write, so I'll still be productive. The codependent side of my brain is hoping he'll notice I'm not there and be bothered by it. The side of my brain which is fighting said codependency is trying not to care what he thinks, this is about doing something healthy for me.
Like I said, he hasn't tried to reach out or contact me at all. That's been a HUGE source of pain for me. Now that I'm beginning to understand how essential NC is for me to get over him, I can see that his continued distance is a blessing in disguise.
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