Turning wheels
Taking back what is mine!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Ky
Posts: 277
Turning wheels
This might be all over the place as I have several different questions/topics and I don't want to make multiple posts so bare with me.
I have been doing some more reading on codependency and a particular paragraph caught my attention.
"They may put up with abusive relationships or relationships that are not fulfilling because any warm body beats (gasp) no warm body. Being alone is perceived as scary, empty, depressing, etc. After all, who will deliver their emotional supplies? Who will distract them so there is no time to deal with their inner life? Even an abusive relationship is better than no relationship."
This isn't me, being alone doesn't scare me. I don't think I stay with ABF because i think being in a disfinctional unhealthy relationship is better than being alone, I stay because I don't want to hurt him. Even though he has and continues to hurt me, I don't want to cause him that kind of pain. Does thatake me less co dependent? I doubt it, in fact it probably makes it worse because I am willing to stay here unhappy and push my own wants to the side as to not hurt him. Just a random thought I guess, tryin to figure stuff out and untwist my emotions which lead me to my next question.
Does anyone else notice that it is hard to unravel your thoughts and memories? Or do I just have a bad memory. H works so hard to confuse me and keep me that way. When I bring up something of a touchy subject it always jut turns into an arguement of what was said mins, days, months, and yrs ago. So much so that I feel like myemories get altered because I get confused and wonder if I am actually remembering correctly or not. It's so dang frustrating and then the whole point of what I was trying to get across him is lost in non sense. I think it is by far the most irritating part of being with an A, that and the constant I love you that he uses to just fill empty space and be saying something.
Then at some point I started thinking about all the past occurances. Certain things will flash in my mind that I somehow forgot that makes me nauseous. Some of the really bad arguements, etc and I wonder how I can ever look at him the same. I've lost so much respect and trust. I finally remembered what started his drinking, he constantly blames me but I had nothing to do with it. He was a pot head when I met him, I knew something was off with his story but we were both kids so I didn't have enough sense to care. He had a very old warrant for him in a different state when he took the charge for some weed his mom had and instead of facing the charges he ran. I learned this about 3 yrs in, again not enough sense to care. Anyways fast forward 5 yrs and he ends up in jail for this and has to be sent back to the state. He spent a month gone and came back on unsupervised probation cause he was under 18 when it happened and it was a first offense. Needless to say he had to stop smoking pot. That's when the drinking started, it was to replace another addiction and honestly a much worse one in my opinion but I know 100% it had nothing to do with me.
So those were my morning thoughts, not sure there is a point to sharing. I probably should have just journal it all but it feels good to be remembering things correctly and clearly. I hope it continues.
I have been doing some more reading on codependency and a particular paragraph caught my attention.
"They may put up with abusive relationships or relationships that are not fulfilling because any warm body beats (gasp) no warm body. Being alone is perceived as scary, empty, depressing, etc. After all, who will deliver their emotional supplies? Who will distract them so there is no time to deal with their inner life? Even an abusive relationship is better than no relationship."
This isn't me, being alone doesn't scare me. I don't think I stay with ABF because i think being in a disfinctional unhealthy relationship is better than being alone, I stay because I don't want to hurt him. Even though he has and continues to hurt me, I don't want to cause him that kind of pain. Does thatake me less co dependent? I doubt it, in fact it probably makes it worse because I am willing to stay here unhappy and push my own wants to the side as to not hurt him. Just a random thought I guess, tryin to figure stuff out and untwist my emotions which lead me to my next question.
Does anyone else notice that it is hard to unravel your thoughts and memories? Or do I just have a bad memory. H works so hard to confuse me and keep me that way. When I bring up something of a touchy subject it always jut turns into an arguement of what was said mins, days, months, and yrs ago. So much so that I feel like myemories get altered because I get confused and wonder if I am actually remembering correctly or not. It's so dang frustrating and then the whole point of what I was trying to get across him is lost in non sense. I think it is by far the most irritating part of being with an A, that and the constant I love you that he uses to just fill empty space and be saying something.
Then at some point I started thinking about all the past occurances. Certain things will flash in my mind that I somehow forgot that makes me nauseous. Some of the really bad arguements, etc and I wonder how I can ever look at him the same. I've lost so much respect and trust. I finally remembered what started his drinking, he constantly blames me but I had nothing to do with it. He was a pot head when I met him, I knew something was off with his story but we were both kids so I didn't have enough sense to care. He had a very old warrant for him in a different state when he took the charge for some weed his mom had and instead of facing the charges he ran. I learned this about 3 yrs in, again not enough sense to care. Anyways fast forward 5 yrs and he ends up in jail for this and has to be sent back to the state. He spent a month gone and came back on unsupervised probation cause he was under 18 when it happened and it was a first offense. Needless to say he had to stop smoking pot. That's when the drinking started, it was to replace another addiction and honestly a much worse one in my opinion but I know 100% it had nothing to do with me.
So those were my morning thoughts, not sure there is a point to sharing. I probably should have just journal it all but it feels good to be remembering things correctly and clearly. I hope it continues.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
It is good to post! It always helps me process my thoughts and the feedback is helpful and validating - something I needed more than ever when I was still in the thick of it.
The confusion began to clear when I quit talking to him about my thoughts, feelings, and needs. I came here, went to alanon for awhile, and had a councilor to talk to. It made a huge difference to disentangle from his murky and twisted addict thinking.
For the other part about not fearing being alone and why you stay I can totally relate. I found a lot of insight for myself when I started learning about emotional boundaries and my lack there of. There is a ton of info out there but this site sort an introduction. See if it hits any notes for you. Emotional Boundaries
The confusion began to clear when I quit talking to him about my thoughts, feelings, and needs. I came here, went to alanon for awhile, and had a councilor to talk to. It made a huge difference to disentangle from his murky and twisted addict thinking.
For the other part about not fearing being alone and why you stay I can totally relate. I found a lot of insight for myself when I started learning about emotional boundaries and my lack there of. There is a ton of info out there but this site sort an introduction. See if it hits any notes for you. Emotional Boundaries
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
Hm. Good questions. The thing I honed in on is, I think, here:
"Even though he has and continues to hurt me, I don't want to cause him that kind of pain. Does that make me less co dependent?"
Your instinct is right to doubt this (in my opinion). Wanting to prevent hurting someone else MORE than you want to take care of yourself sounds co-dependent to me. At the very least, it says that you don't value your own needs in a healthy way.
He's had a lot of trouble in his life and not made great choices to make things better. Those are his problems. It sounds like you have thusfar stayed because you don't want to make things worse for him. Sadly, none of us can guarantee how the actions we take will affect another person. It could be that losing you is the thing he needs to figure out that he is the root of his own problems. Or it could not be. But until you start putting your own needs first, I'm not sure anything will change for you. It feels selfish, sure -- but a healthy, self-respecting person has a lot more to offer their loved ones than one who struggles with self-worth.
I'm glad you shared your thoughts this morning and hope you feel better.
"Even though he has and continues to hurt me, I don't want to cause him that kind of pain. Does that make me less co dependent?"
Your instinct is right to doubt this (in my opinion). Wanting to prevent hurting someone else MORE than you want to take care of yourself sounds co-dependent to me. At the very least, it says that you don't value your own needs in a healthy way.
He's had a lot of trouble in his life and not made great choices to make things better. Those are his problems. It sounds like you have thusfar stayed because you don't want to make things worse for him. Sadly, none of us can guarantee how the actions we take will affect another person. It could be that losing you is the thing he needs to figure out that he is the root of his own problems. Or it could not be. But until you start putting your own needs first, I'm not sure anything will change for you. It feels selfish, sure -- but a healthy, self-respecting person has a lot more to offer their loved ones than one who struggles with self-worth.
I'm glad you shared your thoughts this morning and hope you feel better.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Dear Sadconfused, I really applaud the effort you are making---you seem to want to understand how you got where you are, right now. This is a good sign of the maturity process in you, as well as evidence of your self-esteem.
I hope you have done some reading about how this horrible and progressive disease works. I suggest reading the articles by Floyd P. Garrett, MD---do a google search for h is website. Also, Melody Beattie's books are classic, as well as others suggested on this forum. Your husband sounds classic by his "quacking", blame-shifting, etc.....
Most co-dependents have a history of trauma, or abuse, or, maybe, simply emotionaly barren or more subtle forms of neglect in childhood. Many times we put up with bad behavior because we have no good frame of reference!!
I think, at this point in your development,an individual therapist could help you enormously. Especially, since you seem, to me, to be motivated.
It is hard to unravel thoughts and memories, you ask. YES! YES! YES! It can also feel very confusing and, sometimes, painful and scarey. This is where the therapist can assist you so much.
Don't give up your journey, though. Get help---but don't give up!
Your logic, alone, won't help with an alcoholic. Don't wear yourself out by trying. His "I love yous' are empty unless they are accompanied by loving actions. An active alcoholic is not usually capable.
Hang in here. Recite the serenity prayer until you "get" it.
sincerely,
dandylion
I hope you have done some reading about how this horrible and progressive disease works. I suggest reading the articles by Floyd P. Garrett, MD---do a google search for h is website. Also, Melody Beattie's books are classic, as well as others suggested on this forum. Your husband sounds classic by his "quacking", blame-shifting, etc.....
Most co-dependents have a history of trauma, or abuse, or, maybe, simply emotionaly barren or more subtle forms of neglect in childhood. Many times we put up with bad behavior because we have no good frame of reference!!
I think, at this point in your development,an individual therapist could help you enormously. Especially, since you seem, to me, to be motivated.
It is hard to unravel thoughts and memories, you ask. YES! YES! YES! It can also feel very confusing and, sometimes, painful and scarey. This is where the therapist can assist you so much.
Don't give up your journey, though. Get help---but don't give up!
Your logic, alone, won't help with an alcoholic. Don't wear yourself out by trying. His "I love yous' are empty unless they are accompanied by loving actions. An active alcoholic is not usually capable.
Hang in here. Recite the serenity prayer until you "get" it.
sincerely,
dandylion
Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: SAN FRANCISCO
Posts: 1,176
I think staying in a relationship with someone who continues to hurt you is a bad sign....
I was hurt many times but he kept coming back and I kept letting him come back. He would complain of being heartbroken and claim that he loved me and couldn't imagine life without me. It is weird that he stayed away for good this time but I am grateful.
I also think they do their best to confuse us and make us doubt ourselves because it's a way of keeping us under control. It's very manipulative and obnoxious. I think if you're with someone who makes you doubt your own sanity it probably isn't a good sign...
good luck!
I was hurt many times but he kept coming back and I kept letting him come back. He would complain of being heartbroken and claim that he loved me and couldn't imagine life without me. It is weird that he stayed away for good this time but I am grateful.
I also think they do their best to confuse us and make us doubt ourselves because it's a way of keeping us under control. It's very manipulative and obnoxious. I think if you're with someone who makes you doubt your own sanity it probably isn't a good sign...
good luck!
Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Right here, right now!
Posts: 3,424
I don't find being alone before or after my relationship a challenge.
I still find myself very codependent however.
For me it is about someone else's feelings being more important than mine, or me thinking that they are more important. Actually one of those ways that it came up was about time together with my loved one that got me here. He needed more time than I did, but also wanted a lot of that time to be about football and/or drinking for example.
The fact that I thought I was the one with problems (for years) for not wanting to spend that kind of time together is a great example of my codependency.
I still find myself very codependent however.
For me it is about someone else's feelings being more important than mine, or me thinking that they are more important. Actually one of those ways that it came up was about time together with my loved one that got me here. He needed more time than I did, but also wanted a lot of that time to be about football and/or drinking for example.
The fact that I thought I was the one with problems (for years) for not wanting to spend that kind of time together is a great example of my codependency.
Taking back what is mine!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Ky
Posts: 277
Sorry things have been kinda busy so I hadn't had time to reply back.
"The confusion began to clear when I quit talking to him about my thoughts, feelings, and needs"
This is something I really need to work on. I still try to talk to him, share my thoughts and emotions as if he is a healthy spouse when in fact he isn't. Sad part is that even though I know this and know that I can talk all I want and I am barely going to get a "yea" or head nod, I am still shocked and angered by him not caring. I need to stop investing, he clearly isn't.
I also been researching boundaries and thanks for the link. I am having issues with decidin what responsible boundaries are and how to enforce them.
"It sounds like you have thusfar stayed because you don't want to make things worse for him."
This is pretty much it. I do love him a great deal as we have we have been together for almost 11 yrs and we have a beautiful little girl but I haven't been "in love" with him for a while.
I have been looking into therapy but it's expensive and I have no job and no insurance. There is a place here that does a sliding scale but even having an extra $25 every week is challenging right now. I want totey out al anon as well but I scared of what his reaction will be.
"Westland I know that "I love you" and it ain't pretty. It translates into "you can't leave."
Exactly! It is the most annoying thing ever.
I have started reading beyond codependency and hope to learn more from it. I am defianetly starting to realize that a lot of my issues come fromm childhood with an A father and copendnt mother. I am trying to work through some of that as well now. Saturday was rough, he has a cycle that I have gotten use to. There is a blow up where he gets so wasted and creates chaos then it is calm, he slows down on drinking and slowly things build and build until another drunken blow up. So things are peaceful for now, I heard all the typical promises. I know they are all lies so I have no expectation for change on his part. Round and round we go!
"The confusion began to clear when I quit talking to him about my thoughts, feelings, and needs"
This is something I really need to work on. I still try to talk to him, share my thoughts and emotions as if he is a healthy spouse when in fact he isn't. Sad part is that even though I know this and know that I can talk all I want and I am barely going to get a "yea" or head nod, I am still shocked and angered by him not caring. I need to stop investing, he clearly isn't.
I also been researching boundaries and thanks for the link. I am having issues with decidin what responsible boundaries are and how to enforce them.
"It sounds like you have thusfar stayed because you don't want to make things worse for him."
This is pretty much it. I do love him a great deal as we have we have been together for almost 11 yrs and we have a beautiful little girl but I haven't been "in love" with him for a while.
I have been looking into therapy but it's expensive and I have no job and no insurance. There is a place here that does a sliding scale but even having an extra $25 every week is challenging right now. I want totey out al anon as well but I scared of what his reaction will be.
"Westland I know that "I love you" and it ain't pretty. It translates into "you can't leave."
Exactly! It is the most annoying thing ever.
I have started reading beyond codependency and hope to learn more from it. I am defianetly starting to realize that a lot of my issues come fromm childhood with an A father and copendnt mother. I am trying to work through some of that as well now. Saturday was rough, he has a cycle that I have gotten use to. There is a blow up where he gets so wasted and creates chaos then it is calm, he slows down on drinking and slowly things build and build until another drunken blow up. So things are peaceful for now, I heard all the typical promises. I know they are all lies so I have no expectation for change on his part. Round and round we go!
Taking back what is mine!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Ky
Posts: 277
I hope it does. I'm really proud of myself this morning. Once I got the kid in bed last night I sat on the couch, he came over and instantly in that my brother called and sounded surprised when he answered my phone and asked if we had cheese. I said so and he replays something along the lines of it sounded like he wanted to talk to you about something else. I said oh ok whatever. A few mins later he says I just can't trust you, typically this would led to me asking why and trying to discuss it which would led to an arguement because he is drunk. I just told him that I am sorry he feels that way and I feel the same and left at that. He seemed confused and poked a few more times but I didn't bite. He eventually passed out.
After an hour or so I was ready for bed, I typically spend a good 45 mins trying to get him up to come with me. After 3 attempts last night and asking him if he wanted to sleep there and getting yes I do want to sleep $&*%!' here as a reply I left him there. After I got in bed I keep thinking of reasons to go back and get him up, what if he don't get up for work or stops breathing etc but. I didn't go back! I told myself that those weren't my problems or responsibilities and went to sleep. He came on there at some point, I didn't hear him but he was there this mornings and very confused at that. Baby steps but good ones, I feel good.
After an hour or so I was ready for bed, I typically spend a good 45 mins trying to get him up to come with me. After 3 attempts last night and asking him if he wanted to sleep there and getting yes I do want to sleep $&*%!' here as a reply I left him there. After I got in bed I keep thinking of reasons to go back and get him up, what if he don't get up for work or stops breathing etc but. I didn't go back! I told myself that those weren't my problems or responsibilities and went to sleep. He came on there at some point, I didn't hear him but he was there this mornings and very confused at that. Baby steps but good ones, I feel good.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
