GG128

Even though I said, "If you leave tonight, you're walking away from our relationship" when we were having our argument yesterday about his alcoholism, he said as he left, "We just need to chill out for a bit. Maybe only see each other on Mondays and Thursdays or something. We'll talk about this on Monday." This leads me to believe that even though he took most of his stuff that was here, that he's going to be in touch again. (Not to mention, he wants this his way, and HIM telling ME what we're going to do is his way, so I don't think he'd let me have the last decision.) He also does still have some things in my garage, and I have a bunch of stuff at his place.

I'm going to an Al-Anon meeting tomorrow after work.

Part of me says I should just cut my losses and be done, because it's only going to get worse, but the other part of me says that I love him and I can't walk away so easily. I'm sure that's a common theme around here.

So if we're going to try to work it out, I think we need to spend time together NOT at home where he can drink, and not at a restaurant where he can drink. I'd like to come up with ideas of what we can do that doesn't give him the opportunity to drink. So far, the list I've come up with is: '

Ice Skating or Roller Blading
Movie at the theater (not the one that serves alcohol)
The Bodies Exhibit (with the plastinized bodies)
Taking a board game to Starbucks
Local Indian Caverns
Dinner somewhere that doesn't serve alcohol (it's hard to find these places. So far all I've come up with is chinese buffets, Donatos Pizza, and fast food. Most pizza joints serve. Even freaking Chipotle has beer now!)

We've already done the local museums to death. The Funny Bone Comedy Club is out because they serve. Trivia night is out because everywhere that hosts serves. Hearing live music or doing karaoke somewhere is out, because it's always at bars. Picnic at the park is out because he'll want to bring beer. Sporting events are out because they serve.

What can we do where there's no alcohol? Especially now that it's starting to get cold and we can't be outside.

Freedom1990

Hi GG128!

Unfortunately an alcoholic is going to do what he/she is going to do despite our best efforts.

Any attempt to control an A, like my AD and my deceased EXAH was an exercise in futility. The A was resentful, and I ended up hurt.

Can you accept him just as he is?

This may be as good as it ever gets for the two of you. Alcoholism is a progressive disease, only getting worse as time goes by.

Sending you hugs of support!

Maylie

GG,

I think while he is not there you should ask yourself some key questions;

-How long are you willing to live like this?
-Are you willing to structure your entire life around keeping him away from alcohol (even though he'll prob. sneak it into anywhere you go)
-Are you happy in this relationship?
-and if you were to let him come back when he chooses, what boundaries are you going to set?

Please take care of yourself and put yourself first. He has made it clear that drinking comes first, are you willing to keep being second to it? I'm happy that you are going to go to a meeting

As for activities to do, you can try to do holiday theamed stuff

pumpkin picking
painting/carving pumpkins
hayrides
haunted hayrides/haunted houses

hugs

Maylie

GG128

I know I can't keep him away from alcohol, but at least I can keep him away from it when he's with me for a few hours every so often while we're figuring things out regarding our relationship.

I don't know how long I'm willing to stay. I just know that I'm not ready to go yet.

suki44883

You are assuming he will be willing to do all those things where he cannot drink. Sorry, but you are trying to run his life and that really isn't your place. He has the right to drink all day every day if that's what he wants to do. You can either accept it or not.

Sorry to sound harsh, but you are trying to control him and make him be the person you want him to be. If you can't accept him the way he is right now...today, then you need to either move on or accept that you aren't going to be happy in this relationship.

GG128

We do things all the time where he doesn't drink. He's not an everyday drinker. He CAN even be at home and not drink, we do it plenty. He doesn't go out somewhere that he can't drink and complain that he can't drink.

He's not that bad yet.

redatlanta

I'm confused - are you looking to spend time together to talk or to just be together and do something?

Talking would be impossible at a movie or exhibit....museum and the like.

Seems that you want him to have a good time, maybe to remember that you used to have a good time together before drinking became an issue.

Perhaps you can orchestrate an outing where alcohol is not involved, but that is creating a bubble, a mere small percentage of time that is not real life. Real life is the alcohol has become and issue to the point that you are breaking up.

I understand you aren't ready to give up. Wishing you the best. I hope things work out.

marie1960

"He's not that bad yet." (GG128)

I walked in your shoes for a couple of years. AND then the storm of the century began. All I can advise, secure your lifeboat now.

Best of Luck.

Lynnrae2

He's not that bad yet.....

keyword YET.


Be strong. take care of you first!!!!

GG128

Yes. We've been spending a lot of time at home lately, and I just want to remind him of the good times that we used to have, and that we can have a good time without alcohol. I think that if we have any chance of making it through another week as a couple, we need to start over, in a sense, and not spend all of our time in emotional arguments. If all of our time together is spent rehashing the problem, he's just going to run immediately.

I think that maybe our getting so close is stressing him out. He has a mother than was an emotionally unavailable addict his entire childhood, and then 13 years with a woman who was filled with drama and cheated on him repeatedly. He doesn't know what a healthy, loving relationship is like, and I think it could be freaking him out.

NWGRITS

This may seem harsh, but there's really no other way to say it. You're being the perfect enabler, the perfect codependent. He has to love having a wife like you. You're trying to pin his actions on what YOU do and how stressful his life may be around YOU. His alcoholism has nothing to do with you. He's going to drink whether or not you're in the picture. You don't make him drink any more than you can make him stop drinking. His alcoholism or potential recovery are not your responsibility. Hey may not be "that bad yet," but he'll get there. Are you planning to just stick it out until he does get "that bad?"

Sanity2012

5 months ago, I probably wrote something very similar to what you posted. And I believed it with every tear and sob I felt when sharing it. Today, your posting brings that pain and hurt back, and I wish there were some magic words to help you. Actually there are....YOU are not the problem. Nothing YOU did caused it. YOU cannot cure it. Take care of yourself now. It is YOUR turn.

WishingWell

I think your approach is a good one but . . . you have to be in a very clear, healthy place to do it. I just read a great book called "Get Your Loved One Sober: Alternatives to Nagging, Pleading, and Threatening" by Robert J Meyers Ph.D. and Brenda L. Wolfe Ph.D. This method is used across the country and on the HBO series on addiction.

BUT again, we have to be very clear and healthy ourselves to use it or a person can fall back into codependency. Codendency is a mental health issue, and it doesn't just, by any means, simply relate to the addict in our lives. It is how people who have this relate to the world.

It takes a lot of work to unwind that spool. To live in a healthier way. Much of what you say is true, at the same time, I would suggest putting more time into getting your head healthy. Read books, get into therapy, learn to react without fixing.

I think once we start to get there, we can then help those who need us in a manner that does support them yet doesn't diminish us.

Does that make sense?

inpieces314

I have a story, it's going to be long.
I have fought with my ABF about his drinking since we have been together. The day he told me he wanted to be with me he quit drinking. Mind you, I was his ex-wife's best friend, and he never quit with her, even though she constantly berated him about it. He knew I wanted him to quit, so he did. For 2 weeks. The longest I have ever seen him sober.
Yeah, it's my fault, I knew he was an alcoholic when I got with him. I didn't care, I loved him anyway. So I got pregnant, had a baby, blahblahblah. The whole time, dealing with all this verbal abuse and stuff because the ex wife really did a number on his head, so how did he deal with it? By drinking himself to death.
The verbal abuse got worse, in front of the kids, all the time. Well, only when he was drunk, which of course was all the time. I was constantly kicking him out of the house. He was constantly leaving and coming back. He would not take his stuff so he would have an excuse to come back and try to stay a couple more days, which I would let him do because I did, and still do, love him, and wanted him to stay and grow up.

The abuse became physical. On my side too, I would act just like him, get drunk and do the same crap he did, because in my mind, I may as well, he's doing it, so why can't I?
I got tired of that real quick, because I still have a job, and bills to pay, and kids to raise, all stuff he no longer cares about.

One day 2 weeks ago it got really bad. I got a protective order. He told the judge he is willing to go to rehab to get me back.

I told him I don't know if it will work when he gets out. Yeah, I want it to, but I don't know. I am thrilled that he finally went. I knew he would. I knew he lost absolutely everything and I was the only thing he was holding on to to not go to rehab. But the thing that did it for me was the fact that I still went and made this order binding for 6 months knowing he was going to rehab. I don't care. I still need to be safe. My kids still need to be safe.

Does he love me? Yeah, I definitely see that now if he was willing to jump into the nearest detox center the day I got a protective order on him. Yeah, because he is doing this because he wants his family back, and he knows it may not be enough for me. Yeah, because he could have very easily went and got a protective order on me but never did.

Do I love him? Yeah, I do, I cry every day because I miss him. But I had to do what I had to do. I was sick of the BS. I was willing to watch him go away forever just to get my sanity back. And that is what did it for him. Watching me do the right thing for myself.

That is what you have to do. It's hard, trust me, I know, but you have to do what you feel is right. If he is going to see you a couple days a week, then fine, let him do it, that gives you 5 days that you don't have to deal with the alcoholic drama. You may find you like it better that way, not dealing with all that BS, because it is quite refreshing. And you will know when you have finally had enough, it's going to be sudden, and it's going to hit you like a ton of bricks, and it will be the hardest thing you have ever done walking away, but you will do it. And if he wants to be with you, he will find a way to do it.

Titanic

Here's a list - click the Helpful Resources for Families link on right column and, once there, the last item in the first section: www.pal-group.org

dollydo

Your trying to put a bandaid on a wound that requires sugical repair.

And, attempting to manage his life, to be in control of the situation, that mindset does not work, he will drink when and where he pleases, it is the nature of the alcoholic. Their disease knows no bounderies.

As for what you know about his ex, it is what he told you...addicts lie and blame shift.

Good Luck, I hope this all works out as you have it planned!

Hopeworks

GG128,

All we can do is share our own ESH and wish you the best in your own choices.

No one is discouraging you from planning activities where alcohol is not served with your A and sometimes we need to walk out the relationship one day at a time for our own recovery and detachment with love.

What most of us are trying to share with you is that no matter how clever we are at trying to arrange our lives with the A's that we love the alcohol they love is more powerful than we are.

You could go to church with you A and while he is in the bathroom he could be taking a drink out of a flask! Heck, I had one A that shared with me that he filled his windshield wiper container under the hood of his car and had a tube running under his dash for YEARS and his wife never knew he was closet drinking! I know another A who filled a condom with alcohol and tied it off and taped it to his leg (a trick he learned from doing similar things when he needed clean urine for drug/alcohol testing as it makes it body temp. for the big switch).

You cannot put a battle plan in place that can ever win against alcoholism because the battle takes place in the mind, heart and spirit of the A himself.

It took me 4 years of "not giving up" and I was the BEST of the BEST at controlling my A and could MAKE him get sober over and over and over again! The problem with that is that getting sober for a date, a day, a week or even months is not recovery. And it won't bring peace, serenity, joy and a healthy relationship with someone.

They can stop drinking... the problem is that they don't want to stop drinking! They always, always, always pick up again unless they decide themselves they want to stop drinking more than they want the next drink. Unless they pursue recovery like a drowning man pursues a gulp of oxygen with burning lungs they won't make it.

So... you can get out your dayplanner and put together 100 places to go where there isn't alcohol but in a year, 5 years and 10 years where will things be with this man? If he weren't alcoholic you could make a good guess and as an alcoholic who is not interested in recovery I can tell you he will be a lot worse.

Pursue your plan but have a dual track... plan b is a very good thing. Alanon, therapy, read, read, read all you can and keep coming back. We care.

Chickadees

Hey GG...

I think the very smart folks above have it about covered.

My experience...I too tried to orchestrate sober outings that didn't involve alcohol only to discover that he would somehow find a way to drink anyway; a mickey in his pants at a dog show, vodka in a water bottle at the fall fair.

The absolute worst and final straw for me was, after I had taken to hiding any alcohol in my house, he went to my 90yr old neighbour's house, under the guise of being helpful, and secretly chugged enough gin (then filled it up with???) so that he passed out in my neighbours living room. Since neither my neigbour nor I had seen him drink more than 3/4 of a strong cider, I didn't know if he had just drank, or whether he had taken something else as well. When I couldn't wake him up I called an ambulance and he was taken away to the hospital. This was at 2:30 on a Sunday afternoon.

I am/was all new to this alcoholism too. I get where you're coming from, I really do. Not so long ago, my A was 'not that bad' either. My experience was that trying to 'help' by making alcohol unavailable just pushed it further underground and it took on new dimensions. My good intentions blew up in my face.

Whatever you do, do take care of YOU first.

Good Roads,
Chick

fluffyflea

There is a series of books called "Getting Them Sober." They are very good.

Letting the A drop to their bottom is more productive than trying orchestrate their activities and control. He will find a way to drink NO MATTER WHAT. What he will end up doing if you are orchestrating and controlling is he'll pick a fight with you to get away. That won't be bringing you any closer together. It is just what they do to drink.

If you don't want to give up, great! But it's more healthy, loving and productive to accept him as he is drinking and all. Ultimatums and orchestrating their lives just doesn;t work. Putting the focus on us does.