Recovering A / Custody...
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 76
Recovering A / Custody...
It has been a while since i posted here. Things have been super hectic around here. Started pre school (my son did), new job, sold my house, need to find a place to live....
Back in july my raxh had a girl he went to HS with come and stay with him. Of course they are "just friends" and a bunch of other lies. He is supposedly madly in love with her now (fine by me) and all that stuff. Then this past holiday weekend he drove to FL to see her. He stayed at a nice hotel, blahblahblah...
For the last few months i have emailed him a few times (i think 3 times) that he should give me a schedule that would be good for him for seeing our son. He never responds with a schedule, just a complaint how i do not do this do not do that. The week before labor day he was here and spent time with our son. then he went away for the holiday weekend. Sunday afternoon he emails me demanding time with his son today.
So i make all the arrangements. rush to meet him after pre school. in the parking lot where we met he threatens me with lawyer/court about custody.
In the last few months he has always asked me the day before if he could see him the following day. Never responded to me asking him for a schedule. He does not get that our son is 3 and needs consistency, schedule, bedtime. He took him to the fair on a monday afternoon. Does he not see that he just emails me to see him when he has nothing better to do and then gives me a hard time about it. After threatning to take me to court he asked if there was anything more important then him seeing his son! What?!? Last week driving 15hrs to FL was more important to him...
Why does he do this? He flips our lifes upside down every time he is in the mood to see his son. I have sole custody in the separation agreement. Is it true, that most times the sep. agreement "turns into" the divorce decree?
Since i have been coming here and going to al anon i have never responded to his emails anymore. If i do it's only if he wants to know a time and place to meet. That is IT. So i do learn ;-)
a sidenote: he has 2 kids from his other marriage that are in fl (40min away from where he was) and he did not go see them. He did not even contact them. He drove right past their house to get to his destination. Then he posts pics on FB about his visit there... That his oldest son (14) can see on FB! How inconsiderate is that?!
I just dont get it. He is in recovery and seems really serious about it. He seems to be even more of an a$$ then before....
THanks for letting me babble and rant and rave.
Back in july my raxh had a girl he went to HS with come and stay with him. Of course they are "just friends" and a bunch of other lies. He is supposedly madly in love with her now (fine by me) and all that stuff. Then this past holiday weekend he drove to FL to see her. He stayed at a nice hotel, blahblahblah...
For the last few months i have emailed him a few times (i think 3 times) that he should give me a schedule that would be good for him for seeing our son. He never responds with a schedule, just a complaint how i do not do this do not do that. The week before labor day he was here and spent time with our son. then he went away for the holiday weekend. Sunday afternoon he emails me demanding time with his son today.
So i make all the arrangements. rush to meet him after pre school. in the parking lot where we met he threatens me with lawyer/court about custody.
In the last few months he has always asked me the day before if he could see him the following day. Never responded to me asking him for a schedule. He does not get that our son is 3 and needs consistency, schedule, bedtime. He took him to the fair on a monday afternoon. Does he not see that he just emails me to see him when he has nothing better to do and then gives me a hard time about it. After threatning to take me to court he asked if there was anything more important then him seeing his son! What?!? Last week driving 15hrs to FL was more important to him...
Why does he do this? He flips our lifes upside down every time he is in the mood to see his son. I have sole custody in the separation agreement. Is it true, that most times the sep. agreement "turns into" the divorce decree?
Since i have been coming here and going to al anon i have never responded to his emails anymore. If i do it's only if he wants to know a time and place to meet. That is IT. So i do learn ;-)
a sidenote: he has 2 kids from his other marriage that are in fl (40min away from where he was) and he did not go see them. He did not even contact them. He drove right past their house to get to his destination. Then he posts pics on FB about his visit there... That his oldest son (14) can see on FB! How inconsiderate is that?!
I just dont get it. He is in recovery and seems really serious about it. He seems to be even more of an a$$ then before....
THanks for letting me babble and rant and rave.
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Do you have a custody agreement/visitation schedule as part of your divorce?
If so, stick by that and make notes of when he doesn't show up as agreed upon.
And don't deviate from it. Ever.
That's my advice.
If so, stick by that and make notes of when he doesn't show up as agreed upon.
And don't deviate from it. Ever.
That's my advice.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,295
"Sorry, we already have something planned for tomorrow. I will need advance notice of the date and time when you would like to see your son in the future, a minimum of 2 days notice. If you fail to adhere to our agreements, I will invoke my power for court ordered times and dates."
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
ETA: Also really like previous post!
Keep documentation on all his contacts and visits and if he follows through etc.
I wouldn't worry about his threats. His history and current actions show his true intentions.
I would not contact him at all before that. If he contacts you for visitation you can do as you have been doing if there were not prior plans etc. Log all the details. Do not engage. You can actually turn your back to him if he goes off on some tangent.
When the divorce is final and visitation is set you can stick to that and not deviate. If he misses, he misses. Sadly, there is no control over schedules, food, baths, bedtimes, consistency, if he shows up, etc. etc. You do the best you can to create a smooth, calming transition back into your home and have plans in place for the times he flakes out and doesn't show. My younger sons were 3yo when I left too so I do understand how hard all that is on them.
Keep documentation on all his contacts and visits and if he follows through etc.
I wouldn't worry about his threats. His history and current actions show his true intentions.
I would not contact him at all before that. If he contacts you for visitation you can do as you have been doing if there were not prior plans etc. Log all the details. Do not engage. You can actually turn your back to him if he goes off on some tangent.
When the divorce is final and visitation is set you can stick to that and not deviate. If he misses, he misses. Sadly, there is no control over schedules, food, baths, bedtimes, consistency, if he shows up, etc. etc. You do the best you can to create a smooth, calming transition back into your home and have plans in place for the times he flakes out and doesn't show. My younger sons were 3yo when I left too so I do understand how hard all that is on them.
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Real World
Posts: 729
Hmmmm... OK, a couple things.
First, I have had custody for almost 15 years despite being male and numerous custody battles.
First thing First: Sole custody is a legal distinction. Love is fleeting, your child's other parent, much like Herpes, is forever.
Secondly... I have had joint, primary and sole custody at various times, it has been sole for several years. In most states, there is a presumptive argument that the Court should appoint you joint managing conservators, ie, joint custody. That's lipstick on a pig... what it really means is that one of you typically gets wednesday night (or another night) plus the 1st, 3rd, 5th weekend of each month, alternate spring breaks, half of Christmas break and a good chunk of the summer. That "Joint' parent typically pays child support, health insurance and half of other bills. The other "Joint" parent, AKA the winner of the custody battle, gets the rest of the time plus child support and has the whip hand.
Sole legal custody is rarely sole PHYSICAL custody. You don't get 100% of the time absent a damned good reason because you shouldn't. Kids deserve two parents even if one of them is Satan as long as satan is not driving drunk, having overnight guests, being abusive etcetera.
You asked if temporary orders become the final orders? Often they do. One way to prove to the court that you should NOT have sole custody is to listen to those who tell you not to let your ex see the kid unless you are forced to by the visitation schedule. If you want the court to believe that you can be trusted with cart blanche, don't abuse it. Your job is to facilitate their relationship by being as cooperative as possible.
OK, go walk outside, scream for a minute then come read the rest.
Alrighty then... So how can I possibly say that? Simple, it's true.
I have never enforced the orders except when ex was unstable and then only until she settled down. She inconveniences me, takes advantage, fails to meet her responsibilities, cost me well into the six figures in legal bills, got arrested once for assaulting me when trying to get through me to kid, took my kid to another state and claimed I was a molestor (that was fun, love herrrrrrr) and basically did everything but grow horns and a tail and chase my ass around with a pitchfork. We are not close.
But
My daughter loves her and my duaghter does not belong to me or her mother, we both belong to our daughter.
Yes, it SUCKS. Anyone who would do all the horrible things this loser did to you deserves the worst... but not from you and not using your son as a club.
It is SO easy to rationalize keeping your son from him if he does not give you ample notice, doesn't behave well, doesn't pay child support etcetera. If he does not pay child support you can have him jailed but you can't keep your(plural) son from him.
My advice: The court would like to see you make every reasonable effort to accomodate dipshit seeing your son. It sucks but it is good for your son.
Exceptions?
1. You don't have to turn your life upside down, a last minute request from him does not make it an emergency for you. If it truly inconvenient then say no and offer an alternative. Don't say no because it will teach him to be courteous and plan. We already agreed he's a dipshit, he has been a dipshit for a long time and dipshit he shall be til the end of his dipshit days in all probability. Say yes if you can, for your son.
2. If there is a danger. Wow this is fun, you show up for the swap and dipshit is drunk and has no carseat.... UNless your orders state that you can cancel any scheduled visit you have to turn your son over. If you do not, guess who can be held in contempt? You got it! Spend $100 on a good spypen with audio and HD video and bring a friend whenever possible to the exchange until things settle down. If he threatens you, document but the beauty of a recorder is that it is like wearing a shock collar... everyt time you are tempted to get snarky it zaps you and you remember hizzonner will hear it. If you genuinely can't release son to him in the state he is in then you better have that video and he better be clearly drunk. Alternately, you call the police and let them arrest him and collect your son from them. It sucks but it is better than letting a drunk drive with your son in the car. ...if he isn't drunk then you are toast, this is for safety, not revenge.
After what my ex did to me I wanted to get even. The loser guys, the irresponsible behavior, the fact that I really do know that she is Satan in drag.... but really, for all of her faults she is a pretty good mom when she isn't crazy and my daughter loves her and I should hate her but choose not to. That has made my daughter's life much better and easier and honestly? It's made mine better too.
One last thing - reread your post. What he does or does not do, who with, how he treats others... it's all irrelevant now. All that matters is how he treats your (plural) son. The rest is his business now.
If being as flexible as you can be with the custody arrangement because it is the right thing and best for your son isn't enough reason, not doing so is likely to mean more time in Court because people fight for new orders only when the existing ones are untenable. Judges hate litigants, seriously. If you make it to trial after court ordered mediation and all those legal bills and all the hurdles they put between you and a trial they are pissed.... they will figure out in about ten seconds who is being stubborn and punish both of you but punish whomever they think is gumming up the works more. Don't do that :-)
I'm sorry he is a dipshit. Be a good mom, encourage them to be together as long as it is good time (no drinking, overnight guests, bad environment etcetera). Don't do it for dipshit. Go ahead and wish an uncomfortable and unlpleasant social disease on dipshit but love your son and know that maximizing the GOOD interaction between son and dipshit is really very good for son unless dipshit is being a dipshit TO SON. If he doesn't provide a safe environment and suitable supervision then screw'm, no visitation. But then be saying no because it is BAD FOR SON and not because you don't like dipshit. It is so easy to rationalize that dipshit is evil and thus dipshit is bad for son... avaoid that trap :-)
Anyone who follows a restrictive visitation schedule simply because they legally CAN should not have control over it. Our job is to do our best to ensure that our kids have a close, warm, loving and healthy relationship with the one person we most want to scrape off our shoe and be done with. Ain't that a hoot!
PS> I hate that sharing crap too ;-)
Think that through.
First, I have had custody for almost 15 years despite being male and numerous custody battles.
First thing First: Sole custody is a legal distinction. Love is fleeting, your child's other parent, much like Herpes, is forever.
Secondly... I have had joint, primary and sole custody at various times, it has been sole for several years. In most states, there is a presumptive argument that the Court should appoint you joint managing conservators, ie, joint custody. That's lipstick on a pig... what it really means is that one of you typically gets wednesday night (or another night) plus the 1st, 3rd, 5th weekend of each month, alternate spring breaks, half of Christmas break and a good chunk of the summer. That "Joint' parent typically pays child support, health insurance and half of other bills. The other "Joint" parent, AKA the winner of the custody battle, gets the rest of the time plus child support and has the whip hand.
Sole legal custody is rarely sole PHYSICAL custody. You don't get 100% of the time absent a damned good reason because you shouldn't. Kids deserve two parents even if one of them is Satan as long as satan is not driving drunk, having overnight guests, being abusive etcetera.
You asked if temporary orders become the final orders? Often they do. One way to prove to the court that you should NOT have sole custody is to listen to those who tell you not to let your ex see the kid unless you are forced to by the visitation schedule. If you want the court to believe that you can be trusted with cart blanche, don't abuse it. Your job is to facilitate their relationship by being as cooperative as possible.
OK, go walk outside, scream for a minute then come read the rest.
Alrighty then... So how can I possibly say that? Simple, it's true.
I have never enforced the orders except when ex was unstable and then only until she settled down. She inconveniences me, takes advantage, fails to meet her responsibilities, cost me well into the six figures in legal bills, got arrested once for assaulting me when trying to get through me to kid, took my kid to another state and claimed I was a molestor (that was fun, love herrrrrrr) and basically did everything but grow horns and a tail and chase my ass around with a pitchfork. We are not close.
But
My daughter loves her and my duaghter does not belong to me or her mother, we both belong to our daughter.
Yes, it SUCKS. Anyone who would do all the horrible things this loser did to you deserves the worst... but not from you and not using your son as a club.
It is SO easy to rationalize keeping your son from him if he does not give you ample notice, doesn't behave well, doesn't pay child support etcetera. If he does not pay child support you can have him jailed but you can't keep your(plural) son from him.
My advice: The court would like to see you make every reasonable effort to accomodate dipshit seeing your son.
It sucks but it is good for your son.Exceptions?
1. You don't have to turn your life upside down, a last minute request from him does not make it an emergency for you. If it truly inconvenient then say no and offer an alternative. Don't say no because it will teach him to be courteous and plan. We already agreed he's a dipshit, he has been a dipshit for a long time and dipshit he shall be til the end of his dipshit days in all probability. Say yes if you can, for your son.
2. If there is a danger. Wow this is fun, you show up for the swap and dipshit is drunk and has no carseat.... UNless your orders state that you can cancel any scheduled visit you have to turn your son over. If you do not, guess who can be held in contempt? You got it! Spend $100 on a good spypen with audio and HD video and bring a friend whenever possible to the exchange until things settle down. If he threatens you, document but the beauty of a recorder is that it is like wearing a shock collar... everyt time you are tempted to get snarky it zaps you and you remember hizzonner will hear it. If you genuinely can't release son to him in the state he is in then you better have that video and he better be clearly drunk. Alternately, you call the police and let them arrest him and collect your son from them. It sucks but it is better than letting a drunk drive with your son in the car. ...if he isn't drunk then you are toast, this is for safety, not revenge.
After what my ex did to me I wanted to get even. The loser guys, the irresponsible behavior, the fact that I really do know that she is Satan in drag.... but really, for all of her faults she is a pretty good mom when she isn't crazy and my daughter loves her and I should hate her but choose not to. That has made my daughter's life much better and easier and honestly? It's made mine better too.
One last thing - reread your post. What he does or does not do, who with, how he treats others... it's all irrelevant now. All that matters is how he treats your (plural) son. The rest is his business now.
If being as flexible as you can be with the custody arrangement because it is the right thing and best for your son isn't enough reason, not doing so is likely to mean more time in Court because people fight for new orders only when the existing ones are untenable. Judges hate litigants, seriously. If you make it to trial after court ordered mediation and all those legal bills and all the hurdles they put between you and a trial they are pissed.... they will figure out in about ten seconds who is being stubborn and punish both of you but punish whomever they think is gumming up the works more. Don't do that :-)
I'm sorry he is a dipshit. Be a good mom, encourage them to be together as long as it is good time (no drinking, overnight guests, bad environment etcetera). Don't do it for dipshit. Go ahead and wish an uncomfortable and unlpleasant social disease on dipshit but love your son and know that maximizing the GOOD interaction between son and dipshit is really very good for son unless dipshit is being a dipshit TO SON. If he doesn't provide a safe environment and suitable supervision then screw'm, no visitation. But then be saying no because it is BAD FOR SON and not because you don't like dipshit. It is so easy to rationalize that dipshit is evil and thus dipshit is bad for son... avaoid that trap :-)
Anyone who follows a restrictive visitation schedule simply because they legally CAN should not have control over it. Our job is to do our best to ensure that our kids have a close, warm, loving and healthy relationship with the one person we most want to scrape off our shoe and be done with. Ain't that a hoot!
PS> I hate that sharing crap too ;-)
Think that through.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 76
WOW PohsFriend. You are right with a lot of things. A lot of it - guilty as charged. And this is not rationalizing.
I am truly concerned about my sons future. He has ever characteristic to fall in his fathers footsteps, who fell in his fathers footsteps. I am not only talking about drinking. For example my ex has always struggeled with food, weight. Our son has his genes when it comes to that. And he sees nothing wrong with feeding him junk. A 3yo does not understand yet, why he can do certain things there and not here. He is too little to explain.
Visitation. We do not have a set schedule in the agreement. It sais "mutually agreed upon schedule". I have been accomodating every time he emailed me the day before. I have never said no to him seeing him. I have said no to overnights and some of the things he wanted to do with him.
It also sais in the agreement that his sponsor should be in contact with me in case he falls off the wagon. That has never happened. He is supposed to pay me $$/month towards our mutual debt in addition to the child support. He has never done either. But now his wages are garnished for the CS.
yes i am mad at him. If it were not for my family i would have literally not known how to put food on the table for OUR son. How can he be a good, caring and loving father if he lets that happen?!
But i think deep down i do not want my son to get hurt down the road by his dad. When he decides that he does not want to see him anymore. I dont do these things to be spiteful. I notice when that feeling comes up and i bite my toungue. We probably all have plenty of practice doing that. :-)
Thank you all for your responses. I have been documenting and saving emails too. I do not have a date yet for the final divorce. I don't even know how i get that. Will they just "invite" us? Do we have to initiate that? No idea.
I will re read all of your responses and sleep on it!
thanks again.
I am truly concerned about my sons future. He has ever characteristic to fall in his fathers footsteps, who fell in his fathers footsteps. I am not only talking about drinking. For example my ex has always struggeled with food, weight. Our son has his genes when it comes to that. And he sees nothing wrong with feeding him junk. A 3yo does not understand yet, why he can do certain things there and not here. He is too little to explain.
Visitation. We do not have a set schedule in the agreement. It sais "mutually agreed upon schedule". I have been accomodating every time he emailed me the day before. I have never said no to him seeing him. I have said no to overnights and some of the things he wanted to do with him.
It also sais in the agreement that his sponsor should be in contact with me in case he falls off the wagon. That has never happened. He is supposed to pay me $$/month towards our mutual debt in addition to the child support. He has never done either. But now his wages are garnished for the CS.
yes i am mad at him. If it were not for my family i would have literally not known how to put food on the table for OUR son. How can he be a good, caring and loving father if he lets that happen?!
But i think deep down i do not want my son to get hurt down the road by his dad. When he decides that he does not want to see him anymore. I dont do these things to be spiteful. I notice when that feeling comes up and i bite my toungue. We probably all have plenty of practice doing that. :-)
Thank you all for your responses. I have been documenting and saving emails too. I do not have a date yet for the final divorce. I don't even know how i get that. Will they just "invite" us? Do we have to initiate that? No idea.
I will re read all of your responses and sleep on it!
thanks again.
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