I'm realizing I'm part of the problem. New to this.
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I'm realizing I'm part of the problem. New to this.
I've always just assumed that my mom was an enabler/co-dependent, my sister an alcoholic, manipulator, user. I have spent at leat the last two decades being disgusted with her choices and my parents reactions, trying to beg them to do something different, rationalize, explain, cry, etc. After removing myself for a few months, I went back into the fire and it feels like banging my head against a wall and saying over and over 'when will i ever learn it's never going to change!?'. As usual, I got played as the big bad bully, my sister the victim, my mom who I love so much lied to my face to cover for my sister. It enrages me that at the very least she won't just admit just how plain messed up everything is. It infuriates me that my sister can be so selfish, irresponsible, immature, cruel. It makes me sooo sad for her kids and for my mom who is working as fast as she can to try to make it all better. Maybe it's not true, but if my sister wasn't a gd selfish drunk, my mom could be enjoying life and me and my family could be enjoying her!
I understand the meaning of the serenity prayer, but I can't put it into action. How do I ignore it when my mom lies to me or lashes out at me because she can't lash out at sister? How do I sit back and watch my sister make my mom work her fingers to the bone supporting her in a lavish way and raising her kids who have to see their drunk mom being an idiot? I want to wring her neck. ... I posted on another site for aging concerns trying to figure out what I could do, but I think now maybe I need to accept that there is nothing I can do...
do I call my mom and say I know you lied to me about why you couldn't come out this weekend? You made a million poor excuses but the truth is it's because you were babysitting sister's kids so she could go get wasted. I want to scream that from the mountain tops. YOU CHOSE TO HELP HER GET DRUNK AND LIE TO ME ABOUT IT! But it would be more of that banging my head against a brick wall. I love my mom, I want to protect her, I don't want to stress her out with my anger and sadness, I want my sister to pay for all the pain she caused. That's the truth. I want her to pay. I know it sounds terrible, and I'm a good loving person.
Here's most of the story, although I'm so over it, I don't think it really matters...I'm sick of thinking about it----
I'm from a big family, 8 of 9 siblings are college grads, in good relationships, great friends with one another, all successful, happy and independent. The other sib (the oldest), has never had a real job, gone thru a few marriages, lost a few homes to foreclosure, has NO long term friends, and has pattern of going from one person (typically older people or men)to another, taking them for all she can then accusing them of abuse once they tell her "no more" and dropping them. She has stolen money from a few of her sibs, lied about us (she told my family that I kept asking her young children "where's your daddy?" when she had served him with a restraining order, she claims to not be invited to family things like baptisms or xmas even though we always included her so our parents would be happy, she cries to our parents that siblings were attacking her when they ask her really simple normal questions), she is also an alcoholic. Typically gets slurry drunk from box red wine or whisky and has recently just started passing out in the evenings, sometimes waking up and starting to undress in front of the little cousins or cussing and attacking people. She is pushy and beligerent when she doesn't get her way and can say truly cruel things ("Mom hates you. She told me she can't stand when you come here.") She also pushes my mom around and makes her buy so much junk(sis's a hoarder) and has completely filled my mom's barn, yard, and home with stuff my mom buys for her. She typically has lived off my parents, either in property they own, in their home, or with their funds. My father who could somewhat keep her in line recently passed away and as we all predicted, she and her 2 grade school kids have moved into my mom's nice house. The first thing she did was empty out all of my dad's closets to make more room (and probably to cause drama). She didn't tell any of us. Mom had told us all that she wasn't removing anything for at least a year, but when faced with this she changed her story and said she was so happy that sis did it. Mom herself is child of alcoholics and wants peace at all costs. She pays all sisters bills, phone, gas, mechanics, food, electricity, cash, booze, gives her the nicer car and is stuck at home for days at a time when sister leaves, and watches, feeds, and puts the kids to bed almost every single day. The sad thing is Mom is such an enabler she lies to our face about it, acts like she wanted to do that, or said it just happened once, etc... although we have all seen the pattern for the last 3 decades at least- sis is almost 50. On top of it all, my sister does nothing to help my mom. She sits in the big home like it is her own or visits her rich elderly friends as my mom works the 5 acres and takes care of her kids. All the rest of us live a few hours away and come out to help as much as we can (before she moved in, there was someone there at least twice a month for long weekends). My husband will not kick my 76 year old mother out of her bed, the other bedrooms are "off limits", not to mention my sister's drinking and her declaration that guns are on the property (bad combo with crazy drunks), so we have had to severely limit our time there with our kids (even though we all LOVE their grandma and her house). We recently went and stayed in hotel to come help, we had heard my mom was working non-stop in the yard, and watching the kids non-stop (not from my mother she would never admit that), so we went and worked like dogs helping my mother, while sister sat in the house, entertained old people (probably rich or vulnerable), and left her kids with mom. And my mom covered for her! In rare moments of exhaustion or frustration my mom will admit that sister has drinking problem and personality issues and that she is pushy and harsh, but she is stuck because she wants to protect the children. Then she will never mention that again and try to downplay it if we bring it up, saying how great sister is. Mom's totally getting used, running a welfare state for completely entitled manipulative immature irresponsible sister and our mom lashes out at us if we try to say anything about it. I asked her to my son's bday party and she said she couldn't be away from the farm that long because she is the only one that does the work (rare moment of honesty- altho she didn't also admit she has to babysit sister's kids 24/7) when i suggested that sister could have a work list for those days, mom lashed out at me and said it wasn't the work, that she wanted to have a social life and she couldn't just go back and forth out of town all the time-totally random thing to say, I was inviting her to one weekend bday party, sister takes her car for days, leaves her kids for day, takes all her money so she is broke.I know she lashes out at me because I won't lash back like sister and she can't admit the sad, sad truth. I'm so SAD. I've done this so long I need to accept this is Mom's choice and I can't protect her. Mom is healthy, activ, mental ok- exhausted, depressed and frazzled trying to keep cover story up. I LOVE my mom so much.
how can i stop myself from calling my mom out on her lies? how can i ignore my sister's terrible choices and their sad consequences? How do i actually DO the serenity prayer?
I have read a few of these threads, am new to all this, but I already feel relief and thank you for your advice (honestly it feels like good just to think someone will hear me or understand where I'm coming from- I wish that was my mom!).
I understand the meaning of the serenity prayer, but I can't put it into action. How do I ignore it when my mom lies to me or lashes out at me because she can't lash out at sister? How do I sit back and watch my sister make my mom work her fingers to the bone supporting her in a lavish way and raising her kids who have to see their drunk mom being an idiot? I want to wring her neck. ... I posted on another site for aging concerns trying to figure out what I could do, but I think now maybe I need to accept that there is nothing I can do...
do I call my mom and say I know you lied to me about why you couldn't come out this weekend? You made a million poor excuses but the truth is it's because you were babysitting sister's kids so she could go get wasted. I want to scream that from the mountain tops. YOU CHOSE TO HELP HER GET DRUNK AND LIE TO ME ABOUT IT! But it would be more of that banging my head against a brick wall. I love my mom, I want to protect her, I don't want to stress her out with my anger and sadness, I want my sister to pay for all the pain she caused. That's the truth. I want her to pay. I know it sounds terrible, and I'm a good loving person.
Here's most of the story, although I'm so over it, I don't think it really matters...I'm sick of thinking about it----
I'm from a big family, 8 of 9 siblings are college grads, in good relationships, great friends with one another, all successful, happy and independent. The other sib (the oldest), has never had a real job, gone thru a few marriages, lost a few homes to foreclosure, has NO long term friends, and has pattern of going from one person (typically older people or men)to another, taking them for all she can then accusing them of abuse once they tell her "no more" and dropping them. She has stolen money from a few of her sibs, lied about us (she told my family that I kept asking her young children "where's your daddy?" when she had served him with a restraining order, she claims to not be invited to family things like baptisms or xmas even though we always included her so our parents would be happy, she cries to our parents that siblings were attacking her when they ask her really simple normal questions), she is also an alcoholic. Typically gets slurry drunk from box red wine or whisky and has recently just started passing out in the evenings, sometimes waking up and starting to undress in front of the little cousins or cussing and attacking people. She is pushy and beligerent when she doesn't get her way and can say truly cruel things ("Mom hates you. She told me she can't stand when you come here.") She also pushes my mom around and makes her buy so much junk(sis's a hoarder) and has completely filled my mom's barn, yard, and home with stuff my mom buys for her. She typically has lived off my parents, either in property they own, in their home, or with their funds. My father who could somewhat keep her in line recently passed away and as we all predicted, she and her 2 grade school kids have moved into my mom's nice house. The first thing she did was empty out all of my dad's closets to make more room (and probably to cause drama). She didn't tell any of us. Mom had told us all that she wasn't removing anything for at least a year, but when faced with this she changed her story and said she was so happy that sis did it. Mom herself is child of alcoholics and wants peace at all costs. She pays all sisters bills, phone, gas, mechanics, food, electricity, cash, booze, gives her the nicer car and is stuck at home for days at a time when sister leaves, and watches, feeds, and puts the kids to bed almost every single day. The sad thing is Mom is such an enabler she lies to our face about it, acts like she wanted to do that, or said it just happened once, etc... although we have all seen the pattern for the last 3 decades at least- sis is almost 50. On top of it all, my sister does nothing to help my mom. She sits in the big home like it is her own or visits her rich elderly friends as my mom works the 5 acres and takes care of her kids. All the rest of us live a few hours away and come out to help as much as we can (before she moved in, there was someone there at least twice a month for long weekends). My husband will not kick my 76 year old mother out of her bed, the other bedrooms are "off limits", not to mention my sister's drinking and her declaration that guns are on the property (bad combo with crazy drunks), so we have had to severely limit our time there with our kids (even though we all LOVE their grandma and her house). We recently went and stayed in hotel to come help, we had heard my mom was working non-stop in the yard, and watching the kids non-stop (not from my mother she would never admit that), so we went and worked like dogs helping my mother, while sister sat in the house, entertained old people (probably rich or vulnerable), and left her kids with mom. And my mom covered for her! In rare moments of exhaustion or frustration my mom will admit that sister has drinking problem and personality issues and that she is pushy and harsh, but she is stuck because she wants to protect the children. Then she will never mention that again and try to downplay it if we bring it up, saying how great sister is. Mom's totally getting used, running a welfare state for completely entitled manipulative immature irresponsible sister and our mom lashes out at us if we try to say anything about it. I asked her to my son's bday party and she said she couldn't be away from the farm that long because she is the only one that does the work (rare moment of honesty- altho she didn't also admit she has to babysit sister's kids 24/7) when i suggested that sister could have a work list for those days, mom lashed out at me and said it wasn't the work, that she wanted to have a social life and she couldn't just go back and forth out of town all the time-totally random thing to say, I was inviting her to one weekend bday party, sister takes her car for days, leaves her kids for day, takes all her money so she is broke.I know she lashes out at me because I won't lash back like sister and she can't admit the sad, sad truth. I'm so SAD. I've done this so long I need to accept this is Mom's choice and I can't protect her. Mom is healthy, activ, mental ok- exhausted, depressed and frazzled trying to keep cover story up. I LOVE my mom so much.
how can i stop myself from calling my mom out on her lies? how can i ignore my sister's terrible choices and their sad consequences? How do i actually DO the serenity prayer?
I have read a few of these threads, am new to all this, but I already feel relief and thank you for your advice (honestly it feels like good just to think someone will hear me or understand where I'm coming from- I wish that was my mom!).
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: west coast
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I bet there will be others that can offer insight . . .I am wondering about sibling rivalry . . . is your rage towards your sister or on behalf of your mother, or both?
If your mom doesn't have a problem with the arrangement, why is it such an issue for you? Is it just that you think your sister is getting unfair privileges (rivalry) or something else?
I have often thought of the nightmare to parents in having large families . . .you know at least one kid is going to be a wacky trouble-maker, just number-wise. Your mom is lucky she's got so many good ones.
Is it possible this is a good arrangement for your sister, her kids AND your mom? Maybe your mom was lonely and now feels needed. Does she enjoy taking care of her grandkids?
Is there any danger involved with your sister, or is she just an annoyance - a thorn in your side or maybe getting in the way of your relationship with your mom?
If anything I have said is totally off-base, please ignore it . . .I am just guessing.
If your mom doesn't have a problem with the arrangement, why is it such an issue for you? Is it just that you think your sister is getting unfair privileges (rivalry) or something else?
I have often thought of the nightmare to parents in having large families . . .you know at least one kid is going to be a wacky trouble-maker, just number-wise. Your mom is lucky she's got so many good ones.
Is it possible this is a good arrangement for your sister, her kids AND your mom? Maybe your mom was lonely and now feels needed. Does she enjoy taking care of her grandkids?
Is there any danger involved with your sister, or is she just an annoyance - a thorn in your side or maybe getting in the way of your relationship with your mom?
If anything I have said is totally off-base, please ignore it . . .I am just guessing.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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thanks for the thoughts... you know once I think about it, I AM jealous of my sister that my mom will listen to her, my mom will do anything for her.... in our family we just say that unfortunately the squeaky wheel gets all the grease...and that is sad. success and independence, happiness, hard work, good choices, etc is not rewarded... we say to each other it's because my mom knows she doesn't have to worry about us or our kids, but it's hard to really believe that. I know my mom loves me. I know if I was an alcoholic my mom would take care of me and my kids too. I know my mom wants to avoid any problems at all and I know my dad just died (after 50 years together) and she always was his caretaker too so maybe it is soothing to her to have another pushy capricorn (this time a drunk mean one unfortunately) to take care of... But most of all I can really say I just want to save my mom (I know that doesn't sound healthy)... I want her away from this bs. I want her to enjoy time where she is free, enjoy all her kids and grandkids, write, garden, travel etc.. Just saying that makes me feel like I'm banging into that brick wall!
But how do I move on? how do i stop beating my head against the brick wall? I am a strong person and I am so grateful for my husband, my kids, my other brothers and sisters... it's very hard for me to not say something though when I see injustice. when i see my sister just taking and lying and cheating and hurting people. How do i bite my tongue? ug. I'm going to think about what you said. I think I should go to Al Anon meetings maybe.
But how do I move on? how do i stop beating my head against the brick wall? I am a strong person and I am so grateful for my husband, my kids, my other brothers and sisters... it's very hard for me to not say something though when I see injustice. when i see my sister just taking and lying and cheating and hurting people. How do i bite my tongue? ug. I'm going to think about what you said. I think I should go to Al Anon meetings maybe.
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
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Family is complicated enough without all this thrown in, so I totally empathize. I have to sit back and watch my 90-year-old grandmother take care of her 64-year-old alcoholic daughter, knowing there's nothing I can do about it. It's the life my grandmother chose, though I wished often during my childhood that she would whisk us off to a safe place so we wouldn't have to deal with it anymore. I'm the only one in the family who has broken ties with them. I was destroying myself trying to live in it, and I couldn't expose my children to it any longer. I live 3,000 miles away from "home," but I was still wrapped up in the sickness until a couple months ago. I've since detached from my family and gone NC with my mother, and my life has gotten so much better. By no means was this an overnight change, though. I'd started getting to that place a few years ago, but I was still tied just enough into feeling responsible for my mom and my grandmother to drive myself nuts.
Every family is different, and it's hard for me to say much other than read here, post, go to Al-Anon, and figure out just what your role is in the family. You may find that you can detach and not have anything to do with them, and it works for you. You're not responsible for anyone but yourself and any children you may have. That's it. No one else. Feel free to ask questions here and vent as needed. We'll be here to listen and support you as best we can, but be prepared for tough love if it comes to that. We're really, really good at it.
Every family is different, and it's hard for me to say much other than read here, post, go to Al-Anon, and figure out just what your role is in the family. You may find that you can detach and not have anything to do with them, and it works for you. You're not responsible for anyone but yourself and any children you may have. That's it. No one else. Feel free to ask questions here and vent as needed. We'll be here to listen and support you as best we can, but be prepared for tough love if it comes to that. We're really, really good at it.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
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Originally Posted by knowserenity 
how can i stop myself from calling my mom out on her lies? how can i ignore my sister's terrible choices and their sad consequences? How do i actually DO the serenity prayer?
1. What can you control in this situation you laid out above? Determine that for yourself. That is your "wisdom to know the difference" between what you can change and what you can't.
2. Let everything NOT in your control go. Let.It. Go. What does this look like? Not allowing yourself to obsess, correct, cajole, or in any way engage in the situation anymore. The more you engage, the more enmeshed you become. That's finding your serenity and accepting things and people as they are right now.
3. Find other things in your life to keep you busy; take a class, volunteer, pick up a hobby that interests you...anything to keep yourself busy and occupied. Go live your life!
Good luck, families are challenging!
~T
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thanks- that helps. I actually went on a really long run today and laughed that at least all this angst is helping me increase my running mileage. Basically, I put my fingers back near the fire and got burnt again. I got to think about it, and I'm really not jealous of my sister. She does have so much materially for free, but she has nothing real at all and is just wallowing in her sad sad mess. She does have a lot control over my mother, but it's all based on really messed up reasons and pretty ugly and sad to watch.
I'm an honest person, independent, and pretty straightforward so I think I have mostly been so angry that my sister isn't that way and won't admit it. It's infuriating to see the use, abuse, and immaturity. And I'm very very loyal and have fought so long to protect mom but now i'm tired of it. I think I just realized for the millionth time that it's not going to help. No matter how I say it, or explain it, or whatever I do, it's not going to help. I was just part of the sick dynamic.
So, I wrote my letter of resignation to my mom in my head today as I ran. I'm resigning from trying to make my mom see the light or speak the truth. I'm quitting trying to take her away from the situation or advising how to let my sister face her consequences. I'm giving my mom her walking papers. My mom will always be welcome in my home, I will always love her and send her photos and texts of the kids, but I'm not going to be part of the problem anymore. The big mean sister is quitting her starring role in the play.
I am so fortunate I didn't repeat this mess myself from my mom's example- I married an awesome guy, have three really amazing kids, lots of friends and am so close to all my other siblings. I have a lot I need to work on myself too so I'm going to focus on me. I hate to let my mom go, it goes against everything I feel, like I'm quitting her, but I do not help. In fact I probably should own up to it to my mom. I haven't respected her choices. I have badgered her about why her plans changed suddenly or why she let my sister move in. It's none of my business. Even though I think she is doing it because she is being manipulated, she is smart, able adult woman and she made those choices. I guess I can show her from my actions how people face natural consequences for their choices.
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results= insanity. Now I'm just praying that my sister's poor kids don't have to wait till they are 38 before they lay down their swords of trying to cover and cure and control their mom- or worse yet, never give up and turn up at 76 still covering up for manipulative drunks.
I'm signing my own letter of resignation today. My sister didn't win. She might be controlling my mom, but it's definitely just plain sad- so sad. I'm just over trying to make my mom hear me or listen to me. I'll respect her choices. Thanks for listening everyone- and thanks for the advice. i will know serenity. I feel better already. Now I'm signing up for a half-marathon and looking up the closest AlAnon meeting. thanks again for being a place to vent and process.
I'm an honest person, independent, and pretty straightforward so I think I have mostly been so angry that my sister isn't that way and won't admit it. It's infuriating to see the use, abuse, and immaturity. And I'm very very loyal and have fought so long to protect mom but now i'm tired of it. I think I just realized for the millionth time that it's not going to help. No matter how I say it, or explain it, or whatever I do, it's not going to help. I was just part of the sick dynamic.
So, I wrote my letter of resignation to my mom in my head today as I ran. I'm resigning from trying to make my mom see the light or speak the truth. I'm quitting trying to take her away from the situation or advising how to let my sister face her consequences. I'm giving my mom her walking papers. My mom will always be welcome in my home, I will always love her and send her photos and texts of the kids, but I'm not going to be part of the problem anymore. The big mean sister is quitting her starring role in the play.
I am so fortunate I didn't repeat this mess myself from my mom's example- I married an awesome guy, have three really amazing kids, lots of friends and am so close to all my other siblings. I have a lot I need to work on myself too so I'm going to focus on me. I hate to let my mom go, it goes against everything I feel, like I'm quitting her, but I do not help. In fact I probably should own up to it to my mom. I haven't respected her choices. I have badgered her about why her plans changed suddenly or why she let my sister move in. It's none of my business. Even though I think she is doing it because she is being manipulated, she is smart, able adult woman and she made those choices. I guess I can show her from my actions how people face natural consequences for their choices.
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results= insanity. Now I'm just praying that my sister's poor kids don't have to wait till they are 38 before they lay down their swords of trying to cover and cure and control their mom- or worse yet, never give up and turn up at 76 still covering up for manipulative drunks.
I'm signing my own letter of resignation today. My sister didn't win. She might be controlling my mom, but it's definitely just plain sad- so sad. I'm just over trying to make my mom hear me or listen to me. I'll respect her choices. Thanks for listening everyone- and thanks for the advice. i will know serenity. I feel better already. Now I'm signing up for a half-marathon and looking up the closest AlAnon meeting. thanks again for being a place to vent and process.
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