fourmaggie

ok, so enough of the A in your life....its his recovery ....so where is yours?

are you in a 12 step program (like AL ANON?) the format that AA/AL ANON use is a wonderful change for the rest of your (and the A) in your life...

I am not perfect, I have taken full responsiblity for my reactions, and behaviours and attitudes towards the alcoholism FAMILY in my life....the choatic dysfunction was normal in my household...now, i can begin to change within me..."let it begin with me"

Hypatia

No, I have not gone to Alanon. It is held once every two weeks 15 miles away on Fridays, or another one is once every two weeks on Tuesdays 40 miles away, or another one is once every two weeks on Thursdays 70 miles away. And they are all in German.

Frankly, Alanon and 12 step programs are not all that popular in Germany. As I wrote in a previous post, I will be starting individual therapy with an English speaking psychologist next month.

Meanwhile, the rehab center also has a program for family and friends of patients currently getting treatment. So I will also be participating in that program using other non-12 step methods which are highly successful.

I am not knocking Alanon. If it works for you then go for it. But most Germans I have spoken with are not all that enthusiastic about AA and Alanon and there are many other alternatives available with supposedly higher success rates. I am still exploring my options, and am certain that I will get more info from the psychologist in a few weeks.

fourmaggie

i did not say AL ANON....i said the 12 step program FORMAT....AL ANON around my area is where they use it....

why not look at the FORMAT it self...its for everyday use for anybody that wants to change...this FORMAT in not only used for alcoholism, its used everywhere....

oh and as for therapy, that great too but, if the councelor does not get the dysfunction of alcoholism, like what happened to me, you will be running around in circles....

Hypatia

Everywhere? Not in Germany. Here they use various psychotherapy approaches, along with tools like the Jacobson technique of progressive muscle relaxation. Maybe you should try it?

I rarely let myself run around in circles for long. The scenery gets boring.

fourmaggie

as mom says "dont knock it UNLESS you try it"

maybe i should try it?...my working my program FOMAT has given me a back bone, and i am no doormat and i have seen a difference in me, never mind what other people have seen a change in me....

what is it about the FORMAT u dont like? what fears and control is holding you back

me LOVES yoga....thanks for asking....

Eddiebuckle

3 days detox plus 42 inpatient was just shy of $23,000 where I went. Blue Cross / Blue Shield was kind enough to throw about two grand into the kitty. My breakeven day of sobriety (when the $ I would typically spend on booze exceeded the rehab bill) was around 20 months. Given that I was unemployable the way I was, it's money well spent.

SoaringSpirits

15 years of living with a functioning alcoholic seems like a long time to run in circles.
Hope you can use this time to learn all you can about alcoholism and its effect on the people who surround the addict, and focus on educating and healing yourself. Best of luck to both of you.

lizloh

Im at this point as well. He has the problem, not me... Right!?
Reading the 'things a normie wouldn't know' thread helped. I got through about 4 pages and only THEN it started to dawn on me. Wait, IM not normal?!
It's hard to wrap your mind around and correct me if I'm wrong... Normies wouldn't allow this behavior to continue in our lives? Wouldnt try to fix, reason, prove, blame themselves, continue to get angry??
Your story helps me so much, thank you a million times

lizloh

The thread is a sticky, called 'some of it makes me laugh and some of it makes me cry' and it is so so so so wonderful!!!
It helped on so many levels. I read along and laughed, cried. Said 'oh my' is that where the intimacy went? The ibuprofen every morning? I was relating. But only relating to these things happening in my life but NOT relating to MYSELF ALLOWING these things. Allowing these things to become my normal.

Hypatia

I suspect that according to the standards of most people here, there are roughly 50 million functioning alcoholics in Germany. The legal drinking age here is 16, and beer is legally considered a "food" in some regions.

Eddie wrote that alcoholism is like pregnancy. You either are or you aren't. There are tests which can say with absolute certainty whether a woman is pregnant. There is no such test for alcoholism. Sure, it is easy enough to point a finger at an extreme case and say with certainty "that person is an alcoholic". But with other cases it is not so easy. The more I learn, the more medical and psychological material I review, the less black and white it becomes.

Earlier in this thread I had a discussion with Wicked which started in post 38. The initial question was whether my husband had admitted that he is an alcoholic. I responded by saying:

I have now learned why German professionals do not use the terms "alcoholism" and "alcoholic". The World Health Organisation has stopped using the terms for quite a while now because they are ambiguous and are too imprecise to be used as an actual diagnostic or descriptive medical term. Therefore, both in my own opinion and according to WHO and German medical professionals, I did not spend 15 years living with a functioning alcoholic.

And according to several folks here on SR, there is no such thing as a functioning alcoholic in the first place. A person is either an alcoholic, or not. It is very interesting that I can say with certainty that I am not and have never been an alcoholic using any definition of the term. But I cannot say the same about my husband 2 years ago. According to some definitions he was, according to others he wasn't. The Mayo Clinic makes a distinction:

Frankly, however, it doesn't matter whether or not my husband was or was not an alcoholic 15 years ago, or 8 years ago, or even 2 years ago. We had a great life together and I don't regret marrying this wonderful man. The question is whether we can have a great life together once again.

All that truly matters is that right now he evinced an actual dependency which required medical intervention. Whether than dependence is psychological or physiological is also of little consequence. Regardless of the pathology, the initial stages of treatment follow the same course.

I shall leave any further speculation over definitions and possible past clinical diagnoses for some later date. At the moment it is an unnecessary distraction. I am more focused on what is going on right now as opposed to reviewing past case history.

RIGHT NOW.... my husband is scheduled to enter rehab this coming Tuesday. The hospital is now considering my husband's request to stay in the hospital until rehab starts. He was supposed to be discharged tomorrow but there is a very good chance that he will remain until Tuesday morning. That means that I would pack stuff for him, then pick him up and drive him directly to the rehab treatment center, with a stop for a dog walk in the woods along the way. We will find out for certain tomorrow.

An interesting side note I haven't mentioned up until now. The hospital cafeteria also sells beer and wine. I was quite surprised, but my best friend told me that when she was in rehab for her rheumatism two years ago, there was also wine and beer available and most nights a large group of patients would gather and drink together.

I have been assured, however, that rehab centers in Germany which specialise in addiction rehabilitation are an exception and do not sell beer and wine.

Eddiebuckle

Speaking for myself only, although I did not exhibit the outward signs of alcoholism until the last five or so years of my drinking career, I believe I was an alcoholic for well over a decade prior to quitting. For the alcoholic who continues to drink, the disease continues to progress with ever starker consequences.

Until the alcoholic accepts this,understands he/she can never drink again and makes the lifelong commitment to sobriety, no lasting improvement will occur. Nothing his/her peers, family, boss, doctor, etc. says or does will change anything until he/she fully accepts that reality.

Hypatia

This morning I was thinking of how huge a role alcohol plays in daily life here in Germany. Co-workers go out for lunch and it is completely acceptable for them to have a few beers before returning to work. There are all sorts of beer festivals and wine festivals, and lots of desserts and cakes containing alcohol. When my German sis-in-law makes Black Forest Cake, she always adds the traditional "kirschwasser'. Funny, that translates as "cherry water" and yet it is a very strong, clear cherry brandy. Even the language makes alcohol seem harmless, like "water". It really is a very different culture and I've acclimatised to many of its nuances without even realising it. Only when looking at it through my "American eyes" do I see it. My "German eyes" just accept it all as part of normal life.

But I do have some interesting news to pass on. I just finished Skyping with my husband. He called up the rehab center and found out that they would like him to be there for admittal around 8am. So he has asked for the hospital to arrange for direct transport so that I don't have to get up so early. Instead of driving in the opposite direction to the hospital and then another almost 2 hours to the rehab center, I can just meet him there.

He has also suggested that I could bring him his suitcase on Monday, and then take my time and come to the treatment center a little later on Tuesday. I have asked him to find out if it would be possible for me to show up and have lunch with him at the rehab center and spend some time with him in the afternoon exploring the place, or whether they start immediately with orientation in which case it might be better that I wait for the next regular time he's allowed visitors. But Tuesdays is when they also allow potential patients and families to come and tour the place so perhaps the program won't actually start until Wednesday.

Oh! A big thank you to the weather woman. We had a huge thunder storm with lots of rain last night and today is much cooler. The temperature outside is actually quite comfortable and I am extremely happy that she's finally gotten it right.

NYCDoglvr

Alcoholism is a progressive disease and it advances slowly. Most alcoholics were "functioning" at one point or another until they weren't. The fact that his job is in jeopardy and he isn't trying to get sober is a bad sign. His boss gave him one chance but I wouldn't assume he'll get a second chance.

There's nothing you can do or say that will affect your husband's drinking. I suggest Al-anon, which can be life saving for those who live with alcoholics.

******************

Just read your updates and am so glad he's on the right path. As a recovering alcoholic (20+years) I can say recovery is a solitary process that is very difficult. I'm happy you have hope now. Remember, it's one day at a time.

Hypatia

Thanks for the words of support. My husband is very seriously keeping his promise about following orders once he is in treatment. Although I understand your comment about it being a solitary process, I do believe that my husband has gotten a lot from talking to another, older woman who is voluntarily doing alcohol detox at the same time.

She's also a smoker, so the two of them have been going down for cigarette breaks together and she's been telling him about what she's been through. Hardest for her has been the complete loss of respect and trust from her adult children. Her husband divorced her many years ago, and afaik she has not had a single visitor during her stay at the hospital. She is basically on her own, and that has had quite a bit of impact on my husband.

What I might not have made clear is that since there was no police involvement, he was free to go home after spending the first night in the hospital. Staying at the hospital and going through with the detox was his choice. My husband asked the doctor to get him bumped up to the top of the waiting list. And he could have come home for the weekend before going to rehab on Tuesday but is also voluntarily staying in the "safer" hospital environment.

I continue to take things one day at a time. But the days are definitely getting brighter.

BlueSkies1

Hypatia,
I enjoy reading your morning updates--journaling on here--each day because your story so far is scheduled for success. I really want to read the happy ending.
If it's one of the 0.0000000000000000000000000000009 % cases that actually lead to putting down the bottle without losing the job and marriage, then at least I will have hope it is possible.
I truly hope your husband continues to think that keeping his job, getting mentally healthy, and not destroying his marriage is more important than having a drink.

I too understand the European view on drinking. My xah would have a "cafe correcto" each morning, (or two or three, or then half the bottle) which is the Italian espresso with a shot in it. He romanced the European view on drinking to aid his alcoholism. He knew more drinking idioms and types of alcohol than I had any idea ever existed. What's not to like with candlelight and wine? beer and a hot day? a shot in your coffee? friends gathered around an outdoor table with carafes all around? Nothing but the slippery slope...so I hope since your H is in an environment that does promote drinking, that he can separate himself from the culture. It is going to be an additional hurdle to jump.

scacra1

Hi,

Just a show of support... my A is very successful and higly functioning... gets you very time eh? im slowly starting to realise though, that they dont stay like that.. it only gets worse.. (my A hasnt reached that stage yet though,)
im hoping that my A's work will find out about my A's problem as they are the kind of place to help support as well, but he missing work is infrequent so no-one has guessed yet.
sending you strength to deal with what life throws at you.

Hypatia

Thanks scacra1! All support and good thoughts gladly accepted. Can I take an IOU on the strength for later? I'm doing quite well at the moment.

What I actually need is some help with ironing. Can anyone drop by and do it for me? I've always hated ironing and now I'm looking at a pile of freshly washed shirts. Often I find it is the little things which end up driving me crazy while the big things are being handled with no problem. Grrr.....

MadeOfGlass, it's great to hear that someone is actually reading and enjoying this thread. It really has turned more into a journal or blog, hasn't it? Well, I was told to return and post as often and as much as I felt like, so I'm just taking full advantage of the offer.

I don't have much time today since I'm doing all this fun washing and ironing and packing to get my husband ready to go to rehab on Tuesday. I will be bringing him everything on Monday so he can take it with him. I asked him to make me a list because I am notoriously absent minded even when I'm not a bit stressed out. Right now I'm not really feeling all that bad, which means I'm likely to only forget one or two items. So I want to be able to bring him the suitcase some time tomorrow afternoon to have enough time for the inevitable drive back home to pick up whatever the forgotten thing might be. It is only about a 25 minute drive to the hospital so I'm truly not stressing out about it. And the rehab center is only about an hour's drive from our house, so that is the worst case scenario which isn't all that horrible either.

It is almost a tradition by now, which is why my husband always does all his own packing for his business trips. Last time I packed for myself, I forgot my hairbrush. No biggie but I have long hair so you'd think I would have remembered that at least.

On the way home last night, I stopped off at a regular grocery store to pick up some shaving gel for my husband. As I was standing there in front of the shelves with various men's toiletries, I realised that the other side of the very same aisle was the edge of the liquor section. For a moment I just had to laugh. By standing in the middle of the aisle, I had a clear choice. Reach out with my right hand and grab the shaving gel. Reach out with my left hand and grab a bottle of liquor. Vodka was even on sale! Oh, the irony.

But my addiction isn't liquor. I had to walk a whole three aisles over to get to the chocolate section.

Yesterday afternoon it was cooler so I brought the dogs with me to the hospital. Part of the hospital grounds are nicely landscaped with grass and seating areas, so we stayed outside just chatting and playing with the dogs. We did check with a nurse who had no problem with my husband being away for longer than a regular smoke break. Guess all that fuss is totally over, and they've also gotten to know my husband better and he hasn't caused them any trouble. I wonder if my husband will re-learn the lesson that privileges are earned through responsible behaviour, and taken away through irresponsible behaviour? I'm certain that the rehab center will be working with him on that.

Well, time to get back to ironing. I have time to do a few more shirts before I leave for the hospital with the dogs again. I'll finish the rest tonight when I get back. And I'll likely just do one or two of mine and leave the rest for next week. The dogs won't care if I am a little wrinkled.

Hypatia

I have a confession to make. Yesterday I broke a promise to myself. I am not beating myself up over it, but it did bother me quite a bit at the time. It is still bugging me a bit, or else I wouldn't even be writing about it. But I have decided that I did it with the best of intentions and no irreparable harm has been done so I can live with the consequences.

I lied to my sweet and loving mother-in-law. My promise was that I was not going to cover anything up any more for my husband with his family. That doesn't mean that I have to immediately tell the whole truth to everyone, but I was no longer going to outright lie. I had told my husband that I was going to give him the opportunity to speak first with his family and explain what is going on. But I also warned him that his idea of telling them that he's going to a burn-out clinic won't fly since the rehab clinic specialises in addiction and doesn't take burn-out patients. It would be a stupid lie and easily found out if anyone in the family wants to come and visit him, or even looks it up online. So I told him to stick with the truth, though he didn't have to worry his elderly parents with the whole truth and all the details.

And yet when the time came, I couldn't do it myself for several reasons. First, I really would prefer that my husband break the news to them. Likely I've got a bit of wishful thinking going on, hoping that he takes on more responsibility for his behaviour. He said that he was planning to do it once he was in rehab and I did not nag him. Secondly, I was caught off guard and frankly just panicked.

I had barely walked in the door with the dogs after coming home from the hospital when the phone rang. For whatever reason, I thought it might be my husband or my best friend and I picked it up without looking at call display. Instead, it was my mother-in-law calling to ask how we're doing. She is in her 80s and likes to hear from us at least every 2-3 weeks. We get along great and she has never interfered or caused me any problems at all. She just likes to know that we're still alive and doing ok.

So she asked the usual questions, including if my huband is home or away. Without thinking it through, I said that he's away and she assumed that he's on a business trip. And I let her keep assuming that. I outright lied when I told her that he's either in Spain or Portugal at the moment - that I'm not sure and would have to check. She wondered why I hadn't called her since I've gotten in the habit of calling her at least once during any of my husband's business trips just to let her know that everything is ok and to pass on some funny story or anecdote about my husband's latest trip. There's always something amusing or interesting which happens and she likes hearing the stories. She especially likes to hear that the flight was good, the plane landed safely, the hotel is decent, and the customers are being reasonable. Nothing unusual in that, and as she gets older she is a little more worried about possible dangers with travel so needs a bit of reassurance.

I have called my husband and told him about the discussion with his mother. I also have told him that the next time, I am never again going to lie. I may have lied about the emergency, blackout and hospital detox, but there's no way that I am going to attempt to cover up the next 15 weeks in rehab.

I also did one thing yesterday that I'm quite happy about. Remember that problem I had with mud in my bed? (post 34). Well, his shoes are still all muddy and he decided that he wanted to take them to rehab and asked me to clean them up and polish them for him. Instead, I stuck them in a plastic bag along with cleaning stuff and delivered them to him in the hospital. I told him that if I'm doing all the ironing then the least he can do is clean his own shoes. He wasn't happy about it, and later told me on the phone that I brought the wrong shoe polish, but I just said that I would bring the other shoe polish today and he could still do it himself.

So I am thinking that in about two weeks I am going to drive down to visit my inlaws and tell them in person about what is going on. I haven't told my husband yet since he is extremely nervous about going to rehab tomorrow. But next weekend when I see him, I am going to give him a deadline and let him decide who gets to tell his parents and siblings first. And I have no problem if he ends up deciding that he can't handle it and prefers that I do it. But I won't lie, which means that he can't either. Well, he can try, but he knows how it will turn out.

I just have to be a little careful because his dad is still weak and recovering from his heart attack and his mom also has some medical conditions. But I've already set the stage over the last half year by starting to speak with them about a general concern with my husband's drinking which they share with me. So it shouldn't end up being a huge or dramatic surprise. I think they'll even be relieved at the news if it is broken to them gently. And I'm fairly certain that I'll be doing it face to face with them in about two weeks. At that point I will also be able to reassure them that I've been to the rehab center and that it is a decent place with good staff and that my husband is doing ok. And I'll be able to openly speak with them about the rehab and call with updates so they don't worry too much.

So, that's my "mea culpa". I'm human, I make mistakes. Don't we all? But I won't be repeating this one and it will be easy to fix.

Hypatia

Oh, heck..... just checked my email. It is Monday and a new doctor has rotated onto the floor. And this doctor has cancelled the transport to rehab and said that the wife can do it.

So much for sleeping in tomorrow. At least I'll get a chance to tour the place and get a feel for it. Hmm... also means that if I forget anything today then I don't have to do a second trip. Can just bring it along tomorrow.

Always searching for that silver lining....

Eddiebuckle

That's a tough one to deal with. On the one hand, you lied to your MIL. On the other, to break the news takes the burden off your husband to speak out loud what he has only intimated thus far: he is an alcoholic. I made that pronouncement via e-mail to my siblings, who were making plans for the Christmas holidays back home. I can tell you that my mouse hovered over the "send" button for a very long time, and that when I finally did I had an overwhelming sense of burning my solitary bridge of escape. This is a very big deal, and I think to break the news for him would possibly have lasting repercussions. One possible way to handle this would be to tell your husband that the next time you are faced with any person who would reasonably be told of his situation (the members of which he should delineate) - if they are unaware, you will give them the number to reach him to let him deal with the explanation. Certainly his mother falls in this category.

The "plan" to say that he is at burn out rehab is a lame attempt to avoid facing reality. The reality is if he continues to drink, the consequences will become ever harsher, and if allowed to run its course this disease will cost him everything he values up to his very life.