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Old 06-18-2012, 09:55 AM
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Black outs

I have a question concerning black outs. Do you think that the things that are said during a black out is what the person means unconciously? My AW had another one last night and it was no fun at all. But it seems when the episodes occur, the same theme appears and the same horrible words are said. Is this what they truelly think or is it just ramblings?

thanks

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Old 06-18-2012, 10:09 AM
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I couldn't tell you. I can only speak for myself and I can't remember what I said during a blackout, but chances are, I was speaking from an emotional level. Kind of like the things I say when I'm in a heated argument. Lots of stuff passes my lips that is meant solely as weapons of mean distruction. Very, very little of it anything more than hot air.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:13 AM
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I don't know if it's really meant or not but I have been told by ABF (for what it's worth) that he doesn't mean it. Either way, it hurts to hear it said and that's the purpose for him saying what he says. It's a tool he uses to make himself feel better about his cruddy life. If he can bring me with him, then he's not so alone. Don't fall for it....
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:15 AM
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Well, I've heard the saying, "Drunken words are sober thoughts," but I don't agree with that. I'm a sober alcoholic and I did/said a LOT of things in blackouts that made no sense to me when I got sober. I mean, awful, nasty things to my husband and my children that I would never have done without alcohol and would never have done intentionally. One thing I WILL say is that alcoholics tend to have a lot of problems with expressing anger appropriately ... we tend to "stuff" feelings. So when we get drunk, all inhibitions go out the window and we lash out at whoever tends to be available, even if they aren't the cause for our anger.

I don't know your wife or her issues but it sounds like she definitely has some anger/rage going on there, which is typical of us alkies. Have you tried talking to her about this when she isn't drunk?
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:15 AM
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Hi grizz;
You are in a relationship with an alcoholic - an alcoholic will say it is the alcohol talking.
I am sure that I do not have to tell you that no meaningful conversations can be had with someone who has drank to blackout stage. You may never know what she was intending because she doesnt even know. She is probably incapable of honesty with herself and with others. You may want to learn how to take care of yourself - by reading books/posts on codependancy, boundaries and checking out the Al-anon meetings if you havent already done so. Best wishes to you!!
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:25 AM
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I wouldn't take anything said during a blackout with more than a grain of salt, if that.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:28 AM
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thanks for the responses. It just makes me wonder because it is the same thing time after time with the final statement of me not loving her, I am a liar, and I might as go find someone else. Made for a real nice fathers day. Just glad all the kids were gone before the fireworks started.

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Old 06-18-2012, 10:30 AM
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To me it's unacceptable to use a 'blackout' as an excuse to abuse another person.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Windmills View Post
To me it's unacceptable to use a 'blackout' as an excuse to abuse another person.
I agree. If you are prone to 'blackouts' and have a tendency to abuse the people you 'love' when you blackout, then it's YOUR responsibility to prevent blackouts from occurring.

When they choose to take that drink, if they have been told they engage in abusive blackouts, they are choosing to abuse.

As for OP's question, I think it's a combination of things they really believe about you but have the self control not to say sober, things they believe about themselves they project onto you and just plain nasty bullying rage where they will say anything if they think it will hurt someone else. They just want to hurt others and they don't care who.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by grizz View Post
thanks for the responses. It just makes me wonder because it is the same thing time after time with the final statement of me not loving her, I am a liar, and I might as go find someone else. Made for a real nice fathers day. Just glad all the kids were gone before the fireworks started.

grizz
During a blackout, you won't be able to convince your wife that she's wrong, so it's best to avoid confronting her about it.
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Old 06-18-2012, 10:59 AM
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Been there too.... He says the meanest things, yet claims not to remember. I finally had enough and left, for today. Protect your heart and soul. No one deserves verbal abuse....ever.
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Old 06-18-2012, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Peter G View Post
Take all of my truth, lies, manias, phobias, anxieties, fears, hates, loves, desires, goals, hell take anything you can think of. Now throw it in a blender full of Vodka. Run it for 60 seconds and then pour a glass.

What pours out is exactly what you get from a drunk when he/she is attempting communication. It is nothing but pure myth that a drunk "speaks the truth" when intoxicated. Absolutely, 100% a wives tale, nothing more.
Pretty much the same applies to blackouts, me thinks.
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Old 06-18-2012, 11:48 AM
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"During a blackout, you won't be able to convince your wife that she's wrong, so it's best to avoid confronting her about it".
I agree I just sit there trying to not say things that would escalate the abuse. I know that if I said those things to her my [email protected]@ would have been on the street a long time ago.
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Old 06-18-2012, 12:29 PM
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Hi Grizz,

As the chica who was the one saying the horrible, nasty accusations to my BF - horrible, nasty accusations I don't remember - I can only say this: I was absolutely floored when he told me some of what I'd said (and, mostly, he "didn't want to talk about what [I] didn't remember and [he] wanted to forget" so I know I don't even know the half of it). I was in shock; I was sure I didn't mean any of what I'd said. I struggled with guilt and shame and self-loathing for a long time - kept asking myself "am I really that horrible? that ugly inside?"

And maybe because I need to believe it, but I don't think I'm a horrible person. Alcohol lowers inhibitions, exaggerates emotions, and suppresses long-term memory, right when rational thought flies out the window. The ravings and imaginings of a mad-woman.

On the subject of common themes: note I said "exaggerated." Yes, I believe there was a seed of emotional pain to my rantings - that is, my BF was, I realized later, passive-aggressive (he grew up with an abusive father) and sometimes downright condescending. Was getting drunk and ranting and raving appropriate? No. Absolutely not.

And, whether I meant to say it or not; whether it was "true" or not, I was still absolutely responsible for what I said. SadHeart makes a point I agree with: if you know you become verbally abusive when drunk, you need to stop getting drunk!! Moreover, you need to figure out what the h*** you're so angry about (difficult when you don't remember what you said but certainly not impossible) and talk about it constructively. I have a long history of suppressing anger and hurt because I don't want to hurt others but this pattern doesn't help anyone, even without the drunk screaming.

I took responsibility for my drunk mania too late and my BF finally had enough and left. I was devastated. I hope your wife can see what damage she's causing before it's too late. I wish you both the best.
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Old 06-18-2012, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter G
Take all of my truth, lies, manias, phobias, anxieties, fears, hates, loves, desires, goals, hell take anything you can think of. Now throw it in a blender full of Vodka. Run it for 60 seconds and then pour a glass.

What pours out is exactly what you get from a drunk when he/she is attempting communication. It is nothing but pure myth that a drunk "speaks the truth" when intoxicated. Absolutely, 100% a wives tale, nothing more.

Pretty much the same applies to blackouts, me thinks.
In my experience, this sounds pretty darned accurate & what a tangible way to describe it!

My experiences with blackouts extends to 2 people in my life, my AH & one of my best friends. She, unfortunately, is a binge drinker who typically drinks to blackouts every time she drinks until it starts to scare her & then she dries out long enough to believe she has more control than she really does. Then the cycle starts all over again.

AH in a blackout was venomous to me, my friend was more of a cry-on-my-shoulder about all the things that are going wrong in her life so the tone is totally different but the message is the same. They might speak *some* truths in that state of mind, but it's just bits & pieces of their skewed version of truth at that moment.... never the reality. In my opinion, alcohol exaggerates emotions so if in a blackout he was feeling judged or guilty it was expressed with pure rage. If she was feeling lost or having problems in her marriage, she was a weeping, inconsolable mess. Neither of them ever made any real sense, it was like trying to read a sentence with all vowels & no consonants.
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Old 06-18-2012, 01:14 PM
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My ex use to claim blackouts for his abusive mouth...odd, but over a period of time
after the incident he would slip and use the same words and/or slowly admit that he
"kinda" remembered the event....to me, it was all BS...this blackout thing is nothing but
a way of getting by with abuse and other activities...like cheating.
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Old 06-18-2012, 01:28 PM
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I guess I could understand it more if the rants were not the same every time. It has been some time since the last one, but the content was the same. So I am tending to believe that we she is saying is what she believes deep down. I find myself becoming indifferent to the whole situation. She seems to be remorsful and I told we can work through it, but sheesh this is getting old.
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Old 06-18-2012, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by grizz View Post
I guess I could understand it more if the rants were not the same every time. It has been some time since the last one, but the content was the same. So I am tending to believe that we she is saying is what she believes deep down.
I don't know if my rants were the "same" every time (don't remember a damn thing, and that's the honest truth!), but I do believe they were variations on a common theme. There is a seed of discontent here, and only she can figure out what it is. Did you try asking? She might need some time to figure it out, mind.

Originally Posted by grizz View Post
She seems to be remorsful and I told we can work through it, but sheesh this is getting old.
There are words, and there are actions. Apologies without action are empty apologies.

(Unfortunately, it's hard to feel FULLY remorseful when you're sitting there in disbelief because you don't remember what you did...doesn't excuse the behaviour, of course, but it might help you to understand that, if she's like me, someone may as well have been telling her she turned green and started sprouting lemons off her fingertips...). For myself, I felt terrible when the BF told me - he looked so heartbroken - but honestly, there was a certain disconnect; I had a hard time linking what I'd been told I'd done with his crestfallen face.

But, yes, it does get old. Gosh, does it ever! True sentiments or not, my BF had every right to oust me from his life. If you can work it out, great - if not, well, why stay in a destructive relationship?
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Old 06-18-2012, 02:53 PM
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My ex used to just say a larger scale version of the things he said sober. Apparently he was 'out of control' when he got that wasted.. But not so out of control that he would attack strangers or tell other women all the awful things he said to me. Not so out of control he couldn't stop dead and make me look like the insane one if a visitor knocked at the door. Never so out of control he would hit or scratch my face where it would show.. Only my arms or body. Weird kind of out of control of you ask me.
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Old 06-18-2012, 03:05 PM
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The blackout scene was always the same for my xabf, same themes everytime. Same words, same threats, and then silence the next morning, there were only a few times I told him something terribly hurtful that he said. He would just say it was stupid talk. And yes it was stupid, but it was also soul wounding.

It seems to me, now, looking back, it all revolved around his own unhappiness and self hatred. That kind of hatred and anger is very dangerous stuff, I , now can not believe I never was struck. If there is one thing I know now, my xabf has so much self hatred, and a ton of grief, it takes a lot of energy and booze to keep those demons under wraps. It always felt like he got some kind of high off of the verbal and emotional abuse. I don't know, it's an awful thing to witness.
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