Making amends....I need to understand
 

I am re-posting this thread in this forum - I posted in another one and I would like the friends and family community to look at it....
I was married to an active alcoholic for 16 years. Unfortunately, he was never able to get better. When we divorced, I did not want him to make amends to me because I was so angry. I have been working with a therapist for almost two years and have made progress. It is slow, but I think I am doing well and am optimistic.
Here goes.....I am now re-married...oddly enough to an RA. He is deep in his program and doing very well. We have spoken at length about both our lives and we are deeply connected. I encourage his program, it is good for him and I both.
The thing is.....he wants to meet with an ex to make amends. This was his first love and he did some very terrible things to her and her family. He is making amends to all of them. I understand and support that.
I'm not sure I understand the process of making amends though. He wants to meet her face to face, can't do it over the phone and it seems very secretive, private. It gives the impression that the amends is coming from a place of love and endearment....like an intimate thing that lovers would share. Their text messages get racy, even though I'm sure he doesn't feel that way for her, it's nostalgia. He was 15 when he started using and he has been sober for 14 months....remember that thing they say about a person's emotional stage stopping when they start abusing? Not sure he realizes that those messages are hurtful. Am I wrong? Is it private because it comes from a place of shame? Am I wrong about that too?
We talk about a lot of things...and we have talked about this and I really don't want to bring it up with him again. I just wanted an outside opinion from others in the community.........thanks everyone.....

Double post.

As I read your post, I could feel the fear. It sounds as if you don't trust him. Whether that comes from a legitimate place (i.e. he isn't trustworthy) or from a place of unfounded fear (i.e. your own issues) is something you need to sort out.

You say you encourage HIS program, but what about you? Have you talked about this issue with your therapist?

L

I have been working with a therapist for 2 years and I've made progress. I think its a combo of two things....my own fear and his not understanding that those messages hurt. Not sure I know how to bring it up with him again.
Since I'm just out of a long harmful relationship and he is 14 months sober, sometimes we are still very raw when we talk, like the wounds haven't closed, you know?
I want to get over to my church with a womens support group - hopefully will start this Thursday, but I think I may need to get into Al-Anon - I'll be honest - I tried it once when I was with the the active alcoholic and I didn't care for it. Maybe I wasn't ready then -

Sorry - just re-read your post - I haven't talked to her about it yet becasue it just came up - but I've made a lot of notes and I'll be discussing it with her when I see her next.

FWIW, if I was married to someone and they were sending "racy" message to their ex, under the guise of amends or not, it would be a big red flag for me.

L

anvilhead......you are right on a lot of accounts..we haven't been married that long....I am still carrying baggage, which is why I wanted to post this - to a certain extent I wanted to know if I was being overly paranoid.
I read his text messages out of fear, I will be honest about that. But.....he has said repeatedly that all phone messages / facebook communications, etc is up for grabs for all becasue he wants everything to be open, so I have to assume (yes I know what that does) that he doesn't feel these messages are in anyway hurtful. Leads me back to the "maturity" index for RAs.....
No.....other than this one issue with this ex, he has done nothing that is untrustworthy......

After he and I discussed it the first time.....he shared our conversation with this person and told her what I was feeling.............I'm happy to leave his recovery to him, but does that action cross a line? How about sexual references between the two? Is that hurtful or something I should just accept?

So in one post you say he's never done anything untrustworthy, and in another you say he shared your conversation with his ex. That, by my definition, is untrustworthy. But, you get to make your own definitions for your own life. "Sexual references" is pretty vague, so I don't know (or want to know) what that means. You are asking us if that is hurtful. Is it hurtful to you? Are you willing to accept it?

L

I have to say....this is a difficult thread to read, but in the end beneficial.....sometimes we need others to hold up the mirror that we can't seem to lift.
LaTeeDa...you are absolutely correct.....I do need to decide if its acceptable for me or not and either man up and have the conversation or shut up about it.
I do appreciate the thread dicsussion.......

One thing that has worked real well for me is when I am in doubt is to simply take a couple of deep breadths and wait for the doubt to clear up. Wisdom will come if you are patient. Since you don't really know what is going on any decision you make would be based on guess work, emotions, worry and the behaviors of your previous partner. Doesn't sound like a strong foundation to be making big decisions on to me.

A good Buddhist saying is when in doubt do nothing.

Your friend,

The whole point of making amends is so that the A can finally recognize the damage he/she caused others around them while in active addiction. Racy texts and sexual references have absolutely nothing to do with making amends.

After reading all these posts..... I think that it helped with the clarity of what my true issue is.....I am not comfortable with the messages that were going back and forth - the amends really has nothing to do with that. I need to deal with what the issue is.
Thanks to everyone.......

Consider this: when you marry an alcoholic, recovering or not, you put yourself at risk for exactly these types of issues. There's risk even with non-alcoholics if your judgement is bad enough.

If you had been going to Alanon this whole time you may well have never found yourself in this position, and if you did find yourself here you'd know how to handle it.

Now will you go to Alanon? It's not too late to start and my two cents is you need it.

Cyranoak

P.s. Racy texts are not part of recovery or amends, and there is no scenario where they are appropriate. Why are you believing what he is telling you when your common sense is telling you different?

P.p.s. It's not odd you are married to another alcoholic. It was as predictable as the tides. Alanon might have changed that.

Its nice to see someone work things out in just one thread! I agree with you...these are two separate situations you are talking about, and yes, as a married woman I would be worried too. And pretty darn furious.