Pushed away and shut out by my recovering boyfriend

Old 01-07-2012, 10:19 AM
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One of the toughest lessons I have learned in my life is that just because I love someone doesn't mean that I should be with them. One of the most essential lessons I have learned in recovery is this. Feelings are neither good or bad-they just are. I can acknowledge and respect them but that doesn't mean I have to act them out. My actions, unlike my feelings, are a choice. I would never say that love is not important but it is only one of many important factors to consider in the choice of a partner.

I do not know what you should do. I do know that today my choice is not to get into romantic relationships with alcoholics and other deeply troubled people. My experience has been that the pain of a breakup with someone I love is nothing compared to the sheer hell of riding the relapse roller coaster for years with an alcoholic who just won't or can't get it. Someone who has no trouble destroying their own lives has no problems taking everyone else's down with them. Alcoholics really only love one thing. Booze. They love it because it works to do everything they want it to do.

As both a recovering alcoholic and someone with a history of being in relationships with addicts who just don't seem to be able to 'get it' I can tell you that there were big red flags here all along. A really basic rule for a recovering alcoholic is not to get into any romantic relationships for a year! I'm sure that if his counselors in rehab knew that he was writing you love letters they would have cracked down on him and 'knocked him upside the head'! Obviously that time would have been better spent working on his written relapse prevention plan than indulging in the escape of romantic fantasy. He had absolutely no business getting into a relationship with you or anyone! Another red flag is how you describe the intensity of your love......people who are emotionally unavailable, unpredictable,unstable and chaotic tend to replace real intimacy with an intensity that can be very compelling. Paradoxically, healthy long-lasting and really loving relationships are high in intimacy but low in intensity. Even if he were to get sober and into a solid recovery it takes a good long time before someone is capable of real intimacy and relationship. Years.

Given that you are in vet school you are clearly a very bright, hard working focused and caring person. You deserve a man in your life who can share the values,world view and kinds of behaviors that got you where you are. Thing is,we don't get what we deserve in life...we get what we BELIEVE we deserve. So I ask you.....is this all you believe you deserve in terms of a loving, available,stable partner?
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Old 01-07-2012, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by missg View Post
One of the toughest lessons I have learned in my life is that just because I love someone doesn't mean that I should be with them. One of the most essential lessons I have learned in recovery is this. Feelings are neither good or bad-they just are. I can acknowledge and respect them but that doesn't mean I have to act them out. My actions, unlike my feelings, are a choice. I would never say that love is not important but it is only one of many important factors to consider in the choice of a partner.

I do not know what you should do. I do know that today my choice is not to get into romantic relationships with alcoholics and other deeply troubled people. My experience has been that the pain of a breakup with someone I love is nothing compared to the sheer hell of riding the relapse roller coaster for years with an alcoholic who just won't or can't get it. Someone who has no trouble destroying their own lives has no problems taking everyone else's down with them. Alcoholics really only love one thing. Booze. They love it because it works to do everything they want it to do.

As both a recovering alcoholic and someone with a history of being in relationships with addicts who just don't seem to be able to 'get it' I can tell you that there were big red flags here all along. A really basic rule for a recovering alcoholic is not to get into any romantic relationships for a year! I'm sure that if his counselors in rehab knew that he was writing you love letters they would have cracked down on him and 'knocked him upside the head'! Obviously that time would have been better spent working on his written relapse prevention plan than indulging in the escape of romantic fantasy. He had absolutely no business getting into a relationship with you or anyone! Another red flag is how you describe the intensity of your love......people who are emotionally unavailable, unpredictable,unstable and chaotic tend to replace real intimacy with an intensity that can be very compelling. Paradoxically, healthy long-lasting and really loving relationships are high in intimacy but low in intensity. Even if he were to get sober and into a solid recovery it takes a good long time before someone is capable of real intimacy and relationship. Years.

Given that you are in vet school you are clearly a very bright, hard working focused and caring person. You deserve a man in your life who can share the values,world view and kinds of behaviors that got you where you are. Thing is,we don't get what we deserve in life...we get what we BELIEVE we deserve. So I ask you.....is this all you believe you deserve in terms of a loving, available,stable partner?
I never even knew of the one year of no relationships rule until last week. He never said anything about it and I know his counselors definitely knew about me the whole time because they opened all their mail, and I sent him numerous pictures and photo collages of us and presents. He told them all about me too. I went to New Mexico when he got out of rehab and helped him move his stuff back home and he introduced me to alot of his counselors and people who run the program. They all told me they were so happy he had someone like me in his life and they heard so much about me. I was walkin around holding his hand so obviously more than a friend and he still talks ever so often to people from that rehab place. So I dont know why they didnt say something to him or tell him not to start anything before he did. He is doing well with not drinking anymore, he had 14 months without drinking (with ten months in rehab and 4 months on his own) and then slipped for one night but stopped drinking by the next day and has been going to meetings a few times a week ever since. He is reworking his steps and is trying hard. He's been around people that even drink and he says it doesnt even bother him or make him crave it. I honestly think I was pushed away more because of his depression than the alcoholism factor. He thinks he doesnt deserve me and I am too good for him all of a sudden. We were romantic with each other for over a year and the whole time, things felt special between us and we clicked in a way that i have never felt with anyone else whether it was before rehab when he was drinking alot, during rehab, and even after rehab. I knew him at various stages of his life and recovery so far so its not like I fell in love with one stage of his life.

Everyone in my life (friends and family) also tells me I deserve better than the guys I chose to be date or the few I have fallen in love with but I don't know how to even find better or anything. Its just who I am attracted to. so yeah I do have to work on fixing that but I am too lost to even know where to begin. Everything is just a mess and I need to focus on not lettin this destroy school which takes up 99% of my life. I am already behind in classes from even writing on this forum. I see a psychologist and have for the past 2 years but that doesnt seem to help because I dont think Ive made any personal progress on myself in the past few years let alone if ever. I have vet school which is my dream, and everyone tells me I have everything going for me... smart, pretty, nice, and sociable, but my self esteem is really low and Im not happy with life outside of vet school. I have been focusing everything I have on school for the past 6 years kinda like how RAs can become so wrapped up in work and only focus on that. I dont really know what else to do. Nothing seems to be helping, and losing the only happiness and person who understands me is really only setting me back. Sorry that my posts are always long. Ive never known how to keep things short and simple either, and I thank everyone for their responses.
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Old 01-07-2012, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by dvm2015 View Post
Ok I get that if an alcoholic is actively drinking they cannot maintain any healthy relationships because they are not healthy themselves. But if an alcoholic is actively in recovery are they capable of maintaining healthy relationships or marriages with someone? I am just asking in a general way. Ive heard the horror stories and I am just curious if it is even capable for RA to ever get to this point in their lives where they can maintain healthy relationships with significant others? or If its a yo-yo of up and downs forever.
Of course people who were once addicted to alcohol can recover and maintain healthy relationships and marriages. I certainly have (I've been contentedly abstinent for 13 years and have a very strong, happy marriage) and know many others who have done so as well.

Not all of these people are in 12 step programs, by the way. Some are in other programs, some did go to 12 step programs and have left, and some never did ANY program but simply used a combination of therapy, family support and in some instances support from their church community.

The things you have been told by people who claim that alcoholics never get better or are permanently incapable of having good relationships may well be based on the experiences of those people, but keep in mind that a person who only goes to a 12 step program will only see what is there to be seen. They will not see the people who did it a different way, and they assume everyone who left is out there drinking. This is not so.
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Old 01-07-2012, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by dvm2015 View Post
Everyone in my life (friends and family) also tells me I deserve better than the guys I chose to be date or the few I have fallen in love with but I don't know how to even find better or anything. Its just who I am attracted to. so yeah I do have to work on fixing that but I am too lost to even know where to begin. Everything is just a mess and I need to focus on not lettin this destroy school which takes up 99% of my life.

but my self esteem is really low and Im not happy with life outside of vet school. I have been focusing everything I have on school for the past 6 years kinda like how RAs can become so wrapped up in work and only focus on that. I dont really know what else to do. Nothing seems to be helping, and losing the only happiness and person who understands me is really only setting me back.
I can very much relate to what you posted here.

For me (only me) I struggled with codependency before I loved someone with an addiction problem (as far as I know). Codependency is "my" drug of choice, "helping," "caring for," etc. In the end it made me more nuts in terms of behaviors than the loved one in my life who was using a substance. For me this was because I did not feel good enough about myself. I had the idea that "doing" for others would make myself feel better about my own "being."

It has made me mad, sad, depressed etc, especially in the moment. In the long term though this experience has taught me so much about myself. I am worth it, because if I don't have myself what do I have?

It is similar to a financial decision...I have to put something into myself to get a return. For me that was counseling, Al-anon, after some time Open AA meetings to learn about the disease, A LOT of reading, opening up to friends and families of my struggles etc. The kicker was I had to do that for me regardless of what my loved one was doing. I had spent a long time investing in him with and without returns. I have found investing in myself much more lucrative.

Sometimes it takes awhile to find the path (and sometimes the path changes once it is found).
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Old 01-07-2012, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by dvm2015 View Post
Also, If it helps, I have NO experience with alcoholism, and only recently found out about al-anon but don't see the point now that were broken up. He is 20 years old and I am 23.
IMHO, AlAnon is not about repairing your relationship with him, but about repairing yourself. When you meet another active addict, you will break up after two dates, not two years.
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Old 01-07-2012, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by onlythetruth View Post
Of course people who were once addicted to alcohol can recover and maintain healthy relationships and marriages. I certainly have (I've been contentedly abstinent for 13 years and have a very strong, happy marriage) and know many others who have done so as well.

Not all of these people are in 12 step programs, by the way. Some are in other programs, some did go to 12 step programs and have left, and some never did ANY program but simply used a combination of therapy, family support and in some instances support from their church community.

The things you have been told by people who claim that alcoholics never get better or are permanently incapable of having good relationships may well be based on the experiences of those people, but keep in mind that a person who only goes to a 12 step program will only see what is there to be seen. They will not see the people who did it a different way, and they assume everyone who left is out there drinking. This is not so.
Wow thank you so much for sharing this with me. It makes things a little more optimistic. I have just been hearing not many success stories. I was holding on to the fact that since his mom and dad were capable of staying happily married through his dad's alcoholism that there would be some chance that it is possible. So its good to hear of others. I want to remain positive and not rule out any possible chance because he is a strong person and is doing well with not drinking. I know people deal with their alcoholism in different ways, and thought the fact the RA in my life went to an intensive long term inpatient program for 10 months may have a better chance for success than just going to AA meetings out of the blue. Thank you for this post.
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Old 01-07-2012, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Imperium View Post
IMHO, AlAnon is not about repairing your relationship with him, but about repairing yourself. When you meet another active addict, you will break up after two dates, not two years.
Pretty negative attitude there. my RA doesnt even know I went to an al-anon meeting so clearly NOT using it to repair our relationship, finally once was thinking about myself and my pain. I didnt hear this at all mentioned at the Al-anon meeting either as one of their goals "When you meet another active addict, you will break up after two dates, not two years" Also if you read any of my other posts, I said I was unfamiliar with the Al-anon program and NEVER heard of it before or knew how it would help me. Didnt know if they wouldnt consider me havin an alcoholic in my life, now that we are separated. and Also that post was before I went to an al-anon meeting. Give me a little credit here. I obviously have not had much experience with alcoholism and came here for support.

Also just because someone is an alcoholic doesnt mean they arent deserving of dating others or being in love. Running from someone you sincerely like just because "hes an alcoholic" is a bit too judgemental. Its not like im out there searching for alcoholics to date. It just happened to work out like that. Ive had many boyfriends and none other than this last one have ever had a drinking problem, anxiety or depression. It just happened like that.
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Old 01-07-2012, 02:20 PM
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Apologies if it came off harsher than I intended. I stand by the sentiment, but if I could write it again and attempt to ease the blow, I would.

Best of luck in your recovery.
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Old 01-07-2012, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by dvm2015 View Post
I know people deal with their alcoholism in different ways, and thought the fact the RA in my life went to an intensive long term inpatient program for 10 months may have a better chance for success than just going to AA meetings out of the blue.
Yes, people do deal with their alcoholism in different ways. Friends and family deal with the alcoholism of their loved ones in different ways, too. 12 step programs (AA, NA, Al-Anon, Nar-Anon, etc.) are well known and help many, but they are not the only option nor are they necessarily the best option. From an empirical standpoint, interventions based on cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) have been shown to be at least as effective as 12 step, which is faith-based. If you're interested in learning more about how that might help you, SMART Recovery (which is based on CBT principles) has a family and friends support group you can join online. For more information, look here: Family & Friends - An Alternative to Al-Anon and Intervention
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Old 01-07-2012, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by onlythetruth View Post
Yes, people do deal with their alcoholism in different ways. Friends and family deal with the alcoholism of their loved ones in different ways, too. 12 step programs (AA, NA, Al-Anon, Nar-Anon, etc.) are well known and help many, but they are not the only option nor are they necessarily the best option. From an empirical standpoint, interventions based on cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) have been shown to be at least as effective as 12 step, which is faith-based. If you're interested in learning more about how that might help you, SMART Recovery (which is based on CBT principles) has a family and friends support group you can join online. For more information, look here: Family & Friends - An Alternative to Al-Anon and Intervention
Thanks. Went to my first al-anon meeting last night and heard horror stories, it gave me less hope that loving an alcoholic will ever get easier or that our relationship will ever be healthy again. Im also not one to speak up in a group so it makes me uncomfortable. I see a cognitive behavioral psychologist too but not sure how much that really is helping since I'm feeling so low and her only suggestion was "your asking too many questions." I just dont think people really understand me. (and the one that did, left me) I was interested in working on the 12 steps just to make myself better and maybe be able to leave this relationship up to fate without questioning, crying, and being hopeless about everything but I dont know where to start. How do people start doing steps??? is there a book that guides you through them??? (I know in AA they use a book) It may sound dumb but I really just dont kno. I appreciate the caring response from you tho. It really does help when all else seems hopeless in life.

I will also check into the Smart recovery page as well. Thank you
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Old 12-06-2017, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by dvm2015 View Post
Thank you for the positive support. I know I cant let this blow my school because ive wanted to be a veterinarian since I was like 5. I've had other relationships fall through because of me being away for school. This one is just so much more important to me because we both were so in love and had such a good friendship for such a long time... so I'm trying to focus on me but still have hope that he may be able to work on himself especially since hes so young. I just have no other experience with alcoholics so I dont know if what he is going through is something he can even work on and get over in the future or if he will be like this forever....? Everyone around me though wants me to just move on and not love him anymore so its hard. Honestly trying to move on or even not focus on him is tougher than being in vet school.
I totally understand word for word, emotional and love and everything else, trying to focus and losing the love of my life....
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:21 PM
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Positive thoughts always

Originally Posted by AIMH View Post
I totally understand word for word, emotional and love and everything else, trying to focus and losing the love of my life....
Anything can and will be accomplished if you set your mind and heart to believe...🙏🏼
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:28 PM
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Hi, AIMH, and welcome to SR. Wanted to let you know that you're posting to a thread where the newest post before yours is nearly 6 years old. Reading the older material here is tremendously helpful, but replying to such an old thread, not so much.

How about starting a thread of your own and introducing yourself, so we can get to know you?
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by honeypig View Post
Hi, AIMH, and welcome to SR. Wanted to let you know that you're posting to a thread where the newest post before yours is nearly 6 years old. Reading the older material here is tremendously helpful, but replying to such an old thread, not so much.

How about starting a thread of your own and introducing yourself, so we can get to know you?
I will start a new thread, thank you for the advice.
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Old 12-09-2017, 03:15 PM
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I guess I'm confused. You've been together since he was 13 (!) and you were sixteen, and he was sent for intensive treatment THEN because of his addiction, in 2010?

and then...". I already see a psychologist for anxiety and depression which i was diagnosed with a year and a half ago when I first met him. "

At any rate, the world needs good veterinarians. This is who he is today. It's not about abandoning anybody. You will love many people throughout your life. Some will be family, some will be friends. They will have different religions, different philosophies, different attitudes about money and having children. Your friends and loved ones attitudes toward any of those things don't affect you. You life partner's views and actions will.

This is the person he is today. The fact that we love someone doesn't make him/her the right person for us. That would be true whether or not that person was an addict.

I can tell you that in 25 years, my husband never got better, only worse.
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