LovingYoungMan

Thank you all for your posts. I know it sounds redundant but I really appreciate it. It has been helping me immensely today.

That was really funny about the Tasmanian Devil. I totally related to that.

Al-Anon and you people are saving my life. I am letting go and letting God... +deep breaths & reading.

Someone told me to ask myself "What would love do now?" I am going to just try to be fully present, in every single moment so I can remain fully open, honest, transparent. My side of the street WILL be clean. Thank you friends for sharing your wisdom.

anhauser

you sound like a wooonderful guy and hopefully she will come to her senses. im a bit confused cause it sounds like shes been sober for awhile(4 years is that correct)? It seems that the things everyone says she might be going thru would be more likely in the beginning of her sobriety. I also say this with utmost sensitivity, but have you any suspicions about her seeing anyone else?

LovingYoungMan

Thanks anhauser. Anything is possible with an alcoholic but I'm pretty sure she's not seeing anyone else. She has issues with intimacy and I believe it is more of fear, because she has never been treated right before. She has only been used, conquered if you will..

I think it is more of a self esteem issue and her feeling anxious because she thinks she doesn't know how to love back. My friend related it to a sponge and said her sponge is full, and it either needs to be rung out or dried up a bit. She does have 4 years of sobriety, but I guess it doesn't matter if she has no idea what it is like to be treated with respect. She needs to work through her own issues.

She told me she is not a cheater though so I am trying to take her word on that. I really hope (for now anyways) that she comes to her senses too but know I have no control over the situation.

Thank you for your kind words.

Learn2Live

I notice LYM, that you said you started going to Al-Anon to understand her and to have a good relationship. It seems your focus is still on HER, and not on you. That is, you're trying to figure out HER actions, her behaviors, her feelings and her state of mind, and compare that to what is healthy or normal. Maybe try this week in your program to shift your focus from hers to your own. Have you started working the Steps? You mentioned someone who is like a sponsor, but is there someone at one of your meetings who might make a good sponsor for you?

m1k3

LYM, just a little experience to share.

One that I learned is "hope clouds observation". When you look at someone or something through the eyes of hope you often miss seeing the reality.

Another is that I had a huge hole in myself (ACOA) and I spent most of my life trying to fill that hole with someone else. It didn't work. Once I started recovery I learned how to fill that hole with myself. I now, possibly for the first time in my life, have a positive relationship with myself.

The definition for Codie that I like best is not that a codie has an unhealthy relationship with someone else, its that they have no relationship with themselves.

Your friend,

LostinBA

LYM, I'm going through a similar situation so i can empathize with the confusion and hurt that you are feeling. Lots of great advice from this Forum, but I know sometimes it feels good to just hear that "You are doing the best you can". I like your comment that "Your side of the street will be clean". I totally identify with that. Even though there may be times when you want to "muddy" the streets, keep taking the high road. I don't see how we can ever regret behaving this way. And remember, it's okay to vent any negative thoughts here, I'm the first to admit that during this time/situation, it's hard to always be positive.

LovingYoungMan

I am very grateful today for you all. I worked all night last night and am about to catch a plane to Oakland for a gig but all I want to do is goto an Al-Anon meeting. Thankfully I have my literature. I will respond to everyone soon with more substance. Thank you in the meantime and I hope you all have a blessed Friday.

painterman

One other thing you might consider, you may have been too good, too kind, always available-the saviour in every situation, so much so that she has taken it all for granted.
I have been guilty of this in past relationships, perhaps you need to step back and let her see for herself what she will be missing.

LovingYoungMan

Hello friends. I want to say thank you again to everyone here for your responses so far. I have so much genuine respect for you all. I apologize for my absence. I literally have not had a breather from work and I'm talking 16-24 hour days. So much so that I didn't have to the energy to come here to the forum because I felt I wouldn't have been able to share my thoughts clearly. I will have you know though that it was all that was on my mind. The only thing I want to do was talk to you all and go to Al Anon meetings. Thankfully I had the literature with me so every time I got a lunch or a few spare moments, I was reading. It has been saving my life. I was in some really tough situations that were completely unrelated (100 hours of work in a week that I had to do or risk losing my job in this economy, as well as my grandfather falling and hitting his head and going to the hospital). I literally asked God to take me quick if this was my time. I thought my life was ending there for a moment.

@Learn2Live

I definitely shifted the focus from her to myself after it ended. I want to know my part in it all and be able to be the healthiest person I can be. I know I have issues of my own that stem from childhood but am dedicated to finding peace and serenity within myself. I've learned a lot about co-dependent behavior and believe that there definitely were some things that were an issue on my end. It's tough because I feel the line is a little blurred as far as what is co-dependent and what is not. I am a man who knows how to treat people with respect (in her case she wasn't used to that) and when I love you, I really make an effort to show you. I bring you roses when you are having a bad day. I cook you your favorite meal when you are sick without asking. I will drive to the store to buy you chocolate and I will show you what true intimacy is and mean every word. This is the man I am. I refuse to stop being me to get what I want from people. I want to lead by example and contribute back to humanity. I set the bar really high and people have a hard time believing if I am real or not. I do not feel that I'm overly nice or a doormat. I don't feel like I was sacrificing anything I wanted to do at her expense. I wasn't losing my sense of self at all. I was in pure bliss. She sent me affirmations all the time letting me know how wonderful I was. She started some days by texting me "the 5 things I love about you most today..." That was enough for me. I felt like she was equally returning the love but for some reason (because of some sort of internal fear) she felt like she was falling short/and or didn't deserve to be treated this way. So is the solution to stop treating those I love with respect and caring for their well being, just to keep them uncomfortable longer in a relationship? Is it because I am genuine and not posing the challenge that she might lose me? I think that kind of thing is stupid. There might not be many people left in the world who mean what they say but I do, and it freaks people out.

I also might note (as humbly as I can) that I am an incredibly good looking man with hair that most people don't have the balls to wear. When I walk into a room people constantly wonder who I am because I dress/present myself in a way that commands respect from them. I am a leader and entertain people for a living and try step things up in every aspect of my life. This relationship thing I can't seem to get a hold of though. People tell me all the time I am marriage material (including her) but then they get sucked into their own fears and self destruct. I feel like I can't stop being myself but it's hard because I feel like myself ends up intimidating people. It is not my issue at all but I am the one that ends up suffering. I'm the one with no answer and a broken heart. I have a lot to offer in a relationship and it pains me to think people put me in this elite category that makes them doubt themselves, rather than just accept that I'm great and stay dedicated to growing together. Love is totally a choice and when I love someone I want to stay committed and work through our issues rather than just run from them. I feel this way about my entirely life actually. I have found it to be a very lonely road when you are everything someone wants and they feel pressure by you simply being you.
That is what I am struggling to find the answer to.

I'd love to hear your thoughts if you are willing to share.

-LovingYoungMan

LovingYoungMan

@m1k3

I feel like I have a very positive relationship with myself. I have many hobbies, love my job and overall proud of my accomplishments. If anything, she the one who was more co-dependent. My part in it was I like it when she missed me and wanted to see me. I like to cuddle and be close. I like to be intimate. Maybe I was too available, but the truth is I loved spending time with her and I know she did with me. I didn't put her before myself but I did make myself vulnerable by loving her whole-heatedly. She affirmed this all the time and it made me so happy and proud to be with her. So when "poof" someone is gone, after hearing so many loving things all the time, it is devastating. I can work on me all I want and have an incredible relationship with myself but I would like to share my life with someone else. I want someone I can rely on and grow with. It is very blissful to be adored by someone and to be able to give that gift back regardless of how much you love yourself. Sex without love is just sad. I could get laid every night by a different woman if I wanted to, but I don't want that. I want true substance and a healthy life.

@painterman

It is definitely possible that I was "too good". Not the kind of "too good" that is a pushover or a wuss but the kind of "too good" that was everything they wanted. Too available? Maybe. But what really is too available? I'm a performer and make my own hours unless I have a string of gigs like I have had recently. So when I had time off and she said she wanted to spend it with me I thought it was great. I like to do stupid boyfriend/girlfriend things when I'm not working because my work is mostly fun and lively. I like to go to the zoo and the art museum and go for walks. Should I have said no to hanging out with her just to make her chase me and miss me more, even though she wanted to see me? Sure, maybe the challenge was over. Maybe she did have exactly what she wanted and took it for granted.. ..But does it have to be like that? Do I have to play games? She is/was my best friend and I feel deep loss. I feel like I should have grown up in the 50's. I want to be that little old couple walking down the street holding hands. I have seen more thrills than you can imagine but there is nothing in the world like that kind of love.

Hope you all have a wonderful day.

-LovingYoungMan

LovingYoungMan

Other Alcoholics in recovery are also encouraged to share their stories with intimacy issues.

I read that for people who abused a substance heavily, the neurotransmitters that transfer signals from brain to genitals become disconnected. I imagine that holds true for other areas of intimacy and being close as well. Mix that with fear and self esteem issues and I can understand how a person could have a hard time being intimate.

If you ever had these issues (or know someone who did), were you ever able to overcome them and be in a healthy, loving relationship?

Dee74

I'd be interested to know where you read that.

D

Learn2Live

I think a guy like that DESERVES to have someone in his life who is equally as kind and giving as he is. It is not often that I say that ANYone DESERVES ANYthing (not yelling, just stressing those particular words) because I think that is a really distorted way to relate to life itself and plays a big part in why so many people "get into trouble." Anyway, I look at my current BF of two years, who is recently divorced, and how he treats me, and I cannot believe how his former spouse treated him, that is, like DIRT. And she STILL treats him that way (because to her, relationships are about who is RIGHT and who is WRONG, and of course she always thinks SHE is right). And yes, she is alcoholic, and drug-addicted. I wish he had not waited so long, and just let her walk all over him for as long as she did, because he is a REALLY nice, sweet, kind and caring guy who was severely affected by her alcoholic and addicted behavior, it just seems such a waste, all that he could have accomplished in life had he made better choices.... I wish the OPPOSITE for you, to find someone who treats you the way you treat others.

No. I strive to always treat other human beings with respect and caring for their well-being, no matter who they are or what they do. Don't allow yourself to start acting like THEM!

IDK why she did what she did but I think yes, anything is possible. It doesn't have to make sense and in fact I've never found anything an alcoholic or addict does makes much sense at all. They seem to act counter-intuitively. Yes, it's weird, but they have their sick reasons for doing what they do. People get used to a certain level of "badness" or dysfunction and depending on who they are, can get downright bored with too much "normalcy" and peace. I used to be that way, but then I found true Peace and Serenity, and it is much better than the other stuff. Of course, the fact that I no longer drink helps in this department too, because once I start again, I start making really poor decisions (especially regarding relationships) that I don't really pay for for a couple years.

I understand this more than I can say. It's valid so there's no need really to be "humble" IMO. There was some research recently that I read, that showed that women whose husbands or partners were better looking than them were more UNHAPPY than women whose husbands or partners were not better looking. I believe it said that those marriages (where the man is better looking) are more likely to end in divorce. The takeaway from that for you seems to be, find someone who appreciates you as much as you appreciate her, but make sure she is better looking than you! LOL All in good fun, but there might be something to be said for the research. I bet if you googled it, you could find an article or two describing it

Thank you for listening LovingYoungMan. There are many of us here struggling with the same kinds of questions you have, from the same kinds of situations, i.e., "I gave him (or her) my ALL, the BEST, treated him with kindness, love, compassion, bought him gifts, made his dinner, made his bed, bore his children, and yet look at what he has done! WHY?" Because they're alcoholics, that's why. I'm willing to bet she relapsed LYM. I hope you're taking some time when available, to also read other folks stories and look for the similarities. That helps me, to know I am not alone. Take care. (((hugs)))

MsGrace

I read it too...believe it was in "Under the Influence" or "Beyond the Influence"

StarCat

XABF, in a rare moment of honesty, once told me that he treated me horribly because he felt he didn't deserve anything good in his life, and that when I treated him well he reacted by trying to push me away.

Of course when he felt me actually start to slip away, reacting to the negativity, he'd be desperate to pull me back in.

I'm not sure if this applies here, or if it's just part of the abusive cycle that he and I went through, but either way the answer is yes, it is possible that she was afraid of you being "too good," and was waiting for the "catch," and decided to end things so that she would have control over the bad she feared was coming.

At the end of the day, though, does the "why" really matter?
I think the more important question is really, "Is this the sort of relationship/behavior/way of being treated that you'd want in your life?"

skippernlilg

Just a reminder: 4 years or 40 years of sobriety, to the recovering alcoholic, is still One Day at a Time. In their, and our, recovery, there can be all sorts of setbacks for ill-defined or unexpected triggers. We are all a work in progress.

Having said that, as an ACoA, I, too, have been guilty of pushing away what would look good on paper. All the right circumstances, all the good looks, intelligence, common interests, great sex, good life should equal contentment in a relationship, right? For reasons within my shattered self, I have also pushed away what might be good for anyone else.

When you let go and truly let God (or Higher Power) take control, you may see that Wisdom is taking over. There is an unseen plan at work for your life right now, and that's what is your journey to discover. Trying to understand someone else just blurs your focus on the message you're supposed to see right now in your own life.

Yes, you sound like a great catch, and some of your posts remind me of what I might see on a Dating website: Loves cooking for partner, long walks, etc. What you have to offer sounds great, but at this time, perhaps the substance of your own relationship with your Higher Power is where you are supposed to be right now.

Learn2Live

Nice post Skipper, thank you for sharing.