Need Some Serious Help and Advice
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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Marie1960 thanks for the feedback. That was what i was thinking. This is harder than I thought/knew it was going to be. I'm taking the positive steps, but it hurts to say Goodbye to someone when in honesty you don't want to. My emotional scale is tipping towards sad today. I need a shutoff switch in my head. Oh well, I keep reciting the serenity prayer!
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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What helped me to move forward was admitting I was in love with a memory. Every single good quality that he possessed was now polluted with booze. He was no longer kind, wonderful, smart, and sexy. He was just ugly, mean, fall down, sloppy drunk.
Somedays are truly sad, it's all part of the painful, mourning process. You are entitled to every single emotion you are feeling at this time. In the days ahead may you find peace. A new life awaits you, when you are ready, it will be waiting............... hang in there my friend.
Somedays are truly sad, it's all part of the painful, mourning process. You are entitled to every single emotion you are feeling at this time. In the days ahead may you find peace. A new life awaits you, when you are ready, it will be waiting............... hang in there my friend.
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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I finally started to get better when I stopped believing what he told me and I started believing his actions.
1. She says she is going to AA everyday but sounded drunk and called you after midnight....what do her actions tell you?
2. She had two very different conversations with you in the span of a few hours....what do her actions tell you?
3. She was upset with you though you were doing something reasonable for her....what are those actions indicating?
When I just feel for the words (a long, long time) I would get really confused. Which conversation am I supposed to believe etc. There were two crazy people in the relationship at that time.
When I realized that the actions of someone drunk meant that I could not trust the words coming out of his mouth, it helped me to understand how little of my confusion aobut our relationship was about me. I cut the crazy factor in the relationship in half at that point.
It was not easy...and I just had a therapy appointment about it today 18mths later so I don't want you to think I have it all figured out (far from it). I am actually just starting to come out from under the cloak of this disease and figure out what is mine (before I was willing to take all of it), and what is not....which is quite a bit.
Good luck!
1. She says she is going to AA everyday but sounded drunk and called you after midnight....what do her actions tell you?
2. She had two very different conversations with you in the span of a few hours....what do her actions tell you?
3. She was upset with you though you were doing something reasonable for her....what are those actions indicating?
When I just feel for the words (a long, long time) I would get really confused. Which conversation am I supposed to believe etc. There were two crazy people in the relationship at that time.
When I realized that the actions of someone drunk meant that I could not trust the words coming out of his mouth, it helped me to understand how little of my confusion aobut our relationship was about me. I cut the crazy factor in the relationship in half at that point.
It was not easy...and I just had a therapy appointment about it today 18mths later so I don't want you to think I have it all figured out (far from it). I am actually just starting to come out from under the cloak of this disease and figure out what is mine (before I was willing to take all of it), and what is not....which is quite a bit.
Good luck!
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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I shared something with her tonight that I learned in Step 1. Her response was "I'm Not Coming Back". Then she sent a follow up email asking me to provide information for her to fill out the paperwork.
Needless to say, hurt my feelings, and pissed me off a little more.
I told her I didn't ask her to come back. I was just sharing something with a little apology included. She has made it quite clear how much she hates me.
Other email she sent asking for information to fill in the divorce papers: Responded let the attorneys figure it out. That's what they are paid for.
And last email, letting her know that I again I had done something that she could hate me more for, I kept her insurance coverage so her's wouldn't lapse.
I have no freaking clue who the person I'm dealing with is, but I'm done.
Needless to say, hurt my feelings, and pissed me off a little more.
I told her I didn't ask her to come back. I was just sharing something with a little apology included. She has made it quite clear how much she hates me.
Other email she sent asking for information to fill in the divorce papers: Responded let the attorneys figure it out. That's what they are paid for.
And last email, letting her know that I again I had done something that she could hate me more for, I kept her insurance coverage so her's wouldn't lapse.
I have no freaking clue who the person I'm dealing with is, but I'm done.
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After a good nights sleep, I turned the phones off and didn't worry about it, I feel better today. I realized that my AW has either been trying to hurt/disrupt me, or this is her way of coping. Not sure which, but I can't change it. I have been supportive and positive and I am working on fixing myself. I will do my best not to let her derail my recovery or understanding of what took place and try to understand that there are more than one view to any situation.
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Focusing on what I can control, doing what I need to do today. I got some feedback from my sponsor that I hadn't thought about. My AW is probably upset that I'm in Al-Anon, trying to get better. I didn't even consider that there would be resentment from that direction.
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Hmmm just got responses to my emails last night. they were clear and concise, so I'm assuming no drinking yet. I have decided that there is no reason to respond until I'm served with papers. Then I will respond. One of AH's responses was that she didn't need my insurance since she didn't have a card. Which is funny to me since I had asked her to let me know how I could get her a copy of her insurance card, shots and prescription on Monday night. I offered, she ignored. Her choice.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
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I've watched plenty of loved ones self-destruct and no, they are never like they used to be when they are doing it. And yeah, it's really hard to watch & be involved. For me, It used to be like watching a train wreck; just can't take your eyes off it even though you know it will be horror! Except now I've seen it so many times up close & personal, I don't need to see it any more; I know what is going to happen.
I got tired of trying to figure out how they think, why they contradict themselves from moment to moment, and why they did such-and-such horrible thing. Now I know, it's cause they're @&$ĄŁ€-up, that's why and they have a $&@*+%-up way of thinking. And they're inconsistent and unpredictable. And no, they r not grateful for anything you do.
I got tired of trying to figure out how they think, why they contradict themselves from moment to moment, and why they did such-and-such horrible thing. Now I know, it's cause they're @&$ĄŁ€-up, that's why and they have a $&@*+%-up way of thinking. And they're inconsistent and unpredictable. And no, they r not grateful for anything you do.
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 86
I don't think it's "narcissistic" at all ... I think it's the nature of the beast (alcholism) that you did not cause. You obviously love your wife and want things to work out, but I've learned that it can't work while the A'ic is actively using.
It sounds like you are trying to CONTROL not protect, which is impossible to do? I think it's natural for us non-normies to be "protective" of the ones we love who are in the throes of this disease, but what I've learned is being protective can amount to being enabling. We have to let the A'ic experience the consequences of the disease without our enabling or "protecting". Living with this disease is one of the most challenging things I've done in my life, so you are absolutely right to feel as you do. You are not alone!
Al-Anon was a blessing to me because it brought me together with others who are "in the same boat", and I've learned alot about myself and about the disease. Talking to my fam and friends was hard for me because they are normies and don't "live it", the Al-Anon people (and the people here on SR) have lived with it and the insight learned, for me, is more valuable than having a friend or family person hold my hand (although it's nice to have that too every so often).
Our subject in Al-Anon on Tuesday was "taking care of ourselves" - great topic and brought me back to when I started Al-Anon 2-1/2 years ago and where I am today.
Good luck to you, I hope to find all the answers and serenity you deserve.
It sounds like you are trying to CONTROL not protect, which is impossible to do? I think it's natural for us non-normies to be "protective" of the ones we love who are in the throes of this disease, but what I've learned is being protective can amount to being enabling. We have to let the A'ic experience the consequences of the disease without our enabling or "protecting". Living with this disease is one of the most challenging things I've done in my life, so you are absolutely right to feel as you do. You are not alone!
Al-Anon was a blessing to me because it brought me together with others who are "in the same boat", and I've learned alot about myself and about the disease. Talking to my fam and friends was hard for me because they are normies and don't "live it", the Al-Anon people (and the people here on SR) have lived with it and the insight learned, for me, is more valuable than having a friend or family person hold my hand (although it's nice to have that too every so often).
Our subject in Al-Anon on Tuesday was "taking care of ourselves" - great topic and brought me back to when I started Al-Anon 2-1/2 years ago and where I am today.
Good luck to you, I hope to find all the answers and serenity you deserve.
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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Portia123, thanks for the feedback. I think I turned a corner today. Even though she was being self destructive about her medicine and such, I went ahead and dropped it off for her, and had no expectations of anything for myself. just the best for her. I'm trying to be the best person I can be, and the person I want to be......
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Lost - I really feel for you. It may be time for you to completely detach, not expect anything or do anything except do for yourself, find your serenity and leave her to her devices. If she doesn't take her meds, that's her deal and she'll have to suffer those consequences as well.
My RAH is on about 6 different RX's and unless it's a something "normie" that doesn't get him to the pharmacy to pick them up, I don't get involved with his meds. Funny thing is, my RAH is very health-conscious and is very good about keeping up with his meds - but when it comes to the bottle, whole 'nother story. It's a spell that can't be broken, only arrested...
My RAH is on about 6 different RX's and unless it's a something "normie" that doesn't get him to the pharmacy to pick them up, I don't get involved with his meds. Funny thing is, my RAH is very health-conscious and is very good about keeping up with his meds - but when it comes to the bottle, whole 'nother story. It's a spell that can't be broken, only arrested...
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Interesting day. I learned tonight that she doesn't have a drinking problem, she just had to drink/get drunk in order to have sex. She doesn't have a sex drive, and that was why. Also, I was to blame for pretty much everything. I was controlling, and mean, and smothering. She is filing divorce and nothing is going to stop her.
Once I heard that it was necessary for her to be drunk to want to have sex (this was even when we were dating and on) I know it's over. I never new about this.
I decided based on hearing that, that the marriage is over and I wasn't going to fight it anymore. I mean heck, what do you say to something like that.
Anyway, she hung up on me again and when I tried to call back to give her the rest of the information to put on the divorce papers, she just hung up on me. Don't think I can win either way.
Once I heard that it was necessary for her to be drunk to want to have sex (this was even when we were dating and on) I know it's over. I never new about this.
I decided based on hearing that, that the marriage is over and I wasn't going to fight it anymore. I mean heck, what do you say to something like that.
Anyway, she hung up on me again and when I tried to call back to give her the rest of the information to put on the divorce papers, she just hung up on me. Don't think I can win either way.
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Tonight I gave up on trying to get back together with my AW. I sent her the following email, and turned off my email address:
Okay, so I have written you apologies before, but here is the last one. I am sorry. Right now, it’s not going to matter what I say or do, I understand that. I’m not trying to change your mind. I’m just saying I am sorry for the things I did wrong during our marriage. I have beaten myself up repeatedly and you have had your shots as well. I am going to counseling and Al-Anon to improve myself. I made mistakes and handled some things badly and other things worse. But I am a good person, and I’m going to be a better person moving forward. This doesn’t change how you feel about me I know. I wish it did, but I understand it doesn’t. That’s all I can do or say as far as my own mistakes, because if the other person isn’t receptive, then it won’t matter what is said.
Now for the part of the apology you may not like. The things I put up with affected me just as deeply. I could have walked away and been justified multiple times, but I didn’t. I was willing to work to make things better for us. Today was the first time in 8 years that you were completely honest with me when you told me that in order to want to have sex, it was necessary for you to drink. You see, I wanted you all the time, but I never understood why I was rejected so much. I thought it was me. I wasn’t good enough or something. After a while I just let you drink because I wanted to connect with you. Believe it or not, this was a double-edged sword. On one hand, you kissed me like you wanted me, and on the other hand I enabled you to drink. I regret the enabling, but I don’t the kissing. The drinking caused me to start to try and control my world, which resulted in me trying to control yours as well. Not the correct response, I know that now, but I didn’t then. I thought if I was strong and kept everything focused I could keep you safe. I was wrong. Once you stopped drinking (do you remember falling off the toilet and hitting your head on the bathtub?) I thought what I was doing was working, keeping things organized and directed. I became un-flexible, which isn’t who I was or who I ever wanted to be. For this, I’m not blaming you, I’m just explaining. I’m responsible for my own actions.
I don’t expect to ever get an apology from you, but I hope someday you regret forcing me to give up on us.
Okay, so I have written you apologies before, but here is the last one. I am sorry. Right now, it’s not going to matter what I say or do, I understand that. I’m not trying to change your mind. I’m just saying I am sorry for the things I did wrong during our marriage. I have beaten myself up repeatedly and you have had your shots as well. I am going to counseling and Al-Anon to improve myself. I made mistakes and handled some things badly and other things worse. But I am a good person, and I’m going to be a better person moving forward. This doesn’t change how you feel about me I know. I wish it did, but I understand it doesn’t. That’s all I can do or say as far as my own mistakes, because if the other person isn’t receptive, then it won’t matter what is said.
Now for the part of the apology you may not like. The things I put up with affected me just as deeply. I could have walked away and been justified multiple times, but I didn’t. I was willing to work to make things better for us. Today was the first time in 8 years that you were completely honest with me when you told me that in order to want to have sex, it was necessary for you to drink. You see, I wanted you all the time, but I never understood why I was rejected so much. I thought it was me. I wasn’t good enough or something. After a while I just let you drink because I wanted to connect with you. Believe it or not, this was a double-edged sword. On one hand, you kissed me like you wanted me, and on the other hand I enabled you to drink. I regret the enabling, but I don’t the kissing. The drinking caused me to start to try and control my world, which resulted in me trying to control yours as well. Not the correct response, I know that now, but I didn’t then. I thought if I was strong and kept everything focused I could keep you safe. I was wrong. Once you stopped drinking (do you remember falling off the toilet and hitting your head on the bathtub?) I thought what I was doing was working, keeping things organized and directed. I became un-flexible, which isn’t who I was or who I ever wanted to be. For this, I’m not blaming you, I’m just explaining. I’m responsible for my own actions.
I don’t expect to ever get an apology from you, but I hope someday you regret forcing me to give up on us.
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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She drank, because she wanted to DRINK.
Normal folks don't solve any problem by escape via getting drunk.
Normal folks solve a problem by getting to the root of the PROBLEM and correcting it. Not by escape.
Addicts use, to escape, and then blame.
This is a fundamental understanding that you are still trying to rationalize away.
She drank, because she wanted to DRINK.
CLMI
Normal folks don't solve any problem by escape via getting drunk.
Normal folks solve a problem by getting to the root of the PROBLEM and correcting it. Not by escape.
Addicts use, to escape, and then blame.
This is a fundamental understanding that you are still trying to rationalize away.
She drank, because she wanted to DRINK.
CLMI
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 1,637
Addicts use, to escape, and then blame.
What I have come to accept is that my recovery is for me. To help me make better choices to help protect me from my husband's disease. Because his disease (until and unless he gets recovery!) will always have him trying to escape his responsibilty, avoid his feelings by getting drunk, and then manipulating situations to put the blame on someone other than him. That's it - and I no longer take it personally. It's just addiction - and I'm powerless over it.
So many times I find myself wanting to reach out to my STBXAH... via email, text or phone call. I have found so much love and compassion in my recovery... and I want to show him this new, kind loving Gettingby... but I don't (thank god) because he is in the throws of his addiction.
It's sad. But the wall I've built between me and him is for both our protection.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
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I learned tonight that she doesn't have a drinking problem, she just had to drink/get drunk in order to have sex. She doesn't have a sex drive, and that was why. Also, I was to blame for pretty much everything. I was controlling, and mean, and smothering. She is filing divorce and nothing is going to stop her
Yes, somehow these people are expert at finding the most hateful and hurtful things to say to us, which they instinctively know are the things that will keep us tremendously emotionally involved. To our own detriment. How horrible. Sorry she said this to you.
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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Learn2Live, after what I learned yesterday, I'm not doing anything. I did get a call this morning that she had burned her eye with a curling iron and couldn't find the insurance card that I had emailed her yesterday to go to the doctor. I went ahead and resent it, but that's all I'm doing now. Luckily I have a counseling meeting today at noon, so I will be able to vent some more!
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