MDH2Os

I have been browsing some of the posts in here about relationships with recovering alcoholics and I see a lot of posts by women dating men who were/are recovering but nothing from men dating women and I need some guidance, advice or just help...

I have been dating a woman for 7 months who has been sober for about 2.5 years. I knew about her alcoholism from our first date but don't think I fully knew what I was accepting. Keep in mind that this was as close as love at first sight that I have ever been to. I was ready to marry her after a month and still am just as in love with her and still would love nothing more than to spend the rest of my life with her, but recently there have been some major battles. Not the yelling and screaming type, but it has been rough. She has had major panic attacks and anxiety and she is attributing this to us and the variables surrounding us. I have a steady job, am a single father, my brother lives with me (fully functional and productive member of society) and the normal day to day things that go along with life, oh yeah and we live about 30 minutes away from each other. With all of these things I can't necessarily be there when she needs me or wants me and when I have to dissapoint her in that way, things spiral out of control and our normally beautiful and perfect relationship just goes haywire. She is a very black and white person and does not handle grey well and with me there comes some grey (kid, distance, and trust). Not that I am not trustworthy, but the unknown really gets to her and it comes out in trust. When she gets into one of these downward spirals it is hell and nothing I say or do help and in fact usually everything I say or do is wrong and just creates more anger (no matter what I say). But, on the flip side I am stuck not being able to express myself because she always throws her alcoholism in my face and tells me how easy it would be for her to end up in a bar and dead. I have to swallow everything and even certain realities that may help her because of this cloud hanging over everything.

Will this get better with time? Is she just still emotionally immature due to 20 years of drinking? What do I do to make things better? Help!

Freedom1990

That, my friend, is emotional blackmail. As a long-term (21+ years) alcoholic, I can assure you that her sobriety is not contingent on you. She would like you to think so however.

I highly recommend you locate local Alanon meetings for yourself. Get your hands on the book "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie (amazon sells used copies cheap). Read all the "sticky" topics at the top of this forum and educate yourself on the disease of alcoholism.

Personally I still couldn't handle a relationship at 4 years sober and relapsed.

I am grateful that I made it back alive.

Please consider the suggestions I have listed for you.

Welcome to SR, and I am glad you found us!

dollydo

Welcome,

I think that Freedom & Anvil have covered all the bases.

Keep posting, read all the stickies on the Family and Friends Forum, lots of great fodder
for thought.

MDH2Os

Thanks anvilhead...

I am the ultimate skeptic and I guess the point I was trying to make with the marriage comment was how intense my feelings are for her. I am willing to do just about anything to see where this goes, but I want insight into what to do, how to support and how to love a recovering person. Also, maybe a little justification to know that I am not completely off base. She can make me feel very inadequate (for her emotionally) and I have never felt that way in a relationship. I am a giver, a nurturer... I want to expend all options and give it all I have.

MDH2Os

I guess I am the same way. I will gravitate to the emotionally unstable ones and try to make everything ok.

Nice hard dose of reality...

suki44883

The most important person in all of this is your child. Is this the woman you want to help raise him? She sounds incredibly selfish and immature, as shown by her problem sharing you and your need for time for your real responsibilities. I'm not so sure this is an "alcoholic" problem but rather a sign of incompatibility. To be honest, it sounds like you are more invested in this relationship than she is and if she can't have everything her way, she's going to make you feel inadequate.

Bottom line...you don't know her well enough to be thinking about marrying her. From what you've posted, I think you'd be miserable and I'm sure your child would be.

MDH2Os

What about the panic attacks and anxiety? Is there any help for her there? The fear of this seems to be the driving force behind our recent problems. It is fear of our relationship and me not being able to be there and the grey areas that surround a relationship that she thinks is causing the attacks. It could be or it could be something that has always been there and the reason for the medicating with alcohol for 20 years.

suki44883

She can see a doctor for help with the panic attacks and anxiety. Therapy can be helpful, too, but she has to really want help and be willing to do the work. You can't help with those any more than you can help with alcoholism. It's all on her.

Freedom1990

That will age you quickly. Like Anvil, I too was attracted to the bad boys. I just knew I could fix them.

That took its toll on me physically, emotionally, and spiritually over the years.

Never again.

I value myself too much these days to get enmeshed with an emotional vampire. No thanks.

MDH2Os

Suki,

I have been single for 5 years and have lots of experience and a good grasp on things. I don't mean to make her out as an irrational and completely selfish person. She is normally incredibly rational and for the most part considerate. It is just the last 2 months that something has snapped. The panic and anxiety have been out of control and I am on the receiving end when things spiral and I can't help, or she gets frustrated.

Freedom1990

You are on the receiving end because you allow it to be so.

We all have choices.

Tuffgirl

OMG this sounds exactly like my soon-to-be ex husband. Without sounding harsh here, because I mean it with the best of intentions - RUN WHILE YOU STILL CAN!

She is not ready for a relationship nor "mother" material.

This behavior will only end when she ends it. It is not your baggage. You didn't cause it, you can't control it, and you sure as heck can't cure it.

There are plenty women out there who are kind, trusting, mature, and waiting for a man like you. I know, I am one (well...the kind, trusting, mature part...I need another man like I need another hole in my head after this alcoholism fueled disaster of a marriage)

My husband has stalked me, hacked into my email repeatedly, and in the face of hard evidence, clings to his reality like stink on *poop*. He believes any man I interact with is an affair in the makings, and was so darn codependent he sucked the life out of me. He drove drunk with my kids (his step kids) in the car, threw drunken tantrums at 2am on a school night, and could not handle the simplest of things that comes with having a family.

There is no grey area for this kind of personality. And you will always be trying to please the impossible person and beating yourself up for failing over and over again. You will be tried, judged, and condemned, often without even knowing its happening until it has already happened and you are blindsided by it.

Oh I could go on and on...

Go read a few books about emotionally unavailable people and alcoholism. And then reevaluate the rest of your life because it will be an emotional roller-coaster ride.

bluebelle

If she is having problems with anxiety and panic attacks, that's something that she needs to get help for on her own. It is wrong that she throws her alcoholism in your face whenever you have an argument. It should not be an excuse for her behavior. It sounds like she is asking you to be more than just a bf--she wants you to keep her stable and hold her up. That's just too much to ask of another person. If she wants help with her anxiety and panic attacks, there are mental health professionals who can help her. She will need to work with them and work on herself--without you being involved. There is nothing you can do to fix her or cure her.

I am also concerned by your instant attraction to her and statement that you would have already married her. I understand instant attraction, and it has gotten me in hot water. I'm afraid that I am probably instantly attracted to people that I think I can "fix." I seem to be instantly attracted to people with various addictions. A long term relationship involves hard work, trust, and give and take. It sounds like she is not trusting you and she is just taking, and not giving.

Babyblue

As others have said, her panic attacks and other emotional issues aren't in your control nor can you fix or nurture them away. Take the recovering part out of the story and you still wouldn't be able to fix a person who suffers from her issues. Alcohol was her way to cope and now she has to find other ways. She is an adult and can go see a doctor or psychiatrist if she feels that unstable.

The best way you can support her is to acknowledge her issues but tell her she needs to see someone that can help her.

LifeRecovery

I agree with everyone else and just wanted to add something non-addiction related.

From what I have read it is often about 18-24 months into a relationship that we begin to lose the rose colored glasses and begin to see the person we are in relationship with as the true person (and they us). This was true for me with my loved one, and in my case it is when the addiction really began to present itself.

Hopeworks

Good stuff so far... (by the way my nickname with my girlfriends used to be "scummagnet" ... my inner radar and instant electricty and being irresistably drawn to that sharp dressed, handsome, ultra charming guy in the room of 100 people usually ended up being the one guy with tons of serious hidden issues and baggage!)

OK... time for us to see how well things would work out if this were AHarmony.com (alcoholic dating match site)

1. All dating usually has a honeymoon period and ALL dates, boyfriends and girlfriends are TRYING very hard to make you think they are extremely cool folks... it is called the honeymoon period. If the honeymoon starts getting frayed edges before one year it is highly unlikely that this is a good match and someone may be having a hard time keeping up the ACT.

2. The potential life partner has been sober 2.5 years ... this means has been abstinent from alcohol. However... not drinking does not equate recovery or instant happiness. Those who have made it through the gauntlet of alcoholism have to choose everyday how they will live their lives and how they will structure their recovery. In my opinion... and this is only my opinion... the most success stories of true happiness and joyful living and successful relationships with others are recovered alcoholics that have a spiritual center to their recovery lifestyle.

What is her recovery life plan? Is she involved with a program? Does she have a sponsor? Counselor? Close relationships with others such as family members, friends?

What is she doing about her issues with panic attacks? Statistically many alcoholics have a problem with panic attacks and often a strong recovery program will eliminate them eventually... however... 2.5 years later this is not happening apparently and she needs to find her own answer medically, good counseling or a good recovery program to address it.

Red Flags. I see a lot of them. More than 50% of all marriages fail. They probably all had good chemistry and were "in love". How many had the huge amount of red flags and problems you are experiencing during the honeymoon phase? How many were marrying a person who had been drinking for 20 years and had only been sober a couple of years?

Red Flag, Most abstinent drinkers relapse. That is a statistic. You must figure this into your life plan that your future if you choose to stay involved may eventually include active alcoholism.

Sorry to be so negative... but I wish someone had grabbed me by the shoulders and shaken me and told me to snap out of it when I first gazed across the room and "fell in love" with my RAH!

kiki5711

what is her anxiety about? I know being a stepmom is one of the hardest things in the world and you there are times you feel like you're competing with the child for the love of the parent.

how old is your child? girls in general will be more clingy to the father, and more hateful towards the stepmom.

is this something she might be anxious about.

MDH2Os

What is her recovery life plan? I don't know? She has a great job, incredible kids, involved deeply in her church (even supports the church recovery program), she meditates, eats very healthy, works out and lives in a very structured environment. Is she involved with a program? Yes Does she have a sponsor? Yes, but isn't in contact with that person very much.Counselor? Close relationships with others such as family members, friends? Has one close friend. Her family is about 2 to 3 hours away.

What is she doing about her issues with panic attacks?
She has talked with her doctor, but she is afraid to take the normal medications to catch/stop her attacks. Putting a RAH on Zanax is not good and the other more holistic medicines or non-narcotics don't do much at all. I have been witness to one panic attack and it was scary. It hit like a freight train and we actually had to leave a restaurant, running. Then she had another one recently on a plane trip back from Denver that was so intense she swears she will never fly again. This coming from a person that has flown many times. This fear is spilling over into driving, and other aspects of her life that she never had problems with before. I will push her to see her doctor again and a specialist.

Regardless of her and I working out, she is an incredible person and I want to see her make it through this even if I am not in the picture. Ultimately I would love it if we worked out, but I am not delusional and a lot of what everyone has been saying on here are things that I am aware of and hearing it and getting it off my chest helps. So, thank you all!

MDH2Os

My daughter is 11. We have went through the clingy phase at the beginning but that has pretty much gone away. Yes, this is part of the anxiety, but the reasons for that anxiety have passed and even my GF has said that it has improved drastically and our children get along very well. I think she is still struggling with the potential of becoming a stepmom and this is mostly due to her own experiences with her step parents. She also feels that one more thing added to her life (normal single parenthood) is just too much. In reality her plate is no fuller than anyone's is, but she tends to dump it in one large pile and look at it that way which can be overwhelming for anyone. It's like the old adage "How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time."

Freedom1990

If she's not in regular contact with her sponsor and working the steps, then she doesn't have much of a program of recovery.

My anxiety is directly proportional to how hard I am working the program.