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Confused about something....

Old 06-23-2011, 08:49 PM
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Confused about something....

I was just reading the post about pot etc. I was SO confused because as I read all the views of everyone, I was alarmed at the varying responses. Pot is an ILLEGAL substane and can be an addiction just as alcohol is. If someone came here and asked what to do about their problems with an alcoholic souse, people would tell them to set boundaries.....etc. I really don't understand that change in stance here by many....seriously, I have NO experience w/ pot, but I was really confused by this post and it' responses.
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:02 PM
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Well, the way I see it, alcohol and pot CAN, for some people, be a mere social lubricant. I never got into pot, myself, even in college, and I never partook except in a social setting. I never wanted to get high by myself.

In that kind of setting, I don't think pot is any more harmful to the body or mind than alcohol.

It IS illegal, so I don't condone the use of illegal substances, but I do recognize that some people don't find the illegal aspect of it apalling. Frankly, it's something that I don't care to be around, but others feel differently about it. I think it would probably be best if nobody drank, but I'm not going to insist that everyone else see it my way and refrain from drinking.

The thread, though, is more about when one partner has the right to insist on certain behavior on the part of the other, particularly when the behavior in question is not in that person's presence. I think that's what we are debating, more than whether people should or should not smoke pot.
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:04 PM
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Pot is legal in some states and for some people. I live in a MM state.
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Old 06-23-2011, 11:24 PM
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I think again, that regardless of what the substance used/abused is, it is up to you as the significant other/family/friend to determine for yourself what is acceptable to you.

There are things I read here from other posters that make me want to scream, "RUN! RUN FOR YOUR LIFE! HEAD FOR THE HILLS! ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR COTTONEFFING MIND WHY ARE YOU NOT RUNNIGN!?!?!?" -- but the thing is, whether it's alcohol or pot or heroin or meth, I won't change your mind one bit by screaming at you. I can tell you how I would react and how I view the situation, but you have to determine what your level of acceptance is.

We've all, as family of alcoholics, accepted things we never in a million years would have thought we would. And so maybe that's why some of us are not very judgmental about how others react. And then again, some of us have seen relationships and brains ravaged by pot abuse -- and we will again have another outlook.
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Old 06-24-2011, 11:16 PM
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Pot is only illegal in some parts of the US -- in other parts of the US, Canada, and most other countries it's legal. Took a bit for me to get used to too when I first started talking to my AH, because he smoked a bit then -- but he lived in Alaska, where it's legal. Interesting how he abstained from it here because it'll get you arrested, yet he would still show up to work (in surgery!!) completely snockered.

As I see it, anything can be abused, and in my own life I've seen a lot less damage from pot (which is still widely-used despite it's illegality here) than I have from legal substances...alcohol, for instance.
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Old 06-25-2011, 12:53 AM
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he lived in Alaska, where it's legal.
But it's not. But don't ask me to explain the pot legislation in this state, because it's whacko. Something along the lines of -- it's not illegal to use but it's illegal to possess. (Yeah, we elected those guys. Sorry.)
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Old 06-25-2011, 01:00 AM
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Originally Posted by lillamy View Post
But it's not. But don't ask me to explain the pot legislation in this state, because it's whacko. Something along the lines of -- it's not illegal to use but it's illegal to possess. (Yeah, we elected those guys. Sorry.)
Yeah, I remember reading those laws and giggling to myself -- legal to use, legal to possess up to an ounce, legal to grow a single plant for personal use. Illegal to sell, grow more than one plant, transfer seed, possess more than an ounce, transport, etc. I guess they have to prove how you got it before it's a problem.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:32 AM
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I'm ready for the firing squad here by voicing my opinion.

#1. At one time, ALCHOHOL was illegal. Remember learning about Prohibition? People were morally opposed to the use of alcohol, criminalized those who imbibed, and drove the production, sales, and consumption of it underground. It was a holy mess and lots of people got hurt or killed because of it's illegality.

The same is happening with the drug war now. Amsterdam has virtually no crime because of their leniency to "moral crimes", such as soft drug use and prostitution. We could definitely take a lesson from them.

#2. I would much rather be around someone who smokes pot than someone who drinks any day. I have never seen anyone high on pot want to beat the tar out of someone or get into an uncontrollable rage. Stoners are usually pretty laid back and the most they'll do is take your last twinkie.

#3. As with any drug or alcohol, moderation is the key and some people, regardless of their drug of choice will use it excessively and end up having a big problem.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:48 AM
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Line me up, too!

Originally Posted by Wendy1967 View Post
I'm ready for the firing squad here by voicing my opinion.

#1. At one time, ALCHOHOL was illegal. Remember learning about Prohibition? People were morally opposed to the use of alcohol, criminalized those who imbibed, and drove the production, sales, and consumption of it underground. It was a holy mess and lots of people got hurt or killed because of it's illegality.

The same is happening with the drug war now. Amsterdam has virtually no crime because of their leniency to "moral crimes", such as soft drug use and prostitution. We could definitely take a lesson from them.

#2. I would much rather be around someone who smokes pot than someone who drinks any day. I have never seen anyone high on pot want to beat the tar out of someone or get into an uncontrollable rage. Stoners are usually pretty laid back and the most they'll do is take your last twinkie.

#3. As with any drug or alcohol, moderation is the key and some people, regardless of their drug of choice will use it excessively and end up having a big problem.
Hi Wendy, and I agree.

I grew up in the 50's and 60's when pretty much everybody smoked pot, and when pot was pretty mild stuff. I grew my own and smoked that, and I barely felt a high from doing it. It was just fun, and I still love the smell of weed.

The "new weed" scares me with its potency. I took one hit in 1994 and was stoned for 2 days. That shocked me! I don't know if all of it is strong these days -- my guess is that it varies according to which hybrid is being smoked.

I do think some people can smoke weed responsibly, just like some people can drink responsibly.

I don't think we should criminalize all mind-altering substances. I do think addicts should not be smoking pot to ease their withdrawals from their DOC.

I don't usually post on the friends and family sections, because I am in recovery from opiates after ortho surgery, but I've seen the addiction problem from both sides of the coin.

I think that people with substance problems have enough problems on their hands trying to get off them, without becoming felons at the same time. In my personal experience, people will use substances whether they are legal or not.

My only point here is that, like Wendy, I do think that "weed Prohibition" will only drive the users to seedy places to buy it, and will make criminals out of non-violent, peaceful people, many of whom are not addicts at all.

JMHO

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Old 07-17-2011, 04:03 PM
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Our state just decriminalized MM. My own feelings have evolved over the years.

One of the more compelling arguments I heard against the decriminalization of pot is that it is, in fact, much more potent than it used to be. The other argument is that if someone is willing to break the law to obtain something, it is probably not as innocuous as they would have their loved ones believe.

I remember years ago, hearing a colleague on the phone with a lawyer, discussing how to minimize the fallout of his 19-year-old son's DWI. Aside from losing his license and points on his license, there was the specter of mandatory alcohol counseling. Colleague and his son just wanted the whole issue to "go away." I remember thinking, his son had to obtain booze illegally, and drink until he was too drunk to drive, and then be one of the 1 in 10 police think they actually catch. The boy has a problem. But, not my kid, and until he hits and kills me, not my problem. And not all teenagers drink, and not all who drink, drink to excess, so the "everybody does it"philosophy doesn't fly with me.

I find it troubling that people who smoke pot all say "it's no worse than alcohol." Are they unconscious, or really so limited in their experience that they've never been touched by the issue of alcoholism?

The most troubling aspect for me is that all the people I've known who have smoked pot thought driving while stoned was absolutely hysterical. (And they had admitted impairments of judgement, perception of time, etc,) With the medical pot decriminalized, I think there is a whole new public relations battle to unfold, educating those that partake that impaired driving is not humorous.

Sorry to be such a downer, but as the widow of an alcoholic, and the daughter of a drunk driver who killed someone, the impairment and driving makes me a little nuts. (Having your Dad go to jail at 76 years old is not fun. But as the aggrieved family pointed out, their Dad didn't get to be 76.)
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Old 07-17-2011, 04:24 PM
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I don't know of any studies that have interviewed "people who smoke pot all day" and have obtained any responses at all, let alone equating weed with alcohol. You have effectively applied a stereotype to pot smokers and how "they" think. That is prejudiced and narrow minded. It is also not true of the pot smokers I know.

I don't claim to know how "all pot smokers" think, but the ones I do know seem to be aware of the potency of "today's weed". The fact is that the "legal" substances (specifically prescribed drugs) have been implicated in recent statistics for drug deaths that far exceed any that can be ascribed to pot. In fact, there is no record in the extensive medical literature describing a proven, documented cannabis-induced fatality. (Source: US Department of Justice, Drug Enforcement Administration, "In the Matter of Marijuana Rescheduling Petition" (Docket #86-22), September 6, 1988, p. 56-57. Judge Young - Part 4)

I could go on an give more drug death statistics if anyone wanted to see them. I just think it is a shame to have weed access tied to the illegal drug trade, which does lead to deaths, primarily from violence.

But back to weed.

I still contend: My only point here is that I do think that "weed Prohibition" will only drive the users to seedy places to buy it, and will make criminals out of non-violent, peaceful people, many of whom are not addicts at all.
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Old 07-17-2011, 07:48 PM
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Sorry for painting with such a broad brush. Thought I said, "the smokers I know" ( I actually did, at one point)

I don't care if it's eventually legalized or not. I would like to see drivers with other drugs in their systems held to the same level of responsibility as drunk drivers.

The conversation I heard with the admittedly irresponsible smokers mortified me, though.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:15 PM
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Hi velma929,

Yes, I've heard those comments at times, too. I can think of times when I was drinking alcohol, and later taking opiates, that I drove my car without any qualms that I was not doing the right thing. My own behavior was unacceptable, and I did not even think twice about it at the time.

Thank you for not getting irate at my knee-jerk response to your post. Now I wish the drivers on the highway would behave as politely as you just did with your response.

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Old 07-17-2011, 09:30 PM
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taking my mod hat off...

Here in Australia it's always been illegal to possess or use cannabis, or at least it was until 10 years ago when I stopped buying it. I don't know what the law is now.

In 20 years I was never forced into seedy undergrounds or made a felon.

I'm not aware of the US situation but I guess I've made the journey fully from hippie to cranky old man because my feeling is - if you don't want to be an outlaw...don't break the law.

Weed destroyed my life as completely as any other drug I used ever did.

I'm extraordinary lucky to be here after the many times I drove stoned - I have mates who have died in accidents, accidents I'm sure that were attributable to the use of cannabis...I have another friend, a new smoker, who became so depressed he killed himself...so I have no absolutely time for the no fatalities argument either.

D
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:32 PM
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and...putting it back on.

Lets remember this is a recovery site guys - hold whatever opinions you want, but remember there are people here, besides me, who's lives and the lives of loved ones have been destroyed by cannabis.

If everyone can keep in mind this from rule2:
It is inappropriate to promote the use of alcohol or drugs on our addiction recovery forums.
we should have no problems

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Old 07-18-2011, 12:15 AM
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I'm all for legalization, controlled administration and de-criminalization of drugs, period. The issue for me is not legalization or prohibition of drugs (including marijuana), but one of *addiction."

If a mind-altering drug such as marijuana is illegal where one lives and it still doesn't deter one from using --not even abusing-- it (unless it's some form of organized civil disobedience aimed at changing the law), I would question why one would put oneself at such legal risk.

Cigarettes and alcohol are both legal drugs. They alter moods. They kill. They destroy lives. I do think there's plenty of scientific evidence that marijuana has "medicinal value," but so does vicadin.

Those who can enjoy a joint every so often socially & recreationally should be able to in a legal environment the way I enjoy my ice cream or chocolate!
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Old 07-18-2011, 01:02 AM
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Dee, I am curious as to what impact marijuana had on your life, if you don't mind sharing? I'd love to hear your, or anyone else's, experience with that. Thank you if you do feel like sharing.
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Old 07-18-2011, 02:38 AM
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I don't want to hog the thread, but this is apparently one of my first posts here eaglette.

It sets out pretty well what my marijuana experience was, and sets it out probably better than I would today

glad I lost that hippy tinge tho lol

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ml#post1288813

D
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Old 07-18-2011, 03:01 AM
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Thanks D--Well, I am kind of hippielike myself, but I was that way before I smoked and will probably be until the day I die. It's cute how you threw all the 'man's in there though. Thanks for posting the link...I do want to look over the links you posted back then too if the addresses are still valid.

Rock on.
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Old 07-18-2011, 03:19 AM
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I was always under the impression that pot was 'benign' until a few years ago when I had a horrible experience with it.

I do not use any type of substance (inc alcohol) in terms of drug use for 'fun' since college (years ago) but there was this bachelorette party....

To make a long story short, my friend cultivates pot (complete with the hydroponic lights, nutrients etc) and she made pot brownies.

She showed me once how she did it.. she extracts as much THC from the pot by 'cooking' it, mixes that with butter and adds to the brownie baking process.

So back to this party... I took a small corner off of ONE brownie. A fraction of it and ate it. I went from giggling to sheer panic attacks, hallucinating and palpitations.

I wanted to go to emergency but my friends told me to ride it out. It was the most terrifying experience I have had on any substance. It messed me up for weeks actually.

My doctor (psych) at the time explained to me what had happened, that I was one of those who have negative reactions from pot and because she had extracted so much THC, she condensed it to be way more potent than smoking.

Long and short of it, if my friends were not there, I could have run into the street, couldn't have driven or if I did, would have had a horrible accident. I was so wacked out, short of breath and spent the rest of the night in panic as my friends made sure I was at least safe.

I no longer think it is benign. A cautionary tale I guess you can say.

This is a personal story. It can really be a miserable experience and cause hallucinations if used so potently.

I will never touch the stuff and making something legal also doesn't make it benign (as we know from alcohol which is legal in most places).

Sorry to ramble. It is just an interesting topic that has many sides.
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